Superman vs Iron man

[$5 submissions]

Sorry about the long post but I felt like writing after reading an NRO article on how the latest Superman flick was an exploration in Christian or Mosaic symbology... I discussed it with my wife and I said I've always preferred Marvel characters over DC ones. Here's my explanation.

One of the things that I've always dug about Marvel comics characters is that they are FLAWED characters. They are unsure of their place in the world. They are doubtful of many things and things aren't always certain. They feel angst. In other words, they are like you and me. Take Iron Man for example. Iron Man (Tony Stark) had serious daddy and substance abuse issues. Obviously gifted, he is as much a prisoner of his own success as his own personal demons. Played by Robert Downey Jr (a dude with his own very public fights with personal demons), Iron Man becomes more than a shallow celebration of CGI technowizardy--it becomes an examination of how broken people can come to grips with inner forces that threaten to destroy them. From pending implosion, we get to explore the search for purpose, meaning, and calling in a world that's still far from perfect. In short, Iron Man's trope is all about finding beauty in the imperfect, in the unstable, in the unfair.

You don't get that same vibe with DC characters. In particular, Superman. Superman epitomizes human perfection. He's so perfect that he can't be human. And he isn't-he's from Krypton. This sums up the problem with human ideals. We lift our ideal so high that no one can identify. No one can embody them. Except deities and philosophical abstractions. The problem I see with this is that disembodied ideals alienate people. It makes our own goodness pale next to the unreachable concepts of perfection. We are all made to feel less worthy. When saints get idolized so much we only achieve the frustrating realization that we can't be anything but sinners. We create a psychic prison where we constantly compare ourselves to something that doesn't exist-and isn't capable of existing. We set ourselves up as philosophical Houdinis of some sort-twisting ourselves up knowing that we threw away the key.

The latest Superman movie did a great job of trying to make Superman's story more understandable and easier to relate to. However, the whole conflict between heroes you can relate to and heroes you can only adore from afar was summed up in this line from the movie: "you fear me because you cant control me and you never will, but that doesnt mean i'm your enemy." One key element of control is knowing that what you're observing exists within you. This statement pushes away any element of self-identification.

[Si]

Originally Posted by $5 submissions

Sorry about the long post but I felt like writing after reading an NRO article on how the latest Superman flick was an exploration in Christian or Mosaic symbology...

Stopped reading here.

[SilentKnight]

Superman never banged Pepper Potts.

IronMan for the win.

[mikesinner]

Originally Posted by SilentKnight

Superman never banged Pepper Potts.

IronMan for the win.

How do you know. He could have used his super speed and done her in a microsecond.

[eroticsexxx]

Originally Posted by $5 submissions

Sorry about the long post but I felt like writing after reading an NRO article on how the latest Superman flick was an exploration in Christian or Mosaic symbology... I discussed it with my wife and I said I've always preferred Marvel characters over DC ones. Here's my explanation.

One of the things that I've always dug about Marvel comics characters is that they are FLAWED characters. They are unsure of their place in the world. They are doubtful of many things and things aren't always certain. They feel angst. In other words, they are like you and me. Take Iron Man for example. Iron Man (Tony Stark) had serious daddy and substance abuse issues. Obviously gifted, he is as much a prisoner of his own success as his own personal demons. Played by Robert Downey Jr (a dude with his own very public fights with personal demons), Iron Man becomes more than a shallow celebration of CGI technowizardy--it becomes an examination of how broken people can come to grips with inner forces that threaten to destroy them. From pending implosion, we get to explore the search for purpose, meaning, and calling in a world that's still far from perfect. In short, Iron Man's trope is all about finding beauty in the imperfect, in the unstable, in the unfair.

You don't get that same vibe with DC characters. In particular, Superman. Superman epitomizes human perfection. He's so perfect that he can't be human. And he isn't-he's from Krypton. This sums up the problem with human ideals. We lift our ideal so high that no one can identify. No one can embody them. Except deities and philosophical abstractions. The problem I see with this is that disembodied ideals alienate people. It makes our own goodness pale next to the unreachable concepts of perfection. We are all made to feel less worthy. When saints get idolized so much we only achieve the frustrating realization that we can't be anything but sinners. We create a psychic prison where we constantly compare ourselves to something that doesn't exist-and isn't capable of existing. We set ourselves up as philosophical Houdinis of some sort-twisting ourselves up knowing that we threw away the key.

The latest Superman movie did a great job of trying to make Superman's story more understandable and easier to relate to. However, the whole conflict between heroes you can relate to and heroes you can only adore from afar was summed up in this line from the movie: "you fear me because you cant control me and you never will, but that doesnt mean i'm your enemy." One key element of control is knowing that what you're observing exists within you. This statement pushes away any element of self-identification.

[helterskelter808]

Originally Posted by mikesinner

How do you know. He could have used his super speed and done her in a microsecond.

[The Ghost]

The new Dark Knight movies kicked ass so don't really care about the Marvel vs. DC debate. I just want to be entertained.

[brassmonkey]

superman would fuse his joints with his eyes and break his fucking head off

[ludballs]

Originally Posted by Si

Stopped reading here.

[Rochard]

Sheldon is Batman.

[$5 submissions]

Originally Posted by SilentKnight

Superman never banged Pepper Potts.

IronMan for the win.

[Mutt]

Originally Posted by $5 submissions

One key element of control is knowing that what you're observing exists within you. This statement pushes away any element of self-identification.

not sure what that means

are you saying people can't identify with or relate to Superman because he is beyond the control of human beings?

Superman is Jesus Christ, created by two Jewish immigrants.

[Mutt]

Originally Posted by $5 submissions

The problem I see with this is that disembodied ideals alienate people. It makes our own goodness pale next to the unreachable concepts of perfection. We are all made to feel less worthy. When saints get idolized so much we only achieve the frustrating realization that we can't be anything but sinners.

Of course, that's part of the method of control the monotheistic religions utilize - to make people feel like shit about everything they do, that happiness and goodness can only be found and achieved by following the authority of religion doctrine and dogma.

The eastern religions like Buddhism and Hinduism teach about concepts of human perfection, that it's within us to transcend our inner demons and human struggles and reach the perfect state without some supernatural wizard awarding it to us.