P.S. Yes, every "free" thing has its price. The question is: how how much is that price in YOUR country?
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I pay 6% tax from my earnings and it covers it all. Unemployed people pay zero and they also have the same level of free medicine here. How much do YOU pay for it?
P.S. Yes, every "free" thing has its price. The question is: how how much is that price in YOUR country?Last edited by just a punk; 06-11-2013, 05:47 AM.Obey the Cowgod -
yes, you know what you are talking about, that's why you posted this, right
so again, shut the fuck up about shit you know nothing about. you like russia healthcare, good. great. fantastic. now go smoke a cigg, drink a liter of vodka and get back to work.Comment
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Having been treated on both sides of the US/Canadian border, I don't think the US has a healthcare problem at all. What they do have is an insurance industry problem coupled with big Pharma and Tort Law that could use some reform. But the actual care is exceptional if you're properly insured.
One of the guys I work with in Ohio comes to Canada every few months for his diabetes care, and then goes back home and makes payments to the hospital/doctors here. According to him, it's cheaper to do that, including travel and accommodations, because it's far too expensive for him to get insurance (maybe due to pre-existing reasons?). I have no idea what the figures are, I just found that interesting.
And as someone else said, nothing is free. Certainly the medical industry here in Canada is not free, we pay for it through taxation.Last edited by robwod; 06-11-2013, 05:46 AM.NSFWComment
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Obey the CowgodComment
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here's an example of your free healthcare:
When Karen Papiyants lost his leg in a road accident last year, his medical nightmare was only beginning.
Although like any Russian he was entitled to free treatment, he says the doctors strongly suggested he pay $4,500 into their St. Petersburg hospital's bank account, or be deprived proper care - and perhaps not even survive.
Faced with that choice, relatives of the 37-year-old truck driver scrambled to scrape together the money. But Papiyants said that did not stop the nursing staff from leaving him unattended for most of the night and giving him painkillers only after he screamed in agony.
"It's nothing but blackmail and extortion on the part of doctors," Papiyants said.
wow, what a fantastic free system, you russians should be proud.Comment
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more on fab russia healthcare::::::
Medical care in Russia is among the worst in the industrialized world. A 2000 World Health Organization report ranked Russia's health system 130th out of 191 countries, on a par with such nations as Peru and Honduras.
This is one of the few nations in the world where life expectancy has declined sharply in the past 15 years. The average Russian can expect to live only to age 66 - at least a decade less than in most Western democracies, according to a 2005 World Bank report. For men, the figure is closer to 59 - meaning many Russian men do not live long enough to start collecting their pension at age 60.
Compounded by alcoholism, heart disease claims proportionately more lives than in most of the rest of the world. Death rates from homicide, suicide, auto accidents and cancer are also especially high.
wtg russia health care !!Comment
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low quality and bribes- the hallmarks of russia healthcare
According to a summer 2006 study commissioned by the group, 13 percent of 1,502 respondents who had sought medical help during the previous year had to pay an average of $90 under the table, out of wages averaging $480 a month. The poll had a margin of error of plus or minus 2.6 percentage points.
Panfilova also said medical and pharmaceutical companies routinely bribed health officials so that hospitals bought their equipment and medicines, even though their quality is often not the best.Comment
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here's putin's view on russia health care system:::::
"Life expectancy in our country is 8-10 years lower than in neighboring European countries, the death rate from cardiovascular diseases is 4-5 times higher," Putin said.
The premier said a quarter of Russian hospitals were in very poor conditions, adding that 30% had no running hot water, let alone medical equipment, whose term of service is often expired.
All this added to meager wages and excessive management staff contributes to the poor quality of health care in Russia, he said.Comment
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more::
Two decades after the Soviet collapse, Russia's constitution still guarantees free medical care for everyone. But many Russians say their country is actually segregated between a lucky few who can afford good medical care in private clinics and the vast majority who are left with almost no safety net -- or are forced to make side payments to doctors to get care.
In many regions, crumbling hospitals rely on Soviet-era equipment. Even in Moscow, many hospitals don’t even have air conditioners to stave off the summer heat.
Natalia (who did not want to give her last name) is a nurse at a top state ophthalmology institute. She maintains that in most cases there are two levels of care: free and paid-for.
"The free procedures are ones patients don’t need," she says. "Anything that concerns life-threatening conditions costs a fee."Comment
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Oh bribes... These is a special case in our culture. However you can't give a bribe to a doctor because he/she is not a policeman, a government employee etc. Please read the definition of "bribe" again.
Here s my story of "bribes". Just two moths ago I wanted to remove 3 moles on my chest and came to a commercial (paid) clinic. Showed them to a doctor (paid nothing for a visit) and asked how much it will cost to remove them. He said: 2000 rubles (about $60) if I pay him directly, otherwise I have to pay the clinic price which is about two times bigger. And yes, I gave him a $60 "bribe" for removing of my moles. So I'm a fucking criminal and a bad guy now, I know it
This is how paid medicine works here in Russia. OMFG!!!Last edited by just a punk; 06-11-2013, 06:06 AM.Obey the CowgodComment
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Im sure if I google stuff like "US healtcare criticism" I wont find any of the 314,000,000 results
an american found something wrong with another countries free health care and has proven beyond all doubt that overpriced US rip off health care is better (if you have insurance of course)
dude you are so desperate to not admit that your asshole is not a 2 way street but the health care dick is deeeeeeep inside your anus already...
Report a suspicious cracker: Click HereComment
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well, the surprise is your's, russia is up from ~130th to 119th of countrys by life expectancy.
congrats though, you are no longer at the bottom of the list with 3rd world countries
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...ion_.282011.29
keep drinking your own kool aid splashed with vodka.Comment
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try and keep up.
Im sure if I google stuff like "US healtcare criticism" I wont find any of the 314,000,000 results
an american found something wrong with another countries free health care and has proven beyond all doubt that overpriced US rip off health care is better (if you have insurance of course)
dude you are so desperate to not admit that your asshole is not a 2 way street but the health care dick is deeeeeeep inside your anus already...
you missed my post where i mentioned i have a pre-existing condition and am very aware of the clusterfuck of american health care.Comment
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again, i'm not the one who started the russia v american health care competition here. btw, it's a stupid comparison but y'all wanted to go for it.
go figure.Last edited by dyna mo; 06-11-2013, 06:18 AM.Comment
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These discussions are always proof positive that no clear answer exists. If there was a clear answer, there would be no debate. Everywhere has pluses and minuses. Every healthcare system has pluses and minuses. The benefits and negatives of any system are always over stated and exaggerated and round and round it goes..
Yes, fewer illegal immigrants working equates to more job opportunities for American citizens.
RochardComment
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I think he's referring to the option in Canada to buy extra "premium" insurance coverage, usually through Blue Cross, which gives you certain added privileges such as a private or semi-private room (if available), expedited care whenever possible, things like that. It's not mandatory that you have it, and a lot of Canadians don't. There is no "have to pay" as you said.Originally posted by SpunkyPromote Wildmatch, ImLive, Sexier.com, and more!!
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How much would a facet block infiltration procedure cost in the US? Just curious.
Here, to the patient at least, they're free. I know, I just had them done on my lower back and was charged not a cent. In fact over the past seven months I've seen my new doctor about 5 times, was referred to two specialists both of whom I have now seen, and had one procedure done for the above mentioned injections.
(facet block infiltration is basically in lay terms called "cortisone injections")
I wonder what all that would have cost me in the states? I have yet to recieve a bill for anything here, and the level of care has been quite exemplary.
The big bad evil Canadian health care system at work. lolPromote Wildmatch, ImLive, Sexier.com, and more!!
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To flesh the point out fully, just out of curiousity how much per month do you pay for health care coverage? On this very board I've read posts where americans are paying anywhere from $300 to $1500 per month, depending on family size, pre-existing conditions, etc. Where do you fall in there?Promote Wildmatch, ImLive, Sexier.com, and more!!
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I pay $800 a month for me, my wife, and kid. It has a $3,000 deductible (we have to run up $3,000 a year in medical bills before it pays anything)-Robbie
ClaudiaMarie.ComComment
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we have no dental or extended medical, which is.. massages and sunglasses etc, but all that is through employment (or way more intelligently, your own extended medical)
not sure if Robbie and Family get dental/prescriptions, which could account for the increase
however i can go to any hospital, and i think he would need to go to ones his insurance supports etcComment
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nobody claimed russian health care was better or worse, its probably just the same as it is in the USA the only difference is its free...
the price is the only issue...quality wise if you have money in the USA you are set...if you do not have money in the USA you are better off living in russia if you get sick...thats my argument nothing more... Report a suspicious cracker: Click HereComment
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just some prices for private clinics here (state clinics are a bit worse but free):
private dentist, office and equipment all german all new a tooth with filling is 20euros this is 25$
blood test, private clinic, multi million $$ hewlett packard thing brand new, if I check everything they possibly test for it goes to 200euros but Its a 2 page list of what they check for...a standard blood test is in the 80 euros region and this is a private clinic...state clinic is free they use just as good a machine only you have to wait for like 10 days...
maxio-facial operation, private clinic, done by the chief of surgery himself, top anesthetist, with a private room with 7 day hospital stay and nurse 24h/day and visits from the chief of surgery himself every day, with all the MRI scans 3D Doppler scans, all on brand new western equipment from siemens, with food and basically what ever I asked for, for a total of 3000 euros. It was super complex complex surgery to something close to the brain....could have opted to do it for free but would spend my stay in a 10 bed room with other patients...
tit job, private clinic, top tier clinic, 3000 euros and they do a perfect job
plastic surgery used to be free before the war and sanctions...you just needed to go to any doctor to send you to get checked by a specialist and you wait for a few weeks and they do you for free... Report a suspicious cracker: Click HereComment
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In Russia dental medicine is free too. Yeah, you have to go to a governmental clinic on early morning (8:00 am) to get your ticket for, say 2:00 pm of the same day. Course this is not that comfortable as in paid clinic, but at least you'll get your teeth cured even if you have to spend a whole day to it
Obey the CowgodComment
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Does Russia's healthcare suck? Probably, but then take a look at the country as a whole, everything about Russia sucks, their people for the most part live in abject poverty, many cant afford to eat and their whole way of life is just retarded.
Healthcare, no matter what country you live in directly relates proportionately to how well the country is doing economically, if you live in a shithole, your going to get less than exemplary healthcare, free or not.Comment
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It's not dental...but it is prescriptions (after you spend $3,000 each year out of your own pocket).
And I have never been to any doctor or hospital in the country that didn't accept my insurance (I think you might be thinking of an HMO).
Problem is...I shouldn't need insurance to go to the doctor or get a prescription. "Insurance" used to be something you used for a catastrophe (like a bad auto accident, or cancer, or a heart attack)...not something that you had to use everyday because the price of medical care in the U.S. is so jacked up beyond what anyone else in the world is paying.
-Robbie
ClaudiaMarie.ComComment
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So that's nearly a $10,000 per year expenditure that Canadians don't have to pay. So much for the argument many Americans make about the so-called "high Canadian taxes". I can assure Baddog et al that I pay nowhere near $10k more per year in taxes than US citizens in my same tax bracket. Yet that's usually the first thing out of a lot of Americans' mouths when the subject of Canadian health care comes up -- "Yeah but whut about the TAXES?".
Indeed. What ABOUT the taxes? Fact is it's a fallacious argument. Our lower to middle income tax bracketers pay roughly 20-30% in income tax, so do American tax payers. Our higher earners making six figure+ incomes pay in the 35-45% range, so do high earners in the USA.
We have provincial and federal taxes on goods and services, Americans pay state and federal taxes as well.
The biggest difference I can see is that we don't have to pay any health insurance premiums. Well that and when we go for a simple doctor appointment or an open heart surgery, we recieve no bill afterwards.
As imperfect as it is I wouldn't trade our health care system for a more Americanized one for all the tea in China.Last edited by CDSmith; 06-11-2013, 12:03 PM.Promote Wildmatch, ImLive, Sexier.com, and more!!
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CDSmith...I agree...but our govt. spends more money than every other country combined on a fucking military to kill people and try to run the world. So we can't do that.
And also...as I said, we get double fucked. They intentionally allow hospitals and big pharma to charge 3 and 4 times MORE for the exact same thing here in the U.S. so that the big Insurance companies can make even more money (insurance companies don't actually pay those prices by the way...they "negotiate them down...which means they pay the same prices as the rest of the world does)-Robbie
ClaudiaMarie.ComComment
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Reading it all, it's so good to live in the "3rd world" country, pay 6% (OMFG!) tax, have a free healthcare (even for bums) etc. I know, I'm not free because I can't carry AK47 in my pocket and KGB will kill me if I say that Putin is a piece of shit. Yeah, the oversea people have to pay a heavy price for their freedom because they can say that Obama is **** and stay alive. I envy them very much.
* crying smile *Last edited by just a punk; 06-11-2013, 12:27 PM.Obey the CowgodComment
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It would require an entire overhaul of how health care is delivered in the US, changing it from an insurance system to a true health care system. Instead of paying for health insurance all 100 million tax paying Americans (or however many there are) would simply pay a % point or two more than they are paying now. That would in a lot of cases end up costing you LESS than your present yearly health care usage costs you.
But of course that would upset the giant "for profit" apple cart you've built yourselves. It would also be a blow to the ego of the notion that capitalism is always superior to the evil *gasp* socialism, a term most Americans I know revile. (Baddog I have you in mind here buddy)
It's not that you "can't do that" per se, it's more that America simply WON'T do that. As in it will never happen. I know and accept this. But this conversation will be had numerous times ad nauseum in the future, because some Americans will never stop with the "what about the taxes?" argument whenever someone has the tumerity to suggest that Canada has a better sytem than the good ol US of A.Promote Wildmatch, ImLive, Sexier.com, and more!!
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