steffie

and many where never found In Vietnam. So I am going to give my

When my good friend was drafted to Vietnam he had no choice, he got drafted on his 18th birthday.

When he was in Vietnam the media in the USA made them out to be babykillers.

There were embedded photographers in Vietnam, not life like today, but they were there.

He lost an arm and one leg when he stepped on a mine (at age 18) and what did the media do?

Call them babykillers
Told them they were worthless
Trashed them and denied them medical help and didn't even pay for shrinks.
Wouldn't pay for a prostetic devices
His previous job didn't take him back and he couldn't find one because he was a babykiller
The Anti War protesters than even threw stones at the soldiers when they came home. Many soldiers hid their uniforms and many said they where in Korea and not Vietnam

In this war all we hear are how great our soldiers are, I am glad the media for a change is on the soldiers site. I personally think they are going a bit overboard with the Patrionism for them tho.

The rescue POW girl got
A vaccation in Hawaii
A scholarship
A car
many more things (I would never trade with her, poor thing she deserves every bit of it)

I think the media is trying to make up where they fucked up in Vietnam.

I am not Anti War, but to be honest when we went into Iraq I was sitting on pins and needles. I was worried it would start all over again as soon as the media would show one dead child.

But I guess now its just the opposite. Now the Anti War protesters are being mocked and screamed and called un-american.
US Media won't show or even say how many iraquies we killed, or even show the pictures of dead children (and yes kids died)

How times have changed. To late for my friend, but better late than never

I guess I am just a little ticked today, I think I am going to get a beer now

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Cassie

i remember when my god father came home from nam. i was 5 and there were tons of people there (at the arrival of military personel) yelling and screaming. i do remember crying...probably more because i was scared but thinking about it now, he must have felt lower then low. he was a green beret and got treated like such shit. that treatment (war) cost him 3 marriages and gained him a record for abuse. thinking about it now knots up my stomach cause he is truly a giving man. i havent spoken to him in several years but i hear he is doing better now and has come to grips with what happen to him.

it's a shame what a costly mistake people made towards those soldiers who really didnt have much of a choice.

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Rochard

My father died there when I was nine months old.......

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Mutt

Sorry Rochard. That is tragic that your father never got a chance to see you grow up and for you not to have been able to know him. The supreme sacrifice they call it, and it's an understatement.

68,000 died in Vietnam, I didn't know that, I thought it was 49,000 or something like that number.

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Cassie

58k according to the movie Pentagon Papers but whatever it was, too many died...and no appreciation to boot. did you know that the vietnam thing spanded over 4 decades?

rochard that is so sad....i'm sorry to hear that.

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Interlude

Terrible war, Vietnam. It's unfortunate that the whole situation was mishandled so terribly... it could have been won properly if we had committed the proper forces and taken care of the situation decisively.

Let's not forget the millions of southeast Asians that lost their lives once the US pulled out and left those people to be slaughtered.

jreaka

My father WAS in Korea and he still got spit on.............Great post I agree with you 100%

Fucking hippies .....................don't EVEN get me started on fucking Jane Fonda, that bitch should have had her citizenship revoked!

Serge_Oprano

Vietnam...
The war started by Democrats who don't know shit about anything, war affairs included.

Republican Administration got US out of the war and haven't lost/fucked a single military conflict since.

playa

great post,, Whats good is that the US and also the military learned alot from the vietnam war,, thank goodness there hasn't been a repeat.

I have lots of respect for vietnam vets,, especially the ones that got drafted,

Mr. Jim

We have the power to make history by giving unparalleled support to our troops. For those that have served you know how important this is when coming home. For those that have not served, you have no idea how much it means to a young serviceman who comes home proud of the bravery they put forward but unsure how people will react.

When you see one of our young Men and Women even if they did not deploy......say thank you. It means a lot and makes the entire tour of duty have purpose.

They are the real American Celebrities. We should treat them like it. They showed courage under fire. They made the best of a bad situation and I feel they are walking with heads high and with honor. We do not have to support the reasons for war......we do need to support the men and women who fight

Semper Fi

smack

personally it seems to me, that anyone that would degrade troop from our armed services is a piece of shit. even if you don't agree with the cause of the war these people are out on the front lines risking their lives so that tommorow when you wake up you can get into your huge SUV, ride on down to mcdonalds and get your cheeseburgers without having to be afraid of anything. goddamn hippies.

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playa

i also want to say the real human shields are the members of the military,

they are the real ones that protect the citizens

Mutt

Affluence breeds the kind of ignorant ungrateful pukes who spat on returning Vietnam soldiers and waved 'Bush is Hitler' signs.

They don't deserve citizenship. They were lucky to be born in America. You can bet that 99% of them haven't done a damn thing EVER in their lives for their country.

AND PLEASE SPARE ME THE PREDICTABLE 'THAT'S WHAT MAKES AMERICA GREAT, THAT PEOPLE CAN PROTEST AGAINST THE GOVERNMENT'!!! I've even heard these idiots claim their dissent and civil disobendience is an act of patriotism as noble as that of the soldiers who risk their lives.

Freedom, prosperity and security come with a price. If you don't like the price of admission, get the the fuck out.

They should all leave, find another country, there are plenty of them on this planet. If their grandfathers and greatgrandfathers could see them waving their 'Bush is Hitler' signs I'm sure they'd
be packing their packs for them.

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UnseenWorld

The "peaceniks" today weren't doing much better, because they were still trying to make the troops feel they were in a bad war, which evidently is turning into a good one. It's not a good feeling to think you're out there risking your ass for a bad cause. Any war is a mixed bag of good intentions and selfish interests, but the person out there dodging bullets needs the support of those back home, and our intentions and interests are far more wholesome than those of Nazi Germany or Saddam's Iraq.

The US is a democracy, and in a democracy you get a chance to express yourself at voting time. You have the right to voice your dissent, of course, but once a war starts, I think it's time to shut the fuck up and if you have anything to say to write your congressman or senator but not express yourself in a way that might hurt the morale of the guys and gals on the front line.

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PornoDoggy

By the time you figure in the number of veterans who died from Agent Orange and from the "side affects" of PTSD, you could build another fucking wall.

Just one example. In the mid-1970s it was pretty well established that the rate of lukemia for 'Nam vets with Agent Orange exposure was absolutely through the roof. Admiral Elmo Zumwalt, the Navy Commander in 'Nam who ordered a massive defoliation campaign along the rivers in 'Nam, wrote a book with his son who had been a riverboat commander - and was dying of several different types of lukemia at the same time.

In 2002 the V.A. that there was enough evidence to verify that the rate of lukemia for 'Nam vets with Agent Orange exposure to warrant giving disability benefits to Nam vets with the disease. The ones that lived long enough.

The Bush budget is being criticized by such well known liberal groups as the VFW and the American Legion because of cuts in Department of Vetrans Affairs budget. Many Gulf I vets feel that they are getting the run-around at the VA.

So I hope the soldiers, sailors, airmen and marines enjoy this flag-waving fever while it lasts. But if they can count on one thing, it's that they will be just as quickly forgotten as their fathers and grandfathers were.

Libertine

So you consider it a good thing that the media keep quiet about the effects of war?

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PornoDoggy

Well, Mutt, since there have been protests against every war America has ever fought with the possible exception of WWII, I would suggest that YOU are the one who needs to get the fuck out. YOU are the one who doesn't seem to have a clue about what America is and what America is about.

There are lots of places where that form of unpatriotic behavior is unacceptable. There are even political parties right here in the U.S. who think that. Guy by the name of David Duke runs one; there are plenty of others.

buran

Man if they try and draft me, I'm taking my AR-15 and my ass out the country. Jamaica here I come!

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Fletch XXX

and shot you should be.

and rightfully so.

deserter.

you wouldnt fight for this country if you had to?

weak.

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PornoDoggy

I'm all for defending the right of people to protest.

They have more balls than you do.

Mutt

Obviously I'm not for hauling those who disagree with this or any war away in the middle of the night.

But they should get the fuck out of the country if they hate it that much. This is a big world. There are many Americans ex-patriots living in France. Why would anybody want to live in a country where a Hitler according to them was elected by the people?
I'm asking for them to take it upon themselves and leave.
I'm not for deportation or imprisoning dissenters.
Why would anybody stay somewhere that they don't like and under the rule of a government they despise?

Oh that's right, they are patriots, they want to reclaim America, to see it live up to the principles,hopes and dreams it was founded on. It's a dangerous world, we can't risk our future on your idealism. Sorry.

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pornguy

Someone stated above ( not sure who ) about Vietnam being a war that had been going on for 4 decades.

Actually the problems started there in the 1800's by the British. If you want to read more about the entire thing read Vietnam the 10,000 day war.

Great reading. I am not saying that the british actually started it, but them helping to run the country is what pissed off the people there. And for any of those bitching about the cost of this latest war, Vietnam cost somewhere over 300million just to pay the soldiers while they were there.


I forget where I found this, It may have been here on GFY, but it says alot!


"I want you to close your eyes and picture in your mind the soldier at
Valley Forge, as he holds his musket in his bloody hands. He stands barefoot in
the snow, starved from lack of food, wounded from months of battle and
emotionally scarred from the eternity away from his family surrounded by
nothing but death and carnage of war. He stands though, with fire in his
eyes and victory on his breath. He looks at us now in anger and disgust
and tells us this...

I gave you a birthright of freedom born in the Constitution and now your
children graduate too illiterate to read it.

I fought in the snow barefoot to give you the freedom to vote and you stay
at home because it rains.

I left my family destitute to give you the freedom of speech and you
remain silent on critical issues, because it might be bad for business.

I orphaned my children to give you a government to serve you and it has
stolen democracy from the people.

It's the soldier not the reporter who gives you the freedom of the press.

It's the soldier not the poet who gives you the freedom of speech.

It's the soldier not the campus organizer who allows you to demonstrate.

It's the soldier who salutes the flag, serves the flag, whose coffin is
draped with the flag that allows the protester to burn the flag!!!"



God Bless America
And the Porn Dealers!!!

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Probono

I love you Steffie!

PornoDoggy

First of all, the assumption that antiwar protesters "hate" the country shows YOUR ignorance, not theirs. Some of those protesting the war include Veterans of previous wars and the families of 9/11 victims. I'm don't happen to agree with them regarding the war to rid Iraq of WMD. I think they are foolish, naive, and idealistic beyond belief if they think negotiation would have ever changed.

Now, talk of expanding the war to other countries is a horse of a different color.

I am quite sure there are just as many people who are for this war that have the something other than just the interests of the United States in mind as may be opposed to it because they "hate" America. When you get right down to it, I don't hate America - but I certainly have nothing but contempt for sanctimonious assholes who think they have the market on patriotism cornered.

I repeat ... there are a number of countries where the kind of conduct that upsets you so is simply not tolerated. Some of them are apparently safe from the Bush democracy machine at the moment - some of them are part of the coalition of the willing (to suck up American aid).

Big Monkie

Careful or the secret service might come calling. Cause bush is a deserter too ya know.

rooster

thats ok, rich politicians kids dont make very good soldiers.

<img src="http://www.snopes.com/military/graphics/gore.jpg">

monsta

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Big Monkie

And what price has bush, who dodged the draft, went awol and became a deserter, paid? You think he along with all the other chickenhawks should get the fuck out as well?


Maybe because he was appointed and not elected.

foreverjason

war is horrible, but sometimes action must be taken.

andi_germany

There is definately a difference between war protesters today and decades ago. The war protesters nowadays protest against war and the people who are responsible for the war. The soldiers are seen as what they are. A tool for politicans who failed to do their job properly.
As to the US media coverage I would have to say that it is simply censorship. You don't show dead bodies, hostages and basically no bad war pictures. I thought it was their job to report and not to filter out what they think might not be suitable for you. If you just report without judgement you will not get people to react like in the Vietnam war but inform them so they can make their own mind.

Rictor

Yes, it wasn't the soldiers that screwed up in Vietnam it was our leaders. It's always the little guy that seems to take the fall though. There are so many college courses offered on Vietnam history now, I think you can minor in it. We made a lot of mistakes that are pretty obvious in retrospect.

Rictor

A good novel about Vietnam (the early days before the major US involvement) is Graham Greene's "The Quiet American." I think that has been made into a movie recently.

steffie

I never said that. I mean it simple

In Vietnam they showed kids being blown up and this propaganda was used to call my friend a babykiller.

In this war they are trying too! hard to keep these images away from US TV.

I am only saying maybe the media has learned a lesson from Vietnam and now they focus more on the heroism of the troops.

Another good example is

The POW girl who was rescued (and the media barely mentiones the fact that an Iraqui told Marines where she was, walking thru the dessert for 5 days)

The 7 POW's who were RESCUED (actually they were turned over by the dying Military Regime of Iraq)

Fact become a little blurred if you want to keep the patrionism high in this country.

The media has learned from past mistakes (Korea, Vietnam) but now they are going to the opposite extreme, thats not to good either.

I really need to start drinking or something lol

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