Nice profit you say ? ? ?

[XXXManager]

Some numbers you might want to know about Iraqi debts and "oil" money..

Iraqi debt:
Standing Debts - US$142B
Signed Contracts - US$57B
Kuwait compensation - US$300B
Total debt: ~US$500B

Iraqi income:
Oil estimated income/year US$10-12B
That is income - not profit.

Anyone care to comment now about how the war is about oil?
Even if US embezzled ALL income and had ZERO expenses and EVEN if you assume the war on Iraq didn't cost a dime - it would still take 50-42 years to get the any profit from Iraqi old.

Anyone "oil conspiracy" junkie care to comment with some brains and lack of "its about oil" "finish his father job" slogans?

[FATPad]

It's all about Haliburton.

[Ross]

Thats some nice figures you got there!

[XXXManager]

Originally posted by Ross
Thats some nice figures you got there!

Yep. its important that people back their empty claims with some numbers. There are alot more to the debt list and very little more to the income list.
If someone claims its about oil - they either just enjoy to say that word on boards or he is ignorant of the facts. Just my thoughts on the matter.

[Darren]

Originally posted by XXXManager

Yep. its important that people back their empty claims with some numbers. There are alot more to the debt list and very little more to the income list.
If someone claims its about oil - they either just enjoy to say that word on boards or he is ignorant of the facts. Just my thoughts on the matter.

well back up them numbers with proof.

[XXXManager]

Originally posted by Darren
well back up them numbers with proof.

I will wait first for someone to claim the numbers are wrong and show alternative numbers.
These numbers are taken from an economical analysis I just watched regarding the economical costs and profits regarding Iraq and the War.
You claim otherwise? State your claim

[EscortBiz]

understand the enron scam and then repost

[NineNine]

Shit, I thought this had something to do with an affiliate program. Dammit, if you're droning on about politics bullshit, say so in the subject, assmunch!!

[p00p]

Wasn't/isn't there an embargo on Iraqi oil? If so, it is kind of tough to profit on something you cannot sell. Any pre-embargo stats?

"The total value of Saddam's foreign contract awards (to drill for oil) could reach $1.1 trillion."

http://www.observer.co.uk/internatio...805530,00.html

But yes, this war is all about the WMD they are finding, no?

[Buffed Body]

Even if the numbers were wrong.... how could it be over oil? If Saddam wasn't a threat, the U.S. would just BUY his oil. Iraq hasn't been a threat the last 10 years because of the sanctions. Saddam needed to sell oil to be able to afford the weapons he wanted.

[Darren]

Originally posted by XXXManager

I will wait first for someone to claim the numbers are wrong and show alternative numbers.
These numbers are taken from an economical analysis I just watched regarding the economical costs and profits regarding Iraq and the War.
You claim otherwise? State your claim

wow your so hard and strong it gets me all excited... I will play your game, ur numbers are wrong, now show me proof .....

[p00p]

Originally posted by Buffed Body
Even if the numbers were wrong.... how could it be over oil? If Saddam wasn't a threat, the U.S. would just BUY his oil. Iraq hasn't been a threat the last 10 years because of the sanctions. Saddam needed to sell oil to be able to afford the weapons he wanted.

So what do you think the war is about, then? Weapons of mass destruction? Human rights?

[strobi]

wow bigboy those figures are a little bit high aren't they 2001 debt was only 62.2 billion... A country with a purchasing power of only $59 billion can jump up his debt that quick???

Oh and I don't want to get cought in a "my numbers are better than yours" fight here, I just find your numbers a little bit on the high side.....

[stocktrader23]

Originally posted by XXXManager

I will wait first for someone to claim the numbers are wrong and show alternative numbers.
These numbers are taken from an economical analysis I just watched regarding the economical costs and profits regarding Iraq and the War.
You claim otherwise? State your claim

For about the 10,000th time someone has pointed this out on this forum....

WE DON'T HAVE TO STEAL THE OIL FOR BUSH AND/OR THE U.S. TO BENEFIT FROM IRAQI OIL.

If you can't figure it out yourself it isn't worth arguing about. Why do you assume people that say it's about oil would think we are going to cart the shit back to the states? You are the foolish one.

[Thrawn$]

This truck
Needs a lot of OIL to work

And

etc..

[Buffed Body]

Originally posted by p00p

So what do you think the war is about, then? Weapons of mass destruction? Human rights?

The war is about two things: weapons of mass destruction.... and sending a message to all the arab countries that we will not hesitate to fuck them up if there are more terrorist attacks.

All of the Arab countries involved in terrorist activities are shitting their pants right now. Is this a coincidence?

Even if no more wmd are found in Iraq (although already a bunch were found before the war started... something that wouldn't have happened if there weren't 250k soldiers at the borders). Saddam is a threat to the american people. It's better to get rid of him now before he really does get powerful.

The real country behind sept 11 is Saudi Arabia. The world would really bitch if we attacked them (as we fucking should). Iraq is the next best thing. ;-)

[Theo]

lol,i wont even bother on this.

[Donnie Gangsta]

Originally posted by XXXManager
Some numbers you might want to know about Iraqi debts and "oil" money..

Iraqi debt:
Standing Debts - US$142B
Signed Contracts - US$57B
Kuwait compensation - US$300B
Total debt: ~US$500B

Iraqi income:
Oil estimated income/year US$10-12B
That is income - not profit.

Anyone care to comment now about how the war is about oil?
Even if US embezzled ALL income and had ZERO expenses and EVEN if you assume the war on Iraq didn't cost a dime - it would still take 50-42 years to get the any profit from Iraqi old.

Anyone "oil conspiracy" junkie care to comment with some brains and lack of "its about oil" "finish his father job" slogans?

Where do you get these numbers?

The CIA factbook has completely different ones:

http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/...s/iz.html#Econ

External Debt: $62.2 Billion
Exports: $15.8 Billion

(And btw the export # is low because of the Oil for Food program, preventing Iraq from truly capitalizing on its oil wealth)

And regardless, it's not as if the debt has to be paid. Who is going to make the United States satisfy Iraqi debts?

And it's more for favors, government contracts, (E.g. Haliburton) and political interests.

[p00p]

Originally posted by Buffed Body


The war is about two things: weapons of mass destruction.... and sending a message to all the arab countries that we will not hesitate to fuck them up if there are more terrorist attacks.

All of the Arab countries involved in terrorist activities are shitting their pants right now. Is this a coincidence?

Even if no more wmd are found in Iraq (although already a bunch were found before the war started... something that wouldn't have happened if there weren't 250k soldiers at the borders). Saddam is a threat to the american people. It's better to get rid of him now before he really does get powerful.

The real country behind sept 11 is Saudi Arabia. The world would really bitch if we attacked them (as we fucking should). Iraq is the next best thing. ;-)

With respect, I think your opinions are formed by the media, not your own mind. This has nothing to do with terrorism, or September 11th. I was of the belief the war against terrorism is being fought in Afghanistan? How does Iraq fit into all of this? I don't think the US, Britain are risking lives, spending billions to bomb Iraq because they are the 'next best thing' to Saudia Arabia. That is a foolish statement.

[XXXManager]

You are very funny guys
I wonder what would happen if they let you run an ant-farm for a week

Donnie Gangsta and strobi - External debt is an economical term which is only a part of the overall standing (or enforcable) debt.
p00p: Debt gotta be paid. Basic economics. Especially if reconstruction is to take place, especially if US or UN are to lead the process. They won't let Putin down ;) I think you feel confortable thinking its about oil - cause you don't have to think about it or try digesting the facts. Keep on. BTW - your quote about US$1.1T doesn't really contradicts anything I said, US$12B over 100 years even without including interest is far beyong the $1.1T. That is a hypothetical number which (if close to reality) describes the maximum potential of future contracts. considering future prospect can easily be 100 years or even 60 (with interest) that "could" qoute you gave says nothing really that I didn't say.
EscortBiz: Yep - a good advice to follow. I'll be waiting your return after you get it right.
Soul_Rebel: Don't bother. I see you are too busy working - thats why you got such a low number of post here

Amazingly - this wasn't even my source. Note - this is not CNN - this is a business oriented site.
http://www.busrep.co.za/index.php?fS...ticleId=121471

Title: No clear funding for Iraq's renewal
The US has suggested Iraq could use $11 billion to $14 billion a year in oil revenues for reconstruction. But any attempt by the US to take Iraqi oil receipts would be on suspect legal ground, as there is about $142 billion in enforceable debt claims on the country as well as up to $300 billion reparations outstanding from the invasion of Kuwait, plus $57 billion in contracts signed by the Iraqi government.

But with oil exports running at about $10 billion to $12 billion a year, there would not be enough money to finance humanitarian needs and debt repayments, even assuming a generous debt relief.

Analysts calculate that Iraq debt payments alone would be $1.6 billion annually for the first five years, based on a 66 percent write-off and a five-year grace period, stepping up to $4.8 billion for the next 10 years.

So how are these numbers stand with you - you economics experts?

[XXXManager]

Originally posted by Thrawn$
This truck
Needs a lot of OIL to work
And

etc..

Dude - screen-savers don't need fuel to run

[Theo]

Originally posted by XXXManager

So how are these numbers stand with you - you economics experts?

http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/

The estimated population of the United States is 290,661,906 so each citizen's share of this debt is $22,238.88


The estimated population of the Iraq is 24,001,816 so each citizen's share of this debt is $2,591.47


and yes, Bush administration takes a financial risk with Iraq because the humanitarian aid will be high, but don't tell you believe you're gonna see a reconstruction of iraq in the future.....

tell me it's for the chemical weapons, i can tell you it might be one of the reasons for the war, but don't tell my that at the end you'll have to deal with iraq's national debt as well.

the ones that said we want the god damn oil to fill our suvs and we want it cheap....lol hold your breath again. You'll be the ones that will have to pay the cost of the war and of the humanitarian support.

[Buffed Body]

Originally posted by p00p


With respect, I think your opinions are formed by the media, not your own mind. This has nothing to do with terrorism, or September 11th. I was of the belief the war against terrorism is being fought in Afghanistan? How does Iraq fit into all of this? I don't think the US, Britain are risking lives, spending billions to bomb Iraq because they are the 'next best thing' to Saudia Arabia. That is a foolish statement.

Well... there was a huge terrorist training camp in Afganistan... but ALL the terrorists on the planes used in Sept. 11 were from Saudia Arabia. Not Afganistan. Don't forget Bin Laden is a Saudi, and all his money came from the ruling Saudi family.

"next best thing" is of course an exaggeration, but it's basically true.

"Stabilize the region" is the term used by U.S. politians. Right now all the Arab monarchies/dictatorships hold their power through opression and point at the U.S. and Isreal as the reason the majority of their people live in shit.

It doesn't make sense, but they do it to redirect the general public's blame from them. We're dealing with incredibly primitive societies here.

Why do Saudi schoolbooks call americans 'infidels'?
Why do their 8 year old children beat up dolls made to look like Bush and Collin Powell? (even long before the war)

What will the ruling monarchies/dictators have to say to their people when Iraq is liberated and ends up with the best standard of living in the mid east? It will help clear the US's reputation, even with the nutbar sucide bombers.

[Buffed Body]

If Saudia Arabia didn't have two thirds of all the oil in the world, we would have carpet bombed the fuckers on Sept. 12 2001.

In that respect, this war is all about oil. It's not about Iraqi oil, we've been doing fine without theirs the past 12 years.

[Buffed Body]

Originally posted by XXXManager
Some numbers you might want to know about Iraqi debts and "oil" money..

Iraqi income:
Oil estimated income/year US$10-12B
That is income - not profit.

The new Iraqi economy will have a substancially higher income... the sanctions will be lifted.

Estimates are iraq has about 150 billion barrels of oil. (the kind cheaply pumped). At 20 bucks a barrel... this is three trillion dollars worth, enough to pay for the war, all their debts, and let them get on with their lives.

[XXXManager]

Originally posted by Soul_Rebel
http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/
The estimated population of the United States is 290,661,906 so each citizen's share of this debt is $22,238.88
The estimated population of the Iraq is 24,001,816 so each citizen's share of this debt is $2,591.47

believe you're gonna see a reconstruction of iraq in the future.....

tell me it's for the chemical weapons, i can tell you it might be one of the reasons for the war, but don't tell my that at the end you'll have to deal with iraq's national debt as well.

Glad you chose to reply after all ;)
I agree with you if I understand you right..
As to the things you pointed out.
US debt is indeed very high. What are you trying to say though?
Iraqi debt per person is US$500,000,000,000/24,001,816=US$20,831 - That is $20K - NOT $2K LIKE YOU SAID
Do you really think that you can compare US and Iraq in that aspect - when Iraq's GDP and income per head is so lower than US (not to mention zero infrastructure for economic grow at the moment). Also note - its US - not Iraq - that leads the world economy and financial currencies in the world.

I believe we will see a reconstruction of Iraq. I hope it will be lead by UN, UK, Australia, Spain, Italy, Croatia and whoever supported the actions publically. I hope the UN will be left out. I especially hope the French, Russians and German governments will be left out. Next time - the people there should vote for a government which either has the right principals or bets better (supports the right/winning side).

I think the war is about Terrorism, regional (ME) peace, Economy (oil as a partial only issue [there is much more than oil in the world's economy - such as industrial peace and quiet]), human rights, WoMD and much more. As to now (including oil) I did not see any reason for that war that I didn't think is right.
If people think the war was justified by Bush wanting to finish his father's job - I think they are foolish to think that. As to the war being triggered by all kinds of special corporates - its as true as blue being the most important component in a blue skyscraper. (indeed its a component and important to some marginal extent - but hardly something worth mentining when considering when engineering the building)

[Theo]

What's your source about 500bil debt of iraq? Your cia factbooks reports $62.2 billion and is the number i used for estimating the per citizen debt. Much of Iraq's debt is to countries in the former Soviet Union, with Russia as the biggest creditor. You were the one that made reference to iraqish debt and failed to see further.
My point was you can't work these things out with a calculator like you did. No matter what the outcome of the real debt estimations is, it doesnt make any change.

"I believe we will see a reconstruction of Iraq"

Have faith. I suppose this goes for Afghanistan as well right? I would like some of the experts to define me what the reconstruction will be....

"I think the war is about Terrorism, regional (ME) peace, Economy (oil as a partial only issue [there is much more than oil in the world's economy - such as industrial peace and quiet]), human rights, WoMD and much more."


You can't justify to me the war by using the word terrorism. As I said and i'll keep saying terrorism will be from now on the cause/mean for every movement the public has/must swallow. You need to understand it. By failing to understand it, you'll keep swallowing and one day your own personal security we'll be in real danger. When your kids will leave from the university they would study and one of the religious freaks as we call them blow a vanbus 50feet from them....then his problem will become yours. Who are these guys that post kill all muslims. When was the last time they spoke or dealt with one. What the fuck do they know? I'm a greek and although my country had war conflicts for centuries with turkey, a muslim country, I do not hate muslims. Neither my father was hating muslims, neither my grandfather.

Richard Herrnstein had predicted the upcoming conflict of west with the arab nations. Now he is not alive to see this happening. If you want to equate arab nations with terrorism, do it. Things like regional peace coming from a war do not touch me. You are missing many pieces of the puzzle for which reasons through time american is not the most welcome world traveler. I'll give you another reason some of the sources have been feeding the public the last decades: jealous. Everyone is jealous of the american way of life. Does it work for you? Sure it does for many.

[69pornlinks]

Originally posted by Buffed Body



Why do Saudi schoolbooks call americans 'infidels'?
Why do their 8 year old children beat up dolls made to look like Bush and Collin Powell? (even long before the war)

What will the ruling monarchies/dictators have to say to their people when Iraq is liberated and ends up with the best standard of living in the mid east? It will help clear the US's reputation, even with the nutbar sucide bombers.

why do hollywood movies protray Muslims as "terrorists"?
Iraq liberated like Panama,Vietnam.......

infidels-non-believer.

Dick,Bush and Colon dolls

[XXXManager]

Originally posted by Soul_Rebel
[1]What's your source about 500bil debt of iraq? Your cia factbooks reports $62.2 billion and is the number i used for estimating the per citizen debt. Much of Iraq's debt is to countries in the former Soviet Union, with Russia as the biggest creditor. You were the one that made reference to iraqish debt and failed to see further.

[2]My point was you can't work these things out with a calculator like you did. No matter what the outcome of the real debt estimations is, it doesnt make any change.

[3]You can't justify to me the war by using the word terrorism. As I said and i'll keep saying terrorism will be from now on the cause/mean for every movement the public has/must swallow. You need to understand it. By failing to understand it, you'll keep swallowing and one day your own personal security we'll be in real danger.

[1] If you bothered looking - you would see that the CIA factbook was not brought by me but by someone else. I brough a detailed enough quote for the $500M. Read first - post after.
If I see someone failing to see further - its not me ;)

[2] Your point was badly put. Sorry - base your calculations on the right numbers and it the results will mean something. As to your remark - you are the only economist in the world who thinks the debt doesn't make any different (unless you are not an economist) ;)

[3] First - I know enough about terrorism to see you don't. I live with it on a daily basis. You see it on TV. As to your conclusions about me (or maybe you were referring to someone else) hating anyone (including muslims) - I have no idea where you take that from - certainly not from what I say.
Second - I am not trying to justify anything to you. I don't bother with that. You will need to know enough about terrorism before you understand how anything is about it.
Just to demonstrate your point about "terrorism will be from now on the cause/mean for every movement the public has/must swallow" - You say you expect (or see it valid and something we should "swallow") labor organization to plant bombs in kindergardens next time they want to protest against cuts in salery? Do you expect people to shoot US civilians in order to protest against globalization?

I think you should consider and rethink your opinions and belifs deeper than you did so far.

[Theo]

Originally posted by XXXManager
you are the only economist in the world who thinks the debt doesn't make any different (unless you are not an economist) ;)

Regarding the source I read your post yesterday, but today i forgot you named it. Different news sources, different numbers. Anyway, I was talking about the reasons of the war. Iraqish debt you brought in table is not related. Simple as that.



As to your conclusions about me (or maybe you were referring to someone else) hating anyone (including muslims) - I have no idea where you take that from - certainly not from what I say.


No this wasn't a reference for you. Sorry if you took it like this.


Second - I am not trying.....you did so far.

here i can't follow you, you didn't understand my post

anyway,i'll stop it here, we both seem to have different opinions about how some things are and work, but that's healthy. Only gay agree on everything

[XXXManager]

Originally posted by Soul_Rebel
...but that's healthy. Only gay agree on everything

LOL

[foreverjason]

The estimated population of the United States is 290,661,906 so each citizen's share of this debt is $22,238.88


The estimated population of the Iraq is 24,001,816 so each citizen's share of this debt is $2,591.47

Ya but people in the US make 100x more than people in Iraq, so no worries.

[propromotions]

Originally posted by FATPad
It's all about Haliburton.

There is something none of you dick heads think about. The UN has already made sure the US will not steal there oil.

The US has created a trust fund on Iraq's behalf which will be only in the UN's hands. The profits from oil will go to this trust fund and handed out as needed. No Iraqi official will be allowed to touch that money unless under UN's supervision.

It was created a few days before the Liberation of Iraq started.

[KRL]

You're not seeing the process.

The CEO's of the big American oil companies get together at the country club to form the plan.

Political contributions are made and lobbyists are paid to get the plan in motion.

Next, the United States military goes in and takes over Iraq under the auspicies of a liberation. (Why did it take us 30 years to decide to liberate Iraq is the question that should be asked if it was such a genuine concern).

After our troops get done. The munitions and military industrial complex boys make a fortune refilling all the armament depots again. The Oil companies go in and make a fortune lifting the least expensive oil to recover on the planet and sell it for huge profits.

And to finish this wonderful meal the taxpayers get the bill and some of us who didn't come home from the war paid their share with their blood.

And the Oil company CEO's are back at the country club with big fat smiles on their faces laughing all the way to the bank.

Capitalism at its best.

[Buffed Body]

Originally posted by 69pornlinks


why do hollywood movies protray Muslims as "terrorists"?

That's not hollywood.... that's the news.

[Buffed Body]

Originally posted by 69pornlinks


infidels-non-believer.

True... also "One who has no religious beliefs"
But the real question to ask is .... why is any government pushing this message about americans?

Separation of church and state is a concept Muslim nations don't understand.

[Buffed Body]

Originally posted by 69pornlinks


Iraq liberated like Panama,Vietnam.......

More like Japan, only Iraq has resourses.

[XXXManager]

Originally posted by KRL
You're not seeing the process.
The CEO's of the big American oil companies get together at the country club to form the plan.
Political contributions are made and lobbyists are paid to get the plan in motion.
Next, the United States military goes in and takes over Iraq under the auspicies of a liberation. (Why did it take us 30 years to decide to liberate Iraq is the question that should be asked if it was such a genuine concern).
After our troops get done. The munitions and military industrial complex boys make a fortune refilling all the armament depots again. The Oil companies go in and make a fortune lifting the least expensive oil to recover on the planet and sell it for huge profits.
And to finish this wonderful meal the taxpayers get the bill and some of us who didn't come home from the war paid their share with their blood.
And the Oil company CEO's are back at the country club with big fat smiles on their faces laughing all the way to the bank.
Capitalism at its best.

Hey dude...

Its all in your head Neo

You have the look of a man who accepts what he sees because he is expecting to wake up.

What is real? How do you define real? If you're talking about what you can feel, what you can smell, what you can taste and see, then real is simply electrical signals interpreted by your brain.

You take the blue pill, the story ends. You wake up in your bed and you believe whatever you want to believe. You take the red pill, you stay in wonderland. And, I show you how deep the rabbit hole goes.

Have you ever had a dream, Neo, that you were so sure was real. What if you were unable to wake from that dream? How would you know the difference between the dream world and the real world?

[PostWhore]

Did you know that USA national debt is 60 times more?

[Honeyslut]

I have been reading about individuals who have won court cases against Iraqi and will be paid when American takes over.

Any figures on those totals ?

[KRL]

Originally posted by XXXManager


Hey dude...

Its all in your head Neo

You have the look of a man who accepts what he sees because he is expecting to wake up.

What is real? How do you define real? If you're talking about what you can feel, what you can smell, what you can taste and see, then real is simply electrical signals interpreted by your brain.

You take the blue pill, the story ends. You wake up in your bed and you believe whatever you want to believe. You take the red pill, you stay in wonderland. And, I show you how deep the rabbit hole goes.

Have you ever had a dream, Neo, that you were so sure was real. What if you were unable to wake from that dream? How would you know the difference between the dream world and the real world?

You apparently haven't been to a high end country club or hung out with powerful business people.

[funkmaster]

"If someone claims its about oil - they either just enjoy to say that word on boards or he is ignorant of the facts."

... I have no idea where you got your numbers of, but keep in mind that 90% of iraq´s oil money came from the oil for food program.

[directfiesta]

Originally posted by funkmaster
"If someone claims its about oil - they either just enjoy to say that word on boards or he is ignorant of the facts."

... I have no idea where you got your numbers of, but keep in mind that 90% of iraq´s oil money came from the oil for food program.

lol....

read the caption....

Chevron christened the Condoleezza Rice, a 136,000 deadweight-ton, double-hulled ship, early on in Rice?s decade-long stint on the oil giant?s board of directors. Rice, a member of Chevron?s board of directors since 1991,

now the link, not to be like most people just denying because " they say so..."

http://www.public-i.org/story_01_022801.htm

[directfiesta]

And no, the US is not after the :

For nearly 40 years, oil giants like Shell, Mobil and Chevron have worked in joint ventures with Nigeria's dictatorships to exploit the country's vast petroleum resources, often against the wishes of the local communities of the oil rich Niger delta. Protest against these oil giants has often resulted in a bloody response from their military business partners. Again pro-Democracy activist Chima Ubani.

http://www.pacifica.org/programs/nig...ranscript.html

It is not the oil, it is "Operation Freedom " ... liberate people from a dictatorship .... The US gov is so " humanitarian"....

Bowoto v. ChevronTexaco Corp.

Plaintiffs in this case are victims of gross human rights abuses associated with Chevron's oil production activities in the Niger Delta region of Nigeria. The case is based on two incidents: the shooting of peaceful protestors at Chevron's Parabe offshore platform and the destruction of two villages by soldiers in Chevron helicopters and boats.

http://www.earthrights.org/litigation/index.shtml


I think it is about camels... The US have not many ( only in office) so the gov will get some. Fuck the oil, will ride your camels...

BOI !

[directfiesta]

That's all folks... hehehe...