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Pseudonymous

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#1

Rise In Denials?

06-13-2015, 06:45 PM

it started as affiliates mentioning to me that sales were low and that their traffic was still high. made me think, maybe just higher denials lately. with my recent new launches, ive noticed an abnormally large percent of denials leading me to ask the processor about such denials. they are simply titled "bank denials" , not insufficient funds, etc. but bank denials. which means the bank has denied it. which leads me to believe that alot of our adult processors that have been around for sometime are blacklisted. causing more and more denials each year. customer complaints about one site, makes them complain to the bank, to avoid all the issues , just simply ban the entire processor.

im currently with ccbill, which is the leader in its category and because its been for so long, it makes me wonder how many places they are blacklisted.

i saw phil-flash asking for a new processor? i'd love if he chimed in.

all in all, im getting real tired of these bank denials. i would have been on pace for 15-20 today, between two smaller solo sites.

Is there a way around these blacklists for processors, should they be trying to connect with these banks in another way? Alternative routes? Im not a processor so i dont know what can be done but after 10-15 years of being behind adult sites, the customer complaints will add up, even if they weren't really warranted

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2MuchMark

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#2

06-13-2015, 06:53 PM

You really should talk to CCBil about it.

What I can say though is that even if you have a lot of transactions, your own view offers too small of a sample, and perhaps the date range you are looking at too might be too small to warrant raising any red flags or looking around for other processors.

If you really feel that CCBill has a high deny rate, one suggestion might be to just add a second processor to your site, such as Netbilling, Epoch or Segpay. Simply make it an alternative option for your customers and see what happens.

You could also reach out to your customers and see what they have to say. If their cards are good in other online locations but still getting denied by CCBill, this might be an issue to bring up with them.

Of course, the purchases may just be denied by the issuing bank and if so, there's not much you can do.

Good luck!
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Pseudonymous

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#3

06-13-2015, 06:58 PM

I did mention it to ccbill, what can they say, the person i spoke to simply said, bank denied it, they need to talk to their bank, we like sales, we would approve it if we could. i dont think ccbill is looking to make major changes , theyve made their money like most companies in adult, probably ride it as long as they can. i mean look at their features, their admin was the same for how long? i assume the changes im talking about wouldnt' ever be made. maybe ill send paul here. it should be public information anyway, whats to hide? no sharing of personal data

plus other people can share their experiences from year to year.

and its not a small sample size. ive been processing with them for years and years and the affiliates im talking about have stats for ccbill dating back years

been a while since i accessed the affiliate admin, do affiliates even get access to denial information? i dont believe so but i could be wrong

>> also i want to clarify, i said its not ccbill that has a high deny rate, the post is about banks denying ccbill <<

i checked into the denials, all were denied by their banks. that is my point.

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plaster

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#4

06-13-2015, 07:22 PM

The good 'ol do not honor. My daily transactions are "plastered" with them.
Cascading to another bank helps.
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Pseudonymous

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#5

06-13-2015, 07:27 PM

Originally posted by plaster

The good 'ol do not honor. My daily transactions are "plastered" with them.
Cascading to another bank helps.

yes cascading is a great option. everybody should be

there isn't another great option for that type of processor for canadians as epoch and alot of processors are still not available to canadians

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The Porn Nerd

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#6

06-13-2015, 07:28 PM

Well a couple things here:

1. You may want to get your own merchant account at this point. If you are expecting 15-20 sales daily from two smaller sites then you have enough volume. Maybe it's time you took control of your own billing.

2. There's been an overall drop in conversion ratios since about a year. I hear this from many webmasters (affiliates) and Program Owners. Nothing had changed on my sites and the traffic is increasing so what could be the reason?

Mobile.

Devices are changing people's buying habits. Many check out a site on a tablet or cell phone then signup at home on a desktop. But those same mobile users buy this app and that Membership and this Upgrade and so on, tap tap tap. So many go over their limits without realizing it or do so much micro activity that their banks slow down the approvals.

I found by changing my CCBill signup forms to my own custom responsive forms sales have returned to near normal levels. I would talk to CCBill about turning your forms responsive and seeing how your sites do on mobile. Maybe offer a $1 trial on mobile only that converts to a full Membership.

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Pseudonymous

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#7

06-13-2015, 07:30 PM

thats great input about the responsive forms. i actually made everything responsive and mobile friendly this time around, but didn't consider the form. i will definitely talk to ccbill about this as well

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Pseudonymous

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#8

06-13-2015, 07:39 PM

TPN, have you actually looked at denial percentage of 2014 vs 2015? not just conversions, etc

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Captain Kawaii

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#9

06-13-2015, 07:53 PM

CCBill sales have been pretty bad for us since the beginning of this year. Constant state of denial. CBBill is probably pretty easy to target en masse for banks who do not want to process for adult. We look to promote sites with their own merchant accounts running their own/NATS affiliate software. Trust is an issue so its not a ton of sites.
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The Porn Nerd

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#10

06-13-2015, 08:13 PM

Originally posted by Pseudonymous

TPN, have you actually looked at denial percentage of 2014 vs 2015? not just conversions, etc

I just did because of this thread. LOL They are indeed up about 10%. But that's also the first half of last year (Jan-June) compared to 2015. Second half they are down (July-Dec 2014) so will be interesting to track this data this year.

Originally posted by Captain Kawaii

CCBill sales have been pretty bad for us since the beginning of this year. Constant state of denial. CBBill is probably pretty easy to target en masse for banks who do not want to process for adult. We look to promote sites with their own merchant accounts running their own/NATS affiliate software. Trust is an issue so its not a ton of sites.

Another great point by Captain Kawaii. But I bet the same is holding true for Epoch, NetBilling etc. In the end it's a balancing act between trust and ROI.

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Diomed

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#11

06-13-2015, 10:09 PM

Scrubbing is one of my pet peeves.

From an affiliate perspective...

When you do x sales a day for so long with the same sources, one can swear sometimes it's like someone just up and hit the scrub button.

This is why I like control over the front end.. Having a similar offer/join that remains in continuity with your pitch just as a text link below.. Labeled "backup processing" with a disclaimer that if for some reason you card gets rejected due to processor error, simply use the backup processor link

Can't tell you how many joins that has saved..and as long as it remains in line with the pitch and matches with the program (like the sponsors could be interchangeable with your original pitch anyway ) your good to go.

Pro tip. Try it out yourself and see if you're joins don't increase overall. That is of coarse your not using boxed creatives from your sponsor.

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jscott

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#12

06-13-2015, 11:22 PM

I know companies who have billing companies who actually pursue expired credit cards, they automatically convert them to the new updated cc's after the old ones expire

.... i wonder, does ccbill do innovative things like this? For the past 5-10 years they seem to be anti-innovative unfortunately

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plaster

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#13

06-13-2015, 11:56 PM

Originally posted by jscott

I know companies who have billing companies who actually pursue expired credit cards, they automatically convert them to the new updated cc's after the old ones expire

.... i wonder, does ccbill do innovative things like this? For the past 5-10 years they seem to be anti-innovative unfortunately

That has to be illegal. Most cards likely update every 2 years to the same month, with same number. I am fairly certain updating this expiration date, without customer permission, is illegal.
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jscott

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#14

06-14-2015, 12:07 AM

Not if it's in their TOS
,,, i think there's a special box they need to click too, before purchasing

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NETbilling

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#15

06-16-2015, 11:29 PM

Hi,

We can certainly help give you more control and you will see greater profits and better conversions as well. Lease contact our sales department or email me directly for more info,

Thanks, Mitch

Mitch Farber
CEO - NETbilling, Inc.
Email / Phone: 888-357-8166 / 661-252-2456
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McSpike

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#16

06-30-2015, 02:20 AM

Originally posted by Pseudonymous

do affiliates even get access to denial information? i dont believe so but i could be wrong

affiliates barely manage to get any stats without their admin timing out 10 times with each iteration taking several minutes to timeout. Without statsremote it would be near impossible checking stats, let alone dig into the stats and see, what, denials? lol...

there's a whole bunch of other transparency problems that they have on the affiliate side so it's really a pain for affiliates. if you can just mount more processors and use NATS or something because you dealing only with ccbill is when we are both losing money.
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jscott

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#17

06-30-2015, 03:49 AM

I quit checking ccbill stats years ago when they first quit working
Hope im still making sales

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glocks

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#18

07-07-2015, 02:53 PM

I noticed a large spike in denials via Epoch today. Has anyone else noticed this too?
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Kafka

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#19

07-07-2015, 03:11 PM

Originally posted by glocks

I noticed a large spike in denials via Epoch today. Has anyone else noticed this too?

Yes, i have a significant increase in denials too from CcBill that is.
What not denied is the annual fee of $500.
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glocks

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#20

07-07-2015, 03:19 PM

I mean from Epoch specifically. Can Epoch comment on this perhaps?
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plaster

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#21

07-07-2015, 03:40 PM

They will never comment about rise in denials.
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The Porn Nerd

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#22

07-07-2015, 05:13 PM

Remember too many processers use Merrick Bank for Adult so sometimes it's not the 3rd party processer, it's the merchant bank. Or Visa. Or Greece defaulting. Or Donald Trump talking about Mexican rapists.....so it could be anything.

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