The breakup of the UK

[Scott McD]

With only 10 days to go, looks like it might actually happen!

Seems the English media has finally woken up to the fact. Interesting few days ahead...

[Jel]

If only we could get rid of wales too

[Paul]

Originally Posted by Jel

If only we could get rid of wales too

And Northern Ireland for the win!

I do think if Scotland get their independence they'll regret it for a very long time when things go pear shaped.

The path to hell is paved with good intentions...

[mineistaken]

Who would take oil? Shetland etc?
Anyway I am skeptical if they would actually vote YES.

[Scott McD]

England seems more worried about losing Scotland, than Scotland does about England.

Boris Johnson has claimed Britain is ‘on the verge of an utter catastrophe’ as Scotland swings closer to voting for separation.
The London Mayor attacked the ‘complacency’ in the rest of the country over the prospect of Scottish independence.
He said the country was ‘sleepwalking’ into a tragedy amid growing evidence of a surge in support for the ‘Yes’ to independence campaign.
A poll released yesterday showed support for independence was now in the lead by two points – by 51 per cent to 49 per cent.

[brassmonkey]

Originally Posted by Scott McD

England seems more worried about losing Scotland, than Scotland does about England.

they need to kill the scotts that want to leave

[_Richard_]

fear tactics haven't worked.. now to try bribery?

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by Scott McD

Seems the English media has finally woken up to the fact. Interesting few days ahead...

I've been following this in the English media for the past six months...

My question is how will this affect Ireland?

[Sly]

Originally Posted by Scott McD

England seems more worried about losing Scotland, than Scotland does about England.

The little dog is often so busy yapping that they are oblivious to the advantages they get from hanging around a big dog.

[The Porn Nerd]

Here is how it should be (and will be):

Scotland = Independent cuntry.
Ireland = Independent cuntry
Wales = part of "England" because they share the same bloody island.
England = whatever's left + Wales.
Great Britain = Bye-Bye.
United Kingdon = Bye-bye.
Britain = No longer "great", just British.

Carry on.

[Scott McD]

The best piece i have seen written on this so far:


I'm not taking any credit for this, I just saw someone's post on the Vote NO to Scottish independence and protect the union page and I thought it was genius!!

"I always find that if you flip the debate around with a no or undecided voter it always has the desired result. Try this next time you speak with a no voter, ask them how they would vote in this situation.....there can only be one outcome.

Imagine Scotland was already independent and we were about to have a referendum on whether to join a union with the rest of the UK.
Could the Pro-union side convince us that getting together would be better when we were told what would happen to Scotland after such a union? Some bullet points from the campaign…

-Your main Parliament will move 600 miles away, and your MPs will be in a tiny minority & will therefore have limited ability to effect policy on your behalf
-Scotland will get a government it didn’t vote for.
-All of your oil and gas revenues will be handed over to the treasury in London.
-Even though not 1 inch of track will touch Scottish soil your taxpayers will contribute £4.2bn to the HS2 project.
-Your taxpayers will also subsidise the crossrail project to the tune of £4.2bn
-The biggest nuclear weapons facility in Western Europe will be built on the river Clyde, just 30 miles from your largest city.
-Even though you only have 8.2% of the UK’s population you will contribute 9.9% of the UK’s total tax take yet will only receive 9.3% of that tax take back to spend in Scotland (you will lose £4.4bn per year to the UK treasury)
-You will devolve all of the economic levers you have used to shape your economy directly to London and will now only have control of 7% of your economy
-Even though 79% of your MP's voted against it we will privitise your publicly owned mail service
-Even though 91% of your MPs voted against the bedroom tax in your parliament, we will impose it.
-Even though 82% of your MP's believed that a VAT increase would be detrimental to your economy, we will impose a VAT increase.
-You will join a country whose health and education services are rapidly being privatised.
-Now and again you’ll get dragged into an illegal foreign war.
-An austerity budget will be imposed from London cutting jobs and threatening vital public services even though 81% of your MP's voted against the cuts.
-The financial regulation system will be so weak and so lax that your whole economy will be brought to the brink of collapse.
-The most weak and vulnerable in society, instead of getting the protection and support they deserve will be interrogated and humiliated in an effort to get them off the meagre levels of support to which they are entitled.
Who in Scotland would vote for such a package?
Who would vote for that union?

So why would anyone vote to remain in such a union now?

[RummyBoy]

This is a disaster for the UK. Scotland will 100% be independent from the UK and the flag will be like a Scottish Kilt.

[RummyBoy]

Originally Posted by Paul

And Northern Ireland for the win!

I do think if Scotland get their independence they'll regret it for a very long time when things go pear shaped. The path to hell is paved with good intentions...

My guess is that it'll be the other way around, as Scotland inhabits the high ground. When we get all the mother nature kicks our ass floods, its the south that suffers most.

[Scott McD]

The fact that most English people will tell you the UK is getting turning into a shithole more and more every day doesn't exactly work in the favour of "Better Together".

The current government, current UK policies, the NHS etc are all fucked as it stands.

And we have the most detestable people in Alistair Darling, Gordon Brown, David Cameron, Boris Johnson, Nick Clegg to name a few telling us why the Union is so great.

It's a resounding YES from me !

[ottopottomouse]

I think most people in England don't give a shit either way.

[Jel]

Originally Posted by Scott McD

England seems more worried about losing Scotland, than Scotland does about England.

to be fair, buffoon that he is, Boris probably gives a fuck about the sweaties - which is more than most of the rest of us do

[rogueteens]

Originally Posted by Scott McD

The fact that most English people will tell you the UK is getting turning into a shithole more and more every day doesn't exactly work in the favour of "Better Together".

The current government, current UK policies, the NHS etc are all fucked as it stands.

And we have the most detestable people in Alistair Darling, Gordon Brown, David Cameron, Boris Johnson, Nick Clegg to name a few telling us why the Union is so great.

It's a resounding YES from me !

you do realise that when you reapply to join the EU, you'll be obliged to take a set amount of "asylum seekers" (oops, I mean "economic migrants"). Scotland will turn into one big Londonistan!

[EonBlue]

Originally Posted by The Porn Nerd

Here is how it should be (and will be):

Scotland = Independent cuntry.
Ireland = Independent cuntry
Wales = part of "England" because they share the same bloody island.
England = whatever's left + Wales.
Great Britain = Bye-Bye.
United Kingdon = Bye-bye.
Britain = No longer "great", just British.

Carry on.

Scotland shares the same island as England and Wales. Logic error.

[Scott McD]

Originally Posted by rogueteens

you do realise that when you reapply to join the EU, you'll be obliged to take a set amount of "asylum seekers" (oops, I mean "economic migrants"). Scotland will turn into one big Londonistan!

We are already getting our share just now.

I don't think any country in Europe is exempt from that. Sadly.

These are all still the cons though. Which have been what the "Better Together' campaign has focused on since the start. Reading that piece i posted a few replies back, can you see why many are now simply saying "fuck the Union!" ??

[rogueteens]

Originally Posted by Scott McD

We are already getting our share just now.

Share? You ain't seen nothing yet. How many cities are the White English in the minority now? 4? 5?

[420]

Originally Posted by Scott McD

England seems more worried about losing Scotland, than Scotland does about England.

looks familiar

[_Richard_]

'if you become your own country, you'll have more immigrants!'

[slapass]

Originally Posted by Scott McD

The best piece i have seen written on this so far:


I'm not taking any credit for this, I just saw someone's post on the Vote NO to Scottish independence and protect the union page and I thought it was genius!!

"I always find that if you flip the debate around with a no or undecided voter it always has the desired result. Try this next time you speak with a no voter, ask them how they would vote in this situation.....there can only be one outcome.

Imagine Scotland was already independent and we were about to have a referendum on whether to join a union with the rest of the UK.
Could the Pro-union side convince us that getting together would be better when we were told what would happen to Scotland after such a union? Some bullet points from the campaign?

-Your main Parliament will move 600 miles away, and your MPs will be in a tiny minority & will therefore have limited ability to effect policy on your behalf
-Scotland will get a government it didn?t vote for.
-All of your oil and gas revenues will be handed over to the treasury in London.
-Even though not 1 inch of track will touch Scottish soil your taxpayers will contribute £4.2bn to the HS2 project.
-Your taxpayers will also subsidise the crossrail project to the tune of £4.2bn
-The biggest nuclear weapons facility in Western Europe will be built on the river Clyde, just 30 miles from your largest city.
-Even though you only have 8.2% of the UK?s population you will contribute 9.9% of the UK?s total tax take yet will only receive 9.3% of that tax take back to spend in Scotland (you will lose £4.4bn per year to the UK treasury)
-You will devolve all of the economic levers you have used to shape your economy directly to London and will now only have control of 7% of your economy
-Even though 79% of your MP's voted against it we will privitise your publicly owned mail service
-Even though 91% of your MPs voted against the bedroom tax in your parliament, we will impose it.
-Even though 82% of your MP's believed that a VAT increase would be detrimental to your economy, we will impose a VAT increase.
-You will join a country whose health and education services are rapidly being privatised.
-Now and again you?ll get dragged into an illegal foreign war.
-An austerity budget will be imposed from London cutting jobs and threatening vital public services even though 81% of your MP's voted against the cuts.
-The financial regulation system will be so weak and so lax that your whole economy will be brought to the brink of collapse.
-The most weak and vulnerable in society, instead of getting the protection and support they deserve will be interrogated and humiliated in an effort to get them off the meagre levels of support to which they are entitled.
Who in Scotland would vote for such a package?
Who would vote for that union?

So why would anyone vote to remain in such a union now?

Aren't you forgetting that you would need to fund an army from scratch? Your whole country will be the weak and vulnerable. I suppose you could just rely on everyone around you being nice to you.

[oppoten]

[RebelR]

My only concerns are these: 1) Do you still have to fund the Royal Family, and 2) Will this have any effect on the price of Single Malt?

[_Richard_]

[Bryan G]

I personally hope it happens but I think older folks that are well off and comfortable with the current situation will vote No. They probably are not interested in the uncertainty of change.

[Paul]

Originally Posted by Rochard

My question is how will this affect Ireland?

The short answer is it won't, the Republic of Ireland is a separate country

Originally Posted by Scott McD

So why would anyone vote to remain in such a union now?

Better the devil you know...

The argument you posted presents some excellent points but they are based in a fantasy world where there isn't incredibly powerful global vested interests that bully and manipulate governments to their own ends.

If England decides to play hard ball if Scotland gets it's independence that's when things will get interesting!

What if England decide that Scotland can't use the £?
What if England introduce border control?
What if there isn't as much oil reserves as first though? Or worse, England or anyone else with a military decides to take it by force?
What if a lot of big employers that have links to the vested interests withdraw all investment from Scotland? Capital flight can destroy an economy fast!

For the record Scotty if I lived in Scotland I'd be voting for independence, regardless of anything I've posted above (which are mainly my concerns more than anything else)

You can only push people so far before they decide it's time for a change, for better or for worse. The politicians in the UK have been taking the piss for too long and I think most people outside of London are getting very fed up with how the country is being run.

I certainly wish Scotland the best of luck and I hope the Scottish people prosper if they get their independence!

It's squeaky bum time!

[VIXEN ESCORTS]

I kind of hope it's a yes vote because it will be exciting and Cameron will have to resign and it will be a rocket up Westminsters ass but I also kind of hope it's a no vote because there's really no benefit to Scotland or the rest of the UK. Scottish people will just end up being fucked over by Scottish politicians instead of UK politicians, nothing will change except a few egos being massaged.
What pisses ME off is they want independence but they still want the currency, the monarch etc.....Sorry LOVE, you wanna leave, bye bye !
If it's a yes vote they won't be part of the UK or the EU therefore they will be outside ATVOD's jurisdiction Though I'm sure that loophole will get plugged seeing as they want to outlaw escorting too.
Too cold and wet to move up there but if Cornwall became independent I'd be on the next bus.

[TheDA]

IF Scotland votes 'Yes' it will be bleak for a couple of decades.

[aka123]

Originally Posted by The Porn Nerd

Here is how it should be (and will be):

Scotland = Independent cuntry.
Ireland = Independent cuntry
Wales = part of "England" because they share the same bloody island.
England = whatever's left + Wales.
Great Britain = Bye-Bye.
United Kingdon = Bye-bye.
Britain = No longer "great", just British.

Carry on.

I am not that good in geography, but doesn't Scotland too share the same island?

[Imortyl Pussycat]

ever since I watched the movie Braveheart, I wanted Scotland to be free. i didn't really pay attention to who got what and how before that.

[editeur]

If majority vote for breakup they will get another poll. And then another, until they vote like they a supposed to vote. The same way as it was with EU agreement several years ago.

[_Richard_]

[oppoten]

Here's another good article

http://www.theguardian.com/commentis...s-union-tories

tl;dr On the ballot paper on 18 September, yes seems to read ?never live under a Tory government ever again?.

[The Porn Nerd]

Originally Posted by aka123

I am not that good in geography, but doesn't Scotland too share the same island?

Only Brits and Scots care about such minor details. LOL

Fuck it, Independance for all!! WooHoo!

[VIXEN ESCORTS]

I think people need to get a grip here, that article says:
"Most Brits voted against Thatcherism".............YES
Most Brits vote against EVERY Government they end up with, it was John Major in 1992 who got the biggest ever %, I think 44%.
The alternative is PR, well that's what you've kind off ended up with now with the coalition.
Every group can have a gripe about the country they live in, be they Scottish, Welsh, Cornish, Black Country, whatever, but I hope Scottish people might be grateful that they were part of the UK in the past when it benefited them.

[_Richard_]

Dubh-ghall fearann's ath!

[Cyber Fucker]

Well, let's see.

[Dvae]

Originally Posted by Scott McD

The fact that most English people will tell you the UK is getting turning into a shithole more and more every day doesn't exactly work in the favour of "Better Together".

The current government, current UK policies, the NHS etc are all fucked as it stands.

And we have the most detestable people in Alistair Darling, Gordon Brown, David Cameron, Boris Johnson, Nick Clegg to name a few telling us why the Union is so great.

It's a resounding YES from me !

What, the NHS is fucked?

I thought "free healthcare" was the best thing since sliced bread ... or so we in the US are told.

[mineistaken]

Originally Posted by Dvae

What, the NHS is fucked?

I thought "free healthcare" was the best thing since sliced bread ... or so we in the US are told.

There are many countries with free heath care. Not all are "fucked".
Also - not sure that NHS is "fucked" because it is "free".

[pornmasta]

Originally Posted by The Porn Nerd

Here is how it should be (and will be):

Scotland = Independent cuntry.
Ireland = Independent cuntry
Wales = part of "England" because they share the same bloody island.
England = whatever's left + Wales.
Great Britain = Bye-Bye.
United Kingdon = Bye-bye.
Britain = No longer "great", just British.

Carry on.

the ununited kingdom

[Dvae]

Originally Posted by mineistaken

There are many countries with free heath care. Not all are "fucked".
Also - not sure that NHS is "fucked" because it is "free".

What ever the reason it does not matter. The fact that it is is the point and that anyone involved with it would dare admit it.

[Phoenix]

I am interested to see what happens. I don't care much either way.

[Captain Kawaii]

Originally Posted by Scott McD

The fact that most English people will tell you the UK is getting turning into a shithole more and more every day doesn't exactly work in the favour of "Better Together".

The current government, current UK policies, the NHS etc are all fucked as it stands.

And we have the most detestable people in Alistair Darling, Gordon Brown, David Cameron, Boris Johnson, Nick Clegg to name a few telling us why the Union is so great.

It's a resounding YES from me !

+3 here! (left hand, right hand, middle hand)

Perhaps if London loses some political and financial juice they will have to sit out on some of the illegal wars...and stuff.
With the last 10 days upon you now the heavy propaganda machine will roll out.

[Bourke]

some of you seem to be ignoring the money and troops Scotland puts in to the British armed forces would instead go into a Scottish armed force. They wont be without an army. Its not like there are no Scots in the army...

[Scott McD]

Originally Posted by Dvae

What, the NHS is fucked?

I thought "free healthcare" was the best thing since sliced bread ... or so we in the US are told.

Because under the current Tory government (which we didn't vote for) it might not be free for much longer.

Watch this space...

[Scott McD]

Originally Posted by Paul

For the record Scotty if I lived in Scotland I'd be voting for independence, regardless of anything I've posted above (which are mainly my concerns more than anything else)

You can only push people so far before they decide it's time for a change, for better or for worse. The politicians in the UK have been taking the piss for too long and I think most people outside of London are getting very fed up with how the country is being run.

I certainly wish Scotland the best of luck and I hope the Scottish people prosper if they get their independence!

It's squeaky bum time!

Yup. The polititians at Westminster shouldn't be surprised people have had enough of their BS. Even if it means taking other huge risks.

If people in England had the chance, i'm sure they would want them all out aswell.

As the Yes campaign has already said "if this is better together, then god help us"...

[The Porn Nerd]

This will, of course, lead to haggas becoming Great Britain's "National Food" as a sign of unity. So there's something to look forward to!

[aka123]

Originally Posted by The Porn Nerd

Only Brits and Scots care about such minor details. LOL

Fuck it, Independance for all!! WooHoo!

Well, I support if people want to be independent, at least at some reasonable levels. I don't support having city countries as in the old days, or something like that. Well, present ones can be what they want, but splitting much anymore.

Countries are not just about independence, they are also about functional units. Much splitting makes them peacemeals in the terms of economy and military. Also cost per unit rises, whatever the unit is.

Or if we are in splitting spree, maybe Scotland should give independence to Northumbria? And what about Wessex, Sussex, Kent, Essex, East Anglia, Mercia, North Wales, Strath Clyde, Dalriada and Pictland? Those are historical kingdoms on British Isles