the employers of these sweat shop operations hire and filter the illegals through "employment agencies" which are really just human trafficking operations. it gives them an arms length so they can claim ignorance about the legality of their workers.

it is a nice and profitable scam but essentially the workers are treated like slaves.

Wowsa. .. where you get information?

The base need to be no thicker then 3' and taper up to no bigger then what the forms will accommodate. What in the fuck is going on here... it's like saying a 150k house will cost 1 million dollars based on instructions from the tooth fairy.

So, by your numbers his wall only saves us $50 billion and apparently results in a lot of jobs for Americans to maintain it.

What exactly is the problem with that?

Barrylogic

Of course you won't. Because these clips are funny due to the unending, insane irony and hypocrisy that they so deftly highlight. Sad to think that there exists for one half of any conservative/liberal debate enough raw materials to support multi million dollar business. One half though. The other half just doesn't produce enough blatantly ironic statements to make a funny show. :thumbsup

I was a was a state licensed general contractor for 14 years and worked as a masonry subcontractor on some state and federal funded bridge projects as well years of pouring a lot of concrete, being around concrete construction and estimating and bidding jobs. You know what a rod buster is or what he makes on a federally funded job?

Also, I didn't include the site preparation necessary for a job like that. You would have to set up mobile mix plants along the border and deliver all that concrete to the forms. You ever worked around concrete pump trucks -- I have more than once.

If you form the wall as a tilt up you would need cranes and access roads.
If you form the wall standing in place you will need to bring in the form materials, and set the forms.
Either way you are going to need concrete pump trucks.
You cannot pre-cast and bring the wall to the site.

You will need Class A roads to move the heavy equipment on and temporary construction roads for a 2000 mile border length construction site.

This is not a war on immigrants. You cannot just fuck up the roads that exist and argue force majure or act of war.

What is your experience?

The cheaper tilt up wall is one foot thick and would have to be set between pilings and buttressed. A wall that is self supporting 30 feet tall and 3 feet at its base would be unstable and topple over.

And you will be hard pressed to build a new home for $150K, Maybe, a manufactured home that they bring to your site in 2 pieces on a couple of over wide low boy trailers.

At any rate it is a ridiculous proposal to build a border wall because you could just dig tunnels under it. Even that 10 foot packed stone footing would not stop that -- you could tunnel under that.

The whole idea of building a concrete wall is asinine. Just place a land-mine field in the first 200 feet, put warning signs on either side and enclose it in a concertina wire fence. The US-Mexico border is 2000 miles long.

Whatever dude. It was on Trump's mind and he said it loud. I am sure you must be in the media. :thumbsup

That wall proposal is called verbal diarrhoea.

Trump has a really great plan -- you'll see :1orglaugh

Well something needs done .....

"The federal government now spends more on border and immigration enforcement than it spends on all other criminal law-enforcement agencies — including the FBI, the Drug Enforcement Administration, the Secret Service, the US Marshals Service, and the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives — combined."


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Right?

My point is we need at least try.

It's clear most of you work from home and don't hire anyone full time. The real cost, unless the wall is built with the latest spy technology will be staffing the operation after it's built. Take the cost of a border guard, x 4 for those on the night shift and 1 for every 500 yards of wall. Then the accommodation for the offices, transport, etc. Just rough figures to start everyone thinking.

This is the obvious solution. The Agency angle can be closed, the person using agency staff is responsible for checking who is or isn't legal. Also, take away all benefits, driving licenses, housing, rights to stay with "anchor" babies. Cost less, stops a lot more illegals and the fines paid by the people giving illegals jobs and housing pays for everything.

Republicans will hate it.

Give 100K Americans jobs as border snipers :helpme

That is just as stupid of an idea as building the southern border wall and trying to man it with super infiltration technology. What are these guys smoking?

How many billions will the enhanced enforcement cost?

-------

This is just another sound byte solution to a complex problem.

2000 miles is just to long for a construction solution. :2 cents:

Oh my... Barry I can't even quote your response.

You do not form up a tilt up wall, tilt up means it was pre-fabricated. It would be ridiculous to create the wall as pre-fabricated. Form up the sections, pour it. Every day stuff. So I think we agree that cast in place construction is the route. Just wanted to clarify... tilt up means it was pre-fabricated already.

The only forces on the wall are wind and whatever seismic concerns, wind would govern. The thickness of the wall does not support the wall, the footing does. You do not put a wall on 10 foot packed gravel, you pour a moment footing to handle those forces.

A retaining wall holding back 30 foot of soil at 110 psf would not even be close to 19' at it's base. Wind, at it's highest, would be designed around 25 psf and that would be near the gulf due to hurricane forces. The rest would be around 18 psf or so, unfactored. Seismic would never govern because seismic forces increase based on the weight of the structure, since this is simply a wall supporting nothing other then the wall, seismic would never govern.

The wall would not even need to be 3 foot, reason for 3 foot is not the forces, it's so they can't core it out and walk through the wall. Also wanted to say that the thickness of a pre-cast section, and cast in place section, is roughly the same. Only time that thickness varies is if pre-tensioning of the reinforcement strands occur, which would be so outlandish to consider since the forces on this wall are so minimal. And the thickness of base of wall would be a judgement call to prevent trying to saw cut through it. 3 foot is more then thick enough to deter that.

Pilings and buttresses... lolol. Nope. Spread footing poured wide enough to handle the moment of the small ass forces applied to the face of wall... wind in worst case 100 year occurrence.

It is simple construction. Where did you get exactly these dimensions (19' base and 7' top and then atop a 10 foot packed gravel)?

Ever drive down the road and see those 25 foot or 30 foot sound walls? You think those are 19' wide at it's base and 7' wide at the top?

How are you going to deliver 30 foot tall sections of a pre-cast wall to a job site? and how wide are they? -- that is so ludicrous. We are not taking a sound barrier wall along a class A highway roadbed. Close the highway and deliver the wall.

FIRST OF ALL -- IT IS 2,000 MILES LONG.
Logistics are the first real problem.
And I am assuming a continuous wall -- so you need to allow for seismic and wind sheer movement.


We are not talking basement walls on spread footings -- that is underground work.

What you propose a cat excavator or two and a couple of labourers with cutting torches could breach in 30 minutes or less.

Just a another half assed idea

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CWuM06U0jco

it took like 10 men 30 seconds :1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

What's going on here. I said it would be cast in place... formed and poured in its final resting place.

You have no idea what a moment footing is? That is how this very simple wall would be supported so doesn't topple over.

And cast in place, or pre-fabbed, same dimensions. There is not a miracle that occurs in a plant that cannot be accomplished in the field.

Still trying to figure out your source of dimensions. And wall is around 1000 miles... natural barriers make up the rest.

John Oliver delivers the truth with a nice dash of comedy.

Well you need to buy the machine gun towers -- optional expense not included in the box. :1orglaugh

That wall is 2 1/2 men high they would need a few more men to build a pyramid to climb over a 30 foot (10 meter) wall.

I think we would need a 50 foot wall and a moat filled with crocodiles on the USA side that is 2000 miles long. Another stupid idea :1orglaugh

Don't over tax your brain

So, no one ever crosses a 'Natural Border' LOL
Hannibal marched an entire army over the Alps

a 26 foot ladder costs 299$:

https://www.littlegiantladder.com/

if the wall was 30ft if would leave a whopping 4foot of obstacle :1orglaugh

also if the wall had sections, and its bound to have sections, then you do not even need a ladder:

https://gearjunkie.com/legacy/images/261.jpg

theres cheap shit versions of this for like 10$...

For those unfamiliar with "tilt wall" construction ... the wall is poured into forms with re-bar, cured in place, tilted upright by crane.


http://i.imgur.com/SZ1faZZ.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/XZTnplc.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/zhUbz6o.jpg




Simple as that. Of course Trump will probably make it a little more high finish, lol.

http://i.imgur.com/f0mL8LB.jpg



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I think the wall will look more like

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-lxEc-PSQKf...ll_v005_SE.jpg

wall mart 30ft rope ladder $34.95

Cheap ass rope ladder

trump wall best case scenario = adds 1minute and $34.95 to the costs of illegal immigration BUT the ladder is re-usable...so 1 minute and a few bucks...

my advice is to invest in cement and re-bar companies stocks, trump probably did :2 cents::2 cents::2 cents:

also telescopic ladder companies and rope ladder outfits...

"ANIMAS ? Several hundred ranchers gathered at a small-town high school in the Bootheel on Thursday to rally against what they described as a broken border."


Message from border: ‘We got problems here’ | Albuquerque Journal

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In other news: Drug smugglers buy U.S. land to hide tunnel, feds say - CNN.com

It's hard to believe people are actually arguing the merits of this inane idea.

It will never happen. It's all about stirring up peoples hatred to get votes.

Of course I know tilt ups are poured in place -- LOL

So, we will have a tilt up spot every 1000 feet along a 2000 mile long border, and build cranes that can swing 500+ feet? LMAO.

So, now you need billions in site work and temporary roads made to move the erection (no pun intended) cranes for the wall.

Let's just invade Mexico and make a 20 mile DMZ and free fire border zone :1orglaugh

This whole thing is fantasy land.

he covered tiltup walls.. there has yet to be an effective argument on why this is a good and feasible idea.

i mean.. if a tilt up wall would require a bunch of 'grade A roads' with corresponding service roads... wouldn't that just make the life of an illegal immigrant easier? brand new roads built across a 2000 mile area, all leading to population centers?

So cool! Section 8 condos on the US side, 2 birds 1 stone. :thumbsup

Poured in place means just that... it's poured in the place it remains. That is how the thing would have to be constructed. So that means the forms are vertical, then concrete poured down into them.

Absolutely no tilt up.

You need the rebar sticking out of the footing, into the wall, to get the moment connection into the footing.

They can easily form 12 foot sections (high) and have a cold joint. Wind, seismic, doesn't matter, the wall is self supporting and stands up because of the footing. Which is similar to a spread footing, just wider and with 2 layers of structural reinforcement, not reinforcement simply for crack control. And every 200 feet or so there needs to be a complete and total isolation joint.

Pre-fabbed wall panels have plates that are connected. This connection is at the very, very bottom of the wall. You couldn't get the moment connection so then you would have to create a lot of other support so it stands. These walls work when you have a floor and a ceiling... pin, pin connection. No moment connection required.

Bla bla bla

A giant wall is a gigantic idiot idea /thread

@_Richard_ LOL easy access roads for illegals :1orglaugh:1orglaugh

I like the minefield idea -- low maintenance border control. The coyotes can eat up the pieces :1orglaugh:1orglaugh

In my opinion the wall isn't an "idiot" idea...it's an anti-American idea.

And it's not Trump's idea. It was already funded and passed by Congress years ago, they just never actually built it.

Walls are what the Soviet Union did. It's what Ronald Reagan called on Gorbachev to "tear down this wall".

The only problem on our border is the one being caused by the Federal Govt. "War on Drugs". Stop that...there won't be any problems.

Robbie you live pretty far from the border. I have recently been living in El Paso Texas, right on the border next to Mexico's most violent city. While I agree with your comments about the US drug policy I have to disagree on the border.

Without a wall/barrier of some sort the streets would be full of "opportunists" looking for a way to beg/borrow/steal. Imagine people walking and driving thru your neighborhood. Would you be happy? Feel safe? Knowing these illegals are looking to YOU for survival.


Immigration discussions are great when they are hypothetical because one never comes into direct contact with them. Trust me, seeing a gardner, waiter, student etc, working up north is worlds away from living in a border city. And legal drugs just might make it worse as the money supply south of the border would dry up creating even more poverty.


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Just so I know, you pulled that 19' to 7' atop 10' of cimpacted gravel completely out of your ass.... right?

http://writehere.com/media/photos/op...7e3178384eb3f8

fucking asshat

That wall is still standing for over 1000 years.

My "joke wall" will stand for 3000 years maybe LMAO.

Talking about this wall is like talking about the aliens that just landed on the White House lawn, or some other fable.

Plug one leak there will be another along the border.
Make it a 20 year felony to knowingly? hire an illegal alien.
I don't know what law enforcement could legally do with captured illegals committing crimes that they are not currently doing under our constitutional restraints on US Territory.

There could be a database to verify social security numbers collected on W-2 forms for employment required to be used by all employers -- you would need "license" to work in essence.
The problem is the cash economy that working illegal aliens get paid from.
One huge source of payment to illegal workers is in cash payment and evasion of US employment laws. Casual labor is the big problem. Building walls will not fix that.

We do same same shitty job policing all criminal activities in this country for as long as I can remember. Imprisoning illegal alien criminals costs money and catch and release costs money too as they just come back.

You are just trading one lose-lose situation with another lose-lose with this ridiculous "border wall of Trump".

god damned illegal aliens stealin' yer jeeeerbs :mad:

http://s.quickmeme.com/img/35/354a83...6d0011ef0a.jpg

You know this isn't something that Trump came up with right?

It's a fence that has been passed and funded by Congress for the past ten years...but they simply never actually have DONE it.

With Senate Vote, Congress Passes Border Fence Bill

Priceless ...

This and make the prisoners who we pay to sit around all day build it.

Not bad. Would be better set to music though.

It will be more costly than The Great Wall of china.

No it doesnt.. I also mentioned the cost of upkeep to the wall and you just assume that it will stop 100% of them. It wont, it likely won't stop 10%.

When he says billions and billions, he's giving himself enough margin for error :winkwink:

Google keeps prompting me to watch him everytime I search for Trump, so no.

"the Wall" is just -- -as someone said earlier -- verbal diarrhea from Trump's face hole.

Of course he didn't come up with the idea....but he's sure as fuck using it to pander to xenophobic morons who react with their lizard brains to EVERYTHING. Your reasons for loving Trump are more nuanced and intelligent...of course. HAHA

Then vote for people with real solutions. Not people selling magic beans.