YouPorn owner arrested in tax evasion probe - Page 26 - GoFuckYourself.com

Robbie · 12-29-2012, 12:13 PM

I didn't go to that "keynote speech".

It was a thief onstage bragging to a roomful of people desperate to sell their companies to the very man who was stealing from them and causing them to be desperate in the first place.

I had no desire to go into a room full of fear and pandering and one guy on stage bragging about all the money he has that was made at the expense of the people in the audience.

We have to be the only industry that would let someone like that fuck everybody over and then say: "thank you sir, may I have another"

woj · 12-29-2012, 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

One would think that IF they were going to do that (which they won't), they would have only dealt with guys like Hefner or Flynt. People that their investors had heard of with proven track records.

good call on that, lets give the $$$ to some 80 year old guy, whose company hasn't done anything innovative in 50 years, and has been on the downward spiral for the last 20...

or lets gamble on some new startup who has never earned a profit...

or maybe lets try to invest in some adult venture that has been profitable from day one, and is on a triple digit annual growth path... this option is of course completely ridiculous, impossible to even imagine that some hedge fund could take a chance on it...

Robbie · 12-29-2012, 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by woj

good call on that, lets give the $$$ to some 80 year old guy, whose company hasn't done anything innovative in 50 years, and has been on the downward spiral for the last 20...

or lets gamble on some new startup who has never earned a profit...

or maybe lets try to invest in some adult venture that has been profitable from day one, and is on a triple digit annual growth path... this option is of course completely ridiculous, impossible to even imagine that some hedge fund could take a chance on it...

They wouldn't give the $$$ to some 80 year old guy. They would have invested in a proven company (Playboy) that has been in business for 60 years. And is incredibly accepted in the mainstream. But guess what...they STILL wouldn't have done it if it was to buy a hardcore porn company.

And if you think that ANY firm would invest in a company that was neck deep in piracy and in a money laundering charge in the U.S. AND hardcore porn...then I don't know what to say to you.

If that were the case then I'm thinking that I should go to the bank and ask for a loan of a few BILLION dollars. I just know that a company called "Apple" is a great investment and I'd like to run it.

No, I have no experience in making tech products. No, I don't have enough collateral for a loan of that size. But I'm sure that the bank will do it because it's such a great investment.

After that, I'm gonna buy GM and maybe an oil company or two. I'm sure the banks realize what great investments these are and will just loan me the money!

SKUP · 12-29-2012, 12:33 PM

Wow. You were there and you didn't go to the keynote speech? Man, you are THE ONE. Cool shit bro

Robbie · 12-29-2012, 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SKUP

Wow. You were there and you didn't go to the keynote speech? Man, you are THE ONE. Cool shit bro

Why would I go? Did you go?

Did anyone that went to it actually learn anything?

He had nothing to teach any of you. No prior experience in the business to begin with.

The last keynote speech I went to was Stagliano at XBiz a couple of years back.
Now that was interesting and featured a real giant in our business.

But Fabian? Onstage babbling about how great he is? Sorry, no interest to me.

DWB · 12-29-2012, 01:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by woj

good call on that, lets give the $$$ to some 80 year old guy, whose company hasn't done anything innovative in 50 years, and has been on the downward spiral for the last 20...

A little off topic but your post made me think of it...

Most westerners don't know this because of where they are located, but the Playboy brand in Asia is about as large as they come. Most have no idea who Hef is or where Playboy comes from, but they LOVE the bunny and the "Playboy" name. They think it means they are a player. To say Playboy the brand is popular on this side of the world is a severe understatement.

woj · 12-29-2012, 01:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

They wouldn't give the $$$ to some 80 year old guy. They would have invested in a proven company (Playboy) that has been in business for 60 years. And is incredibly accepted in the mainstream. But guess what...they STILL wouldn't have done it if it was to buy a hardcore porn company.

yea, a company with no vision, no plan, and on a downward spiral for the past 20 years...
why would any hedge fund invest in that?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

And if you think that ANY firm would invest in a company that was neck deep in piracy and in a money laundering charge in the U.S. AND hardcore porn...then I don't know what to say to you.

If that were the case then I'm thinking that I should go to the bank and ask for a loan of a few BILLION dollars. I just know that a company called "Apple" is a great investment and I'd like to run it.

No, I have no experience in making tech products. No, I don't have enough collateral for a loan of that size. But I'm sure that the bank will do it because it's such a great investment.

After that, I'm gonna buy GM and maybe an oil company or two. I'm sure the banks realize what great investments these are and will just loan me the money!

that's a terrible example, there is no reason for anyone to give you money to buy apple...
why would they? and besides, apple isn't even that profitable in terms of ROI...

on the other hand, it's no secret that porn is ridiculously profitable, a fact that is not very hard to verify... why wouldn't hedge funds want some of that action? AFF got funding and went public, and they weren't exactly a "clean" investment either...

DWB · 12-29-2012, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

The last keynote speech I went to was Stagliano at XBiz a couple of years back.
Now that was interesting and featured a real giant in our business.

Wish I would have been there for that one. Is it online anywhere?

Robbie · 12-29-2012, 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by woj

on the other hand, it's no secret that porn is ridiculously profitable, a fact that is not very hard to verify.

What????

No, porn WAS ridiculously profitable. Now selling traffic with FREE porn to cam sites and dating sites is ridiculously profitable.

What do you do woj? Just curious...do you own your own company? What ballpark figure is your income in the adult industry?

You're making a lot of statements here that are pretty incredulous to me and what I see all around me in this business.

woj · 12-29-2012, 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

What????

No, porn WAS ridiculously profitable. Now selling traffic with FREE porn to cam sites and dating sites is ridiculously profitable.

What do you do woj? Just curious...do you own your own company? What ballpark figure is your income in the adult industry?

You're making a lot of statements here that are pretty incredulous to me and what I see all around me in this business.

I don't agree, it's perhaps debatable whether it's still very profitable, but there is no way you can keep a straight face and tell me that 10 years ago it wasn't ridicilously profitable... back then, anyone could make 6 figures, those that had their shit together did 7 figures...

it's a lot harder and less profitable now, but by wallstreet standards great ROI is still there...

Robbie · 12-29-2012, 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by woj

I don't agree, it's perhaps debatable whether it's still very profitable, but there is no way you can keep a straight face and tell me that 10 years ago it wasn't ridicilously profitable... back then, anyone could make 6 figures, those that had their shit together did 7 figures...

it's a lot harder and less profitable now, but by wallstreet standards great ROI is still there...

Oh it WAS ridiculously profitable. As recently as 2006 it was insanely profitable. And growing exponentially every year. But piracy took care of that.

And no "anyone" could not make great money. I know what you mean, but there are always people who work hard and are smarter than others of course.

And a lot of people did make really good money.

But even when porn was at it's peak...mainstream companies (and banks) wanted NOTHING to do with us.

I even tried to get cigarette companies to advertise on AL4A and AMPLAND when we had a combined 3 million uniques a day. And they refused to do business with us because we had links to porn. lol

And even today...I wouldn't dare openly tell my bank that I am in the porn business. Seen too many people get booted for that.

That's why I said IF wall street were going to deal with anyone (and they won't) it would have been an accepted major player like Playboy. And not a guy like Fabian.
Fabian's backing is a nice mystery...and he is lying through his teeth when he tells these stories.

HushMoney · 12-29-2012, 02:26 PM

Wow. Woj, IMO you are so off base at this point, you're not even at the concession stand getting popcorn in this thread. (I'm off to go to the beach and drink, but I'll be glad to come back tomorrow and answer any thing that comes up after posting this)

woj · 12-29-2012, 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HushMoney

Wow. Woj, IMO you are so off base at this point, you're not even at the concession stand getting popcorn in this thread. (I'm off to go to the beach and drink, but I'll be glad to come back tomorrow and answer any thing that comes up after posting this)

off base with what? with my opinion that it's possible that he got a hedge fund to invest? (I'm not saying it would have been easy, but it's far from impossible...)

or with the fact that making $$ in adult was pretty easy?

L-Pink · 12-29-2012, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

...and he is lying through his teeth when he tells these stories.

Thieves never lie, fact.

Barefootsies · 12-29-2012, 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DWB

But no one heard him. They were all googly eyed like little kids meeting their favorite super hero.

In all honesty, as soon as he admitted that the entire audience should have started throwing shoes at him and booed him off the stage.

Nope. Despite the fact Manwin is regularly at conferences are they ever confronted, punched out, threatened, or any of the other online warrior bullshit talked about on GFY regularly. The hall was packed, and plenty of people were there to listen to his keynote, and ask questions.

slapass · 12-29-2012, 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

They wouldn't give the $$$ to some 80 year old guy. They would have invested in a proven company (Playboy) that has been in business for 60 years. And is incredibly accepted in the mainstream. But guess what...they STILL wouldn't have done it if it was to buy a hardcore porn company.

And if you think that ANY firm would invest in a company that was neck deep in piracy and in a money laundering charge in the U.S. AND hardcore porn...then I don't know what to say to you.

If that were the case then I'm thinking that I should go to the bank and ask for a loan of a few BILLION dollars. I just know that a company called "Apple" is a great investment and I'd like to run it.

No, I have no experience in making tech products. No, I don't have enough collateral for a loan of that size. But I'm sure that the bank will do it because it's such a great investment.

After that, I'm gonna buy GM and maybe an oil company or two. I'm sure the banks realize what great investments these are and will just loan me the money!

Umm.. this is how business is done. Playboy is dead and missed the internet completely. You invest in the start up. The new trend. People are chasing yield. Hedge funds have farms in the Ukraine. They are buying 10k houses a week from the banks. They do crazy shit all the time. Look at the inside story of AIG or how Bear Stearns died.

Yeah it is not likely to Goldman Sachs behind him but some hedge fund chasing yield and just a heads up, the guy was right.

Robbie · 12-29-2012, 04:31 PM

slapass...no that is NOT how business is done.

Banks and "wall street" won't touch porn with a 10 foot pole. And if they won't get involved with legitimate companies with proven track records...why do you think they would hop in with a nobody with zero experience buying a company (Mansef) that was involved in piracy and under investigation for money laundering?

It's not even close to reality. Especially with the amount of money that was claimed to have been borrowed.

My guess would be that NO money was ever borrowed. Fabian was made the titular head of the "new" company called "Manwin" (they didn't even TRY to hide it was still Mansef) and money was shuffled around to look like a sale was made.

But that's just my theory.

One thing is for damn sure...nobody gave Fabian a hundred million dollar loan. They wouldn't have done it in GOOD economic times and they damn sure didn't do it in the middle of a worldwide economic meltdown when credit was almost impossible to get.

L-Pink · 12-29-2012, 04:34 PM

No legitimate investment entity loaned 100 million to a shady porn company.

L-Pink · 12-29-2012, 04:36 PM

Imagine the due diligence report "company manages to keep inventory costs to a minimum thru copyright theft"

Robbie · 12-29-2012, 04:40 PM

I would just say to anyone in this thread...
If you believe that Fabian was loaned 100 million dollars for a porn company, then do this simple test:
Go to your bank. Sit down with them and explain that your business bank accounts are a porn business.

Don't ask for a loan or anything. Just tell them that the business accounts are for porn. I'm not talking about the friendly teller at the bank that nods and winks at you when you make deposits and "kind of" knows what you do. Tell it to the manager of the bank personally and make sure they understand you are in the PORN business.

Now watch what happens next.

woj · 12-29-2012, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by L-Pink

Imagine the due diligence report "company manages to keep inventory costs to a minimum thru copyright theft"

didn't youtube used to have a very similar strategy? and how did that play out?

I'm using "used to" loosely, everyone knows damn well that to this day youtube is full of copyrighted content...

woj · 12-29-2012, 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

I would just say to anyone in this thread...
If you believe that Fabian was loaned 100 million dollars for a porn company, then do this simple test:
Go to your bank. Sit down with them and explain that your business bank accounts are a porn business.

Don't ask for a loan or anything. Just tell them that the business accounts are for porn. I'm not talking about the friendly teller at the bank that nods and winks at you when you make deposits and "kind of" knows what you do. Tell it to the manager of the bank personally and make sure they understand you are in the PORN business.

Now watch what happens next.

there is a HUGE difference between a bank and a hedge fund... in fact, there is hardly anything in common, except both are in the finance industry...

L-Pink · 12-29-2012, 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by woj

didn't youtube used to have a very similar strategy? and how did that play out?

I'm using "used to" loosely, everyone knows damn well that to this day youtube is full of copyrighted content...

Thanks for missing the point.

woj · 12-29-2012, 04:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by L-Pink

Thanks for missing the point.

what was the point? That no one would ever invest in a company that does shady shit?
How exactly did youtube get funded then?

Robbie · 12-29-2012, 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by woj

I'm using "used to" loosely, everyone knows damn well that to this day youtube is full of copyrighted content...

YouTube runs a pretty tight ship. Hell they've deleted songs that I wrote and filmed the video for because they THOUGHT it wasn't mine. I had to write them and go through hell to have my shit put back up over it.

Most artists and companies now have their own YouTube channel as well.

The days of saying "Oh piracy is okay because just look at YouTube" are over in my opinion.
Is there content that is unauthorized on YouTube? Yes.

Will you find full length movies that are unauthorized on YouTube? No. And if you do it's a very big exception to the rule.

L-Pink · 12-29-2012, 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

YouTube runs a pretty tight ship. Hell they've deleted songs that I wrote and filmed the video for because they THOUGHT it wasn't mine. I had to write them and go through hell to have my shit put back up over it.

Most artists and companies now have their own YouTube channel as well.

The days of saying "Oh piracy is okay because just look at YouTube" are over in my opinion.
Is there content that is unauthorized on YouTube? Yes.

Will you find full length movies that are unauthorized on YouTube? No. And if you do it's a very big exception to the rule.

And you don't find girls vomiting on cocks or having there asses filled with 2 big black cocks either. Entirely different comparison.

woj · 12-29-2012, 04:49 PM

one could argue that youtube was 10x worse investment back then, it was full of copyright infringement and lost millions per year on top of that... and how did that play out?

L-Pink · 12-29-2012, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by L-Pink

And you don't find girls vomiting on cocks or having there asses filled with 2 big black cocks either. Entirely different comparison.

Quote:

Originally Posted by woj

one could argue that youtube was 10x worse investment back then, it was full of copyright infringement and lost millions per year on top of that... and how did that play out?

cant compare porn and youtube

Robbie · 12-29-2012, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by woj

there is a HUGE difference between a bank and a hedge fund... in fact, there is hardly anything in common, except both are in the finance industry...

woj, no disrespect...but you are just wrong about Fabian getting a "loan"

I've gotten a pretty big loan (for me anyway) before. And it was NOT easy. And I had to hide what I was doing in every fucking way to get a loan for 2.3 million dollars. And that was a real estate investment.

It took a lot of time and paperwork and getting anally examined to pull it off. And they were still real concerned about my claim of affiliate sales online (I didn't say that they were ADULT affiliate sales to them lol).

But I had owned the company since 1998 and had stellar credit AND collateral AND a nice chunk of cash in the bank.

I squeaked in on that loan by a hair. If I had told them that I was in porn...or even WORSE that the loan was for a porn company, they would have laughed me out the door.

I can't even imagine ANYBODY loaning a guy like Fabian that kind of money. Much less 100 Million dollars.

I see by your profile that you are a programmer. So maybe you're just pulling for it to be true because Fabian is a programmer too?

woj · 12-29-2012, 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

YouTube runs a pretty tight ship. Hell they've deleted songs that I wrote and filmed the video for because they THOUGHT it wasn't mine. I had to write them and go through hell to have my shit put back up over it.

Most artists and companies now have their own YouTube channel as well.

The days of saying "Oh piracy is okay because just look at YouTube" are over in my opinion.
Is there content that is unauthorized on YouTube? Yes.

Will you find full length movies that are unauthorized on YouTube? No. And if you do it's a very big exception to the rule.

it would take me 2 mins to find a full length movie, here is one, took me whole 30 seconds to find it..:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s-ZO7qsO1zQ

I could find dozens of other examples...

DWB · 12-29-2012, 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

Banks and "wall street" won't touch porn with a 10 foot pole. And if they won't get involved with legitimate companies with proven track records...why do you think they would hop in with a nobody with zero experience buying a company (Mansef) that was involved in piracy and under investigation for money laundering?

Banks just won't touch other porn companies with a 10 foot pole. But companies who have had to forfeit millions of dollars to the US government for money laundering and are involved in illegal activities... no problem. It's about as low of a risk as they can take with such an investment.

Robbie · 12-29-2012, 04:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by woj

it would take me 2 mins to find a full length movie, here is one, took me whole 30 seconds to find it..:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s-ZO7qsO1zQ

I could find dozens of other examples...

You sure did find one! I stand corrected on that. I thought I had read that YouTube and Google had made sure that wouldn't happen anymore and had all kinds of money deals with different production companies.

woj · 12-29-2012, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

woj, no disrespect...but you are just wrong about Fabian getting a "loan"
.
.
.
.
I see by your profile that you are a programmer. So maybe you're just pulling for it to be true because Fabian is a programmer too?

I might be wrong, I have no idea how he got funded, and I don't really care...

his background doesn't really matter, we are both programmers and view the world from the same perspective, but that is really the only thing we have in common..

though I am slightly offended that you keep saying that he is "just a programmer", making it sound like he was a janitor and one day ended up running a porn empire, implying that a programmer is somehow incapable of running a successful business... the guy is obviously pretty smart, has been around the block a few times, so I don't see any reason why his story couldn't be mostly true...

and don't get any ideas that I support him or agree with his strategies or anything like that... I'm just stating my opinion that his story sounds very possible...

johnnyloadproductions · 12-29-2012, 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by woj

I might be wrong, I have no idea how he got funded, and I don't really care...

his background doesn't really matter, we are both programmers and view the world from the same perspective, but that is really the only thing we have in common..

though I am slightly offended that you keep saying that he is "just a programmer", making it sound like he was a janitor and one day ended up running a porn empire, implying that a programmer is somehow incapable of running a successful business... the guy is obviously pretty smart, has been around the block a few times, so I don't see any reason why his story couldn't be mostly true...

and don't get any ideas that I support him or agree with his strategies or anything like that... I'm just stating my opinion that his story sounds very possible...

Well, whether you support him or not and feel inflicted because he's a "fellow programmer," one thing we know for sure is:

Robbie · 12-29-2012, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by woj

though I am slightly offended that you keep saying that he is "just a programmer", making it sound like he was a janitor and one day ended up running a porn empire, implying that a programmer is somehow incapable of running a successful business

I apologize for that. Didn't mean any offense at all.

I guess I was just trying to say he was not qualified to run this kind of company.
It would be like if I decided to run General Electric. I'm just not qualified.

I'm sure Fabian would be more than qualified to run a large company that had something to do with what he's good at. You know what I mean.

Anyway, didn't mean for it to come off like that. My apologies...

notinmybackyard · 12-30-2012, 07:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by woj

though I am slightly offended that you keep saying that he is "just a programmer", making it sound like he was a janitor and one day ended up running a porn empire, implying that a programmer is somehow incapable of running a successful business... the guy is obviously pretty smart, has been around the block a few times, so I don't see any reason why his story couldn't be mostly true...

I am a pornographer and I have been offending people for most of my life. So I do not care if I offend you.

If you are not a pornographer you can not run a successful porn business. What this person Fabian is NOT doing is running a porn business. He is no different than Kim Dotcom. That is someone that have found a way to be a succesful thief. And sooner or later all thieves end up paying for their crimes one way or another. ((I have more than 40 years of experience and contacts in this industry. Trust me that I hear things ))

As for programmers....
They have gone from the arrogant and narcisstic social moron computer geek to screwing up world economies, destroying personal lives and destabilizing everything they touch. And all because somone was dumb enough to left their door open on their parent's basement.

I suggest you watch the BBC documentary titled « All Watched Over by Machines of Loving Grace » It sums up exactly the webkiddie nacissim and my opinion of this generation's belief of entitlement and its reluctance to do some real work.

woj · 12-30-2012, 08:36 AM

I'm not losing any sleep over it, but damn, I just tried to clarify how hedge funds work (cause obviously no one in this thread has any idea) and it turned into "programmers are destroying the world"... what the hell?

anyway, have fun debating whether it was the Mexican drug cartels that funded him or if God himself sent the money from heaven...

notinmybackyard · 12-30-2012, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by woj

I'm not losing any sleep over it, but damn, I just tried to clarify how hedge funds work (cause obviously no one in this thread has any idea) and it turned into "programmers are destroying the world"... what the hell?

anyway, have fun debating whether it was the Mexican drug cartels that funded him or if God himself sent the money from heaven...

When you understand how hedge funds work...
The first thing you see is warning signs of possible fraud.

But rather than spending the next 2 hours making sure that my english grammar is correct. (English is not my first language) I will just post the wikipedia description.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hedge_fund

Quote:

A hedge fund is an investment fund that can undertake a wider range of investment and trading activities than other funds, but which is generally only open to certain types of investors specified by regulators. These investors are typically institutions, such as pension funds, university endowments and foundations, or high-net-worth individuals, who are considered to have the resources to understand the nature of the funds. Hedge funds collectively invest in a diverse range of assets, but they most commonly trade liquid securities on public markets. They also employ a wide variety of investment strategies, and make use of techniques such as short selling and leverage.

Hedge funds are typically open-ended, meaning that investors can invest and withdraw money at regular, specified intervals. The value of an investment in a hedge fund is calculated as a share of the fund's net asset value, meaning that increases and decreases in the value of the fund's investment assets (and fund expenses) are directly reflected in the amount an investor can later withdraw.

Most hedge fund investment strategies aim to achieve a positive return on investment whether markets are rising or falling. Hedge fund managers typically invest money of their own in the fund they manage, which serves to align their interests with investors in the fund.[1][2] A hedge fund typically pays its investment manager a management fee, which is a percentage of the assets of the fund, and a performance fee if the fund's net asset value increases during the year. Some hedge funds have a net asset value of several billion dollars. As of 2009, hedge funds represented 1.1% of the total funds and assets held by financial institutions.[3] As of April 2012, the estimated size of the global hedge fund industry was US$2.13 trillion.[4]

Because hedge funds are not sold to the public or retail investors, the funds and their managers have historically not been subject to the same regulations that govern other funds and investment fund managers with regard to how the fund may be structured and how strategies and techniques are employed. Regulations passed in the United States and Europe after the 2008 credit crisis are intended to increase government oversight of hedge funds and eliminate certain regulatory gaps.[5]

tony286 · 12-30-2012, 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barefootsies

Nope. Despite the fact Manwin is regularly at conferences are they ever confronted, punched out, threatened, or any of the other online warrior bullshit talked about on GFY regularly. The hall was packed, and plenty of people were there to listen to his keynote, and ask questions.

it never happened when the old ibill came to a show owing million of dollars or acacia or .xxx. I just wonder if someone was watching and said if there is a industry you can fuck over and not much happens this is the one. Mike was the only one who confronted them a show and it gave others strength then to join in.

Also an FYI a hedge fund has to report to its investors where the money goes because those people are looking for a return on investment. Investing wise, porn is a dog.

woj · 12-30-2012, 08:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by notinmybackyard

When you understand how hedge funds work...
The first thing you see is warning signs of possible fraud.

But rather than spending the next 2 hours making sure that my english grammar is correct. (English is not my first language) I will just post the wikipedia description.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hedge_fund

Wikipedia definition is pretty toned down, I don't think it 100% accurately describes how hedge funds really work, if you research a little and look closely you will realize that:

1. hedge funds are pretty much unregulated
2. they can use any strategy they want and invest in any asset they want
3. are very tight lipped about how exactly they make money
4. morals don't matter in finance, $$ is all that matters
5. online porn is a pretty good investment

put all 5 together, and it becomes possible that some hedge fund invested in porn...

tony286 · 12-30-2012, 08:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by woj

Wikipedia definition is pretty toned down, I don't think it 100% accurately describes how hedge funds really work, if you research a little and look closely you will realize that:

1. hedge funds are pretty much unregulated
2. they can use any strategy they want and invest in any asset they want
3. are very tight lipped about how exactly they make money
4. morals don't matter in finance, $$ is all that matters
5. online porn is a pretty good investment

put all 5 together, and it becomes possible that some hedge fund invested in porn...

They still have to answer to their investors.

woj · 12-30-2012, 09:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tony286

They still have to answer to their investors.

that's the thing, they don't...

that's why Madoff was able to steal Billions by running a hedge fund... no one cares, no one checks, and no one even has any authority to check how hedge funds invest the $$... unless there is suspicion of fraud, and then SEC after dozens of complaints could look into it...

L-Pink · 12-30-2012, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by notinmybackyard

I am a pornographer and I have been offending people for most of my life. So I do not care if I offend you.

If you are not a pornographer you can not run a successful porn business. What this person Fabian is NOT doing is running a porn business. He is no different than Kim Dotcom. That is someone that have found a way to be a succesful thief. And sooner or later all thieves end up paying for their crimes one way or another. ((I have more than 40 years of experience and contacts in this industry. Trust me that I hear things ))

As for programmers....
They have gone from the arrogant and narcisstic social moron computer geek to screwing up world economies, destroying personal lives and destabilizing everything they touch. And all because somone was dumb enough to left their door open on their parent's basement.

I suggest you watch the BBC documentary titled « All Watched Over by Machines of Loving Grace » It sums up exactly the webkiddie nacissim and my opinion of this generation's belief of entitlement and its reluctance to do some real work.

Great post!

.

Barefootsies · 12-30-2012, 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by notinmybackyard

I am a pornographer and I have been offending people for most of my life. So I do not care if I offend you.

Quote:

Originally Posted by notinmybackyard

As for programmers....
They have gone from the arrogant and narcisstic social moron computer geek to screwing up world economies, destroying personal lives and destabilizing everything they touch. And all because somone was dumb enough to left their door open on their parent's basement.

It sums up exactly the webkiddie nacissim and my opinion of this generation's belief of entitlement and its reluctance to do some real work.

epitome · 12-30-2012, 11:04 AM

Funds are always on the up and up. They never setup shell corps to conceal their investments.

One of the most respected men on the street was Madoff. Where is he now?

epitome · 12-30-2012, 11:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tony286

They still have to answer to their investors.

Madoff was successful in his scam for decades because he deceived his investors. They never pressed hard because he was giving them the returns they wanted. That's how most investors really are. Institutional investors watch things more... So you just don't put them in the fund holding porn.

adultmobile · 12-30-2012, 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by notinmybackyard

When you understand how hedge funds work...
The first thing you see is warning signs of possible fraud.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hedge_fund

Fabian money is a "Porn Credit Loan Fund" directly allocated to (private?) investors... it is not an "Hedge Fund". In fact an "Hedge Fund" or "Mutual Fund" or anything like that, must submit all (would include Cyprus company names) to the SEC; and SEC is public info, so everyone would also be able to read all by search with google, filter site:sec.gov. If you search for the Chicago guys that the german newspaper claims are involved (but is not proven, it could be false!):

http://www.google.com/?q=%22Cortland...2+site:sec.gov

You find several stuff and funds, all of which detailed 100% of their composition, company by company, stock by stock, and there's no any sign of Fabian's companies in Cyprus, Canada, especially $362 million.
As a title of example how a fund looks like, with composition, see the following one (NOT RELATED TO FABIAN! IS JUST RANDOM EXAMPLE!):

http://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/da...haginncsrs.htm

Of course, it make no sense to "put porn" into institutional funds like the one above - it would have barely worked in pre-Madoff and Lehman Bros collapses, imagine in 2011, no way. But when it comes to "loans" that's outside SEC or stock exchanges; it's just a deal between private people via banks / financial institutions. These loans can be packed and resold too, but again not via stock exchange or institutional funds, again could be direct deals, "dear good customer of bank, we got this, you interested in buy some?".. I'm just curious of they was shown Brazzers / Youporn before to decide to invest, or told something more vague.

woj · 12-30-2012, 01:54 PM

"Like mutual funds, hedge funds pool investors? money and invest the money in an effort to make a positive return. Hedge funds typically have more flexible investment strategies than mutual funds. Many hedge funds seek to profit in all kinds of markets by using leverage (in other words, borrowing to increase investment exposure as well as risk), short-selling and other speculative investment practices that are not often used by mutual funds.

Unlike mutual funds, hedge funds are not subject to some of the regulations that are designed to protect investors. Depending on the amount of assets in the hedge funds advised by a manager, some hedge fund managers may not be required to register or to file public reports with the SEC. Hedge funds, however, are subject to the same prohibitions against fraud as are other market participants, and their managers owe a fiduciary duty to the funds that they manage.

Hedge fund investors do not receive all of the federal and state law protections that commonly apply to most mutual funds. For example, hedge funds are not required to provide the same level of disclosure as you would receive from mutual funds. Without the disclosure that the securities laws require for most mutual funds, it can be more difficult to fully evaluate the terms of an investment in a hedge fund. It may also be difficult to verify representations you receive from a hedge fund."

http://www.sec.gov/answers/hedge.htm

woj · 12-30-2012, 02:01 PM

so, in layman's terms, with hedge funds it's all hush hush and anything goes as long $$ is being made...

epitome · 12-30-2012, 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by woj

so, in layman's terms, with hedge funds it's all hush hush and anything goes as long $$ is being made...

Anyone with common sense knows this but that lacks around here.

Getting a hedge fund to give you money isn't the same as walking into your community bank and asking for a loan. The only thing that matters is making money. A fund can extract the best terms from a riskier investment... Like... Oh... Porn?

12-29-2012, 12:13 PM	#1251
Robbie Leaner, Meaner, Faster Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Vegas Posts: 20,845	I didn't go to that "keynote speech". It was a thief onstage bragging to a roomful of people desperate to sell their companies to the very man who was stealing from them and causing them to be desperate in the first place. I had no desire to go into a room full of fear and pandering and one guy on stage bragging about all the money he has that was made at the expense of the people in the audience. We have to be the only industry that would let someone like that fuck everybody over and then say: "thank you sir, may I have another" __________________ -Robbie ClaudiaMarie.Com

12-29-2012, 02:26 PM	#1262
HushMoney Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Hermosa Beach & Miami, FL. Posts: 2,256	Wow. Woj, IMO you are so off base at this point, you're not even at the concession stand getting popcorn in this thread. (I'm off to go to the beach and drink, but I'll be glad to come back tomorrow and answer any thing that comes up after posting this) __________________ Hushmoney.com Interracialpass Hushpass

12-29-2012, 04:31 PM	#1267
Robbie Leaner, Meaner, Faster Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Vegas Posts: 20,845	slapass...no that is NOT how business is done. Banks and "wall street" won't touch porn with a 10 foot pole. And if they won't get involved with legitimate companies with proven track records...why do you think they would hop in with a nobody with zero experience buying a company (Mansef) that was involved in piracy and under investigation for money laundering? It's not even close to reality. Especially with the amount of money that was claimed to have been borrowed. My guess would be that NO money was ever borrowed. Fabian was made the titular head of the "new" company called "Manwin" (they didn't even TRY to hide it was still Mansef) and money was shuffled around to look like a sale was made. But that's just my theory. One thing is for damn sure...nobody gave Fabian a hundred million dollar loan. They wouldn't have done it in GOOD economic times and they damn sure didn't do it in the middle of a worldwide economic meltdown when credit was almost impossible to get. __________________ -Robbie ClaudiaMarie.Com

12-29-2012, 04:40 PM	#1270
Robbie Leaner, Meaner, Faster Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Vegas Posts: 20,845	I would just say to anyone in this thread... If you believe that Fabian was loaned 100 million dollars for a porn company, then do this simple test: Go to your bank. Sit down with them and explain that your business bank accounts are a porn business. Don't ask for a loan or anything. Just tell them that the business accounts are for porn. I'm not talking about the friendly teller at the bank that nods and winks at you when you make deposits and "kind of" knows what you do. Tell it to the manager of the bank personally and make sure they understand you are in the PORN business. Now watch what happens next. __________________ -Robbie ClaudiaMarie.Com Last edited by Robbie; 12-29-2012 at 04:42 PM..

12-29-2012, 04:49 PM	#1277
woj <&(©¿©)&> Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Chicago Posts: 47,883	one could argue that youtube was 10x worse investment back then, it was full of copyright infringement and lost millions per year on top of that... and how did that play out? __________________ Custom Software Development, email: woj#at#wojfun#.#com to discuss details or skype: wojl2000 or gchat: wojfun or telegram: wojl2000 Affiliate program tools: Hosted Galleries Manager Banner Manager Video Manager Wordpress Affiliate Plugin Pic/Movie of the Day Fansign Generator Zip Manager

12-29-2012, 12:33 PM	#1254
SKUP Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Oct 2011 Posts: 400	Wow. You were there and you didn't go to the keynote speech? Man, you are THE ONE. Cool shit bro

12-29-2012, 04:34 PM	#1268
L-Pink working on my tan Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Florida/Kentucky Posts: 39,152	No legitimate investment entity loaned 100 million to a shady porn company.

12-29-2012, 04:36 PM	#1269
L-Pink working on my tan Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Florida/Kentucky Posts: 39,152	Imagine the due diligence report "company manages to keep inventory costs to a minimum thru copyright theft"

12-30-2012, 08:36 AM	#1287
woj <&(©¿©)&> Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Chicago Posts: 47,883	I'm not losing any sleep over it, but damn, I just tried to clarify how hedge funds work (cause obviously no one in this thread has any idea) and it turned into "programmers are destroying the world"... what the hell? anyway, have fun debating whether it was the Mexican drug cartels that funded him or if God himself sent the money from heaven... __________________ Custom Software Development, email: woj#at#wojfun#.#com to discuss details or skype: wojl2000 or gchat: wojfun or telegram: wojl2000 Affiliate program tools: Hosted Galleries Manager Banner Manager Video Manager Wordpress Affiliate Plugin Pic/Movie of the Day Fansign Generator Zip Manager

12-30-2012, 11:04 AM	#1295
epitome So Fucking Lame Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: St. Petersburg, FL Posts: 12,158	Funds are always on the up and up. They never setup shell corps to conceal their investments. One of the most respected men on the street was Madoff. Where is he now?

12-30-2012, 01:54 PM	#1298
woj <&(©¿©)&> Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Chicago Posts: 47,883	"Like mutual funds, hedge funds pool investors? money and invest the money in an effort to make a positive return. Hedge funds typically have more flexible investment strategies than mutual funds. Many hedge funds seek to profit in all kinds of markets by using leverage (in other words, borrowing to increase investment exposure as well as risk), short-selling and other speculative investment practices that are not often used by mutual funds. Unlike mutual funds, hedge funds are not subject to some of the regulations that are designed to protect investors. Depending on the amount of assets in the hedge funds advised by a manager, some hedge fund managers may not be required to register or to file public reports with the SEC. Hedge funds, however, are subject to the same prohibitions against fraud as are other market participants, and their managers owe a fiduciary duty to the funds that they manage. Hedge fund investors do not receive all of the federal and state law protections that commonly apply to most mutual funds. For example, hedge funds are not required to provide the same level of disclosure as you would receive from mutual funds. Without the disclosure that the securities laws require for most mutual funds, it can be more difficult to fully evaluate the terms of an investment in a hedge fund. It may also be difficult to verify representations you receive from a hedge fund." http://www.sec.gov/answers/hedge.htm __________________ Custom Software Development, email: woj#at#wojfun#.#com to discuss details or skype: wojl2000 or gchat: wojfun or telegram: wojl2000 Affiliate program tools: Hosted Galleries Manager Banner Manager Video Manager Wordpress Affiliate Plugin Pic/Movie of the Day Fansign Generator Zip Manager Last edited by woj; 12-30-2012 at 01:56 PM..

12-30-2012, 02:01 PM	#1299
woj <&(©¿©)&> Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Chicago Posts: 47,883	so, in layman's terms, with hedge funds it's all hush hush and anything goes as long $$ is being made... __________________ Custom Software Development, email: woj#at#wojfun#.#com to discuss details or skype: wojl2000 or gchat: wojfun or telegram: wojl2000 Affiliate program tools: Hosted Galleries Manager Banner Manager Video Manager Wordpress Affiliate Plugin Pic/Movie of the Day Fansign Generator Zip Manager Last edited by woj; 12-30-2012 at 02:02 PM..