pg 2

yes, but is that good or bad?

When it's over, if there is no more terror, then he did good. I don't care how many countries he invades, as long as he's invading terrorism supporting nations and rendering them harmless. If he can secure a robust supply of oil for us at the same time, so much the better.

But if these wars end and there is still terror, and all he did was get some of his rich friends richer, he should be hung.

Yes, I have.
Not that I had a choice.
Which I pay for every time I buy a pack of cigarettes.
No, my daughter goes to private school.
No, I haven't.
Every park I've ever been to, required a fee for entrance.
There are no sidewalks on my road.
Although I have walked on them, they are property owner responsibility.
Which I pay for every time I renew it.
Which I pay for every time I get off of it.
Which I pay for, every time I buy a lottery ticket.
Never heard of bus fare?
Never.
Never.
We have law enforcement, but they do not come out here.
They tend to stay where the crime is.
I contribute to the local police department.
If there were a fire at my house, it would burn down.
I'm 2 miles from the nearest hydrant, and I do not have city supplied water.
I also contribute to the local fire department.
All of which I pay for.

None of which would exist for you to pay a token fee...without taxes.

I'm sure that's because the war on terror started. Before that Bush was like "we should not involve ourselves in the middle east, etc." And if the war hadn't started? What if John Asshahahahaha didn't have more important people to imprison?

If they didn't have the war on terror going I bet they'd have built prisons just for adult webmasters and filled them with 2257 violators, and that's just for starters.

ooooooooooo


http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/europe...ort/index.html

'Deepened divisions'

The effects of the U.S.-led war on terror have been far-reaching, Amnesty said in a statement.

"Far from making the world a safer place, [the war] has made it more dangerous by curtailing human rights, undermining the rule of international law and shielding governments from scrutiny. It has deepened divisions among people of different faiths and origins, sowing the seeds for more conflict," the statement said.

In a separate press conference Wednesday, William Schulz, executive director of Amnesty International USA, said U.S.-led events of 2003 generated deleterious effects.

The war on Iraq provided an excuse for other countries "in the name of anti-terrorism or in the name of national security" to crack down on opponents of their regimes, he said.

Schulz said the Iraqi war was a "distraction of the world's attention from horrific human rights abuses elsewhere," and gave ammunition to countries that circumvent the United Nations and "use the excuse the United States itself does not respect international law."

oooooooooooooo

Much more in that article about " nothing changed", " I still have the same freedom" and so on...

Impressive.

You benefit from people who use libraries. Those people are smart, and smart people invent things, like beer trucks. And you need those to get your beer.

the rable are so fun to watch.:thumbsup

I never said any of that. It's a dirty job, and it's gonna be a mess for a while. It's a mess now, that's for sure. What I said was when it is over there had better not still be terror, nor a mess.

That line wasn't directed to you, sorry. More to TheKing or 12Clicks that always claims that ...
On the other hand, maybe nothing changed for them now, but it could in the near future...

quote:
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Originally posted by theking


Whether or not WMD materials are ever found is immaterial.

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Bottom line...Presidents do not tell the truth...the whole truth and nothing but the truth and as I have stated it was only a part of multiple reasons.


quote:
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Originally posted by theking


If memory serves me I think there have been a couple of people that have been detained for having links to "al Qaeda" and I believe a training camp was destroyed in the North that had links to "al Qaeda". Whether or not my memory serves me well...is immaterial.

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It was reported that the training camp was bombed by US Air power and was vacated when our ground forces entered the area.



quote:
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Originally posted by theking

The invasion of Iraq was for multiple reasons and WMD materials and "al Qaeda" members or those that have links with "al Qaeda" were just a couple of those reasons and in my opinion not on top of the list of reasons.

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The media does report about the problems in Iraq but there is not any mass revolt at this point in time.


quote:
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Originally posted by theking

It is ridiculous to keep repeating the President said this or the President said that. There has not been a President in my life time that has told the truth...the whole truth...and nothing but the truth...and anyone that pays attention is aware of this...and I assume that the same applies to every leader of every country.

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President Johnson (Democrat) stood on the floor of Congress and told a bald face lie about the Tonkin Gulf incident and as a result the Congress passed the "Tonkin Gulf Resolution" which engaged the USA in the longest war in our history. This is only one incident of a President lying about an event where our military was used.


quote:
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Originally posted by theking

In addition Iraq is a fair sized country...with lengthy borders...ports and a poputlation of 27,000,000. Easy to hide materials...easy to export materials...easy for people to hide among the population...or leave the country.
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The use of certain types of WMD's would have been far more harmful to Iraqi troops...not to mention Iraqi civilians...then it would have been to US forces. The successful use of certain types of WMD's is not an easy task to accomplish.

None of which would be required if the democrats that run this state had a clue how to manage a budget.

They're laying off hundreds of school teachers here, at the same time they send out 5 (FIVE) guys, 10 (TEN) times to fix a 1 foot round pothole.
This same exact pothole has been "fixed" twice a year, every year, for the past five.

The same people that would rather have 2 (TWO) Policemen controlling traffic at a certain "T" intersection for 16 (SIXTEEN) hours a day, every day, than put up a traffic light.

The same people that overspent by BILLIONS of dollars so the people in Boston can save a few minutes of driving, fined a 92 year old woman $75 for not shoveling the sidewalk in front of her house fast enough after an 18" snowstorm.

The same people that lowered the odds of winning anything on lottery tickets so they could have more tax money, then complain when people stop buying the tickets, and embark on a huge advertising campaign to get people to buy them again.

the same people that have tripled the cost of a pack of cigarettes in the past few years, only to complain when people quit smoking, or start buying them online.


and this list goes on, and on.

When some random New York Times reporter got caught lying about some facts in a story, it was headline news all around the U.S.

When Bush gets caught lying about why we're going to war, the media is nearly silent.

It's pretty crazy.

I would agree 100% - if my vote in fact counted.. but with the popular vote taking second place to the electorate system, and idiots that cant simply punch a hole all the way through a peice of paper.... I cant make fun of the people that dont even bother anymore.. (yes i still go through the trouble.. just in case they decide to count mine)

Exactly, that's the scary part about all this. There are so many scandals with the Bush administration right now you can't even count them yet no democrats are going out of their way to call them on it all, is very peculiar.

#1 WMD must be found for the US to remain credible. and If they were "destroyed before the war" (the latest lie) then there would be evidence of there destruction..

#2 The Terrorist camp that was discoverd in the north was a well known camp which was located in Kurd controlled territory, NOT in areas that Saddam had control.

The world is better off with Saddam out of power - but that doesnt make bush honest

Well...yes it does. I left off the military...which without it you would be speaking German...Japanese...Russian or maybe in the furture your kids would be speaking Arabic.

Mis-mangement of tax dollars is nothing new...and will always exist.

I'll give you military.

Iraq claimed to have destroyed them and 1441 demanded that Iraq produce evidence that they had been destroyed. Iraq did not produce a single paper...or a single scientist or person that was involved in the destruction...or the physical "evidence of their destruction". Why do you think they did not supply the proof that they had destroyed their WMD materials?

Correct...non the less...it was in Iraq and had ties to the "al Qaeda"

No President is competely honest with the people let alone the world...and there are many legitimate reasons for this.

If you're a Libertarian, then do you dislike Bush for increasing government spending and government power over the people so much?

Anyone who says they like Bush and what he is doing is not a Libertarian by any means.

Well...if there are so many scandals that they are uncountable I would not expect you to be able to list them all...but educate us and identify just a dozen or so.

The media...print and TV are speaking to the subject...but it could never be often enough...or demanding enough to satisfy you.

The media has been sucking up to Bush since before he took office.

Look at the huge difference in coverage between the non stop media attacks on Clinton and the non stop media love and praise of Bush.

Even someone as right wing biased as you can't deny the right wing media bias in the United States.

Don't tell me you still believe there is a "liberal media" out there somewhere? :1orglaugh

Terrorism is the best thing to ever happen for the Bush administration.

The best part about a war on terror is it has no definitive start or end point.

Why would he want to put an end to this kind of political mileage?

Not a problem...

If they don't find the wmd then ol' Bush is in for some major legal problems.. He can't start a war just because he wants to.. and after gaining support, and justifying the war through his wmd hooplah, then none being found, there's gonna be a whole lotta yellin & shoutin to bring his ass down hard...

The issue if finding *any* WMD is one of the major reasons Bush talked the US into going to war. This has cost many lives and serious injuries on both sides.

The US Admin, (on this we sure agree), is unable to state any truths. There was "apparently" files of "evidence" with the locations of all WMD in Iraq - some of which were presented to the UN in an attempt to decieve the Security Council. The security council did not hold an credibility in this "evidence". Frankly, the assembly at the security council have far more information on Iraq than anything the US has.

It was a simple matter, at least according to the US rhetoric, of invading Iraq and visiting these alledged sites and destroting these weapons. I would question whether *any* US forces visited these site - since this is already known by other countries to be a waste of time.

The bottom line on just this aspect alone is the credibility of the US Admin is at stake and, in turn, the US as a whole. This "credibility" does not matter within the US since this issue can be controlled. However, it is not controllable outside US territory. This "war" has not yet begun, - there are going to be many repercussions from this - and not limited to any "terrorist cells".

Basically, I have to hold the "Whitehouse thing" and his "doctrine pumping" associates responsible. They lied time and time again on many aspects. (Even long before any 9/11!)

Frankly my dog behaves better, - she knows she ain't supposed to piss all over the place. This is what the US Admin have done, - both to the US people and those in other countries.

I wonder whatever people in the US were thinking when, (least according to some alledged "democracy"), elected such a pitiful individual, who already had a disasterous track record, as President of the United States.

What legal problems might you be speaking of?

Not sure why anyone is surprised that GW is making a mess of things. Look at his resume and you will see that he comes from a a legacy of failures. If all he has shown is a propensity to run his companies into the ground while making out with money and power, why is any shock that this is what is happening at his biggest gig to date?

It will take many many many years to repair the damage to our foreign relations and my children will likely be living the legacy of this negative cash flow business plan that has been instituted under GW's watch. Think about it, what business do you know that could run successfully long term in this deep in the red manner?

I think the dumbass quota for this thread has been reached. Going to war is not a bad thing however war will none get rid of terrorism, as terrorism is one of the side effects of war. You will never be able to kill all of the terrorists because every war action you take will create more terrorists. The strategys needs to be multi faceted in order to combat terrorism and it simply isn't at this point in time. What our current administration is doing is applying a band aid to a bleeding artery. If you want to attack terrorism you cut off it's head, not the fingers. There will always be terrorists so long as there are people on this earth, they will always have the motivation to commit acts such as 9/11, what you can do is take their tools with which they can do mass damage and their number 1 tool is money. Their money comes from the Saudi Royal family, so indirectly terrorist money comes from the US Government because of it's dealings with the Saudi Royal family and US corporations and their dealings to buy the oil of the Saudi Royals, thus supplying them the funds to divert to terrorism. Kill Bin Laden, kill Saddamn, kill and attack anyone you want, if the US strategy doesn't change to one that is less influenced by greed then there will never be an end to terrorism.

LOL, I was just saying the other day that the two of them have probably been living in the guest wing at Camp david for ages

Thats very true, however there are degrees of lies.. and invading a country based on things that in hindsight, are not materializing is pretty extreme.

Iraq was supposed to provide evidence of the destruction of the WMD's and didnt, however Bush claimed they were a immediate threat to the US and the middle east... obviously that was not true.
Bush cant find the WMD's, cant find links that Saddam supported AlQueda (sp) - he cant even find Osama..
yet hes already threatening Iran and accusing them of the same things that he accused Iraq of.

I dont mind doing things to defend the country, but maybe we should start by controlling our borders instead of invading every country that has links to terrorism and oil...

The only repercussions will be from "terrorists" and maybe some politcal price that the President may have to pay...but no country on this earth that has a leader in their right mind wants to become a percieved foe of the USA...economically or militarily.

Yeah he was lying and I think he's a horrible fucking president. However anyone who pays attention to world news more than US news would have known he was full of shit long before now. The truth is we were attacking Iraq because they were our easiest target over there and not liked by the rest of the middle east so we could take them over with the least reprucussions, and gain a deal on their oil and oil contracts. But that was just the begining, the bigger picture was to setup a forward base of operation right in the middle of the fucking middle east so we could get directly at Iran, cutting Iran's nuke program will have two effects, 1 it will shut them down from owning nukes, but bigger than that, they are North Korea's #1 customer and we will have eliminated N Korea's #1 customer and their outlet for selling their systems. It pays to be informed, all of this is going to be interesting since we still aren't going after the money supply which is Saudia Arabia, and if we never go after the money, we'll never slow terrorism down. When Bin Laden said he was going to take down America too many of you dumbasses took him literally. All along his plan was to gain control and power of Saudia Arabia and their oil and money as well as the two holyiest muslim sites and he's doing it and we aren't stopping it because of our own greed.

I have to defend your president... He is not the most intelligent or educated man ( thought the "Talibans" were a rock group), and we all now that he has many slips of the tongue .

All along, he didn't mean IRAQ , but in fact IRAN ....

Ouuupsss , I invaded (liberated) the wrong country... Oh well!

Very well said. Terrorism will only become more of a problem due to Bushes actions (or inactions) and quite frankly I'm not to sure Bush would have it any other way.

Just breath in and relax this is still the best country to live in by far

Dont worry Iran will come soon enough

quote:
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Originally posted by theking


Reasons for war.

#1. Iraq was defeated on the field of battle and signed certain terms. Iraq has been in violation of those terms since they signed the terms in '91. The USA has demanded that those terms be complied with and that Iraq remain a defeated country.

#2. Iraq attempted to assasinate a former American President.

#3. Iraq has fired upon, almost daily, for almost 11 years, USA military forces.

#4. Iraq is believed to have, or are acquiring, or are attempting to acquire WMD's. The USA will not allow that.

#5. Iraq has, on multiple occassions called for Americans, to be killed where ever they are found. Thus they are a sworn enemy of the USA.

#6. Iraq is a strategic piece of real estate for future military operations against our enemies in the region, which number in the 100's of millions.

#7. Iraq is a strategic piece of real estate for its oil fields and for the surrounding oil fields, for as the worlds oil supplies dwindle the USA will be in a position to control the dwindling oil supplies for its use and the use of its European allies.

#8. A take over of Iraq sends a very powerful signal to the other countries in that area of the world that if they don't get their act together they will be next.

Any one of the reasons above is a reason for war.
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I posted that long before the invasion of Iraq. Pay particular attention to #6-8.

It is my belief that #6-8 are the driving force behind the invasion of Iraq. If I am correct...what would have been the reaction of the World if President would have stated these reasons?

The majority of the American people...I do not believe would have had a problem...if the President would have stated reasons 6-8..but approval may have been lessened.

theking really needs a job

you're just wasting tax payers money spending your life posting shite on this board

a BJ ????

not today

I am working on a database in between posts...thank you very much. In addition the taxes that I pay more than cover my VA check...so I pay my own way...thank you very much. You are now dismissed...troll.

prove it you cripple

you're constantly asking everyone and their dog for proof to back up their posts

now it's your turn

put up or shut up

No...troll. My business is my business and not a fucking trolls business or anyone else's business on this board.

I quit taking orders when I left the military...you are dismissed troll.

just as I thought

watching jerry springer

Regards,

SexySarah

did you just learn the word 'troll' today?

trying to see how many times you can use it in one sentence?

:1orglaugh

Regards,

SexySarah

because Sadam knew he couldn't win, but thought he would survive the war just like last time. It was a good political move to destroy the weapons.

No thunder in your balls, huh? Better to let folks blow up building and kill thousands of americans and not respond with full force? Fuck that.

Wait a year, then try posting again.

It might make more sense then.

Regards,

SexySarah

It's precisely because of the US meddling in the business of other countries that folks want to blow up buildings and kill thousands of americans, numbnuts