I vot ban for guns

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  • tony286
    lurker
    • Aug 2002
    • 57021
    #251
    Originally posted by Jesus H Christ
    ....absolutely wrong there Tony.

    In 2008 and 2010, the Supreme Court issued two landmark decisions concerning the Second Amendment. In District of Columbia v. Heller, 554 U.S. 570 (2008), the Court ruled that the Second Amendment protects an individual's right to possess a firearm, unconnected to service in a militia[1][2] and to use that arm for traditionally lawful purposes, such as self-defense within the home. In dicta, the Court listed many longstanding prohibitions and restrictions on firearms possession as being consistent with the Second Amendment.[3] In McDonald v. Chicago, 561 U.S. 3025 (2010), the Court ruled that the Second Amendment limits state and local governments to the same extent that it limits the federal government.[4]

    You see the Second Amendment is based on preventing tyranny, any kind. So when my local or federal police stop looking and acting like Gestapo Stormtroopers:

    Then we can talk about possibly banning assault rifles.
    no it wasnt, it was if we were attacked as a country.

      Comment

      • StickyGreen
        .
        • Oct 2003
        • 13076
        #252
        Originally posted by tony286
        Actually was to protect the country if it was under attack because they didnt have a professional army.
        You're still missing the point. Public militias are separate from the national military.

        And the 2nd Amendment was not written with an expiration date, it is valid through any time in the future should we ever face tyranny. This is why it says the 2nd Amendment rights may not be infringed.... ever.
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          Comment

          • PR_Glen
            Confirmed User
            • Oct 2006
            • 9058
            #253
            Originally posted by pornopete
            I live in a country where almost every home has 1 automatic rifle for each male over 18 and in 10 years I remember only two murders. Funny how that is.
            no you don't. or have you completely forgotten what an automatic rifle is? Those are extremely rare and illegal in canada.
            webmaster at pimproll dot com

              Comment

              • brassmonkey
                Pay It Forward
                • Sep 2005
                • 77396
                #254
                i took boomer to the city limits today. he was loud
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                  Comment

                  • PR_Glen
                    Confirmed User
                    • Oct 2006
                    • 9058
                    #255
                    Originally posted by pornopete
                    Have you considered maybe Im not in Canada.
                    have you considered that your location says toronto? why the fuck would i consider you live some place else?
                    webmaster at pimproll dot com

                      Comment

                      • MakingItPay
                        Confirmed User
                        • Feb 2005
                        • 1922
                        #256
                        Originally posted by Rochard
                        And the other option is being woken up at 3am from a deep sleep, arming myself with my AR15 in the dark, playing James Bond and hunting down an unknown amount of assailants in my own house? In the dark? From a deep sleep?

                        Anyone who thinks I will instantly be awake at the first sight of trouble, spring into action while the James Bond music kicks in, somersault down the stairs, and shoot an armed intruder in the dark watches way too much fucking TV.

                        The cops woke me up one night; They thought there was some kind of domestic disturbance at my house when it was really a few doors down. It took me five full minutes to wake up, figure out what was going on, move my ass down stairs, turn on the lights, ID who was outside, turn off the alarm, and open up the front door.

                        We have the right to bear arms. Did it protect these kids? The people at the mall? The people at the movies? The people at the college? Nope.

                        I'm not saying get rid of our rights. I'm just saying we have to stop the nuts from getting guns.
                        I'm with you on stopping nuts from getting guns, and perhaps having armed guards at schools. Protecting our children, the way we protect the bank's Money.

                        But no, they didn't have the right to bear arms at any of those places. It is illegal to carry in those locations. That is a big reason, only the guy that didn't mind committing a felony had guns.

                        And nobody that is trained in home protection would go moving about the house like james bond during a break in. That is how you shoot your kid. But, if you don't want to be trained, just call 911. They will save the day for sure.
                        Last edited by MakingItPay; 12-15-2012, 05:53 PM.
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                          • livexxx
                            Confirmed User
                            • May 2005
                            • 1201
                            #257
                            Originally posted by StickyGreen
                            You're way off, and don't seem to understand the concept of tyranny. If a dictatorship were to take over America they would be in control of the military, not the citizens... this is why the people have the right to form militias and bare arms if necessary to preserve the free state.
                            Any specific type of tyranny or dictator about to take over any time soon?
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                              Comment

                              • StickyGreen
                                .
                                • Oct 2003
                                • 13076
                                #258
                                Originally posted by livexxx
                                Any specific type of tyranny or dictator about to take over any time soon?
                                Who knows... the country has been slowly headed that way for a long time now...



                                This is the typical cycle. Where are we now? You tell me...
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                                  Comment

                                  • Dirty F
                                    Too lazy to set a custom title
                                    • Jul 2001
                                    • 59204
                                    #259
                                    The tyrany argument is hilarious....and sad at the same time.

                                      Comment

                                      • StickyGreen
                                        .
                                        • Oct 2003
                                        • 13076
                                        #260
                                        Originally posted by Dirty F
                                        The tyrany argument is hilarious....and sad at the same time.
                                        I bet you think the statement "history repeats itself" is also hilarious.

                                        In Franck's fantasy world no one will ever again attempt to install an evil authoritarian dictatorship.
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                                          Comment

                                          • Rochard
                                            Jägermeister Test Pilot
                                            • Dec 2001
                                            • 75733
                                            #261
                                            Originally posted by tony286
                                            You have point. If people actually read it.
                                            A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

                                            The right to bear arms was to be part of a well regulated Militia.Which was before we had a professional military.
                                            I honestly believe that their intention, at the time of writing, was to create an all volunteer army - to be called up in the event of national emergency. And if you read about it, in some cases Militias were formed on temporary basis, although more for law enforcement than anything else.

                                            The National Guard is sort of a government militia. Perhaps what we need to do is say "anyone who owns a firearm is the first ones drafted if the nation goes to war".
                                            Herschel Savage
                                            Brooklyn, NY

                                              Comment

                                              • directfiesta
                                                Too lazy to set a custom title
                                                • Oct 2002
                                                • 30135
                                                #262
                                                bunch of paranoids here ....
                                                I know that Asspimple is stoopid ... As he says, it is a FACT !

                                                But I can't figure out how he can breathe or type , at the same time ....

                                                  Comment

                                                  • Rochard
                                                    Jägermeister Test Pilot
                                                    • Dec 2001
                                                    • 75733
                                                    #263
                                                    Originally posted by pornopete


                                                    Reality is it was your daughter sneaking in after partying late. You shot her.
                                                    That's part of my point - the odds of me shooting someone in my own family by mistake is greater than the odds of my house ever being broken into while I am sleeping.
                                                    Herschel Savage
                                                    Brooklyn, NY

                                                      Comment

                                                      • Rochard
                                                        Jägermeister Test Pilot
                                                        • Dec 2001
                                                        • 75733
                                                        #264
                                                        Originally posted by MakingItPay
                                                        I'm with you on stopping nuts from getting guns, and perhaps having armed guards at schools. Protecting our children, the way we protect the bank's Money.
                                                        I am not sure if guards at schools would be enough. Maybe if you had two or three officers at EVERY school nationwide it would be a deterrent. But that's a lot of money...

                                                        Originally posted by MakingItPay
                                                        But no, they didn't have the right to bear arms at any of those places. It is illegal to carry in those locations. That is a big reason, only the guy that didn't mind committing a felony had guns.
                                                        I believe it was illegal to carry at the college, but not at the local mall or movies.

                                                        But that doesn't really matter. Can you just imagine if someone was carrying a concealed weapon in the mall when a gun man attacked? Do you honestly mean to tell me that "Bob", a forty-five year old insurance salesman, is going to be able to go from shopping with his wife and kids to instantly being in a tactical situation he was never trained for? Is "Bob" going to be able to tell who the gun man is from the dozens or hundreds of shoppers when everyone is running around with their heads cut like chickens screaming? Is "Bob" really going to be able take out a gun man armed with an assault rifle at forty yards?

                                                        Is "Bob" really going to be able to take another's man's life during a tactical situation without having any time to determine if the shooter is the shooter, a police officer, or another innocent civilian who has armed himself?

                                                        We have the right to bear arms and a lot of us do, yet oddly not once at a mall or school or movies has a civilian pulled out a handgun and taken out the gunman. (I do recall the shooting at the church where the armed security guard took out the gunman.) Where are all of these people who proudly own handguns? Hiding?
                                                        Herschel Savage
                                                        Brooklyn, NY

                                                          Comment

                                                          • buzzard
                                                            Confirmed User
                                                            • Aug 2002
                                                            • 1276
                                                            #265
                                                            Of course you do.

                                                              Comment

                                                              • MakingItPay
                                                                Confirmed User
                                                                • Feb 2005
                                                                • 1922
                                                                #266
                                                                Originally posted by Rochard
                                                                That's part of my point - the odds of me shooting someone in my own family by mistake is greater than the odds of my house ever being broken into while I am sleeping.
                                                                You know when they calculate those odds, they include gang shootings, since they make the leap that rival gangs know each other.

                                                                If you are trained in the safe use of gun and home defense techniques, your odds of shooting a family member by accident are greatly reduced. You might accidentally run over your own kids in your car too. But not owning a gun is a choice I think you should have the right. I just hate when people give up their rights freely, and since they don't use it, they want it taken from me.
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                                                                  • MakingItPay
                                                                    Confirmed User
                                                                    • Feb 2005
                                                                    • 1922
                                                                    #267
                                                                    Originally posted by Rochard
                                                                    I am not sure if guards at schools would be enough. Maybe if you had two or three officers at EVERY school nationwide it would be a deterrent. But that's a lot of money...



                                                                    I believe it was illegal to carry at the college, but not at the local mall or movies.

                                                                    But that doesn't really matter. Can you just imagine if someone was carrying a concealed weapon in the mall when a gun man attacked? Do you honestly mean to tell me that "Bob", a forty-five year old insurance salesman, is going to be able to go from shopping with his wife and kids to instantly being in a tactical situation he was never trained for? Is "Bob" going to be able to tell who the gun man is from the dozens or hundreds of shoppers when everyone is running around with their heads cut like chickens screaming? Is "Bob" really going to be able take out a gun man armed with an assault rifle at forty yards?

                                                                    Is "Bob" really going to be able to take another's man's life during a tactical situation without having any time to determine if the shooter is the shooter, a police officer, or another innocent civilian who has armed himself?

                                                                    We have the right to bear arms and a lot of us do, yet oddly not once at a mall or school or movies has a civilian pulled out a handgun and taken out the gunman. (I do recall the shooting at the church where the armed security guard took out the gunman.) Where are all of these people who proudly own handguns? Hiding?
                                                                    Where I live it is illegal to have a weapon in the Movie Theater, and in the Mall, and in schools. Or anywhere they put a little no guns allowed sign. Since it sounds like you don't have a conceal carry permit, you may not be aware of this.

                                                                    Yes, if Bob gets a conceal carry permit he knows how to point and shoot at someone that is attacking him. Will he turn into Bruce Willis? Who knows? Let's allow them to carry and in those places and you will see these high body count crazies reduced dramatically. Gun free zones are where these things happen. Ironic isn't it?
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                                                                      • Rochard
                                                                        Jägermeister Test Pilot
                                                                        • Dec 2001
                                                                        • 75733
                                                                        #268
                                                                        Originally posted by MakingItPay
                                                                        Where I live it is illegal to have a weapon in the Movie Theater, and in the Mall, and in schools. Or anywhere they put a little no guns allowed sign. Since it sounds like you don't have a conceal carry permit, you may not be aware of this.
                                                                        I have never seen such a sign. Ever.

                                                                        Originally posted by MakingItPay
                                                                        Yes, if Bob gets a conceal carry permit he knows how to point and shoot at someone that is attacking him. Will he turn into Bruce Willis? Who knows? Let's allow them to carry and in those places and you will see these high body count crazies reduced dramatically. Gun free zones are where these things happen. Ironic isn't it?
                                                                        No. We already know what will happen. Bruce Willis isn't real. Nor is James Bond. You put an armed civilian into a tactical combat situation surrounded by other civilians and you'll just have an extra shooter.
                                                                        Herschel Savage
                                                                        Brooklyn, NY

                                                                          Comment

                                                                          • StickyGreen
                                                                            .
                                                                            • Oct 2003
                                                                            • 13076
                                                                            #269
                                                                            Originally posted by Rochard
                                                                            You put an armed civilian into a tactical combat situation surrounded by other civilians and you'll just have an extra shooter.
                                                                            You give people no credit, as if they're all just blithering idiots who couldn't possibly use a firearm correctly and efficiently. And how exactly is one kid with a gun a "tactical combat situation?"
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                                                                              • Rochard
                                                                                Jägermeister Test Pilot
                                                                                • Dec 2001
                                                                                • 75733
                                                                                #270
                                                                                Originally posted by MakingItPay
                                                                                If you are trained in the safe use of gun and home defense techniques, your odds of shooting a family member by accident are greatly reduced. You might accidentally run over your own kids in your car too. But not owning a gun is a choice I think you should have the right. I just hate when people give up their rights freely, and since they don't use it, they want it taken from me.
                                                                                I completely disagree.

                                                                                When are you woken up in the middle of the night by an intruder, it's dark, your confused, you are incoherent because you just woke up, adrenaline is flowing, and you are in a tactical situation in which you have no information - you don't know if it's six guys with screw drivers, three guys with baseball bats, or two guys with AR15s. You can't turn on the light because it will give you away AND destroy your night vision. Then factor in a dog that is between you and the intruders, your wife that just woke up and has no idea she's just walked into the line of firing, PLUS a 12 year old kid who is generally clueless in the middle of the afternoon no less at 3am with shots going off.

                                                                                Look at the guy who shot his own kid a few weeks ago. He thought someone was breaking in, turns out it was his son. His burning desire to protect himself just killed his son.

                                                                                I don't live in fear. The two doors leading out are set so when they close they cannot be opened from the outside without a key, and we have an alarm system with a battery system.
                                                                                Herschel Savage
                                                                                Brooklyn, NY

                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                  • Evil1
                                                                                    Confirmed User
                                                                                    • Mar 2002
                                                                                    • 3893
                                                                                    #271
                                                                                    Yeah ban guns, because ancient ass technology cant be reproduced in any home workshop.



                                                                                    With a fucking shovel!

                                                                                      Comment

                                                                                      • Dirty F
                                                                                        Too lazy to set a custom title
                                                                                        • Jul 2001
                                                                                        • 59204
                                                                                        #272
                                                                                        Originally posted by Evil1
                                                                                        Yeah ban guns, because ancient ass technology cant be reproduced in any home workshop.



                                                                                        With a fucking shovel!
                                                                                        I'm not even gonna explain how retarded that argument is because you won't get it anyway.

                                                                                          Comment

                                                                                          • Evil1
                                                                                            Confirmed User
                                                                                            • Mar 2002
                                                                                            • 3893
                                                                                            #273
                                                                                            Originally posted by Dirty F
                                                                                            I'm not even gonna explain how retarded that argument is because you won't get it anyway.
                                                                                            Really, they banned booze once, want a history lesson on what happened next? ban guns and a week later you'll have underground production lines churning them out with absolutely zero barriers to anyone at all getting their hands on them.

                                                                                            The first semi automatic handgun was invented in 1893 by Hugo Borchardt. Just to clear some shit up, that was long assed time before CNC machines appeared. For fucks sake guns were made before anyone even had electricity.

                                                                                            But apparently in your world you need a cnc machine? Ok, here you go. $1275, not exactly a major economic hurdle. http://www.robotshop.com/sherline-54...m_campaign=jos

                                                                                            Heres a mac-10

                                                                                            Now point out the part(s) you are claiming are impossible to be reproduced?

                                                                                            Or are your trying to say no one at all will step up to fill a supply void and get filthy rich much like they didn't when heroin was banned?

                                                                                            fuck.. I can go to home depot tomorrow morning and have a pistol that shoots 12 gauge shotgun shells made before your ass rolls out of bed using 9 inches of 3/4 inch steel pipe (a 12 gauge shell fits in perfectly) 6 inches for the barrel and 3 for the handle, also need a end cap, a couple roofing nails and a spring. $7-8. And no, it wont blow my hand off when it fires.

                                                                                            Oh and here you go, the manufacturing process of turning a shovel into a fuckin ak-47 with pictures, no cnc machine anywhere to be found.
                                                                                            http://www.northeastshooters.com/vbu...=1#post2695046

                                                                                            Amaricans wanted their booze, and they got it!
                                                                                            Americans want their weed, meth, heroin, crack, cocaine, acid, mushrooms and they get that shit too, easily.
                                                                                            300+ million guns out there, any question if Americans will want guns too?

                                                                                              Comment

                                                                                              • Nookster
                                                                                                Confirmed IT Professional
                                                                                                • Nov 2005
                                                                                                • 3744
                                                                                                #274
                                                                                                Originally posted by Evil1
                                                                                                Really, they banned booze once, want a history lesson on what happened next? ban guns and a week later you'll have underground production lines churning them out with absolutely zero barriers to anyone at all getting their hands on them.

                                                                                                The first semi automatic handgun was invented in 1893 by Hugo Borchardt. Just to clear some shit up, that was long assed time before CNC machines appeared. For fucks sake guns were made before anyone even had electricity.

                                                                                                But apparently in your world you need a cnc machine? Ok, here you go. $1275, not exactly a major economic hurdle. http://www.robotshop.com/sherline-54...m_campaign=jos

                                                                                                Heres a mac-10

                                                                                                Now point out the part(s) you are claiming are impossible to be reproduced?

                                                                                                Or are your trying to say no one at all will step up to fill a supply void and get filthy rich much like they didn't when heroin was banned?

                                                                                                fuck.. I can go to home depot tomorrow morning and have a pistol that shoots 12 gauge shotgun shells made before your ass rolls out of bed using 9 inches of 3/4 inch steel pipe (a 12 gauge shell fits in perfectly) 6 inches for the barrel and 3 for the handle, also need a end cap, a couple roofing nails and a spring. $7-8. And no, it wont blow my hand off when it fires.

                                                                                                Oh and here you go, the manufacturing process of turning a shovel into a fuckin ak-47 with pictures, no cnc machine anywhere to be found.
                                                                                                http://www.northeastshooters.com/vbu...=1#post2695046

                                                                                                Amaricans wanted their booze, and they got it!
                                                                                                Americans want their weed, meth, heroin, crack, cocaine, acid, mushrooms and they get that shit too, easily.
                                                                                                300+ million guns out there, any question if Americans will want guns too?
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                                                                                                  • Matyko
                                                                                                    PsyHead
                                                                                                    • Aug 2005
                                                                                                    • 8681
                                                                                                    #275
                                                                                                    Originally posted by baddog
                                                                                                    That might fly in Hungary, would not fly here. Do you think it is okay to have the government in your home looking around?
                                                                                                    Actually this sounds pretty bad and not democratic, but it is not the government who is knocking on your door but some related agency who just check if you play by the rules. And yes, I think it is very OK to check ppl occasionally who have guns. I know it is hard to understand as the laws are totally different there and this most likely sounds Insane to you :P But here not many men keep guns at home. Also, I think they only check w ppl w [serious] gun arsenal not everyone.
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                                                                                                      • GAH
                                                                                                        Confirmed User
                                                                                                        • Jul 2010
                                                                                                        • 88
                                                                                                        #276
                                                                                                        It's really up to the people of Connecticut to do something about this, start the ball rolling, get a campaign going while feelings are high. If they were to declare themselves gun-free- Connecticut forever, that anyone who visits and has a gun with them gets incarcerated, maybe it could kick-start something good. Crocodile tears from the President won't, that was embarrassing to watch. Time for America to grow up.

                                                                                                          Comment

                                                                                                          • Matyko
                                                                                                            PsyHead
                                                                                                            • Aug 2005
                                                                                                            • 8681
                                                                                                            #277
                                                                                                            I haven't read the whole thread, but as a Non-US 'outsider' I saw Michael Moore's movie Bowling for Columbine and what I know is that you can say this guy is demagogic but he is right on many topics. Do not let retarded ppl keep guns at home thats it. Do not let any kids be able to reach your gun thats it. If you don't take enough attention and your kid gets your gun and shots his classmate for some minor thing than you should spend your life in jail.

                                                                                                            If it was indeed true that you could get bullets at any walmart than its obviously fucking BAD and it had to be changed
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                                                                                                              • PornoMonster
                                                                                                                Confirmed User
                                                                                                                • Mar 2003
                                                                                                                • 2257
                                                                                                                #278
                                                                                                                Originally posted by Rochard
                                                                                                                I am not sure if guards at schools would be enough. Maybe if you had two or three officers at EVERY school nationwide it would be a deterrent. But that's a lot of money...



                                                                                                                I believe it was illegal to carry at the college, but not at the local mall or movies.

                                                                                                                But that doesn't really matter. Can you just imagine if someone was carrying a concealed weapon in the mall when a gun man attacked? Do you honestly mean to tell me that "Bob", a forty-five year old insurance salesman, is going to be able to go from shopping with his wife and kids to instantly being in a tactical situation he was never trained for? Is "Bob" going to be able to tell who the gun man is from the dozens or hundreds of shoppers when everyone is running around with their heads cut like chickens screaming? Is "Bob" really going to be able take out a gun man armed with an assault rifle at forty yards?

                                                                                                                Is "Bob" really going to be able to take another's man's life during a tactical situation without having any time to determine if the shooter is the shooter, a police officer, or another innocent civilian who has armed himself?

                                                                                                                We have the right to bear arms and a lot of us do, yet oddly not once at a mall or school or movies has a civilian pulled out a handgun and taken out the gunman. (I do recall the shooting at the church where the armed security guard took out the gunman.) Where are all of these people who proudly own handguns? Hiding?
                                                                                                                That is because these crazies seek out places that DO NOT ALLOW GUNS.
                                                                                                                I heard that for the batman movie there were 7 other theaters close to where the gunman lived, even bigger more frequented ones. This one does NOT allow firearms.

                                                                                                                Most of these cases the Shooters keep shooting until the Police arrive. The police arrive the commit suicide and then the Police Write the report...

                                                                                                                NOTHING Could of prevented the shooting of that many kids unless there were armed guards at the school. (or guns were never invented)

                                                                                                                I say Bring ALL of our troops home and place them around in places, like we did for the airports after 911. Money we are already spending!
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                                                                                                                  • MaDalton
                                                                                                                    I am Amazing Content!
                                                                                                                    • Feb 2004
                                                                                                                    • 39861
                                                                                                                    #279
                                                                                                                    Originally posted by baddog
                                                                                                                    You guys seem to find it difficult to wrap your head around how many people live here; and I never suggested they were all suicides.
                                                                                                                    As usual i do appreciate your attempt of insinuating that i might be stupid - i would suggest using a little math and add up the number of inhabitants of the other countries on that image, then add up their number of deaths and put each in relation.
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                                                                                                                      • MakingItPay
                                                                                                                        Confirmed User
                                                                                                                        • Feb 2005
                                                                                                                        • 1922
                                                                                                                        #280
                                                                                                                        Originally posted by Rochard
                                                                                                                        I have never seen such a sign. Ever.



                                                                                                                        No. We already know what will happen. Bruce Willis isn't real. Nor is James Bond. You put an armed civilian into a tactical combat situation surrounded by other civilians and you'll just have an extra shooter.
                                                                                                                        Go to your mall today. Look on the door. Ask if you are allowed to carry your concealled weapon there. Better yet. Google the last few high body count shootings. Oregon, Aurora, and the recent school. See if they are "Gun Free" Zones. (hint: They all are)

                                                                                                                        You are the one that mentioned James Bond. Rochard, I understand you just want to feel safe, but if you don't own a gun, aren't trained, and have no desire to defend your home with one, I am not sure your opinion is an educated one. Do people accidentally shoot their friends and family? Do people sometimes accidentally run over their own children? Yes. Is owning a gun a huge responsibility? Yes.
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                                                                                                                          • MakingItPay
                                                                                                                            Confirmed User
                                                                                                                            • Feb 2005
                                                                                                                            • 1922
                                                                                                                            #281
                                                                                                                            Originally posted by Rochard
                                                                                                                            I completely disagree.

                                                                                                                            When are you woken up in the middle of the night by an intruder, it's dark, your confused, you are incoherent because you just woke up, adrenaline is flowing, and you are in a tactical situation in which you have no information - you don't know if it's six guys with screw drivers, three guys with baseball bats, or two guys with AR15s. You can't turn on the light because it will give you away AND destroy your night vision. Then factor in a dog that is between you and the intruders, your wife that just woke up and has no idea she's just walked into the line of firing, PLUS a 12 year old kid who is generally clueless in the middle of the afternoon no less at 3am with shots going off.

                                                                                                                            Look at the guy who shot his own kid a few weeks ago. He thought someone was breaking in, turns out it was his son. His burning desire to protect himself just killed his son.

                                                                                                                            I don't live in fear. The two doors leading out are set so when they close they cannot be opened from the outside without a key, and we have an alarm system with a battery system.
                                                                                                                            The person that shot his son was not trained, and because he wasn't he made a mistake that killed his kid. If you don't want to defend your home, and your doors need a key to be opened (LOL) then that is great. But people that are prepared do not live in fear. I bet you don't live in fear of your house burning down either, but I bet its insured. I don't judge you for not wanting the awesome responsibility of your own defense. How you defend something depends on how much you value it.
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                                                                                                                              • MakingItPay
                                                                                                                                Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                • Feb 2005
                                                                                                                                • 1922
                                                                                                                                #282
                                                                                                                                Originally posted by PornoMonster
                                                                                                                                That is because these crazies seek out places that DO NOT ALLOW GUNS.
                                                                                                                                I heard that for the batman movie there were 7 other theaters close to where the gunman lived, even bigger more frequented ones. This one does NOT allow firearms.

                                                                                                                                Most of these cases the Shooters keep shooting until the Police arrive. The police arrive the commit suicide and then the Police Write the report...

                                                                                                                                NOTHING Could of prevented the shooting of that many kids unless there were armed guards at the school. (or guns were never invented)

                                                                                                                                I say Bring ALL of our troops home and place them around in places, like we did for the airports after 911. Money we are already spending!
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                                                                                                                                  • arock10
                                                                                                                                    Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                    • Jan 2006
                                                                                                                                    • 6217
                                                                                                                                    #283
                                                                                                                                    Originally posted by StickyGreen
                                                                                                                                    You're way off, and don't seem to understand the concept of tyranny. If a dictatorship were to take over America they would be in control of the military, not the citizens... this is why the people have the right to form militias and bare arms if necessary to preserve the free state.
                                                                                                                                    And your AR15 will fight off the governments unmanned drones and tanks. Right
                                                                                                                                    Sup

                                                                                                                                      Comment

                                                                                                                                      • arock10
                                                                                                                                        Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                        • Jan 2006
                                                                                                                                        • 6217
                                                                                                                                        #284
                                                                                                                                        Originally posted by Jesus H Christ
                                                                                                                                        ....absolutely wrong there Tony.

                                                                                                                                        In 2008 and 2010, the Supreme Court issued two landmark decisions concerning the Second Amendment. In District of Columbia v. Heller, 554 U.S. 570 (2008), the Court ruled that the Second Amendment protects an individual's right to possess a firearm, unconnected to service in a militia[1][2] and to use that arm for traditionally lawful purposes, such as self-defense within the home. In dicta, the Court listed many longstanding prohibitions and restrictions on firearms possession as being consistent with the Second Amendment.[3] In McDonald v. Chicago, 561 U.S. 3025 (2010), the Court ruled that the Second Amendment limits state and local governments to the same extent that it limits the federal government.[4]

                                                                                                                                        You see the Second Amendment is based on preventing tyranny, any kind. So when my local or federal police stop looking and acting like Gestapo Stormtroopers:

                                                                                                                                        Then we can talk about possibly banning assault rifles.
                                                                                                                                        And the 2nd amendment needs to be amended to reflect society today. Not when we had marauding British around and no army
                                                                                                                                        Sup

                                                                                                                                          Comment

                                                                                                                                          • Grapesoda
                                                                                                                                            So Fucking Banned
                                                                                                                                            • Jul 2003
                                                                                                                                            • 46238
                                                                                                                                            #285
                                                                                                                                            Originally posted by Rochard
                                                                                                                                            I have never seen such a sign. Ever.
                                                                                                                                            seen the sign in bars several times

                                                                                                                                              Comment

                                                                                                                                              • Rochard
                                                                                                                                                Jägermeister Test Pilot
                                                                                                                                                • Dec 2001
                                                                                                                                                • 75733
                                                                                                                                                #286
                                                                                                                                                Originally posted by StickyGreen
                                                                                                                                                You give people no credit, as if they're all just blithering idiots who couldn't possibly use a firearm correctly and efficiently. And how exactly is one kid with a gun a "tactical combat situation?"
                                                                                                                                                I do not give people credit at all. I've seen how the majority of the people drive, and that's plenty enough for me.

                                                                                                                                                How is one kid with a gun a tactical situation? Any time you are faced with taking out a shooter it is in fact a tactical situation. In this case it was one "twenty year old kid" with an assault rifle in a school. If you were armed and present at the school, you would have to go room to room to find him and kill him. That's exactly what a tactical situation is.
                                                                                                                                                Herschel Savage
                                                                                                                                                Brooklyn, NY

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                                                                                                                                                  • Rochard
                                                                                                                                                    Jägermeister Test Pilot
                                                                                                                                                    • Dec 2001
                                                                                                                                                    • 75733
                                                                                                                                                    #287
                                                                                                                                                    Originally posted by MakingItPay
                                                                                                                                                    Go to your mall today. Look on the door. Ask if you are allowed to carry your concealled weapon there. Better yet. Google the last few high body count shootings. Oregon, Aurora, and the recent school. See if they are "Gun Free" Zones. (hint: They all are)
                                                                                                                                                    My wife dragged me out the mall last night and I looked for such signs. I didn't see anything. I live in California.

                                                                                                                                                    Originally posted by MakingItPay
                                                                                                                                                    You are the one that mentioned James Bond. Rochard, I understand you just want to feel safe, but if you don't own a gun, aren't trained, and have no desire to defend your home with one, I am not sure your opinion is an educated one. Do people accidentally shoot their friends and family? Do people sometimes accidentally run over their own children? Yes. Is owning a gun a huge responsibility? Yes.
                                                                                                                                                    I do own a gun, I am trained, but I understand that defending my home with a firearm is risky at best. The odds of me being able to defend myself in the middle of the night in the dark are slim at best. In the mean time, the odds of home invasion or a robbery are so slim that is unlikely to happen - do you know anyone who's house was broken into when they were in it, or do you know anyone who's house was involved in a home invasion? I'm forty-four years old and oddly enough, I don't know one person who has ever gone through this. The odds of me shooting a family member by accident is much greater.
                                                                                                                                                    Herschel Savage
                                                                                                                                                    Brooklyn, NY

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                                                                                                                                                      • MakingItPay
                                                                                                                                                        Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                        • Feb 2005
                                                                                                                                                        • 1922
                                                                                                                                                        #288
                                                                                                                                                        Originally posted by Rochard
                                                                                                                                                        I do not give people credit at all. I've seen how the majority of the people drive, and that's plenty enough for me.

                                                                                                                                                        How is one kid with a gun a tactical situation? Any time you are faced with taking out a shooter it is in fact a tactical situation. In this case it was one "twenty year old kid" with an assault rifle in a school. If you were armed and present at the school, you would have to go room to room to find him and kill him. That's exactly what a tactical situation is.
                                                                                                                                                        I want the teachers to be able to have their own guns if they want them. The kid went room to room easily killing everyone. Nobody would be required to run to the aid of others. But they wouldn't all be sitting ducks. What is tragic is that nobody had any chance at all thanks to the school being "gun free" and homicidal crazy criminal friendly.
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                                                                                                                                                          • MakingItPay
                                                                                                                                                            Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                            • Feb 2005
                                                                                                                                                            • 1922
                                                                                                                                                            #289
                                                                                                                                                            Originally posted by Rochard
                                                                                                                                                            My wife dragged me out the mall last night and I looked for such signs. I didn't see anything. I live in California.



                                                                                                                                                            I do own a gun, I am trained, but I understand that defending my home with a firearm is risky at best. The odds of me being able to defend myself in the middle of the night in the dark are slim at best. In the mean time, the odds of home invasion or a robbery are so slim that is unlikely to happen - do you know anyone who's house was broken into when they were in it, or do you know anyone who's house was involved in a home invasion? I'm forty-four years old and oddly enough, I don't know one person who has ever gone through this. The odds of me shooting a family member by accident is much greater.

                                                                                                                                                            Call the mall and ask if you can carry a concealed weapon in it. Let us know. If you can, you are going to be less likely that a high body count kill will happen there.

                                                                                                                                                            I have a hard time believing your "I own a gun and am trained" but say you are against having one for defending your home because you may shoot your kid. Why do you have a gun again? I don't know anyone personally who's house has flooded, but I have flood insurance.

                                                                                                                                                            Those shoot a family member statistics I don't buy it. How many people do you know personally that own a gun? How many have accidentally killed a family member. They use Gang statistics to skew that number. You believe them, yet you claim to own a gun. Sure you do.
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                                                                                                                                                              • MaDalton
                                                                                                                                                                I am Amazing Content!
                                                                                                                                                                • Feb 2004
                                                                                                                                                                • 39861
                                                                                                                                                                #290
                                                                                                                                                                more guns are clearly a solution



                                                                                                                                                                http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...loped-country/

                                                                                                                                                                but i have understood by now that many people in the US have a different mentality about that and i have given up arguing about it.

                                                                                                                                                                it just puzzles me that instead of being angry at the shooter that spoils it for the responsible gun owners, or having empathy for those who just lost a little child to a madman, the immediate reaction is always attacking anyone who even slightly suggests to rethink gun policies.

                                                                                                                                                                when owning a gun is more important than the smallest chance to prevent a tragedy like this, i think something is wrong.

                                                                                                                                                                but fortunately i live in places where i dont have to worry about that - i just feel sad for the parents and families that lost someone yesterday.
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                                                                                                                                                                  • tony286
                                                                                                                                                                    lurker
                                                                                                                                                                    • Aug 2002
                                                                                                                                                                    • 57021
                                                                                                                                                                    #291
                                                                                                                                                                    Originally posted by Rochard
                                                                                                                                                                    I am not sure if guards at schools would be enough. Maybe if you had two or three officers at EVERY school nationwide it would be a deterrent. But that's a lot of money...



                                                                                                                                                                    I believe it was illegal to carry at the college, but not at the local mall or movies.

                                                                                                                                                                    But that doesn't really matter. Can you just imagine if someone was carrying a concealed weapon in the mall when a gun man attacked? Do you honestly mean to tell me that "Bob", a forty-five year old insurance salesman, is going to be able to go from shopping with his wife and kids to instantly being in a tactical situation he was never trained for? Is "Bob" going to be able to tell who the gun man is from the dozens or hundreds of shoppers when everyone is running around with their heads cut like chickens screaming? Is "Bob" really going to be able take out a gun man armed with an assault rifle at forty yards?

                                                                                                                                                                    Is "Bob" really going to be able to take another's man's life during a tactical situation without having any time to determine if the shooter is the shooter, a police officer, or another innocent civilian who has armed himself?

                                                                                                                                                                    We have the right to bear arms and a lot of us do, yet oddly not once at a mall or school or movies has a civilian pulled out a handgun and taken out the gunman. (I do recall the shooting at the church where the armed security guard took out the gunman.) Where are all of these people who proudly own handguns? Hiding?
                                                                                                                                                                    http://samuel-warde.com/2012/12/conc...m-world-video/ interesting info

                                                                                                                                                                      Comment

                                                                                                                                                                      • brassmonkey
                                                                                                                                                                        Pay It Forward
                                                                                                                                                                        • Sep 2005
                                                                                                                                                                        • 77396
                                                                                                                                                                        #292
                                                                                                                                                                        just putting it out there. the school shooter was not a gun owner!!
                                                                                                                                                                        TRUMP 2026 KEKAW!!! - The Laken Riley Act Is Law!
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                                                                                                                                                                          • Rochard
                                                                                                                                                                            Jägermeister Test Pilot
                                                                                                                                                                            • Dec 2001
                                                                                                                                                                            • 75733
                                                                                                                                                                            #293
                                                                                                                                                                            Originally posted by MakingItPay
                                                                                                                                                                            I want the teachers to be able to have their own guns if they want them. The kid went room to room easily killing everyone. Nobody would be required to run to the aid of others. But they wouldn't all be sitting ducks. What is tragic is that nobody had any chance at all thanks to the school being "gun free" and homicidal crazy criminal friendly.
                                                                                                                                                                            Yes, clearly this is the properly solution. We need our kids surrounded by firearms on a daily basis.

                                                                                                                                                                            No fucking way in the world I would want any of my kid's teachers to have a firearm in school. Most of them are female, less than a hundred pounds, and would cry at the thought of using a gun to shoot an animal no less attempt to take a man's life.

                                                                                                                                                                            Out of all of my kid's teachers, there was only one of them I would ever consider able to handle a firearm.

                                                                                                                                                                            Here in the US, assault rifles are legal, twenty six and seven year old kids KILLED. Meanwhile in China, assault rifles are banned, twenty kids got "wounded". See the difference?
                                                                                                                                                                            Herschel Savage
                                                                                                                                                                            Brooklyn, NY

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                                                                                                                                                                              • baddog
                                                                                                                                                                                So Fucking Banned
                                                                                                                                                                                • Apr 2001
                                                                                                                                                                                • 107089
                                                                                                                                                                                #294
                                                                                                                                                                                Originally posted by Rochard
                                                                                                                                                                                I have never seen such a sign. Ever.

                                                                                                                                                                                You need to get out more.



                                                                                                                                                                                Originally posted by Matyko
                                                                                                                                                                                Actually this sounds pretty bad and not democratic, but it is not the government who is knocking on your door but some related agency who just check if you play by the rules. And yes, I think it is very OK to check ppl occasionally who have guns. I know it is hard to understand as the laws are totally different there and this most likely sounds Insane to you :P But here not many men keep guns at home. Also, I think they only check w ppl w [serious] gun arsenal not everyone.
                                                                                                                                                                                Are you familiar with the phrase "getting your foot in the door?"

                                                                                                                                                                                Originally posted by MaDalton
                                                                                                                                                                                As usual i do appreciate your attempt of insinuating that i might be stupid - i would suggest using a little math and add up the number of inhabitants of the other countries on that image, then add up their number of deaths and put each in relation.
                                                                                                                                                                                I am sorry that is how you are interpreting it, not much I can do about how you interpret my comments. I asked the question of someone yesterday, perhaps you will field it; what year were those numbers taken from and how many were suicides? I don't accept a graphic as fact just because it is on the Internet.

                                                                                                                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                                                                                                                  • Rochard
                                                                                                                                                                                    Jägermeister Test Pilot
                                                                                                                                                                                    • Dec 2001
                                                                                                                                                                                    • 75733
                                                                                                                                                                                    #295
                                                                                                                                                                                    Originally posted by Jesus H Christ
                                                                                                                                                                                    I've told Rochard to ignore me because I've proven him wrong so many times I actually feel sorry for him. Anyway, less then a week ago we had a kid walk into a mall in Portland Oregon with a Ar-15 and kill 2 people. Then the school shooting a couple days ago. You'd think the liberal media would be having a field day with this firearm killing spree epidemic?

                                                                                                                                                                                    Nope, want to know why you don't hear fuck all about the Portland Oregon Mall shooting in the national news anymore? Because the shooter was stopped by a private citizen who had carry permit. Not one national news media covered this because of their Media bias and so they completely dropped the whole Portland Oregon mall shooting.

                                                                                                                                                                                    The shooter shot himself, ending his own life.
                                                                                                                                                                                    Herschel Savage
                                                                                                                                                                                    Brooklyn, NY

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                                                                                                                                                                                      • Rochard
                                                                                                                                                                                        Jägermeister Test Pilot
                                                                                                                                                                                        • Dec 2001
                                                                                                                                                                                        • 75733
                                                                                                                                                                                        #296
                                                                                                                                                                                        Originally posted by baddog
                                                                                                                                                                                        You need to get out more.

                                                                                                                                                                                        I went to the mall last night, didn't see it. Went to half a dozen places outside of the mall too last night, didn't see it.
                                                                                                                                                                                        Herschel Savage
                                                                                                                                                                                        Brooklyn, NY

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                                                                                                                                                                                          • MakingItPay
                                                                                                                                                                                            Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                                            • Feb 2005
                                                                                                                                                                                            • 1922
                                                                                                                                                                                            #297
                                                                                                                                                                                            Originally posted by Rochard
                                                                                                                                                                                            I went to the mall last night, didn't see it. Went to half a dozen places outside of the mall too last night, didn't see it.
                                                                                                                                                                                            Perhaps where you live in California, you aren't allowed to have a CCW permit. That would certainly eliminate the need for the signs. Did you call and ask?
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                                                                                                                                                                                              • MakingItPay
                                                                                                                                                                                                Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                                                • Feb 2005
                                                                                                                                                                                                • 1922
                                                                                                                                                                                                #298
                                                                                                                                                                                                Originally posted by Rochard
                                                                                                                                                                                                The shooter shot himself, ending his own life.
                                                                                                                                                                                                As soon as he realized he had a gun aimed at him.
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                                                                                                                                                                                                  • MakingItPay
                                                                                                                                                                                                    Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                                                    • Feb 2005
                                                                                                                                                                                                    • 1922
                                                                                                                                                                                                    #299
                                                                                                                                                                                                    Originally posted by Rochard
                                                                                                                                                                                                    Yes, clearly this is the properly solution. We need our kids surrounded by firearms on a daily basis.

                                                                                                                                                                                                    No fucking way in the world I would want any of my kid's teachers to have a firearm in school. Most of them are female, less than a hundred pounds, and would cry at the thought of using a gun to shoot an animal no less attempt to take a man's life.

                                                                                                                                                                                                    Out of all of my kid's teachers, there was only one of them I would ever consider able to handle a firearm.

                                                                                                                                                                                                    Here in the US, assault rifles are legal, twenty six and seven year old kids KILLED. Meanwhile in China, assault rifles are banned, twenty kids got "wounded". See the difference?
                                                                                                                                                                                                    All those guns around the school should be no problem. If someone started to use it you could call the police. Or just lock the doors like you do. With the police around and good locks why do you live in fear of guns?
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                                                                                                                                                                                                      • baddog
                                                                                                                                                                                                        So Fucking Banned
                                                                                                                                                                                                        • Apr 2001
                                                                                                                                                                                                        • 107089
                                                                                                                                                                                                        #300
                                                                                                                                                                                                        Originally posted by Rochard
                                                                                                                                                                                                        I went to the mall last night, didn't see it. Went to half a dozen places outside of the mall too last night, didn't see it.
                                                                                                                                                                                                        You think it might have something to do with CA not being a right to carry state? Like I said, you need to get out more.

                                                                                                                                                                                                          Comment

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