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  • Relentless
    www.EngineFood.com
    • Aug 2006
    • 5697

    #106
    Originally posted by wehateporn
    Programs won't dare shave him
    They won't shave him anyway. They are competing with all other programs to get his traffic. If they pay him less, he sends his traffic to someone who pays him more.
    The rest is nonsense really.


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    • mopek1
      Confirmed User
      • Jun 2004
      • 3191

      #107
      Originally posted by Relentless
      Yes I read this.

      If a company shaves but gives me the best ROI out of all the programs I push I will likely still push to them but I DO CARE if they shave.

      That shaved money is my money and when times are good (2006) I put it away for when times are bad (2014).

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      • mopek1
        Confirmed User
        • Jun 2004
        • 3191

        #108
        Originally posted by Relentless
        If they pay him less, he sends his traffic to someone who pays him more.
        That assumption is based on the fact that there are many other similar sponsors who can convert.

        Very difficult to find these days.

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        • Relentless
          www.EngineFood.com
          • Aug 2006
          • 5697

          #109
          Originally posted by mopek1
          That assumption is based on the fact that there are many other similar sponsors who can convert. Very difficult to find these days.
          No it is not. If there is only ONE sponsor like that who converts... they are the highest paying sponsor available. Whether they shave or not. Whether they are pretty or not. They are the only $/click so they are the highest $/click. You either promote them, or make a site to compete with them.


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          • Relentless
            www.EngineFood.com
            • Aug 2006
            • 5697

            #110
            Originally posted by mopek1
            Yes I read this. If a company shaves but gives me the best ROI out of all the programs I push I will likely still push to them but I DO CARE if they shave. That shaved money is my money and when times are good (2006) I put it away for when times are bad (2014).
            If you tell me you would send more traffic to a site that pays you much less because you think the site paying you more shaved you (and still paid you more) I will note your decision and simply stop talking to you.

            $ per click. It's the most basic math there is, and it's the only math that matters.

            The *only* exceptions are:

            1 - If the site is damaging your brand (i.e. shady hidden xsells, card banging etc etc)

            2 - If the cost of creating the clicks they convert is much higher than the cost of creating clicks that will convert elsewhere.


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            • Magnetron
              Lord High Groundhog
              • Jun 2013
              • 1841

              #111
              Originally posted by robwod
              Lucas, while I understand the point of your thread, would it not be more productive to speak to any program owners directly to inform and resolve any possible issues versus public accusations?

              I'm just not seeing where the outcome of these results can be productive for you as it may very well sour any business relationship you may otherwise have with a program you accuse of shady behaviour.

              I monitor my own links and if I find something I question, I deal with a program owner directly, and in private. I just can't see anything beneficial from public accusations.
              I believe he approached JT a few times on multiple boards about his mysterious decline in sales. JT responded as though he was being ambushed and told him to address his concerns through proper channels. I can only assume TC did and wasn't satisfied with the theoretical explanations he received IE your traffic turned to shit overnight, etc.
              .
              Approach the mirrored reflection saying his name three times : "Butcher .... Butcher .... Butcher ....."
              and wait to see if this Bogeyman urban legend manifests in the background, looming over shoulder
              While your neighbors were busy killing off everyone in the neighborhood
              with your own butcher knife in hand concealed behind your back
              you stood for
              ever before the window saying
              nothing

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              • wehateporn
                Promoting Debate on GFY
                • Apr 2007
                • 27176

                #112
                Originally posted by Relentless
                They won't shave him anyway. They are competing with all other programs to get his traffic. If they pay him less, he sends his traffic to someone who pays him more.
                The rest is nonsense really.
                Maybe they will throw in 'Bonus Sales' to keep him sweet

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                • mineistaken
                  See signature :)
                  • Apr 2007
                  • 29656

                  #113
                  Originally posted by Relentless
                  I owe you a drink Robert. I expected on GFY that people would mistakenly claim you were 'in favor of shaving' since you posted that people should be professionals - just because that's what the mob always does... but I never expected it would take less than 30 minutes.
                  Wrong, I am not saying he is for shaving.
                  I am saying that IF program is shaving talking in privately would be bad karma when keeping in mind that other webmasters would continue to be shaved.
                  And IF program is not shaving and there is legit reasons there is no big deal for those reasons made public.

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                  • mineistaken
                    See signature :)
                    • Apr 2007
                    • 29656

                    #114
                    Originally posted by robwod
                    Of course others benefit from public information. My question was what benefit will Lucas get from it? One would assume it damages his image with other programs, and certainly it is conceivable he gets terminated from the ones he accuses of wrong doing.

                    So yes, others benefit from his testing, but what does he get out of it? He's the one spending money. Are all of the people waiting with anticipation of the results going to line up and send him money to at least recover the cost of the test joins he is making for their benefit? Somehow I seriously doubt it.
                    This is what I was talking about - you care only about yourself (or him in this case). While we are talking about the bigger picture and doing good research for everybody.
                    He is not doing this to "profit" himself, that is the main thing you should understand. He is doing this for the forum community as well.
                    Last edited by mineistaken; 04-10-2014, 09:57 AM.

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                    • Relentless
                      www.EngineFood.com
                      • Aug 2006
                      • 5697

                      #115
                      How is he doing anything for the community? He knows his $/click from each program. That does very little to help you determine what your $/click will be... unless he shares his traffic sources and marketing campaign methods (and assuming you can duplicate them).

                      Let's say TC earns .23 cents per click. That means you will earn X per click.

                      What is X?

                      X is the ONLY number that matters.... and TC's stats do little to solve it for you.

                      Threads like these just push sponsors and professional affiliates apart (Robwod's point). They do absolutely zero to educate anyone because you already have the only two numbers you need. How many clicks did you send to a program, and how much did they pay you?
                      Last edited by Relentless; 04-10-2014, 10:05 AM.


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                      • signupdamnit
                        Confirmed User
                        • Aug 2007
                        • 6697

                        #116
                        Originally posted by robwod
                        mineistaken: No, I am saying that my first inclination if I see a problem is to deal with people I work with directly, and discreetly rather than running to a public board and making accusations.

                        Incidentally, I was just speaking to some other webmasters and wondered how long it take for someone to spin my thoughts on professionalism / professional courtesy to something negative. Only 21 minutes, thanks
                        It's either true or it's not. No one has damaged RUC yet. They have a chance to come in here and explain and show how it is a misunderstanding or how they will make it right. If they handle it right they could turn this into something positive. At least in my eyes.

                        This is part of what is wrong with this industry. No people should not have to shut up and take it when they are cheated. No someone should not have to get permission to post things like this. No someone does not owe it to the sponsor to ask for an explanation first. It's the sponsor's duty to check these things themselves first and others have a right to know about it. If a sponsor gets all bent out of shape over a legitimate occurrence like this then they aren't a good business in the first place. It's just like all the businesses bitching about Yelp reviews. Usually the ones bitching are the biggest scumbags. Good businesses get people to defend them and everyone knows they are good. In the same way good sponsors do not fear scrutiny.
                        Last edited by signupdamnit; 04-10-2014, 10:18 AM.

                        You don't like my posts? Put me on ignore or fuck right off. I'll say what I want.

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                        • signupdamnit
                          Confirmed User
                          • Aug 2007
                          • 6697

                          #117
                          Originally posted by Relentless
                          How is he doing anything for the community? He knows his $/click from each program. That does very little to help you determine what your $/click will be... unless he shares his traffic sources and marketing campaign methods (and assuming you can duplicate them).

                          Let's say TC earns .23 cents per click. That means you will earn X per click.

                          What is X?

                          X is the ONLY number that matters.... and TC's stats do little to solve it for you.

                          Threads like these just push sponsors and professional affiliates apart (Robwod's point). They do absolutely zero to educate anyone because you already have the only two numbers you need. How many clicks did you send to a program, and how much did they pay you?
                          I appreciate the info. I know others do. You don't. Well okay. But everyone doesn't think like you. We run our businesses differently. It's our choice. Personally it means a lot to me whether or not someone is cheating me. My business model is usually long term to where current $/click values isn't my only concern.
                          Last edited by signupdamnit; 04-10-2014, 10:21 AM.

                          You don't like my posts? Put me on ignore or fuck right off. I'll say what I want.

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                          • OldJeff
                            Big Fucking hahahaha
                            • Feb 2003
                            • 2489

                            #118
                            For fucks sake, most of you cunts have only ever seen a test join in your stats
                            "As pornographers we must act responsibly! ;))"- Nickatilynx

                            I might be Old and Tired, but at least I don't support a whiney cunt

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                            • KickAssJesse
                              Confirmed User
                              • Jul 2008
                              • 942

                              #119
                              you're more than welcome to test any of our sites

                              Contact - email: jesse~AT~atkcash~DOT~com - Skype: kickassjesse - ICQ: 386185547
                              ATK Cash $$$

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                              • Relentless
                                www.EngineFood.com
                                • Aug 2006
                                • 5697

                                #120
                                Originally posted by signupdamnit
                                It's either true or it's not. No one has damaged RUC yet. They have a chance to come in here and explain and show how it is a misunderstanding or how they will make it right. If they handle it right they could turn this into something positive. At least in my eyes. This is part of what is wrong with this industry. No people should not have to shut up and take it when they are cheated. No someone should not have to get permission to post things like this. No someone does not owe it to the sponsor to ask for an explanation first. It's the sponsor's duty to check these things themselves first and others have a right to know about it. If a sponsor gets all bent out of shape over a legitimate occurrence like this then they aren't a good business in the first place. It's just like all the businesses bitching about Yelp reviews. Usually the ones bitching are the biggest scumbags. Good businesses get people to defend them and everyone knows they are good.
                                Wrong. People making accusations need to have proof first. That's why nobody is allowed to go around posting 'I'm pretty sure you are a rapist'

                                As for Yelp, I've been hired several times to answer bad reviews for companies. They aren't answering bad reviews because they are hard working business owners who care deeply about what yelp readers think. They are hiring me to answer Yelp reviews because paying me costs less than the amount they earn by combating negative reviews. It's simple cost/benefit analysis.

                                Money divided by clicks = value

                                The rest is just another GFY dog and pony show to smear brands that idiots will 'hate' without any factual reason to do so


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