Paul Markham

So the EU strikes trade deals with other countries, then why do they refuse to strike one with the UK?

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MaDalton

<sigh> so much hate and misinformation...

the good thing is: real life does not consist only of GFY right wing idiots and therefore I am pretty confident that life will go on - even without the UK in the EU.

but a lot of you need to go out more

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MaDalton

they do not - you ignoramus

they will start negotiating one after Brexit

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MaDalton

you do realize that London is the financial center of Europe and that German banks are currently in pretty poor shape, right? Just look at all the scandals and fines for Deutsche Bank (some of them involving the Trump family).

but hey, has never stopped conspiracy artists like you, right?

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nico-t

What this fact also explains is why the EU needs the UK and not the other way around. Today Juncker and his anti-democratic clan again bluffed their way through the day, with May completely falling for it again.

If the UK would have said from the start: No deal, EU would have come crawling on its knees and do anything for a deal, like i said before. And this was earlier today confirmed on Sky News by a journalist being interviewed who said exactly the same.

What was also said by people not working for Sky News, but who were interviewed by them (i was amazed at how the interviewers are so extremely biased), is that the media is painting a totally unrealistic horror picture in case of a no deal Brexit. Everyone not working for the media who were being interviewed agreed that this narrative is simply false. It was quite funny to see the anti-Brexit interviewing puppets being constantly argued completely under the table by facts. They had zero facts to argue against it.

And one final thing i noticed is these anchors are constantly promoting a second referendum throughout the day, a measure that would be straight up dictatorial and insulting to democracy and all the citizens. They kept saying it every 5 minutes or so for hours. And the funniest thing when just yet one anchor said 'we see the talk about a second referendum increasing'. Yea no shit, because you are the ones doing it!
It was a great lesson once again which tactics the media uses to create a narrative out of thin air.

NewNick

Thats nice dear.

But have you managed to change your pants yet ?

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Manfap

If they could get a free trade deal of course.

Although Germany probably wouldn't want it's own currency back, the Euro forced everyone to compete, France, Italy, Spain have no chance of competing with Germany.

MaDalton

lol - dude - you are a joke.

the whole Brexit campaign was one big piece of misinformation and basically the old and stupid voted against brown people.

but congrats on your paranoia, at least it keeps you busy

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Manfap

A no deal is going to fuck France bigtime, and with EU elections in 6 months shit's going to get interesting.

What happens when the biggest block in the EU is Lepen/Northern League/VOX/ADF/Austrian/Hungary/Polish national parties?

VOX will score big in the EU elections in Spain, atleast 15%

Manfap

It was a lot more than that.

More the fault of UK government not building the services to cope with the influx of people.
Schools with too many children, not enough doctors etc.

There is a massive housing shortage in places of the country where people actually want to live.

Wages stagnating because companies just put up an advert in Poland to get 100 workers for a new factory.

UK benefits system doesn't help either, as most of the jobs that are available pay less than being on benefits.


It is not just about brown people, alot of 'brown people' voted for it.

But as every political party is pro EU, Brexit was the punishment.

nico-t

Total misconception. What you're essentially saying here is the majority of the UK are stupid racists who hate brown people... that's quite an extreme insulting generalization buddy.

celandina

If sir Humphrey have read your comment he would surely set up a quango to determine the degree of your imbecility..

The gospel truth..and BTW you have a sense of humour of a slug.

TheSquealer

This is a persistent feature of people who lean to the far Left.

"If i don't get what I want in a vote or election, it's because voters are stupid.... therefore, i am free from any obligation to respect the outcome or views and opinions of others".

This guy is so smug and so arrogant, it's unreal.

He starts talking about DE banks being in trouble. That was odd. I remember before the EU when the German Mark was the global standard for stable currencies, the German economy was envied and German banks were rock solid. But.. whatever.

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Paul Markham

Agree, the trade deal is all that keeps the EU together.

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Paul Markham

Those elections will see a huge swing to the Right, because the Left has fucked up and refuses to shift.

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Paul Markham

Spot on. Being in the EU is expensive. Spending money the EU governments don't have is the only option. I was hoping Thommy and Stefan would say this, but they chickened out.

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Paul Markham

The EU isn't striking trade deals with non-EU countries???????? Please check you facts.

I agree with you that the EU will be forced to negotiate a trade deal with the UK, but only if the present deal is rejected. If it's not the UK needs the EU's permission to leave. They have repeatedly refused to put that in writing.

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The Porn Nerd

Dude there are some parts of The Netherlands where even Dutchies cannot understand what the fuck they are saying. Europe is like the Tower Of Babel with all the different languages. But most people speak ENGLISH and that's how anything gets done between nationalities. Total fucking mess. Make English the official World Language and be done with it.

PS: And can you make the Euros all the same size please? Different colors is fine but different sizes is fucking whack. Fuck your money EU (the exchange rate is also a killer at 1 euro to $1.15USD)!

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Manfap

Most non English speaking countries in the EU have a dialect or 2 kicking about, some even have entirely different languages. Spain's got 3 plus numerous dialects.

Even the UK is seeing a rise in Welsh speakers, as it's being taught in schools again.

How boring would the world be if everyone spoke English?

Learn another language, it's good for your brain.

Manfap

The UK can afford it, it just chose to ignore it. The other problem is to build the schools/hospitals/houses they'd need another 500k Poles to do the work.

directfiesta

Élections have consequences....
Votes have the same.

Time for UK to get the fuck out... Or kicked out.

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Thanks !

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el gringo/yankee verdadero

The Porn Nerd

True, very true. Scottish and Irish dialects are completely ridiculous to understand for example. But I'm not saying eliminate other languages. Just teach English to everyone too, that's all.

And I actually can converse in about five languages. As in....



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klinton

Paul Markham

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Paul Markham

The UK is already very deep in debt because of EU policies. You're advocating it gets further into debt to build more schools/hospitals/houses to house cheaper workers who will pay less tax and put more Brits on a lower wage. Resulting in less tax revenues and higher debts.

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Manfap

The UK is not in debt because of the EU, it ran a pretty constant 40-50% debt for years until the 2008 crash which even you cannot blame the EU for.

If you are going to bring 5 million people into the country you need to put the infrastructure in place to cope with them.

The UK gov know's this and ignored it.

thommy

EXACTLY !!!

and above from that the UK´s growth after the crisis would not happen without the EU.

after the 2008 crisis EVERY COUNTRY IN THE WORLD have increased the debts with no exception because they tried to do what every right winger loves so much: they tried to survive with the LOCAL MARKETS. but in a local market that isn´t able to export and make money globally this is ONLY to realize with debts.
people like paul simply to not understand how an economy is working.

this money they lend came mostly from the european central bank and without this cheap money they would be heavily in trouble.

now let´s see what happens after the next financial crisis when there is no euopean central bank anymore who give them cheap money. THAN they have a MUCH bigger problem because money from the free market will be given only on higher interest.

now they are playing with the idea of a new vote. I really hope they will not do that because finally the stupids in this world NEED an example to see how economy works.

I am really sorry for those brits who knew that from the start and voted against the brexit - but that´s life in a democracy where the dumbs are the majority.
a good way to prevent such accidents in the future would be to stick money in the education system and produce less dumbs.

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Manfap

It's not just the UK. Don't think it's going to stop there. You talk about educating the people, but then the people understand that they are in fact fucked.

You can not ask millions of people to conform when what you're asking them to do is to lower their standards of living against the previous generation.

That sweet spot where housing was affordable, people retired in their late 50's, they had pretty decent workers rights. Now it's become a gig economy with no rights, housing eats up 40% of your wage and you're gonna have to work until your 75.

Governments and countries chose globalisation not the working class who it effects the most.

Is it the EU's fault, no but someone has to take the blame.

The scary part of the Brexit vote is not the 70 yearolds who gaze into the distance lovingly remembering the Empire, it's the young socialist northern working class who voted for it.

Phoenix

Ol Germany found a new way to control Europe

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thommy

I think you can also blame the russians for that because there is a lot of evidence that they spread the same fake news as on the trump election.

in the meantime ALL of the fake arguments are proven wrong and only the complete brainwashed will still use them.

that they have influenced the trump election is now even admitted by the senate and from republicans and in THIS REPORT by the oxford university.

here is another interesting article about that:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/techn...=.d095651ad23a

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thommy

you are a super dumbhead !

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ilnjscb

Stefan, Thommy, you cannot actually be praising Juncker? Please separate this incompetent buffoon from the idea of a united Europe.

Apart from his disastrous and unprecedented "appointment" of Selmayr, he has not done one thing right. People may blame populism, but he should share a lot of the blame. Arrogant twerp, with no real accomplishments to point to.

Brexit and all the others wouldn't be happening if the EU had good leaders. In fact, name me ANY leader right now who is popular at home and abroad, and don't come at me with Justin Trudeau.

Manfap

There is some truth in that statement though.

By adopting the Euro, France/Italy/Spain has to compete with German productivity, and with an equal currency, none of them can.

Germany didn't put a gun to their heads and say use the Euro, but the lure of a stable currency was too much for Italy and Spain, France at the time still had the delusional thought that it was Germany's equal, so happily took it.

Would France take the euro now?

thommy

who praised Juncker or the EU ?


we all know that the EU have still a long way to go and it will NEVER be perfects as every other unions aren´t perfect either.

the leaders you call CAN NOT exist because the EU is still a muppets show with near to zero power.
all european countries are still far from each other - mentality wise and economy wise. but one of the BASIC IDEAS of the EU was to change that. and when they founded the EU they knew that it is a long and hard way.

look, the united states are not united til today and how long did this project have time ?

I am pretty sure in europe we can do that faster and better and with less time. but my generation will not see that. possibly the next generation what is already growing up with it will do better. bit someone have to start it because on this planet is all about buying and selling power and strong unions that can´t be overseen.

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thommy

nobody put a gun to anyones head. we still have a lot of countries with their own currency. but the euro makes things much easier and the countries that have the euro prefer to buy from those that also have the euro because it is more calculable.

and why do you think that germany productivity is higher than in other countries?
german is a country with very high wages and social costs. to produce in Germany is nearly that high as in france. If you have ever been in France you would know why.
France is a 110% welfare country - I would nearly say a socialist country with far too much power at the labor unions with far too much power at the labor unions and an uncomfortable legacy from the colonial era.

so the real question is where france would be today without the euro and the european union.

I think the problem is that people are expecting too much and don´t want to give a shit to make things better. on top of that the EU can not resolve problems that were already existing before. many of this problems have been hidden til the day when it was necessary to put the clean books on the table.
this long existing truth was then simply attributed to the EU and the oil was poured into the fire of the populists.

this is the really sad part but you can not explain that to dumb people who do not understand how economy and economic tricks are working.

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Phoenix

They even got them to do it to themselves this time. Your reponse to my obvious tongue in cheek remark really paints you as an intellectual.

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Manfap

German workers are expensive, but they would have ended up even more expensive if you'd kept the DM, you couldn't keep upping prices on exportable goods to cover the currency growth.

By switching to the euro you stabilised your manufacturing cost.

Hourly labour cost is similar in France and Germany, but you are more efficient.

France can drop costs by taking an axe to parts of it's welfare state, but there is no way that is going to happen, he backed down after 4 weeks of protests, the French people know he will never pass a difficult law again, but if he does they will rightly or wrongly blame the EU on the cuts.

thommy

but look the MAJOR idea behind the EU is to keep every country balanced.
THIS is the reason why there are net payers and net receivers.
if a country is stronger than others this country have to pay to the EU and germany, france and britain have paid BECAUSE the benefit more than others and if they are doing bad one day they have the right to receive.

I don´t know how you can see this as a competition it is completely the opposite of that.
germany is in a better condition than others because

1. the people went through a hard time in the crisis and they worked even harder to get out of it.
2. pensions and welfare did not rise in that time - even infrastructure was effected by that.
3. in germany it where NOT the private people that get the money and the easy loans. Germany had a programm for the tax paying companies and helped them with cheap money and forced them to invest.

since 2013 the german economy is in plus and they still pay back all the debts.
in the bad times the dept to GDP was at 81% now it is at 64 (what is already called "a healthy debt")
actually germany gave also a lot of credit to other countries for that because there is still an ammount of 1,2 trillion euro in GIVEN loans to other countries - away from the money that they have paid INTO EU.

but all that have nothing to do with the EU - it have to do with the mentality.

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ilnjscb

That makes sense, but you still need to get rid of Juncker.

The Porn Nerd

No, you need to make all the fucking euro bills the same fucking size.

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Paul Markham

Bringing in 5 million people in and building infrastructure has costs. Firstly building houses for those people to live in, because unless they earn enough to buy their own they rely on government to supply. Then there's the children who need educating. Then healthcare, then jobs that pay enough so the new comers can pay enough in taxes to pay for their infrastructure.Then policing.

If all it achieves is driving down wages, companies no longer need to train Brits when they can import cheaper, trained and experienced from abroad, the government has to take up the costs of training the young.

You are right about the UK gov know's this and ignored it, so companies could make more money.

The UK Debt to GDP was because the banks crashed and industry that we used to have has gone and along with it the well paid jobs, manufacturing plants and all the wealth they generated. Now with austerity really biting the UK is just managing to keep debt to 88%. Are you advocating they spend even more to drive it up again?

Limiting migration to only those who earn enough to support themselves and their families is a must. That includes paying enough in taxes so the government can afford to build the infrastructure needed. Which is why in the new White Paper issued by the UK government they have set the same limit to EU citizens migrating as applies to non-EU citizens.

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Paul Markham

Once the UK leaves the EU it will be able to trade freely with the world not not be controlled by EU rules. Which by it's own words relies on local markets.

People like Thommy simply do not understand how an economy works.

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Paul Markham

Everyone ignores the misinformation spread by the Remain side. That information came from sources such as the Bank of England, the Chancellor of the Exchequer, CBI and business leaders plus 1,000 of bureaucrats. They all predicted to a man that the UK would immediately crash if the people Out. Well guess what, the UK grew after the vote of Out.

Are you implying the Russians influenced the referendum more than most politicians, most newspapers, most news media? If so how did they do this?

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Paul Markham

You are right about the EU being a Muppet Show, that's what scares the UK and why they want out now. Would anyone give a load of Muppets the power the EU has and more scarier the power it wants?

For the EU to become one, it has to change. A common language, a common currency, a redistribution of wealth or industries (this means German companies moving to countries like Greece and paying German wages or Germans giving money to countries like Greece) a migration policy that puts EU citizens first, etc. But above all one government that can run everything. And as you say at the moment that government is a bunch of Muppets who are set up to act like Muppets. With no intentions of changing.

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Paul Markham

We have different size bills because it helps the blind and poor sighted to know what they have.

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Paul Markham

And now the UK has left Germany and France will have to increase their contributions even more. They will have to do this while making less money by selling less to the UK, one of it's largest markets.

Brits care about themselves first and with so many now forced to live on welfare they don't want to be giving money to other countries.

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thommy

looking forward to see your face when you see the rality

in opposite to you i have a master degree in economic science.
what do you have?
a master degree in talking bullshit ?

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thommy

i really don´t know where you get this missinformation from.

britain´s GDP was on an alltime high in 2014 with 3074.36 Billion USD.
after that the brexit rumour started and til the brexit vote the GDP fell to 2650,85 Billion.
AFTER the vote the GDP fell again to 2622 billion and the UK is STILL in the EU and every importer and exporter tries to make every biz possible as long as this works.

the real number you gonna see after they leave and i can tell you already it will be under 2000 billion within 2 years.

in that time the costs of life will increase a lot because the only chance that britain have is to lower the value of the pound to export. but that means that every IMPORTED good will cost much more. and not only the currency value will be the reason for it also the much higher cost for logistic will do their part.

i know it is hard for you to accept that everything you believed in your life was just hot air.

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