What is the failure rate of people in this business? - GoFuckYourself.com

hybrid · 05-04-2003, 04:10 AM

It's been stated that only like 5% of B&M businesses will actually make it.

What do you think the percentages of webmasters that do/don't make it are? Why?

And don't go posting some stupid shit like "0", it's too predictable.

quiet · 05-04-2003, 04:21 AM

zero.

who fucking knows. depends on many things. like what you consider success. and building a successful tgp vs avs vs building a paysite vs building a payment solution vs hosting vs spam vs you name it are very different things.

Jakke PNG · 05-04-2003, 04:22 AM

A fucking lot. But you have to define failure. A shitload of people come to this industry with 0 investment.. you can't really fail with 0$ if you don't take a loan. It's just wasted time then.

The Other Steve · 05-04-2003, 04:33 AM

Well if you mean the make it - as in stay in the industry making money - I think the answer these days is - not many.

Gutterboy · 05-04-2003, 04:35 AM

From what I saw when I read TNB and VNWR regularly, I'd say close to 90% of newbies who posted introduction never make it past 6 months.

As others have said tho.. what defines faliure? Some of those newbies were college students who made no investment.. free hosts, free content etc.. and just wanted summer beer money out of it.

Paul Markham · 05-04-2003, 04:36 AM

All i can say is that when we send out an update email to registered webmasters 10-12% are returned as "Undeliverable"

They just faded away. Luckily it is rarely the guys that bought.

tical · 05-04-2003, 04:40 AM

8hahahahaD

xenigo · 05-04-2003, 04:52 AM

This is a pretty fucking sad thread. Seriously, you can make money if you bring something unique to the market that nobody else is offering. If you create something that's unique, that nobody else offers, and of course offer a product that's in demand, and if you know how to market your product I think you'll be fine. Yeah, I think there's a lot of people that get into this business expecting to get something for nothing, and I think those are most of the people that disappear after a while... expecting to just be handed the money. I think a lot of people don't understand that you have to actually WORK to make money in this business. It sure as hell isn't free money. Nobody's just handing it to you.

But I also think that if you have something to offer, you'll do fine. The success / failure rate in this business is probably pretty similar to any other business. There's always going to be people expecting a free ride.

nicchick · 05-04-2003, 05:49 AM

The first 6 months I was in this business, I probably didn't make a buck an hour. Now 2 years later, its more like 30 bucks an hour.
You just have to keep plugging and keep learning- Most people don't have the patience.

SomeCreep · 05-04-2003, 05:57 AM

I dont know about failure stats for the adult biz, but I have read that 90% of small businesses fail (go out of business) and more than half dont make money until after their first 6 months.

StacyCat · 05-04-2003, 06:06 AM

Im here after 6 months, and I was profitible my first month out (as in, covering my recurring expenses)

wimpy · 05-04-2003, 06:10 AM

define "failure"

hybrid · 05-04-2003, 06:18 AM

Quote:

8hahahahaD

WTF ?

Dveron · 05-04-2003, 06:43 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by wimpy
define "failure"

"Hello, this is McDonalds."
"Please can I have my old job back?"

genomega · 05-04-2003, 07:27 AM

96% fail.

How many people are willing to work 12-14 hours a day?

KRL · 05-04-2003, 08:13 AM

A lot of people jump into adult as a secondary income so you do see a longer survival rate because they have other income to fall back on as they get their sites going.

Most of the failure comes from not so much lack of revenues, but the realization that this business isn't as easy as they thought it would be and requires round the clock 7 days per week of your attention if you want it to grow into a serious business that can support you full time.

A lot of people also don't realize all the legal issues they have to deal with when they jump in. Even basic ones like setting up corps or LLC to start building insulation layers and such. Or content legalities, etc.

Its pretty hard to fail in this business if you work hard, learn the tricks and ins and outs from the guys who have been in it for a while, are creative and do your homework daily, and have some general marketing and promotion skills.

The guys who become whales are typically great also at market analysis and finding the niche voids that aren't being served well by current sites. And then build out their own affiliate programs. Or guys who setup large scale deals to service the webmaster community. There's a lot of money in providing the tools to the gold prospectors.

Overall I'd estimate 10%-20% come in and leave within 12 months for whatever reason. So the chances are pretty much in your favor to succeed if you do it right and don't cut corners.

quiet · 05-04-2003, 08:19 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by KRL
A lot of people jump into adult as a secondary income so you do see a longer survival rate because they have other income to fall back on as they get their sites going.

Most of the failure comes from not so much lack of revenues, but the realization that this business isn't as easy as they thought it would be and requires round the clock 7 days per week of your attention if you want it to grow into a serious business that can support you full time.

A lot of people also don't realize all the legal issues they have to deal with when they jump in. Even basic ones like setting up corps or LLC to start building insulation layers and such. Or content legalities, etc.

Its pretty hard to fail in this business if you work hard, learn the tricks and ins and outs from the guys who have been in it for a while, are creative and do your homework daily, and have some general marketing and promotion skills.

The guys who become whales are typically great also at market analysis and finding the niche voids that aren't being served well by current sites. And then build out their own affiliate programs. Or guys who setup large scale deals to service the webmaster community. There's a lot of money in providing the tools to the gold prospectors.

Overall I'd estimate 10%-20% come in and leave within 12 months for whatever reason. So the chances are pretty much in your favor to succeed if you do it right and don't cut corners.

i like most of your posts. but are you saying 80 percent manage to stay?

lol

Matt 26z · 05-04-2003, 08:22 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by genomega

How many people are willing to work 12-14 hours a day?

Spending that kind of time, AND MORE, in this biz doesn't necessarily equal a compensation to justify the hours worked..... or even anywhere near there. That's for damn well sure.

KRL · 05-04-2003, 08:24 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by quiet

i like most of your posts. but are you saying 80 percent manage to stay?

lol

What I'm saying is 10-20% just plain out fall on their butts and drop completely, but a large number just continue on as a side biz never really turning it into a full time deal, where they might make a few hundred to a couple thousand a month. You see a lot of people here even posting how they have day jobs.

But you're right only a small percent turn it into a full time 6 figure or higher serious business.

quiet · 05-04-2003, 08:31 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by KRL

What I'm saying is 10-20% just plain out fall on their butts and drop completely, but a large number just continue on as a side biz never really turning it into a full time deal, where they might make a few hundred to a couple thousand a month. You see a lot of people here even posting how they have day jobs.

But you're right only a small percent turn it into a full time 6 figure or higher serious business.

i'd say very few even actually end up making beer money.

Mutt · 05-04-2003, 08:31 AM

it's not just kids and the unemployed who've come in and tried their luck and given up in 6 months. There are LOTS of people who've come in with fairly big investments, 100,000 and up, who had big expectations and found out there is a whole lot more to this than they imagine.

i profited a fair bit from one of these people

KRL · 05-04-2003, 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mutt
it's not just kids and the unemployed who've come in and tried their luck and given up in 6 months. There are LOTS of people who've come in with fairly big investments, 100,000 and up, who had big expectations and found out there is a whole lot more to this than they imagine.

i profited a fair bit from one of these people

Very true Mutt.

Mutt · 05-04-2003, 08:34 AM

biggest flameout i've ever seen personally is somebody who came in with about a million bucks, not sure he spent it all - but he disappeared within a year.

KRL · 05-04-2003, 08:36 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mutt
biggest flameout i've ever seen personally is somebody who came in with about a million bucks, not sure he spent it all - but he disappeared within a year.

Damn, what sites?

quiet · 05-04-2003, 08:38 AM

the most amazing thing for me, is reading this board for the past couple of years - all the scamming.

i've been in this biz full time sinc 96, and the few times of been scammed, i learned. now i just watch and laugh. i'll never understand the big deal over being ripped off. you got fucked. you'd do much better simply avoiding that situation from now on...

very strange.

quiet · 05-04-2003, 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mutt
biggest flameout i've ever seen personally is somebody who came in with about a million bucks, not sure he spent it all - but he disappeared within a year.

a couple of years ago, this paysite proggy paid for david lee roth (i believe) at an internext. they were going to take over the internet. it was hilarious.

KRL · 05-04-2003, 08:44 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by quiet

a couple of years ago, this paysite proggy paid for david lee roth (i believe) at an internext. they were going to take over the internet. it was hilarious.

From all I can remember over the years the biggest flameout has to be Seth and IEG. He was really doing huge volume and had huge market share and then just sank his ship into total oblivion.

Mutt · 05-04-2003, 08:53 AM

the flameout i'm talking about - maybe somebody else who goes back 5 or 6 years will remember full details.

They had a content division and a paysite/webmaster affilliate program. What I had heard was that the guy who invested all the money had actually won a state lottery - millions. Guess he thought this biz would be fun and he could make some more millions out of it.

I can still see the website in my mind but i can't remember the name.

NetRodent · 05-04-2003, 08:53 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by quiet
the most amazing thing for me, is reading this board for the past couple of years - all the scamming.

i've been in this biz full time sinc 96, and the few times of been scammed, i learned. now i just watch and laugh. i'll never understand the big deal over being ripped off. you got fucked. you'd do much better simply avoiding that situation from now on...

very strange.

Yup. Don't air your dirty laundry it public. It looks bad for all involved.

quiet · 05-04-2003, 09:02 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by KRL

From all I can remember over the years the biggest flameout has to be Seth and IEG. He was really doing huge volume and had huge market share and then just sank his ship into total oblivion.

the only difference being that Seth W. made huge money... regardless of his mexico thing now....

gruffy · 05-04-2003, 09:02 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mutt
biggest flameout i've ever seen personally is somebody who came in with about a million bucks, not sure he spent it all - but he disappeared within a year.

Nice.

Well, let's say if you can come in with zero - and be making something you can live off of within 3-4 months you are golden.

It means you have aquired enough skills and intelligence to survive.

Sure you may have to be a TGP piker and whore out affiliate programs, but how much money could you make off a million dollars of financial backing after a few years of the rough and tumble?

Hooper · 05-04-2003, 09:10 AM

Mutt.. you're talking about Hanco... the guy spent close to 10mil. He pissed everybody off though, so nobody would send him traffic.

Apparently his father one a lottery and gave him the $... so it was found money..

but still...

I think an interesting fact is the stigma associated with the biz.

Name another business where everybody thinks it's "cute" when you make a few bucks from it... but once you go full time and start being successul they call you a scum bag.

I know quite a few people who left porn just cause their extended family disowned them.

Mutt · 05-04-2003, 09:15 AM

good memory Hooper - HANCO.

u think it's possible he could have dropped that much money?

i can see ONE million, hard to fathom more than that.

Hooper · 05-04-2003, 10:44 AM

I wouldnt be suprised if he burned up a mil at that internext show alone... that rotating bar inside the booth.. all the fabio lookalikes standing around grutning.. the parties.. a huge staff...

ok.. maybe 400-500k i could see on that show.

most of what i know about hanco is rumor mill crapola. although i do remember some idiot sales rep calling me on the phone harassing us for traffic..

we finally told them to fuck off and put us on their do not call list ;-)

steffie · 05-04-2003, 11:48 AM

Depents what you consider failure..

I started in this business with having another fulltime job. My goal was to make as much money as in my fulltime job so I wouldn't have to leave the house and work for somebody else.

I succeeded..

No I don't make money like quite or other big time hitters on here, however.... that said..

I make enough to stay at home, travel when I want, own homes and vehicles and don't have to work for somebody else.

For some people this business is a success if they make enough so they don't have to leave and work for another.

For other people if you don't make the kind of money as quite youre a failure.

So, you do have to define failure. Some moms who don't work and now make 500 bucks per month on livecam as extra income are considering themselves a success.

It's all how you look at it

xoxox

booker · 05-04-2003, 12:55 PM

Hard work beats talent when talent doesn't work hard. When I meet my personal goals, however high or low they may be, that is success. If I come up short but keep trying and finally make it, or come up short again, that is success. If I quit without giving it an honest effort, that is failure.

05-04-2003, 04:10 AM	#1
hybrid So Fucking Banned Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Backseat of a Ford Escort Hatchback Posts: 3,253	What is the failure rate of people in this business? It's been stated that only like 5% of B&M businesses will actually make it. What do you think the percentages of webmasters that do/don't make it are? Why? And don't go posting some stupid shit like "0", it's too predictable.

05-04-2003, 04:22 AM	#3
Jakke PNG ex-TeenGodFather Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Suomi Finland Perkele Posts: 20,306	A fucking lot. But you have to define failure. A shitload of people come to this industry with 0 investment.. you can't really fail with 0$ if you don't take a loan. It's just wasted time then. __________________ ..and I'm off.

05-04-2003, 04:33 AM	#4
The Other Steve Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Sunny Queensland - perfect one day and better the next. Posts: 2,106	Well if you mean the make it - as in stay in the industry making money - I think the answer these days is - not many. __________________ Left intentionally blank ... just like my brain

05-04-2003, 04:35 AM	#5
Gutterboy So Fucking Banned Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Dis Posts: 4,751	From what I saw when I read TNB and VNWR regularly, I'd say close to 90% of newbies who posted introduction never make it past 6 months. As others have said tho.. what defines faliure? Some of those newbies were college students who made no investment.. free hosts, free content etc.. and just wanted summer beer money out of it. Last edited by Gutterboy; 05-04-2003 at 04:40 AM..

05-04-2003, 04:36 AM	#6
Paul Markham Too old to care Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: On the sofa, watching TV or doing my jigsaws. Posts: 52,943	All i can say is that when we send out an update email to registered webmasters 10-12% are returned as "Undeliverable" They just faded away. Luckily it is rarely the guys that bought. __________________ Blowout deal. 880 videos, 2,400 image sets, plus many RAW videos. $500. PM me for a deal. Skype Paulmarkham70

05-04-2003, 04:21 AM	#2
quiet we'll miss you our friend. RIP Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Fernie, BC Posts: 25,115	zero. who fucking knows. depends on many things. like what you consider success. and building a successful tgp vs avs vs building a paysite vs building a payment solution vs hosting vs spam vs you name it are very different things.

05-04-2003, 04:40 AM	#7
tical Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Las Vegas Posts: 6,504	8hahahahaD

05-04-2003, 04:52 AM	#8
xenigo Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Oakland, CA Posts: 8,067	This is a pretty fucking sad thread. Seriously, you can make money if you bring something unique to the market that nobody else is offering. If you create something that's unique, that nobody else offers, and of course offer a product that's in demand, and if you know how to market your product I think you'll be fine. Yeah, I think there's a lot of people that get into this business expecting to get something for nothing, and I think those are most of the people that disappear after a while... expecting to just be handed the money. I think a lot of people don't understand that you have to actually WORK to make money in this business. It sure as hell isn't free money. Nobody's just handing it to you. But I also think that if you have something to offer, you'll do fine. The success / failure rate in this business is probably pretty similar to any other business. There's always going to be people expecting a free ride.

05-04-2003, 05:49 AM	#9
nicchick Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 316	The first 6 months I was in this business, I probably didn't make a buck an hour. Now 2 years later, its more like 30 bucks an hour. You just have to keep plugging and keep learning- Most people don't have the patience.

05-04-2003, 05:57 AM	#10
SomeCreep :glugglug Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Where the Wild Things Are Posts: 26,118	I dont know about failure stats for the adult biz, but I have read that 90% of small businesses fail (go out of business) and more than half dont make money until after their first 6 months. __________________ Webair Hosting I use and recommend Webair for hosting.

05-04-2003, 06:06 AM	#11
StacyCat Confirmed User Join Date: May 2002 Location: Texas Posts: 1,167	Im here after 6 months, and I was profitible my first month out (as in, covering my recurring expenses)

05-04-2003, 06:10 AM	#12
wimpy Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Cali Posts: 607	define "failure" __________________ Fyodor Dostoyevsky wrote: "Every man has reminiscences which he would not tell to everyone but only his friends. He has other matters in his mind which he would not reveal even to his friends, but only to himself, and that in secret. But there are other things which a man is afraid to tell even to himself, and every decent man has a number of such things stored away in his mind." icq 8243657

05-04-2003, 07:27 AM	#15
genomega Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: NW Florida Posts: 1,190	96% fail. How many people are willing to work 12-14 hours a day? __________________ No Jerk TGP Gallery Monitor MoneyBookers

05-04-2003, 08:13 AM	#16
KRL Entrepreneur Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: USA Posts: 31,429	A lot of people jump into adult as a secondary income so you do see a longer survival rate because they have other income to fall back on as they get their sites going. Most of the failure comes from not so much lack of revenues, but the realization that this business isn't as easy as they thought it would be and requires round the clock 7 days per week of your attention if you want it to grow into a serious business that can support you full time. A lot of people also don't realize all the legal issues they have to deal with when they jump in. Even basic ones like setting up corps or LLC to start building insulation layers and such. Or content legalities, etc. Its pretty hard to fail in this business if you work hard, learn the tricks and ins and outs from the guys who have been in it for a while, are creative and do your homework daily, and have some general marketing and promotion skills. The guys who become whales are typically great also at market analysis and finding the niche voids that aren't being served well by current sites. And then build out their own affiliate programs. Or guys who setup large scale deals to service the webmaster community. There's a lot of money in providing the tools to the gold prospectors. Overall I'd estimate 10%-20% come in and leave within 12 months for whatever reason. So the chances are pretty much in your favor to succeed if you do it right and don't cut corners. __________________ If you would like to develop your domains, you can lease inexpensive foreign labor from the leaders in the field at iWebmasters.com TO LOWER YOUR COSTS AND INCREASE YOUR PRODUCTION! * * * * * * * * * * * * Domains Adult News KRL's Newsletter Biz Tips Just Listed Domains

05-04-2003, 08:31 AM	#21
Mutt Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 34,431	it's not just kids and the unemployed who've come in and tried their luck and given up in 6 months. There are LOTS of people who've come in with fairly big investments, 100,000 and up, who had big expectations and found out there is a whole lot more to this than they imagine. i profited a fair bit from one of these people __________________ I moved my sites to Vacares Hosting. I've saved money, my hair is thicker, lost some weight too! Thanks Sly!

05-04-2003, 08:34 AM	#23
Mutt Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 34,431	biggest flameout i've ever seen personally is somebody who came in with about a million bucks, not sure he spent it all - but he disappeared within a year. __________________ I moved my sites to Vacares Hosting. I've saved money, my hair is thicker, lost some weight too! Thanks Sly!

05-04-2003, 08:38 AM	#25
quiet we'll miss you our friend. RIP Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Fernie, BC Posts: 25,115	the most amazing thing for me, is reading this board for the past couple of years - all the scamming. i've been in this biz full time sinc 96, and the few times of been scammed, i learned. now i just watch and laugh. i'll never understand the big deal over being ripped off. you got fucked. you'd do much better simply avoiding that situation from now on... very strange. __________________ we'll miss you our friend. RIP

05-04-2003, 08:53 AM	#28
Mutt Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 34,431	the flameout i'm talking about - maybe somebody else who goes back 5 or 6 years will remember full details. They had a content division and a paysite/webmaster affilliate program. What I had heard was that the guy who invested all the money had actually won a state lottery - millions. Guess he thought this biz would be fun and he could make some more millions out of it. I can still see the website in my mind but i can't remember the name. __________________ I moved my sites to Vacares Hosting. I've saved money, my hair is thicker, lost some weight too! Thanks Sly!

05-04-2003, 09:10 AM	#32
Hooper Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: A Free America Posts: 2,210	Mutt.. you're talking about Hanco... the guy spent close to 10mil. He pissed everybody off though, so nobody would send him traffic. Apparently his father one a lottery and gave him the $... so it was found money.. but still... I think an interesting fact is the stigma associated with the biz. Name another business where everybody thinks it's "cute" when you make a few bucks from it... but once you go full time and start being successul they call you a scum bag. I know quite a few people who left porn just cause their extended family disowned them. __________________ <a href="http://www.adultplatinum.com/"><img src="http://www.adult.com/wmbanners/10dcash-468x60.gif"></a>

05-04-2003, 09:15 AM	#33
Mutt Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 34,431	good memory Hooper - HANCO. u think it's possible he could have dropped that much money? i can see ONE million, hard to fathom more than that. __________________ I moved my sites to Vacares Hosting. I've saved money, my hair is thicker, lost some weight too! Thanks Sly!

05-04-2003, 10:44 AM	#34
Hooper Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: A Free America Posts: 2,210	I wouldnt be suprised if he burned up a mil at that internext show alone... that rotating bar inside the booth.. all the fabio lookalikes standing around grutning.. the parties.. a huge staff... ok.. maybe 400-500k i could see on that show. most of what i know about hanco is rumor mill crapola. although i do remember some idiot sales rep calling me on the phone harassing us for traffic.. we finally told them to fuck off and put us on their do not call list ;-) __________________ <a href="http://www.adultplatinum.com/"><img src="http://www.adult.com/wmbanners/10dcash-468x60.gif"></a>

05-04-2003, 11:48 AM	#35
steffie Confirmed User Join Date: May 2002 Location: Somewhere in the Mountains, far far away Posts: 2,422	Depents what you consider failure.. I started in this business with having another fulltime job. My goal was to make as much money as in my fulltime job so I wouldn't have to leave the house and work for somebody else. I succeeded.. No I don't make money like quite or other big time hitters on here, however.... that said.. I make enough to stay at home, travel when I want, own homes and vehicles and don't have to work for somebody else. For some people this business is a success if they make enough so they don't have to leave and work for another. For other people if you don't make the kind of money as quite youre a failure. So, you do have to define failure. Some moms who don't work and now make 500 bucks per month on livecam as extra income are considering themselves a success. It's all how you look at it xoxox __________________ Partying since '96 and not going anywhere Anna's Dorm

05-04-2003, 12:55 PM	#36
booker Confirmed User Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Baltimore Posts: 1,370	Hard work beats talent when talent doesn't work hard. When I meet my personal goals, however high or low they may be, that is success. If I come up short but keep trying and finally make it, or come up short again, that is success. If I quit without giving it an honest effort, that is failure. __________________ Xanadu024 (aim) or 286785389 (icq) "Hard work beats talent when talent doesn't work hard."