Mercedes stands for perfection. - GoFuckYourself.com

Validus · 06-12-2003, 01:08 AM

Alright, I have noticed that I am not the only one who might be thinking this. Since I have been to Germany, I have gotten the opportunity to drive a verity of cars and the winner is clear, Mercedes. BMW and Audi don?t match it.

lagwagon · 06-12-2003, 01:20 AM

what is it the x 8 or something like that? $100,000 beamer with like 400 plus horsepower. i dont think i am right but fuck man bmw has some dope ass cars.

volante · 06-12-2003, 01:23 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Validus
Since I have been to Germany, I have gotten the opportunity to drive a verity of cars and the winner is clear, Mercedes. BMW and Audi don?t match it.

Drive harder. The equivalent BMW will win...

Validus · 06-12-2003, 01:24 AM

Well, I am not saying they don?t but in comparison to Mercedes Benz?

PostWhore · 06-12-2003, 01:26 AM

BMW is more driver's car.

vending_machine · 06-12-2003, 01:27 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Validus
Alright, I have noticed that I am not the only one who might be thinking this. Since I have been to Germany, I have gotten the opportunity to drive a verity of cars and the winner is clear, Mercedes. BMW and Audi don?t match it.

Mercedes, BMW, and Audi are all in different "classes".. Can't really compare them straight up.

Have you driven the Audi S8?

DirtyDanza · 06-12-2003, 01:27 AM

Well BMW does put in writing "the ultimate driving machine" my vote is BMW .... I suppose that if you can prove that some drives better than a BMW you'd be rich for them fals advertising......

Validus · 06-12-2003, 01:34 AM

Volante, win? In speed or top speed? Maybe?

C-Class VS 3 Series BMW:

BMW doesn?t have cup holders
Parking sensors only at the rear
No steering wheel controls for onboard computer
BMW comes with a old Navigation system
Lights are not turned on and off auto
BMW Steering is a lot harder (personal preference)

I am sure I could find more, and most of these are most likely options but I believe you get more from Mercedes for your euro (dollar) then from BMW.

Validus · 06-12-2003, 01:35 AM

vending_machine: Ah, I can't say I have. I have heard things about audi... good and bad.. but never driven one myself.

volante · 06-12-2003, 01:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Validus
Volante, win? In speed or top speed? Maybe?

C-Class VS 3 Series BMW:

BMW doesn?t have cup holders

Validus · 06-12-2003, 01:40 AM

Dude, if you spend a good amount of time on the road... cup holder are pretty important

DarkJedi · 06-12-2003, 01:41 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Validus

C-Class VS 3 Series BMW:

BMW doesn?t have cup holders
Parking sensors only at the rear
No steering wheel controls for onboard computer
BMW comes with a old Navigation system
Lights are not turned on and off auto
BMW Steering is a lot harder (personal preference)

all these reasons are gay

mule · 06-12-2003, 01:50 AM

I was always opposed to Mercedes. Dunno, I just didn't like the kind of people who drove them or something. But some years ago my dad bought a second-hand one, and it's just fucking unbelievable...that thing is almost 20 years old now, and it still sounds, feels and handles like a brand-new car. Not a rattle, not a squeek. Top quality.

TurboTrucker · 06-12-2003, 02:09 AM

Mercedes are ugly, very few look good.

AWW - Kevin · 06-12-2003, 02:44 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by TurboTrucker
Mercedes are ugly...

disagree completly, and here's the reason

Mr Pheer · 06-12-2003, 02:56 AM

C-Class VS 3 Series BMW:

BMW doesn?t have cup holders
they are under the arm rest. who needs a cup holder? cars didnt have cupholders for like 70 years

Parking sensors only at the rear
I dunno wtf a parking sensor is... I use mirrors

No steering wheel controls for onboard computer
mine has steering wheel controls for stereo, cruise control, and I forgot what else. Dunno why you would need to control the onboard computer

BMW comes with a old Navigation system
I guess an old BMW would. I prefer not to have a nav system, its just an expensive gimmick. I like onboard nav in my airplane, but I pretty much know my way around town when I'm driving my car.

Lights are not turned on and off auto
Mine does. Thats what the sensor on the dash is for

BMW Steering is a lot harder (personal preference)
Most people prefer to "feel" the road a little. But like you said, personal preference

I hardly ever drive my BMW much, its mostly my wife's car. I've gotten to wear cars do not excite me anymore. I gonna buy a new bike this weekend, just havent decided which one to get yet.

Machete_ · 06-12-2003, 03:06 AM

Im from Europe, ant both BMW, Audi and Mercedes are cares that
I have driven and owned

The list:
MB 190 2,3
MB 190 2,5 16v Evolution II
MB E280
MB S420 AMG

Audi 90 Cupe
Audi 200 Turbo
Audi A6 Avant Quartro

BMW 325
BMW M5

Mercedes wins. Audi have better road preformance, Bmw looks cool but you cant get the power down on the street the same way Audi does ( I had to get 3 part suspention kit on the M5 before it wa safe to push 105%)
The mercedes might not be the fastest, but if you have ever owned one in more than 3 months, you know what I mean when I say its a winner.

Right now I have a old Volvo740 Turbo on the road, but im rebuilding a 96 Toyota Supra - full HKS kit - it will be a road monster when its done in about a year or so - no rush

KRL · 06-12-2003, 03:41 AM

I've had Benz's more than any other car. Had one Beamer and it was crap in comparison. The Benz's are like tanks. I had a 450 sedan that went to 200K miles and was still running like it was just off the showroom floor.

The only thing I don't like now is I think Mercedes has lost the classic look their older model cars had. You could always tell a Mercedes instantly, it was so distinct. Now the sedans look like a lot of other high end sedans.

I stopped liking SL's after they putzed that design up. I had a 560SL that rocked like a sports car should. Then got the new style SL after that and it felt so sedate in comparison. You couldn't feel the road as much. It got too luxurious.

But they are the best engineered and built cars still in my opinion. And if you take good care of them they last forever.

BlueDesignStudios · 06-12-2003, 03:44 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by PostWhore
BMW is more driver's car.

I agree

models · 06-12-2003, 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by KRL
I've had Benz's more than any other car. Had one Beamer and it was crap in comparison. The Benz's are like tanks. I had a 450 sedan that went to 200K miles and was still running like it was just off the showroom floor.

The only thing I don't like now is I think Mercedes has lost the classic look their older model cars had. You could always tell a Mercedes instantly, it was so distinct. Now the sedans look like a lot of other high end sedans.

I stopped liking SL's after they putzed that design up. I had a 560SL that rocked like a sports car should. Then got the new style SL after that and it felt so sedate in comparison. You couldn't feel the road as much. It got too luxurious.

But they are the best engineered and built cars still in my opinion. And if you take good care of them they last forever.

agreed, i have a '97 S320 LWB now with 100K miles that drives like brand new. the S class cars are the best i've ever owned, and i used to be in the auto business. nothing better on the road IMO

foe · 06-12-2003, 10:02 AM

parking sensors are for soccer moms

shima · 06-12-2003, 10:05 AM

Does anyone really use the parking sensors?
I have a Mercedes which is 18 years old, and I'm going to sell it. The reason? I want a newer Mercedes. And ONLY Mercedes.
Heard enough problems about the BMWs from a guy who owns 535. Audi is good, but I like Mercedes more

models · 06-12-2003, 10:25 AM

the parktronic system actually works well. even if our dog runs in front (or back) of the car while pulling out of the driveway it alerts you.

and it gives visual and audio info about how close the thing is to the car---like the edge of a bumper, or the edge of your garage door.

doesn't sound like much, but for city driving it really does keep your car from getting scratched.

PostWhore · 06-12-2003, 12:24 PM

ok lets see.
BMW has better handling than Mercedes
BMW builds better engines than Mercedes
BMW stops faster than Mercedes.

hmmmm BMW has cupholders, you can access onboard computer from stering wheel.

Read the car news, Mercedes is fucking up with their Navigation system.

If you want a mean machine on the road get a BMW, if you want to cruize down the street get a Mercedes.

badmrfrosty · 06-12-2003, 01:19 PM

Fuck you guys, I like my Pontiac Grand Am GT1 ('03).

:-)

BMF

Kohun · 06-12-2003, 01:38 PM

Indeed Mercedes is better

TurboTrucker · 06-14-2003, 08:41 PM

And that's supposed to be a sports car I believe? The Chevy Cavalier looks more aggresive than that. That looks like something my mom would drive.

Quote:

Originally posted by AWW - Kevin

disagree completly, and here's the reason

x582 · 06-14-2003, 10:57 PM

I went to see the new 2004 A8 today at my Audi delearship... and wow! It's a very impressive car

The navigation system just rocks! Everything in the car is controlled by the multimedia monitor (LCD screen) and it's pretty slick

I never tried the navigation system in Mercedes - but this one has some wicked features! i wanted to go at the ATM and the computer listed all ATMs around, and I chose the ATM i wanted to go, and the car drew the route and stuff... It does the same things for restaurants, gas station etc... Plus it's on a DVD (Mercedes and BMW's system works with CDROM i think)

The only other navigation system i tried was in my 1999 BMW 7 series, and the system didn't have these features.

I was really impressed by the new A8 - and the price is decent. Its start at $70k for a 350hp luxury car

liquidmoe · 06-14-2003, 11:53 PM

BMW's navs are DVD now. And its a driver's car for sure, just try getting a Benz in stick and you will see. Handling is better, performance is better, but ride quality is stiffer, as it should be since it's focused on performance over luxury. And yes some of it is getting dated compared to the newest Benz but dont forget that the new 5-series is coming out this summer and that by 2005 summer the new 3-series and 3-series coupes which will be numbered as 4-series will be coming out.

SleazyDream · 06-14-2003, 11:57 PM

fuck BMW and Mercedies. CAT RULES. it's all about the POWER

<img src=http://www.evansequip.com/LargePics/4644/FrntR.jpg>

liquidmoe · 06-15-2003, 12:05 AM

CATs for pussies

j3ff · 06-15-2003, 12:18 AM

why you all bother with those german cars..... go for renault

AWW - Kevin · 06-15-2003, 01:14 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by TurboTrucker
And that's supposed to be a sports car I believe? The Chevy Cavalier looks more aggresive than that. That looks like something my mom would drive.

LOL

0-100kmh 4.7sec
Top Speed without limiter ~350kmh

yes it is a Sportscar and a classy one at that !!

kris242 · 06-15-2003, 01:34 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by TurboTrucker
And that's supposed to be a sports car I believe? The Chevy Cavalier looks more aggresive than that. That looks like something my mom would drive.

1080 HP LPE Ecotec 4 cylinder/16 valve 2.2L engine Lingenfelter Cavlier

Rich · 06-15-2003, 01:47 AM

Grow up son, I've driven 'em all, and you can't beat Canadian. Ever heard of a Lada?

TurboTrucker · 06-15-2003, 01:49 AM

I didn't say it wasn't fast, just that it doesn't look like it.

I like this design a lot better.

Quote:

Originally posted by AWW - Kevin

LOL

0-100kmh 4.7sec
Top Speed without limiter ~350kmh

yes it is a Sportscar and a classy one at that !!

PostWhore · 06-15-2003, 02:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by AWW - Kevin

LOL

Top Speed without limiter ~350kmh

i'll call BS on this one

PostWhore · 06-15-2003, 02:38 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by liquidmoe
BMW's navs are DVD now. And its a driver's car for sure, just try getting a Benz in stick and you will see. Handling is better, performance is better, but ride quality is stiffer, as it should be since it's focused on performance over luxury. And yes some of it is getting dated compared to the newest Benz but dont forget that the new 5-series is coming out this summer and that by 2005 summer the new 3-series and 3-series coupes which will be numbered as 4-series will be coming out.

1. there is not Benz in stick (except C Kompressor hatch)
2. BENZ has shitty handling and stopping power. Try BMW and you will see the difference. (new AMG are good streight line racers though)

sltr · 06-15-2003, 05:45 AM

the slr looks sweet!

SPIKE326 · 06-15-2003, 08:51 AM

Ever since mercedes teamed with chrysler I've steared away. Go lambo or ferrari.

Gutterboy · 06-15-2003, 09:00 AM

Why do people like these "drivers cars" anyway? Small penis? Masochism?

Fuck that.

If I'm spending 50k + on a car I want heated leather seats, steering wheel computer controls, a great sound system, GPS, cup holders up the fucking wazoo, and every other automotive creature comfort you can think of.

Might make an exception for the Lotus Elise

Ace-Ace · 06-15-2003, 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by kris242

1080 HP LPE Ecotec 4 cylinder/16 valve 2.2L engine Lingenfelter Cavlier

Cavalier with RWD eh? Sweet!

Cardboard Box · 06-15-2003, 09:09 AM

I've got an SLK230, pretty much a Miata on steriods but I love it! (not much price difference between the two-particularly the tenth anniversary Miata-when I bought it in '99)

06-12-2003, 01:08 AM	#1
Validus Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Calgary, Canada Posts: 4,012	Mercedes stands for perfection. Alright, I have noticed that I am not the only one who might be thinking this. Since I have been to Germany, I have gotten the opportunity to drive a verity of cars and the winner is clear, Mercedes. BMW and Audi don?t match it.

06-12-2003, 01:20 AM	#2
lagwagon Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: az Posts: 8,464	what is it the x 8 or something like that? $100,000 beamer with like 400 plus horsepower. i dont think i am right but fuck man bmw has some dope ass cars. __________________ FTVGirls - FTVMilfs - DanielleFTV

06-12-2003, 01:26 AM	#5
PostWhore Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 4,720	BMW is more driver's car. __________________ Ask me how to monetize with adult traffic!

06-12-2003, 01:27 AM	#7
DirtyDanza Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: BP4L.... Las Vegas, Posts: 8,370	Well BMW does put in writing "the ultimate driving machine" my vote is BMW .... I suppose that if you can prove that some drives better than a BMW you'd be rich for them fals advertising...... __________________ AVN Nominated Camming Couple

06-12-2003, 01:50 AM	#13
mule Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: hamsterdam Posts: 6,085	I was always opposed to Mercedes. Dunno, I just didn't like the kind of people who drove them or something. But some years ago my dad bought a second-hand one, and it's just fucking unbelievable...that thing is almost 20 years old now, and it still sounds, feels and handles like a brand-new car. Not a rattle, not a squeek. Top quality. __________________ Converting like a mofo

06-12-2003, 01:24 AM	#4
Validus Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Calgary, Canada Posts: 4,012	Well, I am not saying they don?t but in comparison to Mercedes Benz?

06-12-2003, 01:34 AM	#8
Validus Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Calgary, Canada Posts: 4,012	Volante, win? In speed or top speed? Maybe? C-Class VS 3 Series BMW: BMW doesn?t have cup holders Parking sensors only at the rear No steering wheel controls for onboard computer BMW comes with a old Navigation system Lights are not turned on and off auto BMW Steering is a lot harder (personal preference) I am sure I could find more, and most of these are most likely options but I believe you get more from Mercedes for your euro (dollar) then from BMW.

06-12-2003, 01:35 AM	#9
Validus Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Calgary, Canada Posts: 4,012	vending_machine: Ah, I can't say I have. I have heard things about audi... good and bad.. but never driven one myself.

06-12-2003, 01:40 AM	#11
Validus Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Calgary, Canada Posts: 4,012	Dude, if you spend a good amount of time on the road... cup holder are pretty important

06-12-2003, 02:09 AM	#14
TurboTrucker Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Phoenix Arizona Posts: 2,363	Mercedes are ugly, very few look good. __________________

06-12-2003, 02:56 AM	#16
Mr Pheer Retired Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 21,257	C-Class VS 3 Series BMW: BMW doesn?t have cup holders they are under the arm rest. who needs a cup holder? cars didnt have cupholders for like 70 years Parking sensors only at the rear I dunno wtf a parking sensor is... I use mirrors No steering wheel controls for onboard computer mine has steering wheel controls for stereo, cruise control, and I forgot what else. Dunno why you would need to control the onboard computer BMW comes with a old Navigation system I guess an old BMW would. I prefer not to have a nav system, its just an expensive gimmick. I like onboard nav in my airplane, but I pretty much know my way around town when I'm driving my car. Lights are not turned on and off auto Mine does. Thats what the sensor on the dash is for BMW Steering is a lot harder (personal preference) Most people prefer to "feel" the road a little. But like you said, personal preference I hardly ever drive my BMW much, its mostly my wife's car. I've gotten to wear cars do not excite me anymore. I gonna buy a new bike this weekend, just havent decided which one to get yet. __________________ 2 lifeguards for Jessica

06-12-2003, 03:06 AM	#17
Machete_ WINNING! Industry Role: Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 14,579	Im from Europe, ant both BMW, Audi and Mercedes are cares that I have driven and owned The list: MB 190 2,3 MB 190 2,5 16v Evolution II MB E280 MB S420 AMG Audi 90 Cupe Audi 200 Turbo Audi A6 Avant Quartro BMW 325 BMW M5 Mercedes wins. Audi have better road preformance, Bmw looks cool but you cant get the power down on the street the same way Audi does ( I had to get 3 part suspention kit on the M5 before it wa safe to push 105%) The mercedes might not be the fastest, but if you have ever owned one in more than 3 months, you know what I mean when I say its a winner. Right now I have a old Volvo740 Turbo on the road, but im rebuilding a 96 Toyota Supra - full HKS kit - it will be a road monster when its done in about a year or so - no rush

06-12-2003, 03:41 AM	#18
KRL Entrepreneur Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: USA Posts: 31,429	I've had Benz's more than any other car. Had one Beamer and it was crap in comparison. The Benz's are like tanks. I had a 450 sedan that went to 200K miles and was still running like it was just off the showroom floor. The only thing I don't like now is I think Mercedes has lost the classic look their older model cars had. You could always tell a Mercedes instantly, it was so distinct. Now the sedans look like a lot of other high end sedans. I stopped liking SL's after they putzed that design up. I had a 560SL that rocked like a sports car should. Then got the new style SL after that and it felt so sedate in comparison. You couldn't feel the road as much. It got too luxurious. But they are the best engineered and built cars still in my opinion. And if you take good care of them they last forever. __________________ If you would like to develop your domains, you can lease inexpensive foreign labor from the leaders in the field at iWebmasters.com TO LOWER YOUR COSTS AND INCREASE YOUR PRODUCTION! * * * * * * * * * * * * Domains Adult News KRL's Newsletter Biz Tips Just Listed Domains

06-12-2003, 10:02 AM	#21
foe Confirmed User Join Date: May 2002 Location: CT Posts: 5,246	parking sensors are for soccer moms

06-12-2003, 10:05 AM	#22
shima Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: May 2003 Location: Office, as usual Posts: 1,753	Does anyone really use the parking sensors? I have a Mercedes which is 18 years old, and I'm going to sell it. The reason? I want a newer Mercedes. And ONLY Mercedes. Heard enough problems about the BMWs from a guy who owns 535. Audi is good, but I like Mercedes more

06-12-2003, 10:25 AM	#23
models Registered User Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: chicago Posts: 118	the parktronic system actually works well. even if our dog runs in front (or back) of the car while pulling out of the driveway it alerts you. and it gives visual and audio info about how close the thing is to the car---like the edge of a bumper, or the edge of your garage door. doesn't sound like much, but for city driving it really does keep your car from getting scratched.

06-12-2003, 12:24 PM	#24
PostWhore Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 4,720	ok lets see. BMW has better handling than Mercedes BMW builds better engines than Mercedes BMW stops faster than Mercedes. hmmmm BMW has cupholders, you can access onboard computer from stering wheel. Read the car news, Mercedes is fucking up with their Navigation system. If you want a mean machine on the road get a BMW, if you want to cruize down the street get a Mercedes. __________________ Ask me how to monetize with adult traffic!

06-12-2003, 01:19 PM	#25
badmrfrosty Confirmed User Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 500	Fuck you guys, I like my Pontiac Grand Am GT1 ('03). :-) BMF

06-12-2003, 01:38 PM	#26
Kohun Confirmed User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Copenhagen Posts: 274	Indeed Mercedes is better __________________ Click here to make money www.PEAKMONEY.com ICQ # 172316026

06-14-2003, 10:57 PM	#28
x582 Confirmed User Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: heh? Posts: 609	I went to see the new 2004 A8 today at my Audi delearship... and wow! It's a very impressive car The navigation system just rocks! Everything in the car is controlled by the multimedia monitor (LCD screen) and it's pretty slick I never tried the navigation system in Mercedes - but this one has some wicked features! i wanted to go at the ATM and the computer listed all ATMs around, and I chose the ATM i wanted to go, and the car drew the route and stuff... It does the same things for restaurants, gas station etc... Plus it's on a DVD (Mercedes and BMW's system works with CDROM i think) The only other navigation system i tried was in my 1999 BMW 7 series, and the system didn't have these features. I was really impressed by the new A8 - and the price is decent. Its start at $70k for a 350hp luxury car

06-14-2003, 11:53 PM	#29
liquidmoe Confirmed User Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: NY Posts: 4,994	BMW's navs are DVD now. And its a driver's car for sure, just try getting a Benz in stick and you will see. Handling is better, performance is better, but ride quality is stiffer, as it should be since it's focused on performance over luxury. And yes some of it is getting dated compared to the newest Benz but dont forget that the new 5-series is coming out this summer and that by 2005 summer the new 3-series and 3-series coupes which will be numbered as 4-series will be coming out.

06-14-2003, 11:57 PM	#30
SleazyDream I'm here for SPORT Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Phone # (401) 285-0696 Posts: 41,470	fuck BMW and Mercedies. CAT RULES. it's all about the POWER <img src=http://www.evansequip.com/LargePics/4644/FrntR.jpg> __________________ This dog, is dog, a dog, good dog, way dog, to dog, keep dog, an dog, idiot dog, busy dog, for dog, 20 dog, seconds dog! Now read without the word dog.

06-15-2003, 12:05 AM	#31
liquidmoe Confirmed User Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: NY Posts: 4,994	CATs for pussies

06-15-2003, 12:18 AM	#32
j3ff Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Quebec city Posts: 690	why you all bother with those german cars..... go for renault __________________ Can A Paysite Pluggin NOT Be A Simple Pluggin? Downloadable MPEG, WMV and DiVX -- UPDATED DAILY! www.itsyourporn.com

06-15-2003, 01:47 AM	#35
Rich So Fucking Banned Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 11,486	Grow up son, I've driven 'em all, and you can't beat Canadian. Ever heard of a Lada?

06-15-2003, 05:45 AM	#39
sltr Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 3,191	the slr looks sweet!

06-15-2003, 08:51 AM	#40
SPIKE326 So Fucking Banned Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 257	Ever since mercedes teamed with chrysler I've steared away. Go lambo or ferrari.

06-15-2003, 09:00 AM	#41
Gutterboy So Fucking Banned Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Dis Posts: 4,751	Why do people like these "drivers cars" anyway? Small penis? Masochism? Fuck that. If I'm spending 50k + on a car I want heated leather seats, steering wheel computer controls, a great sound system, GPS, cup holders up the fucking wazoo, and every other automotive creature comfort you can think of. Might make an exception for the Lotus Elise

06-15-2003, 09:09 AM	#43
Cardboard Box Registered User Join Date: May 2003 Location: Blue Mountain Beach Posts: 46	I've got an SLK230, pretty much a Miata on steriods but I love it! (not much price difference between the two-particularly the tenth anniversary Miata-when I bought it in '99) Last edited by Cardboard Box; 06-15-2003 at 09:14 AM..