Shaving %

[traffic addict]

Is there a site that have tested all this shaving issues?

Why not upload a site that will show how much each program is shaving!
All we need is like 20 credit cards.
Then we register to each program and send them 10k clicks with 20 signups, using our own credit cards.
And post how many clicks and how many signups do they show on their stats page.
We should do it once a week, I'm sure we will be able to cover the cost by seling some advertising space on this site

[EscortBiz]

shaving is starting to hurt, many that have not are not starting to and all I can say is its only a matter of time before greed will kill em.

[detoxed]

the one in my sig doesnt shave

[traffic addict]

Originally posted by detoxed
the one in my sig doesnt shave

I think that most of the programs are not shaving, but I'm sure that some of them do, I can't see how a program can offer $85 per signup.

But I think that instead of talking about it so much all of the time, the Adult webmasters should also do, somthing about it!

And uploading a shaving rate site should do the job for us!

[CDSmith]

Originally posted by traffic addict
But I think that instead of talking about it so much all of the time, the Adult webmasters should also do, somthing about it!

Bingo.

Since "shaving" is tantamount to outright theft, if it is occuring (and I'm not saying that it is) you would think someone, somewhere, with some company would have found and produced some irrefutable proof of it at least once. All it would take is one court case and one set of criminal charges brought, and the shaving issue would be done. Who in their right mind would shave signups after such a precedent?

[Darren]

I dont thin kthe problem is as bad as some people say, as an affiliate program owner I WANT and try my hardest to get my affiliates converting....

it exists but it is NOT a massive issue.

[CDSmith]

The thing that bothers me the most about "shaving" is that so many people talk out of their ass about how it *is* when they possess not a shred of solid evidence about it. I hate the idea of any company or paysite owner shaving signups as much as the next guy, as I make a good percentage of my overall income from being an affiliate of around 30 sponsors, but I've never been a fan of tossing out innuendo and bold statements about it without having something to back it.

[traffic addict]

Originally posted by CDSmith
The thing that bothers me the most about "shaving" is that so many people talk out of their ass about how it *is* when they possess not a shred of solid evidence about it. I hate the idea of any company or paysite owner shaving signups as much as the next guy, as I make a good percentage of my overall income from being an affiliate of around 30 sponsors, but I've never been a fan of tossing out innuendo and bold statements about it without having something to back it.

I feel the same
That's why I think, that if webmasters are so dam sure about shaving, they should do something about it

[easyfun]

Fucking right shaving goes on - Big time.
The problem starts when you get webmasters controlling what gets paid out -
How the fuck can some of these deals offered to partner webmasters be met? - We pay X amount per free sign up etc.
On my sites, I have a minimum of 40gig of my own content and several thousand gigs of plug ins - Yet I know full well 50% of surfers joining for a trial actually cancel before getting to see one pic!
ALWAYS go with a site that uses 3rd party billing - That way you get no problems (provided the 3rd party billing company is pretty solid)
If a company chooses to run its own affairs via a merchant account - it is soley to increase profits - Usually, the company quickly realises the extra staff needed for admin etc, costs more than the few percent saved by 3rd party billing -
I know both globill and ccbill will pay partners by click thru and by sign up - To me, as an operator of a partner program, this is the cheaper option - Unless, of course, I decide I want to get greedy!

[CDSmith]

Originally posted by CDSmith
The thing that bothers me the most about "shaving" is that so many people talk out of their ass about how it *is* when they possess not a shred of solid evidence about it.

Originally posted by easyfun
Fucking right shaving goes on - Big time.

Case in point.

[m0rph3us]

what program do you run easyfun ?

[SykkBoy]

Originally posted by CDSmith
Bingo.

Since "shaving" is tantamount to outright theft, if it is occuring (and I'm not saying that it is) you would think someone, somewhere, with some company would have found and produced some irrefutable proof of it at least once. All it would take is one court case and one set of criminal charges brought, and the shaving issue would be done. Who in their right mind would shave signups after such a precedent?

personally, I'd love to see this go both ways...

if some clown sends a fake signup, they get nailed for theft as well...problem is going after cheaters overseas woul be too expensive...

all that is happening and going to continue to happen is instant signups to programs will go away....no more signup and send traffic right away....invite only programs, etc.

it'll be better for the industry as a whole...no more carding, no more shaving, just (more) private deals...of course it'll be tougher for the newbies...but oh well, life is tough and getting tougher.

In fact, since leaving DarkDollars, I've been working on a new program that will be an "invite only, high paying, no shaving, no bullshit, just making a lot of money together with people I trust" type of program....fun fun fun

[ecko544]

I have a couple of sponsors that shave here trust me I have tested it myself.

- www.eroticacash.com
- www.isharecash.com
- www.trafficcashgold.com
- www.orgasmcash.com
- www.sunnydollars.com

All those ones are shaving because I have tested them myself if u do not believe me take like 10 cards hack them after test them on sponsors you'll see that they are shaving. The sponsors who don't shave and are good are SilverCash , platinumbucks , wootwootcash and the sponsors who are using ccbill for stats are supposed to don't shave too...

[CDSmith]

Originally posted by SykkBoy2
personally, I'd love to see this go both ways...

if some clown sends a fake signup, they get nailed for theft as well...problem is going after cheaters overseas woul be too expensive...

Gawd-damn right it goes for both sides. No question cheaters are a burning rash on the ass of this industry. However, I would like to underline the point that one does not justify the other.

all that is happening and going to continue to happen is instant signups to programs will go away....no more signup and send traffic right away....invite only programs, etc.

it'll be better for the industry as a whole...no more carding, no more shaving, just (more) private deals...of course it'll be tougher for the newbies...but oh well, life is tough and getting tougher.

In fact, since leaving DarkDollars, I've been working on a new program that will be an "invite only, high paying, no shaving, no bullshit, just making a lot of money together with people I trust" type of program....fun fun fun

Just as many TGP's have the "private partner submitter list", your point is the same model but for affiliate programs. I would not be suprised at all if the "by invite only" becomes more prevalent in the near future.

One amendment might be that you allow trusted affiliates to recommend new webmasters in, thus maintaining a webmaster refferral system. The exception to the traditional referral program, however, would be that if anyone refers in someone who ends up cheating, then BOTH the cheater and the one who referred him are shitcanned. What do you think?

[kenny]

I like the idea of a invite only program or a program that makes you fill out a application that can be approved or denied. That will cut out fake signup fraud and put more money in the honest webmasters pockets. Prehaps alot of programs wouldn't have to shave if more measures where taken to prevent webmaster fraud.
I think many programs that shave do it under good intentions to keep a competitive edge. Unfortunately it leaves the door open for other programs to abuse it. There for I think any stat manipulation is fraud.
While there is a lack of solid evidence towards shaving, I do remember a long thread here that included screen caps of proof. I forgot what program it was.
There is only a matter of time before something big happens reguarding a affilate based program caught shaving. It is going to change alot things. It may be some mainstream program but it will effect all internet companies. There may be a group of people right now testing programs for fraud. Just because it isn't made public doesn't mean that it isn't happening.

[SykkBoy]

Originally posted by CDSmith
Just as many TGP's have the "private partner submitter list", your point is the same model but for affiliate programs. I would not be suprised at all if the "by invite only" becomes more prevalent in the near future.

One amendment might be that you allow trusted affiliates to recommend new webmasters in, thus maintaining a webmaster refferral system. The exception to the traditional referral program, however, would be that if anyone refers in someone who ends up cheating, then BOTH the cheater and the one who referred him are shitcanned. What do you think?

yup, I agree
In the rush to be competitve, sponsors went after every webmaster in a shotgun approach to signing up affiliates...I'd rather have 10 good affiliates sending me 20-30 true signups per day then a 100 guys sending me 2-3 signups every other week...I'd rather work 1 on 1 with those affiliates than have to babysit 100 newbies making their first tgp gallery...don't get me wrong, I'm not bagging on newbies, but I'd, personally, just rather work closely with 10-15 good solid affiliates and provide them custom adverts and whatever it took to get their traffic/business. Working with that, it would be easier to run a 35-40 per signup prgram without playing games with numbers or traffic (on both sides, the affiliate side and the sponsor side)

One of the trends I see (nothing new, but just increasing) is affiliates telling surfers how to cancel. I've seen some GOOD sales pages that explain the free signup process, but some less creatvie and not so bright people try to take it a step further and explain the cancel process...

[easyfun]

m0rph3us - What program do I run?

Actually, I am just about to kill my program!

I agree with what has been said about running smaller programes wher you can work individually with other webmasters etc.

I have had some of my sites online since 1996 (www.legshow.net) eg - And I guess, in a way, I am (was) still stuck in that time warp!

I will be releasing a new program very soon which will be a few years ahead of its time - That way I can be in the next time warp for another few years!

Seriously - Yes, I will be releasing something very unique - we are testing it all out now - It will not be based on my old sites, but sales there will be counted -
Which is the good thing about ccbill - They track very well.

(Yes, I know - It is very easy to break any 3rd party tracking by adding your own code - But I figure partner webmasters like to eat as well - )

[Kevlar]

There are already a lot of people who do private deals, several companies run pay sites and buy joins without a public program anyone can join. But there's a need for public programs as well, not everyone can send 100 joins/day. A shaving resource page is good in theory, but I'd be shocked to see it actually happen.

[Fletch XXX]

shaving?

[Luc Duboi]

www.adultrevenueservice.com DOES NOT shave .

[easyfun]

To some people, importance of being flooded with cash rules.

I get emails regularly asking to buy member emails etc - I just couldn't go down that or any other line. - I see some in this industry do some crazy things just to make a buck.

The likes of sunnydollars aren't in this for the long run - Simply to get as much stashed away now, and most likely spending the rest of their lives looking over their shoulders expecting the past to catch up with them. I hope it does - And I hope I get there first!

Unfortunately, the majority of webmasters want a cleaner internet -
Unfortunately? Yes! Because the majority do nothing, or little about it.
Somebody gets hacked, or has some coding or program stolen or compromised, is usually not too keen on saying much about it for feer of being rediculed.
You have all seen the posts here and on other boards - "So and so has nicked my program" Rather than helping, he will get an answer like "Well. why didn't you fucking encode it then"!

So! Those that shave will do so and continue to do so -
Those that don't will not, and continue not to!

[Quotealex]

Originally posted by CDSmith
Case in point.

Where's the dollar4all thread where someone showed....

[Rich]

Originally posted by Alex from Montreal


Where's the dollar4all thread where someone showed....

hahaha, now that was conclusive evidence. Anyone want to guess what name they used to open their new program?

[traffic addict]

Originally posted by Rich


hahaha, now that was conclusive evidence. Anyone want to guess what name they used to open their new program?

LOL
I don't think they did up to now
Maybe next month

[BluMedia]

I don't see why any sponsor would shave period. You want your webmasters to be happy with your program and keep promoting it. If you fuck them over they go elsewhere so what would be the point of that? I do wonder how some sites payout so much, we are at 40 per signup and I don't know how we could payout anymore than that in this point in time.

Mark

[easyfun]

If you are looking long term, mark. You want to keep your wm's and give them as much as you possibly can.
If you are not in this industry for the long haul - You want to make as much as you can ans quickly as you can.

[Rich]

Originally posted by BluMedia
I don't see why any sponsor would shave period. You want your webmasters to be happy with your program and keep promoting it. If you fuck them over they go elsewhere so what would be the point of that? I do wonder how some sites payout so much, we are at 40 per signup and I don't know how we could payout anymore than that in this point in time.

Mark

Nice try