New study?????

Why not just use the old facts?

That shit was used without regard to anything or anybody.. If you're in the area, get out or get fucked..

and don't bother calling me a conspiracy theorist... I saw how it was applied.. and I saw what it did..

New studies aren't needed.. just talk to the people that were there..

:1orglaugh

True. But doing a little something is better than doing nothing at all.

theking:
There is a difference between "self interest" and "selfishness" while trying to cover this with some "gloss" of "aiding the world" and "we are gonna liberate you" while embarking on adventures of sheer unadulterated greed and other "private agendas" for power.

Countries do advance their interests all the time.. most are lead by more mature governments and some manage to actually sign treaties and honor them - they actually have some morality that is not dwarfed by greed and ulterior agendas.

There is much use of words like "peace" in the US admin, - this is just crass misuse of the word - actions prove otherwise. It is easy to act on an agenda when there is clearly zero understanding of the outcome - which, time will tell, but may actually be totally "anti" US interests.

The US is a very fickle and immature "democracy", at least on the part of the Admin. A policy on Monday changes to something else on Tuesday. There is a total zero when it comes to any form of diplomacy and some state of living in a Disneyland bubble on many issues. I suspect, we will be seeing a watershed response shortly from many other nations and people - hell, tis already started.

The US is indeed the major military power at this time, and.. still can be the major economic power - if it actually addresses the issue. To accompany this it could have a portion of morality as well and actually be able to be trusted by other nations. Sadly the US media portrayal of the world may work in the US, but that's another "Disney bubble" as far as the rest of the planet is concened - you would think you watching another movie.

That is very true. It's really sad seeing what some of the older vets have to live like. Kinda pisses me off. We're handing out billions in welfare to countries, corporations and lazy ass individuals, but we can't manage to take care of the people who went and fought for us properly.

so you cant entertain AND educate/disseminate?

art is inevitably exploitative.

Roger & Me was funny and enlightening. I find it odd that you would consider those qualities to be exclusive of intelligent debate.

Is it that easy???

And what would these be?? This sounds like some homespun term like "homeland security" and Mommas apple pie.
Values start with the assumption of common sense and morality - and I never seen Bush or most of the Admin release any signs of either of these....

The Founding Fathers, Jefferson, Lincoln and the rest would be ashamed to see the US leadership reduced to "things" like GW... even more, to hear his hypocracy about "American values", which should be "US values" since the rest of American don't want to know of these values...

The fore fathers would kill someone for putting a tax on their tea, some fore fathers even had slaves.

Every government has its own form of propaganda for the masses. The more insiteful see propaganda for what it is.

Their mature governments have not made them number one.

This administration will end and very possilby at the end of this term. Then you can bitch about the next administrations agenda (and I am satisfied you will) and replace "ignorant" Bush with "ignorant"...

Refer to above responses.

Quote:

The US is indeed the major military power at this time, and.. still can be the major economic power - if it actually addresses the issue. To accompany this it could have a portion of morality as well and actually be able to be trusted by other nations. Sadly the US media portrayal of the world may work in the US, but that's another "Disney bubble" as far as the rest of the planet is concened - you would think you watching another movie.

Our self serving interests are what have made us number one...so the USA must be doing something right. Unless one considers that being number one is not a good thing.

Nazi Germany was number 1 for about two years. Germany was the most technically advanced nation on earth and was a center of the arts, science and philosophy. By the time Hitler invaded France, Germany was, for that brief period in history, arguably the number 1 country in the world.

Being #1 is not all that it's cracked up to be if that stature is achieved through immoral means.

We still use it here on the farms, you need a "restricted use" pesticide license to buy it because it sports the old scull & crossbones on it like all restricted peticides. "Gramaxone" is the name. Farmers us it all the time on the fields that grow the vegetables most of us eat. It smells bad, about 6 ounces of the stuff is enough for about 500 gallon mix depending on where your applying it and what adjuvants you are mixing with it. :)

Cheers,
BV

theking lives in a black helicopter.

:winkwink:

Ya really holly crap.

Maybe I should have mentioned that the Fox article is an editorial.

Moral and immoral are subjective terms. We have been number one for almost sixty years and counting.