Congrats forum Britons on your independance!!

[redwhiteandblue]

I am of the opinion now that what we will actually do is re-join EFTA and become a non-EU member of the EEA, thus keeping single market access but ridding ourselves of control from Brussels. It doesn't solve the immigration crisis but it's like a halfway house to getting everything we want.

[mineistaken]

I am of the opinion now that what we will actually do is re-join EFTA and become a non-EU member of the EEA, thus keeping single market access but ridding ourselves of control from Brussels. It doesn't solve the immigration crisis but it's like a halfway house to getting everything we want.

I was saying about EEA, but couple days ago you sounded as if you are not (you still are) and will not be part of EEA. Looks like you have changed your mind.

[Paul Markham]

Yes, already a few are talking of moving to Germany & the Netherlands, Amsterdam

They have been moving here, Czech, for the last 15 years. With EU money to help them.

[Paul Markham]

I am of the opinion now that what we will actually do is re-join EFTA and become a non-EU member of the EEA, thus keeping single market access but ridding ourselves of control from Brussels. It doesn't solve the immigration crisis but it's like a halfway house to getting everything we want.

The EEA doesn't rid the UK of the EU.

The UK needs to demand a balanced trade deal or 10% tariff's either way. With French and German elections coming up soon. The UK holds the aces.

Next round of General Elections. These hold the keys to the future of Europe. If enough people in a few of these countries decide they've had enough of this failed experiment and don't like where it's headed. There won't be EU elections in 2019. It will have imploded. Then we go back to a common trade deal and get over this mess.

Netherlands March 2017

France April 2017

Germany September 2017

Norway September 2017

Czech Republic October 2017

Luxembourg October 2017

Italy February 2018

Hungary April 2018

Sweden September 2018

Belgium May 2019

Austria 2018

European Union 2019

[redwhiteandblue]

I was saying about EEA, but couple days ago you sounded as if you are not (you still are) and will not be part of EEA. Looks like you have changed your mind.

Yes I know I was getting a bit confused between the status of the EEA and EFTA, the point is though that it's not certain if we would remain in the EEA when we leave the EU because no-one else has done it before.

I never said or thought that we would not be in it, it's always been one of the options (the so-called "Norway" option). What I think will decide it is the sheer complexity of disentangling ourselves from all the EU legislation in the two years we will have. I don't think that can be done in one go.

If we rejoin EFTA and remain in the EEA it completely changes the dynamic of those two groups. That means that we can continue to persue changes and eventually get all the things we wanted, as other countries decide to join us rather than continuing along the path of EU integration.

[NewNick]

Your costs are in USD but your earnings are in GBP?

Yes.

Earnings 70% in GBP some costs in Euro/GBP, and a big chunk in USD.

[NewNick]

Yes I know I was getting a bit confused between the status of the EEA and EFTA, the point is though that it's not certain if we would remain in the EEA when we leave the EU because no-one else has done it before.

I never said or thought that we would not be in it, it's always been one of the options (the so-called "Norway" option). What I think will decide it is the sheer complexity of disentangling ourselves from all the EU legislation in the two years we will have. I don't think that can be done in one go.

If we rejoin EFTA and remain in the EEA it completely changes the dynamic of those two groups. That means that we can continue to persue changes and eventually get all the things we wanted, as other countries decide to join us rather than continuing along the path of EU integration.

Staying in the single market and closing the borders would be the number one goal in any negotiations.

Germany, France and Italy have said it will never happen so work that one out.

Cameron knows has handed a poison chalice to the next PM. He knows that the next PM will have to sign off on a deal that destroys the economy, or indefinitely delay the Chapter 50 call with the inevitable squealing from Farage et al.

It is a fucking unnecessary mess that will not deliver what the leave vote were promised.

The Empire is gone and nostalgia does not pay the bills. Unless you are a dried up old migrant pornographer.

[Paul Markham]

Yes.

Earnings 70% in GBP some costs in Euro/GBP, and a big chunk in USD.

The GBP will rally.

[Paul Markham]

Staying in the single market and closing the borders would be the number one goal in any negotiations.

Germany, France and Italy have said it will never happen so work that one out.

Have those countries asked their voters whet they think?

Freedom of Movement is more than acceptable. So long as those moving can pay their own way without taking a job from a native. Taking taxpayers money to support migrants, without asking those taxpayers if they agree. Is undemocratic.

Cameron knows has handed a poison chalice to the next PM. He knows that the next PM will have to sign off on a deal that destroys the economy, or indefinitely delay the Chapter 50 call with the inevitable squealing from Farage et al.

Why? The EU relies on Britain far more than you think. Trade is a two way street.

It is a fucking unnecessary mess that will not deliver what the leave vote were promised.

The Empire is gone and nostalgia does not pay the bills. Unless you are a dried up old migrant pornographer.

How much better off is Britain after 15 years of the EU?

[Paul Markham]

The EU was created undemocratically and will be destroyed by democracy.

French European Constitution referendum, 2005

Dutch European Constitution referendum, 2005

Treaty of Lisbon

Enlargement of 1995

The EU takes little notice of people rejecting it. It asks them again and stacks the cards, or just lets them trade so long as they do as they're told. Which is what the EEE is about.

French and Dutch politicians ignored the will of their people.

Most countries now have learned the lesson to not ask the people in case they give the wrong answer. It will only take large Right Wing votes to get ore democracy. Which is sad for the Left and Centre.

[NewNick]

How much better off is Britain after 15 years of the EU?

You should stick to the facts Paul instead of trying to throw up daft arguments that are impossible to quantify.

However the Cornish have been able to quantify the answer to your 15 year question.

It appears that a county which voted to leave has actually been a huge beneficiary of EU funding to the tune of £60m per year.

OOPS.

Council to seek urgent confirmation from Ministers on EU funding allocated to Cornwall - Cornwall Council

Turkeys voting for Christmas.

[redwhiteandblue]

You should stick to the facts Paul instead of trying to throw up daft arguments that are impossible to quantify.

However the Cornish have been able to quantify the answer to your 15 year question.

It appears that a county which voted to leave has actually been a huge beneficiary of EU funding to the tune of £60m per year.

OOPS.

Council to seek urgent confirmation from Ministers on EU funding allocated to Cornwall - Cornwall Council

Turkeys voting for Christmas.

Is that more than the value of the Cornish fishing industry that has been decimated by the common fisheries policy?

[Paul Markham]

It appears that a county which voted to leave has actually been a huge beneficiary of EU funding to the tune of £60m per year.

OOPS.

Yes, I get that part. The UK gives £350 million a week and the EU gives back some and tells the UK where to spend it. Which is why N. Ireland and Scotland want to remain.

Let's assume for a moment England and Walee leave. Where is the guaranty the EU will continue to give N. Ireland and Scotland money and who will it come from? N. Ireland and Scotland are assuming they would get back in, get the money without contributing more than they get back and that contributions wouldn't come from Westminster.

The UK pays more into the EU budget than it gets back.

In 2015 the UK government paid £13 billion to the EU budget, and EU spending on the UK was £4.5 billion. So the UK?s ?net contribution? was estimated at about £8.5 billion.

Each year the UK gets an instant discount on its contributions to the EU?the ?rebate??worth almost £5 billion last year. Without it the UK would have been liable for £18 billion in contributions.

Makes your £60m per year, look farcical. Got any more silly points to make, I love knocking them over.

[Paul Markham]

Listening to the debate in Brussels it was clear the pro-EU MEPs were adamant that they will decide the future of Europeans. None of them showed any intentions of asking their people what they thought.

Why should they when the people might reject this gravy train. Brexit has served as a severe warning to them that democracy isn't something they can rely on. There's even talk of rejecting the vote of the people. Then what?

[nico-t]

Listening to the debate in Brussels it was clear the pro-EU MEPs were adamant that they will decide the future of Europeans. None of them showed any intentions of asking their people what they thought.

Why should they when the people might reject this gravy train. Brexit has served as a severe warning to them that democracy isn't something they can rely on. There's even talk of rejecting the vote of the people. Then what?

Yep. Talks of a "Superstate" all of a sudden. They haven't learned one thing, the only thing they learned is to speed up the EU monster as a true dictatorship with one central government. 100% the opposite of what the people want, what a great institution.