Originally Posted by Mutt (Post 19745373)

The question I have always had about these ancient religions and their fantastic supernatural tales is how did these ancient people regard them - those people may have been genetically no different than us today but the way they thought and perceived the world is far different than how we do in 2013. Thinking objectively is natural to us, as is skepticism - it wasn't to them, but I don't know to what degree they differed from us. These myths when they heard them may not even have registered as myths to them, they might have just accepted whatever stories were told as fact.

Originally Posted by Jim_Gunn (Post 19745308)

The real progress will only have been made when belief itself isn't seen as a virtue but as a vice and when irrational belief any kind of superstitious nonsense as seen as silly and shameful.

Originally Posted by mikesinner (Post 19745725)

many people already see it that way. I always laugh at people that say they believe in something that has no evidence. I cringe at the word faith. Ignorant people love to use that word when you corner them on something with no proof.

Originally Posted by MaDalton (Post 19744314)

edit: and no, i don't.

my proof: there are a few billion people on this planet who don't believe in god and still their life is not any different

Originally Posted by Jim_Gunn (Post 19745286)

All one has to do is read the Bible to see that there is no monotheistic "God" in Christian mythology but rather a whole pantheon of deities, demi-gods, supernatural entities and ferocious monsters in the myths. It stands to reason since Christianity is derived from an amalgamation of earlier religions, many of them polytheistic. The idea that the three main gods in Christianity are united in one entity was not even established until the Third Century A.D.. Not to mention it's preposterous anyway. God, Jesus and the Holy Ghost (later renamed to the Holy Spirit because worshipping a ghost sounds silly after all) are three clearly different characters in the various stories.

Then you've got Satan who is clearly a deity of equal or nearly equal power to "God". After all you can't have good without evil or heaven without hell. And the three main deities of Christianity are apparently powerless to stop him. After the Devil there are a number of demi-gods of immense powers such as the archangels, some of whom are featured prominently in the myths and even named such as Gabriel, Michael & Uriel. Who knows how many garden variety angels serve "God"- hundreds, thousands even? But they would also count as demigods of a sort. They surely aren't human.

Then you have who knows how many demons, also demi-gods with supernatural powers who serve Satan and sometimes intervene in human affairs. The Bible also describes several other non-human demi-gods or monsters of a sort including the Nephilim- giants, fallen angels or some kind of angel & human hybrids depending on the various interpretations from antiquity.

Now I know these aren't demi-gods but still look how rich the myths are full of fantastical creatures not like anything that ever actually lived on earth- Leviathon, flying serpents, unicorns, satyrs, Behemoth, cockatrices. I won't even get into saints, former humans who transmogrify into something else entirely.

Ancient, medieval and modern religious leaders have both censored and abridged Christian mythology over the last two millennia. But make no mistake about it. Christian mythology is as rich as any other polytheistic religion.

Originally Posted by baddog (Post 19745747)

What does one have to do with the other?

Originally Posted by Grapesoda (Post 19745744)

pretty harsh statement... why do you have concerns about someone's faith if they aren't burdening you? say someone with a child that has cancer... why not allow them the faith to think their child is going to a better place? how can that harm you?

Originally Posted by Best-In-BC (Post 19745764)

Pretty concrete though in reality, unlike all the bs your supporting.

Originally Posted by Grapesoda (Post 19745744)

pretty harsh statement... why do you have concerns about someone's faith if they aren't burdening you? say someone with a child that has cancer... why not allow them the faith to think their child is going to a better place? how can that harm you?

Originally Posted by Grapesoda (Post 19745771)

that's how it plays out when you pick and choose your reality :2 cents:

Originally Posted by Jim_Gunn (Post 19745308)

The real progress will only have been made when belief itself isn't seen as a virtue but as a vice and when irrational belief any kind of superstitious nonsense as seen as silly and shameful.

Originally Posted by baddog (Post 19745752)

Saints don't transform into anything they were not on earth.

Originally Posted by MaDalton (Post 19745756)

seriously?

Originally Posted by madalton (Post 19745789)

i turned beer into pee - and not only once

Originally Posted by Best-In-BC (Post 19745775)

Yeah, I base mine of facts and I don't need a phoney story to make my self fell better. If more people ignored not having answers and trust in what we have now and venture out with a open mind to find more we would all be a heck of alot better.

Originally Posted by baddog (Post 19745787)

Yes please.

Originally Posted by mikesinner (Post 19745772)

Look up the definition of the word faith, basically belief without evidence.

Normally we would refer to that as ignorance which is something that leads to prejudice.

Originally Posted by Robbie (Post 19745804)

Grapesoda... I'm in agreement with Bill Maher on that.

He said the other night on his show that people ask him why not let people have their religion? It doesn't hurt anybody.

Then he pointed out the inquisition, the suffering, EVERY war ever fought, people being beheaded in the Muslim countries, people persecuted worldwide... all caused by religion.

And yeah...it does matter. I think it's time we actually put an end to society playing this big make-believe game of "God". Too many people hurting and dying because of this nonsense.

Originally Posted by Grapesoda (Post 19745810)

isn't the Islamic fighter just using Islam as a shield to hide their real intentions which are completely political?

Originally Posted by Grapesoda (Post 19745810)

isn't the Islamic fighter just using Islam as a shield to hide their real intentions which are completely political?

Originally Posted by MaDalton (Post 19745806)

easy - statistically all the same things happen to everyone and everywhere.

no matter what they believe or whether they believe at all.

show me statistic evidence that devout christians do better than the rest - or conservative muslims....

http://quotes-lover.com/wp-content/u...chievement.jpg

Originally Posted by Robbie (Post 19745779)

I agree with that 100%



Lloyd...come on man. A "saint" is a human being who is declared a "Saint" by the Catholic Church. You need to research stuff before you type it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint Scroll down to "Christianity" and the Roman Catholic Church. They are about to make Pope John Paul a "saint". They have an entire list of stupid shit to become a saint. The final thing is for 2 "miracles" to be performed by the person AFTER THEY ARE DEAD! lol :1orglaugh

God, Jesus, The Pope, "saints", angels...it's all just silly ass superstition. It's just insane that people still believe this stuff (or more likely a testament to how good they are at indoctrinating us into it as children)

Originally Posted by baddog (Post 19745857)

hmmm, I thought the difference was supposed to be what happened after death. I don't recall ever hearing that my life was going to be better because I was raised Catholic.

Originally Posted by Robbie (Post 19745868)

Oh yeah...I hear it all the time. Maybe not Catholics...but definitely in protestant churches and especially evangelical churches.

They claim that once you "walk with the Lord" your life will be "blessed". They preach that nonsense all the time.

Originally Posted by Jel (Post 19745874)

people who equate religion with the excuse of religion by those who start and/or advocate war(s) should maybe take a closer look at what this sentence means.
No, I'm not even in the slightest bit religious.

Originally Posted by Jel (Post 19745881)

Thing is, their interpretation of 'blessed' is very different than ours, so in that respect, they actually are 'blessed' in their own view, which is their own reality, which means they are :2 cents: :)

Originally Posted by MaDalton (Post 19745812)

you mean like the conservative christians when it comes to gay marriage, abortion, divorce, PORN etc?

Originally Posted by baddog (Post 19745857)

hmmm, I thought the difference was supposed to be what happened after death. I don't recall ever hearing that my life was going to be better because I was raised Catholic.

Originally Posted by Grapesoda (Post 19745885)

not to the same degree... but yes... anything 'different is frowned upon' rules and regulations for sure... this is the only way society's could survive in in the past... no real freethinkers...

and no Christians has stuck a bomb up his ass and walked into a gay bar that I know of..., if yo7u are implying that I am a Christian you might want to read some of the statements I've posted..

Originally Posted by Robbie (Post 19745884)

I've actually watched evangelical preachers on television claiming that if you send them $100 that "God" will "bless" you and "enrich" you "ten fold"

So they are saying: "Give us $100, and 'God' will make circumstances occur that will get you $1000!"

It's such a scam. :(

Originally Posted by MaDalton (Post 19745886)

i can eventually remotely accept that some people believe in a divine spark (aka Big Bang) that started the universe (even though i don't believe that either personally) - but here you lost me completely

Originally Posted by Robbie (Post 19745827)

I don't believe the actual guy doing the fighting and killing is doing it for political reasons. I think they BELIEVE 100% that it is for "God". Now the guys at the top? The "Mullahs" or whatever stupid name they come up with to control people?
Yes, he is definitely doing it for political reasons.

I don't believe that the Ayatollahs believe in their "God" anymore than the Pope believes in his "God".

They know it's bullshit and use it for power over the masses.

Originally Posted by Mutt (Post 19744249)

I mean God, creator of the universe and everything in it not some nebulous concept of a force/power - I mean God, a thinking all knowing all seeing deity.