The new 2014 Camaro Z28: A Muscle Car for Muscle heads

[2MuchMark]

Yes, I know. As a former owner of 2 next-gen Camaros and 10 Firebirds, the New Z28 Camaro is a RIDICULOUS Car. V8, 7 Litre 505 Horsepower blah blah blah.. for $79,250 CAD!

I really believe that ICE Muscle cars like this are on their way out. Electric is just so much cooler, and smarter.

[MK Ultra]

Like an ex smoker becoming violently negative on cigarettes so goes the newly converted treehugger.

[dyna mo]

I think I'm gonna go down to the shore.

[candyflip]

Digging this one much, much, much more.

[Rochard]

Electric cars are going to be a major game changer..... They will be much faster than what we have now.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by Rochard

Electric cars are going to be a major game changer..... They will be much faster than what we have now.

nope, not until battery tech makes a major leap forward, like exponential major.

currently, get it, yuk yuk, there is no new battery tech on the horizon.

[edgeprod]

Originally Posted by Rochard

Electric cars are going to be a major game changer..... They will be much faster than what we have now.

Many of them are already pretty fucking fast. Instant torque is an amazing thing.

[_Richard_]

Originally Posted by MK Ultra

Like an ex smoker becoming violently negative on cigarettes so goes the newly converted treehugger.

[Penny24Seven]

Originally Posted by **********

Yes, I know. As a former owner of 2 next-gen Camaros and 10 Firebirds, the New Z28 Camaro is a RIDICULOUS Car. V8, 7 Litre 505 Horsepower blah blah blah.. for $79,250 CAD!

I really believe that ICE Muscle cars like this are on their way out. Electric is just so much cooler, and smarter.

I drove them before I bought mine. I didn't get the 72K Camaro though, It was just unreal though.
My eyes could not keep up with it. Very load and it was like I was driving a race car. A little much for me. I would like it for a fun ride now and then but not everyday

[dready]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

nope, not until battery tech makes a major leap forward, like exponential major.

currently, get it, yuk yuk, there is no new battery tech on the horizon.

Then why are nearly all major supercar manufacturers embracing hybrid technology?

http://www.wired.com/2014/07/bugatti-hybrid-supercars/

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by dready

Then why are nearly all major supercar manufacturers embracing hybrid technology?

http://www.wired.com/2014/07/bugatti-hybrid-supercars/

Because people like ********** do what the television tells them to and they go buy those cars.

Im not making up the simple fact that battery technology lags far behind where it should be and needs to be to add to the value proposition. Tesla s is what 7000 batteries and 3000 pounds. That is not a solution, that's a problem. And just as big of peoblem is the manufacturing and disposal of those batteries.

Btw, do you know how many tons of pollution are created with each of those hybrids built?

20 tons on average. Much of that from the batteries. Car builders don't give a shot about that, they only care about selling cars.

[dyna mo]

Again, here is the comment i was replying to. Electric cars will not be a game changer until there is a game changer battery.

Originally Posted by Rochard

Electric cars are going to be a major game changer..... They will be much faster than what we have now.

[dready]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

Again, here is the comment i was replying to. Electric cars will not be a game changer until there is a game changer battery.

I agree with you that they won't be a game changer until the batteries are better for consumer cars. When it comes to sports cars (which is what this thread is about) it is already a HUGE game changer. No ICE can come close to competing with the amount of torque that can be generated by electric motors.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by dready

I agree with you that they won't be a game changer until the batteries are better for consumer cars. When it comes to sports cars (which is what this thread is about) it is already a HUGE game changer. No ICE can come close to competing with the amount of torque that can be generated by electric motors.

No, the thread is about a muscle car, a camaro is not and has never been a sports car.

And again, the comment to which i replied was regarding electric cars in General.

[ottopottomouse]

Originally Posted by MK Ultra

Like an ex smoker becoming violently negative on cigarettes so goes the newly converted treehugger.

Its just like someone who found religion too.

[dready]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

And again, the comment to which i replied was regarding electric cars in General.

Please reread Rochard's post and then explain how current battery technology prevents cars from going faster.

[MK Ultra]

Originally Posted by ottopottomouse

Its just like someone who found religion too.

Praise Jebus!

Can I get a amen since I can't spell Hallilu... Halaliu... Halleluyah?

Originally Posted by dyna mo

Again, here is the comment i was replying to. Electric cars will not be a game changer until there is a game changer battery.

Actually the development of an inexpensive room-temperature superconducting materiel would really help with extending the battery life, that could also be a game changer for a lot of energy issues.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by dready

Please reread Rochard's post and then explain how current battery technology prevents cars from going faster.

After you reread it and point out where he mentions hybrids.

[2MuchMark]

Originally Posted by MK Ultra

Like an ex smoker becoming violently negative on cigarettes so goes the newly converted treehugger.

I know... and you're right.

Originally Posted by candyflip

Digging this one much, much, much more.

Me too. The SRT is a nicer car and the price is better too. (Still ICE though... so blah. ;) )

Originally Posted by dyna mo

nope, not until battery tech makes a major leap forward, like exponential major.

Lol!

Originally Posted by dyna mo

Because people like ********** do what the television tells them to and they go buy those cars..

Television told me? When is the last time you saw a TV ad for a Chevy Volt or a Tesla? None or at least, very few. How many ads do you see for a Dodge Ram? or BMW? Or Acura? Every 2 minutes.

Originally Posted by dyna mo

No, the thread is about a muscle car, a camaro is not and has never been a sports car.

Originally Posted by ottopottomouse

Its just like someone who found religion too.

Praise a'Jee-zus!

I know what you mean but not really... A $40k Camaro is alot (which is what I paid for mine, which was a 2SS RS 1LE. $60k for the ZL1 is too much. $80k for a CAMARO is fucking ridiculous. I think $80k for that car is insane, and, I think $80k for an ICE car is insane. If I was going to spend that much money (and I almost did), it would be for an electric car.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by dready

Please reread Rochard's post and then explain how current battery technology prevents cars from going faster.

I would answer you specifically but since i already did (the comment re: tesla s bat pack weighing 3000 pounds. If you can't see how weight adversely impacts speed, i cant justify wasting time trying to re-explain that .

[dyna mo]

Some of yall would argue blue just because i said red. Lolz. If youve failed to keep up on what thebattery issuez are re: electric powered vehicles then you really shouldn't be arguing at all. Either way, pretty funny.

[dyna mo]

I'm going to break off a little knowledge today, for my fellow gfyers. I'm in a good mood, on the beach, drinking a beer and relaxing after catching this morning waves

battery technology lags

take your pick from google

https://www.google.com/search?q=batt...sm=93&ie=UTF-8

If The Future's Battery-Powered, We're Screwed

Forget innovation. We?re all stifled until we crack the battery conundrum.

http://readwrite.com/2014/07/11/batt...mer-technology

[dready]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

I would answer you specifically but since i already did (the comment re: tesla s bat pack weighing 3000 pounds. If you can't see how weight adversely impacts speed, i cant justify wasting time trying to re-explain that .

Quoted from Wired.com's article posted two days ago:

Today?s supercars are powered by batteries as well as internal combustion engines. The leading examples are the Porsche 918, the McLaren P1, and the Ferrari LaFerrari. At near or over $1 million a pop, each uses a hybrid powertrain.

It?s obvious why. Improving fuel economy may not matter to people who pay annual gas bills with the change under their sofa cushions. Improving performance does. Electric motors produce instant torque, which translates to terrific acceleration. When cost isn?t a factor, you can slap a motor on each wheel and really pump up performance. The 918 uses 6.8 kilowatt-hours of electricity to get it from zero to 60 in 2.5 seconds while maintaining a combined EPA fuel economy rating of 22 mpg. The LaFerrari?s 32-pound lithium-ion battery pack can get it to 205 mph. The P1 has one of the best Nürburgring times ever. Those are results.

[Penny24Seven]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

No, the thread is about a muscle car, a camaro is not and has never been a sports car.

And again, the comment to which i replied was regarding electric cars in General.

A camaro is not a sports car because you say so? I would probably agree with you on the camaros from the 90's and even up to 2002 but the new ones are so much better.
500 HP is not a sports car lol

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by dready

Quoted from Wired.com's article posted two days ago:

again, that has nothing to do with the simple fact that battery technology needs a major breakthrough, I'm finding it extremely difficult to sort out why you're taking issue with that fact. That's not my opinion, it's not even opinion, it's fact.

Originally Posted by Brian837

A camaro is not a sports car because you say so? I would probably agree with you on the camaros from the 90's and even up to 2002 but the new ones are so much better.
500 HP is not a sports car lol

No. Camaro is not a sports car because General Motors has said so. They've made it very clear for decades, they make 1 sports car and that is the Chevrolet Corvette. HP has very little to do with what makes a sports car.

[dyna mo]

The Chevrolet Camaro is an automobile manufactured by General Motors under the Chevrolet brand, classified as a pony car and some versions also as a muscle car.


The Chevrolet Corvette is a sports car by the Chevrolet division of General Motors (GM) that has been produced in seven generations.

[Choopa Phil]

Dyna ill just leave these little gems here for you. I think you like to argue at nothing sometimes.

http://www.chevrolet.com/camaro-sport-coupe.html
http://www.chevrolet.com/camaro-zl1-sports-car.html
http://www.chevrolet.com/car/sport.html

I guess this must be the first year GM considers the camaro a sport car...OH WAIT they used to make a Camaro called the SS or SUPER SPORT.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by Choopa Phil

Dyna ill just leave these little gems here for you. I think you like to argue at nothing sometimes.

http://www.chevrolet.com/camaro-sport-coupe.html
http://www.chevrolet.com/camaro-zl1-sports-car.html
http://www.chevrolet.com/car/sport.html

I guess this must be the first year GM considers the camaro a sport car...OH WAIT they used to make a Camaro called the SS or SUPER SPORT.

umm, i'm not the one that took issue with my comments, others were. I am simply replying to those. Just like I am replying to your attempt to argue, I didn't initiate your arguing with me, but I'll sort it out.

again, ss is not sports car. Can some version of the new camaro be marketed as a sports car, sure, why not, but again, GM has a history of clearly differentiating the Corvette from the Camaro and that difference has been the Corvette is a sports car and the Camaro is a pony car.


but since you brought up the SS marketing scheme.

Here's a sports car, presenting the Chevy s10 SS pickup truck sports car.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chevrolet_S-10#SS

[Robbie]

Actually...a REAL sports car isn't even a corvette.

A REAL sports car has NO air conditioning and NO power steering (rack and pinion only).

They are stripped down and never have a top (always convertible). Purists won't even allow for crank up windows (you are allowed to have zip-on or snap on clear plastic window covers for inclement weather with your rag top).

But the term sports car has evolved. I'm talking purely from a "purists" point of view.

I owned a lot of mustangs in the 1970's, a couple of corvettes more recently, and a prowler.
I don't consider ANY of those to be sportscars though.

I do consider the 2 MG's that I owned to be 100% sports cars by definition.

[Choopa Phil]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

umm, i'm not the one that took issue with my comments, others were. I am simply replying to those. Just like I am replying to your attempt to argue, I didn't initiate your arguing with me, but I'll sort it out.

again, ss is not sports car. Can some version of the new camaro be marketed as a sports car, sure, why not, but again, GM has a history of clearly differentiating the Corvette from the Camaro and that difference has been the Corvette is a sports car and the Camaro is a pony car.


but since you brought up the SS marketing scheme.

Here's a sports car, presenting the Chevy s10 SS pickup truck sports car.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chevrolet_S-10#SS

Where do you think the SS branding originated from? This is obviously marketing but when you put a RWD drive train in a 2 door coupe with racing developed parts you get whats called a sports car. Mind blowing!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_Sport

"Both historically and today, the Super Sport package has typically included high-performance tires, heavy-duty suspension, and increased power, along with a variety of other performance and appearance upgrades."

[ExtremeBank_Adam]

A few pics from a car show / go kart competition that a few buddies and I went to a couple weekends ago. Not a great showing of high end cars, and our group had some of the better cars there (Gallardo, C6 Z06, my yellow C7, and the new Z28). There was a Maserati, and a few Lotus', but not much else, unless you like Mustangs or rice burners.

The Z28 is pretty awesome, but not a daily driver for sure. The brakes are pretty bad ass, too...

Here are some pics of our cars (mine is the yellow 2014 Vette):

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by Choopa Phil

Where do you think the SS branding originated from? This is obviously marketing but when you put a RWD drive train in a 2 door coupe with racing developed parts you get whats called a sports car. Mind blowing!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_Sport

"Both historically and today, the Super Sport package has typically included high-performance tires, heavy-duty suspension, and increased power, along with a variety of other performance and appearance upgrades."

From your link,

In 1961, the SS "kit" was offered on any Impala for just $53.80. The package included Super Sport trim for both the interior and exterior, chassis reinforcements, stronger springs and shocks, power brakes, spinner wheel covers, and narrow-band whitewall tires.

although I already knew the ss moniker originated with the Impala, but if you and other want to think that impala SS is a sports car or that a 1968 camaro ss was a sports car or any car is a sports car, no worries. It wasn't my intention to step on toes or stomp on egos, I was simply adding to the thread that GM has historically claimed they make one sports car- the Corvette.

[Vendzilla]

Didn't GM just issue a recall for the Camaro?

[Choopa Phil]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

From your link,



although I already knew the ss moniker originated with the Impala, but if you and other want to think that impala SS is a sports car or that a 1968 camaro ss was a sports car or any car is a sports car, no worries. It wasn't my intention to step on toes or stomp on egos, I was simply adding to the thread that GM has historically claimed they make one sports car- the Corvette.

But they dont as per their website which lists the Camaro as a sports car in all trims from base model V6 all the way up to the ZL1.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by Choopa Phil

But they dont as per their website which lists the Camaro as a sports car in all trims from base model V6 all the way up to the ZL1.

Again, Gm has historically differentiated the 2, I was simply adding that to the thread.


When I made the comment, I was not aware that the difference between a pony car and a sports car was such a sensitive subject.


If you want to buy the marketing that a v6 3800 pound 4 seater base Camaro is a sports car, that's perfectly fine with me.

[Choopa Phil]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

Again, Gm has historically differentiated the 2, I was simply adding that to the thread.


When I made the comment, I was not aware that the difference between a pony car and a sports car was such a sensitive subject.


If you want to buy the marketing that a v6 3800 pound 4 seater base Camaro is a sports car, that's perfectly fine with me.

How have they historically separated the 2? The camaro back in in the 60's was touted as a sports car...albeit not on the level of a corvette but it still was considered one. Maybe not in YOUR book its not considered a sports car that but nothing you have posted shows Chevy denying the Camaro as a sports car or calling it something different.



Here are some more Camaro ad's - http://www.productioncars.com/vintag...evrolet/Camaro Chevy apparently boasted that this car had 4 seats and handled so well they considered it a sports car.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by Choopa Phil

How have they historically separated the 2? The camaro back in in the 60's was touted as a sports car...albeit not on the level of a corvette but it still was considered one. Maybe not in YOUR book its not considered a sports car that but nothing you have posted shows Chevy denying the Camaro as a sports car or calling it something different.

It's not that big of deal man, I simply added to the topic that GM has traditionally/historically made sure to keep the cars separate.

The ad you posted supports that, they refer to the Camaro as a sportY car, not a sportS car,

from the same year.



The ad clearly makes sure to mention the Corvette is a sports car, specifically.

And the only one made in America.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by Choopa Phil

Here are some more Camaro ad's - http://www.productioncars.com/vintag...evrolet/Camaro Chevy apparently boasted that this car had 4 seats and handled so well they considered it a sports car.

In not in one single ad on that page does Chevy/GM refer to the Camaro as a sports car.

At best, they refer to it as a sport coupe. That is intentional. Again, supporting my comment that GM has always differentiated the Corvette as the one sports car they manufacturer.

[Choopa Phil]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

In not in one single ad on that page does Chevy/GM refer to the Camaro as a sports car.

Youre making this too easy for me! :D

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by Choopa Phil

Youre making this too easy for me! :D

Lolz ,making what easy for you? Arguing an arcane post in athread couched by you saying i had some need to argue for no reason. Ok, sure. You win the argument, in your eyes, the ad i posted has no importance while the one you did makes something too easy.

Again, i was simply adding to the topic, in my recollection, and supported with gobs of examples, GM historically differentiated the Corvette as its only sports car.

You felt the need to take issue with that.

[Robbie]

Again...from my experience...a camaro is not a "sports car". A mustang is not a "sports car"
They belong more in the "muscle car" group.

Lamborghini, Ferrari, etc. are "super cars".

Real "sports cars" were Triumphs, E series Jags, MG's, early Porsche, Austin Healy's etc.

A sports car has TWO seats. It's light and nimble. No power steering. No top. Usually drum brakes

And most of them (except for those monster 12 cylinder Jags) had small 4 cylinder engines and weighed next to nothing. They were raced in road rally's all over Europe.

A sports car wasn't known for having a big engine. It was known for handling and cornering and sitting low to the ground (a few inches). Sports cars didn't have much "luxury"...no AC, no power-anything.

And if you ever drive an old sports car...you will instantly know why they are the funnest cars in the world to drive. You are completely connected to the road. And when you take an MG up to 100 mph...you are scared shitless! It's thrilling to say the least. lol

[dyna mo]

I don't disagree Robbie. A lot of tradition in what makes up a sports car. In that light, a Mazda Miata is a fantastic modern day sports car.

But I wouldn't disagree that the industry is moving away from that tradition, as per the comments in this thread, I think technology allows more cars to handle like sports cars and then can be thought of by many as a sports car. one of the new Camaro models, I can't recall which one there are so many, certainly blurs the line between it and the new Corvette.


The new Alfa Romeo 4c, along the lines of traditional sports car and by all accounts a fantastic car.

[dyna mo]

[Robbie]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

I don't disagree Robbie. A lot of tradition in what makes up a sports car. In that light, a Mazda Miata is a fantastic modern day sports car.

But I wouldn't disagree that the industry is moving away from that tradition, as per the comments in this thread, I think technology allows more cars to handle like sports cars and then can be thought of by many as a sports car. one of the new Camaro models, I can't recall which one there are so many, certainly blurs the line between it and the new Corvette.


The new Alfa Romeo 4c, along the lines of traditional sports car and by all accounts a fantastic car.

Alfa Romeos are cool as shit. One of the few sports cars that I never got to drive. I almost bought an old one back in the mid 1980's but at the last minute I couldn't get over to see it and it got sold.

I would still say that you can have all the technology in the world...and it might make some cars "feel" a bit like the driver can have the illusion of driving a sports car.

But there is no way to replicate the feel of a 1275 cc A series engine with an oversized 1 3/4 inch carb powering a 1,500 pound car that is perfectly weight balanced in rear and front on rack and pinion steering with a NON-synchronized 4 speed transmission on skinny 13 x 5 inch intertube tires on wire wheels.

That is a sound, smell (gasonline and oil), feeling (your ass in the seat is about 4 inches from the ground lol), and just pure mojo that you just will never get in a heavy, big engined, power steering, big tires car.

Don't get me wrong...I love muscle cars too.

But it's a whole different experience.

To me, driving a sports car is like fucking that super skinny, tiny tit, tiny ass spinner chick.
And driving a muscle car is like banging that thick bitch with the bubble ass.

Both are GREAT! But completely different feeling.

[michael.kickass]

A true classic.

[Choopa Phil]

Originally Posted by Robbie

Alfa Romeos are cool as shit. One of the few sports cars that I never got to drive. I almost bought an old one back in the mid 1980's but at the last minute I couldn't get over to see it and it got sold.

I would still say that you can have all the technology in the world...and it might make some cars "feel" a bit like the driver can have the illusion of driving a sports car.

But there is no way to replicate the feel of a 1275 cc A series engine with an oversized 1 3/4 inch carb powering a 1,500 pound car that is perfectly weight balanced in rear and front on rack and pinion steering with a NON-synchronized 4 speed transmission on skinny 13 x 5 inch intertube tires on wire wheels.

That is a sound, smell (gasonline and oil), feeling (your ass in the seat is about 4 inches from the ground lol), and just pure mojo that you just will never get in a heavy, big engined, power steering, big tires car.

Don't get me wrong...I love muscle cars too.

But it's a whole different experience.

To me, driving a sports car is like fucking that super skinny, tiny tit, tiny ass spinner chick.
And driving a muscle car is like banging that thick bitch with the bubble ass.

Both are GREAT! But completely different feeling.

You should give an S2000 a drive, theyre fantastic driver cars. The driver makes the car IMO. RWD, manual, Coil Overs, and a good corner balance and you can make any car a sports car or handle close to it.

[Itchy]

Originally Posted by Rochard

Electric cars are going to be a major game changer..... They will be much faster than what we have now.

[L-Pink]

Originally Posted by MK Ultra

Like an ex smoker becoming violently negative on cigarettes so goes the newly converted treehugger.

[2MuchMark]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

I'm going to break off a little knowledge today, for my fellow gfyers. I'm in a good mood, on the beach, drinking a beer and relaxing after catching this morning waves

battery technology lags

take your pick from google

https://www.google.com/search?q=batt...sm=93&ie=UTF-8

If The Future's Battery-Powered, We're Screwed

Forget innovation. We?re all stifled until we crack the battery conundrum.

http://readwrite.com/2014/07/11/batt...mer-technology

Your answer to everything is just sit on your hands and give up. I call bullshit. Batteries are getting better every day. You only need to look at the current state of electric cars and all battery powered devices actually to see that. Your phone and laptop last 5 times longer than they did 10 years ago. Today there are more electric cars on the road than ever, and I'll bet you $100 that sales of electric will increase, not decrease, and that the rate of the increase will itself increase.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by **********

Your answer to everything is just sit on your hands and give up. I call bullshit. Batteries are getting better every day. You only need to look at the current state of electric cars and all battery powered devices actually to see that. Your phone and laptop last 5 times longer than they did 10 years ago. Today there are more electric cars on the road than ever, and I'll bet you $100 that sales of electric will increase, not decrease, and that the rate of the increase will itself increase.

You dont read good. Or embrace reality good.

I said that for what rochatd said, that if electric cars are going to make a significant breakthrough in speed over intrnsl combustion then s major breakthrough in battery tech must proceed that and i backed that up with supporting links.

You think electric cars are going to make a majorspeedforwardraggaroSeverakthousandpobatrieTha twouldbecuteify.