content guys - can you please give your 2cents - GoFuckYourself.com

lil2rich4u2 · 05-18-2003, 08:54 PM

Ok i was originally looking for club pics for my new site, then i tossed the idea convinced it was a legal nightmare.

I went with drunkdollars and used some of their content for now.

Now, i have a guy who works in a nightclub, willing to snap all the photo's i need for me ... he is telling me there is no 2257 for clothed women or something. I told him i would check it out.

I have 2 questions.

#1. Are we certain i cant make a profit on public domain pics if they are non-nudes?

#2. Asuming we are ... what forms would the "models" in question have to sign? Would i still need ID even if they arent clothed?

I am still questioning the legalities after seeing Kronic's post yesterday ...

Quote:

Originally posted by kronic

"One worry everyone seems to have going into this market is over the legality of the content. How can it be legal if there are no model releases? Can I get into trouble for promoting a site with public nudity? Is this content on the up-and-up? There are few laws pertaining specifically to this issue. None address it head-on, and all cases brought before courts have been dismissed, closed out of court, or quietly settled. Keep in mind that there have been for quite a few years now 2 certain fairly large companies selling videos of this exact type of content during late night TV and on infomercials. The company that provides our public nudity content has been taking photos since the 60's, shooting video since the mid-80's, and selling videos online to a very loyal fan base since 1997.

Basically, the legalities boil down to this. Most States in the US recognize that individuals have a right to privacy, and a right to be protected from intrusions. A place where a person has this right is any place where any reasonable person would believe that she could disrobe in privacy, without being viewed, photographed, or filmed by another. Obviously, individuals appearing in a wet t-shirt contest, public Mardi Gra event, or other public place, where they are being openly photographed will have no reasonable expectation of privacy. There is also a clause that has been used obtaining to the journalistic attempt to portray those sexual aspects of society that are often overlooked of avoided by traditional media (such as public nudity, exhibitionism, lewd and lascivious behavior, flashers.)"

The key phrase here is "reasonable expectation of privacy".

Some girl flashing her tits in a public place for a guy holding a camera, doesn't have a "reasonable expectation of privacy".

If you kick open the door in the restroom and catch someone on the toilet, they would have a "reasonable expectation of privacy".

What you CANNOT do, is use these images to PROMOTE your product without a release.

That's why GGW, for example, only used paid models on their covers and commercials. They were sued by someone who's image they used on one of their first video covers, without a release. She won the right to have her picture removed from their product. The amount of compensation she received? Zero dollars and zero cents.

So can i have your input please?

Thanks in advance.

lil2rich4u2 · 05-18-2003, 08:55 PM

Even in his post, i see this line:

"What you CANNOT do, is use these images to PROMOTE your product without a release."

That means even if that "expectation of privacy" is not an issue, and i can snap and publish all i want .... this means i canot profit off them?

slapass · 05-18-2003, 08:58 PM

I have heard the same rational. If they are in public and it is obvious they can be photographed then it is legal but do not promote with them.

lil2rich4u2 · 05-18-2003, 09:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by slapass
I have heard the same rational. If they are in public and it is obvious they can be photographed then it is legal but do not promote with them.

Ripping this logic apart, i see this ...

I cannot have them on my front page or splash, as that would be promoting with them.

I can however have paid models on my splash, and have my public pics inside? That would be more like "SELLING" them .... i would THINK selling them is worst than promoting them ... but im just going by the way i see it worded everywhere.

So looking at GGW ... they have paid models on cover, but public pics on inside of DVD .... i think this is same thing.

alan-l · 05-18-2003, 09:03 PM

just play safe, I remember of somebody who sued a site portraying a pic of her at a party. Make him give you IDs to the least, but I'd advice 2257 all the way

lil2rich4u2 · 05-18-2003, 09:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by alan-l
just play safe, I remember of somebody who sued a site portraying a pic of her at a party. Make him give you IDs to the least, but I'd advice 2257 all the way

Well its not really easy i think.

Getting few hundred pics per night is not a problem, but getting few hundred pics with release signed from each one of the persons in pics is a bitch.

Now if i need ID ... that means he has to do 1 of 3 things:

#1. shoot a pic, then go beg the girl to hold up her ID and sign at the dotted line

#2. have women sign and hold ID up, then stage all the pics

#3. have everyone in the club hold up there ID for a pic at the door upon entry and snap at will inside.

Lets be realistic .... #3 is out of the question, lol

#2 i think it would be hard to have these amateur drunk girls stage a good pic

#1 i dunno, thats why im asking here, heh

Paul Markham · 05-18-2003, 09:25 PM

I can see why you are asking this question here. The number of legal brains here where else would you ask?

So if one of the girls you shoot has a Dad who's an ambulance chasing lawyer and decides to sue you, your host, billing billing company and sponsor your defense will be.

THE GUYS ON GFY SAID IT WAS ALRIGHT.

Case dismissed.

Ever thought of asking a lawyer?

LiveDose · 05-18-2003, 09:25 PM

lil2rich4u2 · 05-18-2003, 09:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by charly
I can see why you are asking this question here. The number of legal brains here where else would you ask?

So if one of the girls you shoot has a Dad who's an ambulance chasing lawyer and decides to sue you, your host, billing billing company and sponsor your defense will be.

THE GUYS ON GFY SAID IT WAS ALRIGHT.

Case dismissed.

Ever thought of asking a lawyer?

Charly,

I just figured theres alot of oldtimer content guys here who would know for fact what the laws are.

As old as this biz is, and as many ppl are in it now ... theres not a chance in hell i am the only one working this idea.

Naturally before i begin production ill have to dish out for a consultation fee, just hoping to kill some of the doubt in my mind before dumping any cash.

thepornoguy · 05-18-2003, 09:36 PM

In my infamous opinion.......

any publicity is good advertising the worst the publicity the better the advertising......

So my

is if you do it and you think you might get sued make sure the upside is worth the cost of defense and then milk it for all it is worth.

Kronic is right on target according to my lawyers

If you think you are alone no go

But if you know you are not alone anything goes

The issue over promote is that you are using someones image to brand a product and you have no release for that

If you are displaying the content then you are only sharing images and videos that are represented as this happened and we caught it on film

See the difference?

The promoting is not what the person intended who was the subject of the content

Butt the person did intend to be seen while doing whatever it was they were doing when the images were acquired.......

my

and probably worth less than half of that.......

lil2rich4u2 · 05-18-2003, 09:41 PM

I understand.

Its still that "promoting" that is getting to me, i can easily hire some models to snap for my splash and tours, and have all the public stuff inside. However this leaves me with "making a profit on public pics" and i THINK is a no-no

I have a real estate lawyer who has some friends, im going to see if i can just jot down the situation and have him advise me legally rather than leaving it all open.

My only reason for posting this is that i thought someone has crossed this bridge before and had some experience to share.

No biggie i supose.

Paul Markham · 05-18-2003, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by lil2rich4u2

Charly,

I just figured theres alot of oldtimer content guys here who would know for fact what the laws are.

As old as this biz is, and as many ppl are in it now ... theres not a chance in hell i am the only one working this idea.

Naturally before i begin production ill have to dish out for a consultation fee, just hoping to kill some of the doubt in my mind before dumping any cash.

I understand and know you probably will ask a lawyer, but how many newbies on this board will just think "They said it was cool" and go ahead and do it?

Here's a thought and again I say ask a lawyer, what if the club had a notice up, that people may have their pictures taken inside the club for promotional purposes?

prostock · 05-18-2003, 11:48 PM

well guys to me i think alot of you are missing that big sign that nor is by the door and i think this is what we all need to think about and this i think will NOT MAKE IT PUBLIC CONTENT

for damn sure all go go or strip barrs i have ever been in , in any country they have from all i can remember always have two things on that sign
1 NO GUNS ( FIRE ARMS
2 NO PIC TAKEN OR NO CAMERAS

so NOW think on that one and if i was you littlerich i would go to that club and look all around for any shit on a sign as well before you even wast the cash with the lawer look for that shit first

05-18-2003, 09:25 PM	#7
Paul Markham Too old to care Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: On the sofa, watching TV or doing my jigsaws. Posts: 52,943	I can see why you are asking this question here. The number of legal brains here where else would you ask? So if one of the girls you shoot has a Dad who's an ambulance chasing lawyer and decides to sue you, your host, billing billing company and sponsor your defense will be. THE GUYS ON GFY SAID IT WAS ALRIGHT. Case dismissed. Ever thought of asking a lawyer? __________________ Blowout deal. 880 videos, 2,400 image sets, plus many RAW videos. $500. PM me for a deal. Skype Paulmarkham70

05-18-2003, 09:25 PM	#8
LiveDose Show Yer Tits! Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Somewhere Out there... Posts: 25,792	__________________ Scammer Alert: acer19 acer [email protected] [email protected] Money stolen using PayPal

05-18-2003, 09:36 PM	#10
thepornoguy Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Online Posts: 163	In my infamous opinion....... any publicity is good advertising the worst the publicity the better the advertising...... So my is if you do it and you think you might get sued make sure the upside is worth the cost of defense and then milk it for all it is worth. Kronic is right on target according to my lawyers If you think you are alone no go But if you know you are not alone anything goes The issue over promote is that you are using someones image to brand a product and you have no release for that If you are displaying the content then you are only sharing images and videos that are represented as this happened and we caught it on film See the difference? The promoting is not what the person intended who was the subject of the content Butt the person did intend to be seen while doing whatever it was they were doing when the images were acquired....... my and probably worth less than half of that....... __________________ John 'TPG' Smith Poonhound FREE CASH iKobo The new paypal for adult webmasters Hosted exclusively by <a href=http://69adulthost.com>http://69adulthost.com</a>

05-18-2003, 09:41 PM	#11
lil2rich4u2 ICQ: 175171926 Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: New York, NY Posts: 11,046	I understand. Its still that "promoting" that is getting to me, i can easily hire some models to snap for my splash and tours, and have all the public stuff inside. However this leaves me with "making a profit on public pics" and i THINK is a no-no I have a real estate lawyer who has some friends, im going to see if i can just jot down the situation and have him advise me legally rather than leaving it all open. My only reason for posting this is that i thought someone has crossed this bridge before and had some experience to share. No biggie i supose. __________________ HEY!! Unbeatable hosting! Customer service is top notch! --> ISPrime <-- Do a search on any board, their reputation is rock solid .. for years!!

05-18-2003, 11:48 PM	#13
prostock On probation Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: not telling you , the exwife might find me Posts: 4,160	well guys to me i think alot of you are missing that big sign that nor is by the door and i think this is what we all need to think about and this i think will NOT MAKE IT PUBLIC CONTENT for damn sure all go go or strip barrs i have ever been in , in any country they have from all i can remember always have two things on that sign 1 NO GUNS ( FIRE ARMS 2 NO PIC TAKEN OR NO CAMERAS so NOW think on that one and if i was you littlerich i would go to that club and look all around for any shit on a sign as well before you even wast the cash with the lawer look for that shit first __________________ ICQ # :158519717

05-18-2003, 08:55 PM	#2
lil2rich4u2 ICQ: 175171926 Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: New York, NY Posts: 11,046	Even in his post, i see this line: "What you CANNOT do, is use these images to PROMOTE your product without a release." That means even if that "expectation of privacy" is not an issue, and i can snap and publish all i want .... this means i canot profit off them? __________________ HEY!! Unbeatable hosting! Customer service is top notch! --> ISPrime <-- Do a search on any board, their reputation is rock solid .. for years!!

05-18-2003, 08:58 PM	#3
slapass Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Earth Posts: 14,622	I have heard the same rational. If they are in public and it is obvious they can be photographed then it is legal but do not promote with them.

05-18-2003, 09:03 PM	#5
alan-l Confirmed User Join Date: May 2003 Location: look behind you Posts: 2,477	just play safe, I remember of somebody who sued a site portraying a pic of her at a party. Make him give you IDs to the least, but I'd advice 2257 all the way