Where is my REFUND ? Where is that tax break ?

[VRPdommy]

Not that you were not warned ! Tax breaks do not mean tax rebate. Just withholding were lowered to make you feel richer and spend more !

But if you have lots of rental property, you probably made out the best in all of this.

https://www.nbcnews.com/business/tax...refund-n969366

[Bladewire]

Trump supporters have been posting online how pissed they are saying that they make the same amount of money last year and they're paying $1,300 in taxes and no refund, most have seen huge reductions in their refunds etc etc.

Trump Voters Are Turning On Him After Realizing That They’re Being Screwed By The GOP Tax Plan

[RedFred]

My taxes are $2800 higher than last year. Glad I could make billionaires richer.

[Bladewire]

Originally Posted by RedFred

My taxes are $2800 higher than last year. Glad I could make billionaires richer.

Damn that's sucks!

[kane]

I have a friend who is a big Trump supporter and has been talking about the extra money he has been getting from the tax cut all year. With the tax law changes, his refund will be about half as much as it was last year. Turns out his tax cut wasn't nearly as much as he thought.

[Rochard]

A lot of people are complaining about this on FB. I am guessing the complaints will get louder the closer we get to tax time.

[blackmonsters]

[TampaToker]

You guys so full of shit lol i just did my daughters and all of my family members taxes and they all are getting more money back then the did last year.

[kane]

Originally Posted by TampaToker

You guys so full of shit lol i just did my daughters and all of my family members taxes and they all are getting more money back then the did last year.

It depends on your situation. My friend and his wife had a lot of write-offs in the past that are no longer allowed because they were replaced by a bigger standard deduction. The new deduction isn't as big as the itemized deductions were. Also they both did make a little more during the year because of the tax cut which put them in a slightly higher bracket.

In the end, when all the math is done, my buddy and his wife will end up bringing in about 2% more than they did last year. So they will see a slight increase, but in my state inflation was about 3% last year, so they really just broke even at best.

I just read that so far, as filing gets under way, the average refund this year is about 8.5% less than last year. Of course, it is still very early in the tax season.

[GAMEFINEST]

I need a tax break

[VRPdommy]

The structure of this was the same as any other break.
It has been done 3 times in my lifetime and you would think by now folks would not buy it. They pass this stuff so fast, nobody really has a chance to review it for true implications.
And the deviling details are always written after the bill has past while in some sub-committee where words meet the deed. That is where the hocus-pocus is done.

Those that are making out better will be in a minority. Mainly those with little income where the standard deduction discounts more taxable income.

But, we know the top 3% made out pretty well. Many saved more than I make. Think about that.

I'm sure this will bring out a mess of new proposals, it has in the past.
Watch out for the catch phrases of FAIR TAX etc, where they eliminate corporate ITX with sales tax (corp don't pay sales tax, you do)

I have had it in my head for 20 years now that the only fair thing to do is make the personal income tax rate the same for everyone. Anything less is discrimination.
Nobody should be able to have a tax break on personal taxes that everyone can't have the possibility of.

Lets say the rate is 18%
To help those at the lower end of the scale without discriminating the top, everyone gets a standard deduction of 15k and 4k for dependents, blind, etc.

Everyone gets the same qualifying rates and deductions.

You should not get a rate discount for the volume of money you made. We are all the same here and should be treated as such.

That's it. Postcard size just like Trump promised ! When is that coming anyhow ?

[thommy]

Originally Posted by GAMEFINEST

I need a tax break

i think, what you need is a break from the tax break.

i am not american and not really familiar with the tax laws there but even for me it was clear from the start that the small ones, that take care their properties will pay the bill.

the guys that rent and do nothing (slum owners) will benefit on the short term but even they can not prevent years with higher costs on the long term.

but this is what trump supporters are well known for. they vote for things that they do not understand.

[Rochard]

So the middle class is going to pay more taxes, the rich get a huge tax cut, businesses got a huge tax cut, the economy has not done what Trump hoped, and our deficit went through the roof for no reason.

Are we tired of this winning yet?

[crockett]

Originally Posted by TampaToker

You guys so full of shit lol i just did my daughters and all of my family members taxes and they all are getting more money back then the did last year.

TampaToker did his daughter's taxes with the 2016 version of eztax..

[Bladewire]

[VRPdommy]

Originally Posted by Bladewire

...LOL...

[SBJ]

This thread needs a manga hat

[2MuchMark]

Average tax refund down 8% so far this season

(CNN)Tax season is off to a slower start this year, with early filers seeing smaller average refunds.

"The average refund is down about 8% under the first full year of the overhauled tax code, according to data released by the IRS on Friday. Refunds averaged $1,865 compared to $2,035 for tax year 2017."

https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/09/polit...ata/index.html

[Robbie]

Guys...tax "refunds" only happen because you paid too much tax in the first place from withholding taxes.

The govt. took your money and kept it for a year interest free.

The LESS "tax refund" you get at the end of the year...the better off you did that year.

Getting a lump sum at the end of the year makes you "feel" good.
But those of us who actually own their own business and PAY taxes by writing a big ass check to the govt. every quarter know better.

[RedFred]

Originally Posted by Robbie

Guys...tax "refunds" only happen because you paid too much tax in the first place from withholding taxes.

[GAMEFINEST]

There goes my porn collection

[pimpmaster9000]

paul-markham-o-nomics...rearrange the seats on the titanic and focus on the passengers that got the window seats...kinda like trumps china tarrifs...china will buy more but others will buy less...but focus just on china buying more

pathetic magic beaners believing in a populists magic beans

[directfiesta]

Originally Posted by TampaToker

You guys so full of shit lol i just did my daughters and all of my family members taxes and they all are getting more money back then the did last year.

Why am I not surprised.....

[BaldBastard]

Do not forget for a second your paying the extra tariff tax as well ;)

[Bladewire]

Originally Posted by directfiesta

Why am I not surprised.....

[VRPdommy]

Probably going to take some time.... perhaps until late April...
To find out what the 'effective tax rate' has been for those around 200k 1M & 10M of personal income.

I might give odds that most at 1M & up have a ETR of 13% or less.

[RyuLion]

Originally Posted by SBJ

This thread needs a manga hat

Poor girl, she needs more practice..

[Bladewire]

Originally Posted by MrBaldBastard

Do not forget for a second your paying the extra tariff tax as well ;)

Republicans fuck 99% of the people over whenever they're in office. It's astounding how stupid their voter base is.

[ANAL PASTE]

Originally Posted by Robbie

Guys...tax "refunds" only happen because you paid too much tax in the first place from withholding taxes.

No shit captain cuckold.

[VRPdommy]

So, now, our national debt grows 10% in just one year 2018!
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...er/2849978002/

I wonder how close that is to the amount of savings to some in those tax cuts ?

[Robbie]

Originally Posted by VRPdommy

So, now, our national debt grows 10% in just one year 2018!
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...er/2849978002/

I wonder how close that is to the amount of savings to some in those tax cuts ?

My guess is that it's not much.

By the way, tax revenues ROSE in 2017 and 2018.
But the problem is spending. The Federal Govt. needs to stop spending. They are bringing in historically high revenue...but spending it even faster and running up a trillion dollar deficit.

We don't NEED to spend even more money on the freakin' military. 1.4 TRILLION in just 2 years.
We need to bring all that military home and close all the bases around the world that cost us so much money.

[Paul Markham]

Why do Americans expect a tax break? Your country is sinking into further debt because you don't pay enough taxes.

[RedFred]

Originally Posted by Robbie

My guess is that it's not much.

By the way, tax revenues ROSE in 2017 and 2018.

Where in the hell do you get your info from?


It’s Official: The Trump Tax Cuts Didn’t Pay for Themselves in Year One

Federal tax revenues declined in 2018 while economic growth accelerated, undercutting the Trump administration’s insistence that the $1.5 trillion tax package would pay for itself.

[VRPdommy]

Originally Posted by Robbie

My guess is that it's not much.

By the way, tax revenues ROSE in 2017 and 2018.
But the problem is spending. The Federal Govt. needs to stop spending. They are bringing in historically high revenue...but spending it even faster and running up a trillion dollar deficit.

We don't NEED to spend even more money on the freakin' military. 1.4 TRILLION in just 2 years.
We need to bring all that military home and close all the bases around the world that cost us so much money.

I agree.
The only problem with this is a Focal one.
Those on the right are always accusing those on the left of being the spenders.
OK... I'll go with that, but it is really a question of what they want to spend it on.
Those on the right use the issue to choke the FDA, EPA and any regulatory body the ability to enforce rules that they have no guts to repeal.

To give those on the right a bit of credit for actual Mil Spend need...
That is the fact that they have suddenly decided we are playing the wrong war game for the future and want to catch-up on that change instantly. Since the war in Iraq, things everywhere are changing rapidly.

I hate to say it in a way that sounds like politics, but if we had never went into Iraq, this would be such a different picture right now.
Be that as it may be, this is where we are.

Then again, we should have went into Syria much sooner, it would have made everything much easier. The right in congress were screaming for it and when POTUS started to make those moves, the right failed to support him on it and wanted him to hang from it.
So it became a larger mess requiring more money to fix.

In any case, this is where we are.
We need infrastructure spending. It's good for jobs and business needs and even the cost of business benefits from it. It's a no-brainer.
But I want it to be 'SMART SPENDING' NOT just just a bunch of money thrown around that end-up in some corrupt contractors hands.

But it's not going to happen till someone can figure out how to politically capitalize on the issue or it would have already because both sides know we need it.

I don't mind spending if it is a true investment in the future and I doubt many can make the case for some of this spending the last 4 years. Those tax breaks are a form of spending.

Revenue is up but spending is up much more.
I'm sorry to say that the current politics will not make a good new TAX PLAN for the future, but everyone knows we need it.

Perhaps they need to get on a good spending plan and get those priorities right first to determine a better tax plan.

If you have ever been around a government entity when they say the cost of a project is all this red tape....
It is true...
But most of that red-tape was put in place to avoid corruption of the money.
So when they take it off... guess what you get.
Those that police spending have no budget to do so.
How can anyone think this will turn out well.

[VRPdommy]

[VRPdommy]

Actually, the new December numbers are in with a $14B deficit.

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/02/13/us-p...-tax-cuts.html

I can see this getting progressively worse as the economy has little room to grow under the circumstances it is in.
So it will be more taxes for someone but who ?
It will mean spending cuts but for who ?

We know the incentive has been there to CUT those Socialist programs like Social Security...
perhaps that is where they will head.... I doubt it, but I'm sure they will manufacture a crisis to make a case for it.
History shows us twice that this is the path they take.

[RedFred]

Originally Posted by VRPdommy

We know the incentive has been there to CUT those Socialist programs like Social Security...
perhaps that is where they will head.... I doubt it, but I'm sure they will manufacture a crisis to make a case for it.
History shows us twice that this is the path they take.

Mitch McConnell says it out loud: Republicans are gunning for Social Security, Medicare and Obamacare next

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by Robbie

My guess is that it's not much.

By the way, tax revenues ROSE in 2017 and 2018.
But the problem is spending. The Federal Govt. needs to stop spending. They are bringing in historically high revenue...but spending it even faster and running up a trillion dollar deficit.

We don't NEED to spend even more money on the freakin' military. 1.4 TRILLION in just 2 years.
We need to bring all that military home and close all the bases around the world that cost us so much money.

Great. Then stop spending money. This is simple math. In the absolutely dumbest move ever done by a president, Trump manged to raise taxes for the average American, slashed taxes for the rich and big companies, spent more money and more money on our military, which means... He fucked the average American and shot our deficit through the roof.

How this good for anyone?

[Rochard]

Fox News is trying to spin the tax increase....

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/har...n-middle-class

They are saying "But, as fact checkers quickly pointed out, the size of one’s refund has more to do with how much was withheld for taxes over the course of the year rather than one’s overall tax burden." And they are right. In order to cover the tax increase, they would need to withhold more money because.... They need to pay more tax.

[beerptrol]

Chump ordered them to lower the % with held from pay checks so that paychecks looked bigger and people would think that the tax cuts were helping them. Chickens have come home to roost at tax return time

[King Mark]

All trump did was the same thing he always does...

[Robbie]

Originally Posted by VRPdommy

Those on the right are always accusing those on the left of being the spenders.

That's because the Republicans are just as big of liars as the Democrats. They ALL overspend.

I'm no expert...but it seems that back when the U.S. went off the gold standard and started printing money with nothing physical to back it up, it laid the groundwork for what we see today.
A govt. that is bloated and taking in over 3 TRILLION dollars a year in revenue...and spending over 4 trillion.

I'm just not sure how much longer that can sustain itself.

[Bladewire]

Originally Posted by Robbie

That's because the Republicans are just as big of liars as the Democrats. They ALL overspend.

I'm no expert...but it seems that back when the U.S. went off the gold standard and started printing money with nothing physical to back it up, it laid the groundwork for what we see today.
A govt. that is bloated and taking in over 3 TRILLION dollars a year in revenue...and spending over 4 trillion.

I'm just not sure how much longer that can sustain itself.

Trump & the GOP taxed the poor to give the rich a tax break. You ignore that and spread blame to everyone, you are that daft. The Democrats voted AGAINST the tax scam... and you ignore that. Shameful

[VRPdommy]

Truth be known... It was never Trumps tax plan.
The republicans had been working on this since before trump made his party nom.

And Robbie, if you check, you will find once we came off the gold standard, we tied the dollar to the price of oil.
Technically, our money is backed by oil now.

If you watch the currency exchanges and understand the oil markets a bit, it becomes clear how complex our dollar's value is determined.

This is why Russia and Iran, Cuba, Venezuela and some others have wanted to get off this OIL/Dollar standard.
Everyone that needs to buy oil, needs to buy dollars to do it.
At least with OPEC Countries. The original intention was to stabilize the oil price, which it did do, and also artificial property value in the states.

The dollar is still backed by gold. Just not 1 to 1 and now you can't demand gold from dollars at a federal reserve bank.

Your never going to get either party to come clean on spending. So I think the right thing to do is insure they are spending it on "YOUR PRIORITIES" among anything else they might spend it on. You will not receive what you fail to ask for.

[VRPdommy]

I really want to hear from someone in the 70-150k income bracket to see how they made out.
Especial if they have a LLC.

[VRPdommy]

Amazon pay $0 on record profits of $11B

Hmmm.... How do I get one of those tax breaks ?

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/amazo...180337770.html

The company reported $5.6 billion in U.S. profits in 2017 and paid $0 last year as well.

[Robbie]

Originally Posted by VRPdommy

And Robbie, if you check, you will find once we came off the gold standard, we tied the dollar to the price of oil.
Technically, our money is backed by oil now.

I've never thought of it like that. Technically isn't our dollar not backed by anything? Just a "system of floating rates"?

No matter what...the govt. just prints money. And of course "borrows" money (it's never gonna get paid back) creating the giant deficit.

The whole damn thing is insane.

The politicians long ago figured out that they could just make it an unlimited amount of money to spend and began enriching themselves by funneling astronomical amounts of money back to their cronies.

[Robbie]

Originally Posted by VRPdommy

Amazon pay $0 on record profits of $11B

Hmmm.... How do I get one of those tax breaks ?

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/amazo...180337770.html

The company reported $5.6 billion in U.S. profits in 2017 and paid $0 last year as well.

That same article also says this:
"Amazon pays all the taxes we are required to pay in the U.S. and every country where we operate, including paying $2.6 billion in corporate tax and reporting $3.4 billion in tax expense over the last three years,"

It's confusing. Did they pay "zero" or 2.6 BILLION in taxes?
Or is this third party company that is looking at Amazon's public records saying that they HAVE been paying taxes but won't have any for the year 2018?
The article also says that the companies being looked at by the "Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy" all say their findings are incorrect.

[thommy]

Originally Posted by Robbie

I've never thought of it like that. Technically isn't our dollar not backed by anything? Just a "system of floating rates"?

No matter what...the govt. just prints money. And of course "borrows" money (it's never gonna get paid back) creating the giant deficit.

The whole damn thing is insane.

The politicians long ago figured out that they could just make it an unlimited amount of money to spend and began enriching themselves by funneling astronomical amounts of money back to their cronies.

money worldwide in this days is not backed up from anything. actually the gold in fort knox nobody have seen in the last 30 years and even IF it would be seen you would not know to who it belongs to. Germany wanted to check their gold there a few years ago and it have been denied. so all they know is that they have theoretically a few hundred billion in gold there.

unfortunately money is a good today and the value is depending on supply and demand.
as there are many international trades (including oil) are still made in dollar, there is always a high demand on it that makes it quite stable.

it is a fairly tale that governments can simply print money as money supply would automatically decrease the value of a currency and increase inflation.
this is why countries do have debt.

it is also not generally a bad thing if a country do have dept - it is just a question how much and how fast the debt is increasing. look at japan - their total debt (total = private, government and companies) is at around 400 % to GDP what looks insane when you compare it to the 233% of the USA.
so HOW can that work there and why it is dangerous in the USA ?

the answer is very simple: japan lends the money from the japanese and US borrows the money from foreign countries. the foreign dept to GDP is USA is 100% and in japan 50%.
China´s foreign dept to GDP is only 9%. so if a country borrows from it´s own citizens, tha payback plus the interest will run right back into this country. if a country borrows from other countries the payback and the interest will strength the foreign nations gross income.

if you look at the dept situation in US under this aspect you will see the real problem.
last month the US credit rating from moody´s have been downgraded the first time in decades because of this problem. that means that it will become more expensive for the US to lend money outside and with a lower tax-income and higher spendings in things like a wall or military spendings (what will not bring any profit but additional costs) it will be impossible to pay it back.

the oxymoron in MAGA is that the country that depends mainly on foreign nation´s capital wants to lead. this is the same as when a bank gives a unsecured credit to someone and this someone wants to become the manager of this bank.

[thommy]

Originally Posted by Rochard

Great. Then stop spending money. This is simple math.

nope - it is not that simple.
a government can not stop to spend money - not even theoretically.
if they would do that the whole world would be owned within 10 years from 10-20 people.

imagine what would happen, if everybody in the world stop to spend money.
no cash flow at all. this would break the circulation what we know under the name "economy". economy is nothing else than big a river what is feed by the water from it´s spring. but the spring delivers actually the same water again and again - so the most important thing is that the water in the river have to find a way back into the spring.

this is actually the main reason why taxes and the government spendings from that are important for an economy. government spendings can even go targeted into the market because our big river in this example is actually the sum of many small rivers with many small springs. when the water in the river is low it is even legit to "borrow water" to fill the springs up.

as you see in this example any kind of prosperity is made from the same ammount of water. and this is the tricky part in it. it is kind of a perpeduum mobile that uses the same energy again and again but have to spin faster with each cycle.
this efficiency CAN ONLY be realized with globalizing and optimized by using geo-local circumstances and competition.

economy is a very very complex thing and here is also the problem. as voters usually do not know about this complexity, they are voting for "easy answers" - but there are no easy answers.