Sallyrand?
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Your pics are fine, i saw few more already, but what a was asking is different videos of the plane/crash... like i said, i saw many from the tower, and what was unclear for me is where are those Pentagone videos, thats it thats all..Last edited by Axel_Crak; 09-10-2012, 07:56 PM.
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A jumbo jet went through this hole:
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re: wtc
~1510ºC (2750ºF) - melting point of typical structural steel
~825ºC (1517ºF) - maximum temperature of hydrocarbon fires burning in the atmosphere without pressurization or pre-heating (premixed fuel and air - blue flame)
Diffuse flames burn far cooler.
Oxygen-starved diffuse flames are cooler yet.
The fires in the towers were diffuse -- well below 800ºC.
Their dark smoke showed they were oxygen-starved -- particularly in the South Tower.Arguing whether the Democratic or Republican party is better is like debating which steaming pile of shit is slightly less stinky.Comment
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horrible, but dark smoke so strange in this issue...
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Are we really going to hash this out every September?
This is some of the dumbest dribble I've read in a long time. This plane crash was unlike any other plane crash in history, and it crashed into one of the biggest buildings in the world. It's not one building, but rings of buildings. It was massive.in
shot you can see how the plane has hit the building - wings have sheared off and the body of the plan has continued through the inside of the pentagon as indicated by the burnt roof above where the plane continued
its interesting to see that vertical shear at the front of the impact site. i cant explain why all the upper levels would have sheared away like that without anything to cut through them. the plane was at ground level so yeah cant explain that
all the fuel onboard - if the roof was burnt like we can see it is but the fire was limited to the path of the plane and immediately surrounding it then i guess we can only assume they have a killer sprinkler system at the pentagon. maybe the building is built from super flame resistant shit. probably. that combined with good sprinklers limited the spread of the fire
i see b3t3k's thread about the missing money - no idea about that - its probably true
Vertical shear? A fucking 200 ton airplane smashed into a large concrete building and instantly fucking exploded. Don't look at it as a thirty foot wide body that should leave a neat and tidy hole; It fucking exploded and destroyed floors above the impact. And just because the plane crashed at "ground level" doesn't mean it stayed level at the moment of impact. My guess was that the plane the building and instantly aimed up - not down.Herschel Savage
Brooklyn, NYComment
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Clearly that's exactly what happened. As the entire world shifted it's attention from NYC to the Pentagon, they just pulled up in trucks and dropped airplane parts.Herschel Savage
Brooklyn, NYComment
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I love people with fake nicks. For all GFY knows, your fake nick is really my fake nick and I'm just debating with myself.
I swear to god you fucking idiots ate lead paint when you were kids. Use some common fucking sense here. Why the fuck do you think there is videos of the WTC but none of the Pentagon?
How many tourists pointed their video cameras at the WTC before they fell vs how many tourists go to the Pentagon?Herschel Savage
Brooklyn, NYComment
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Allow me to help.
A fucking airplane hit it. What in the world makes you think it was anything else? Don't give me stories about angles and vertical shear and the hole wasn't big enough. Obviously the plane could have hit at any angle, we don't need to discuss vertical shear because a plane hit the building and exploded taking out the roof, and the hole was plenty big enough - but when you look at a picture of the damage in the huge building from a distance it makes the damage look small.
When the towers fell, the ground shook to the point that it registered as an earthquake. Two towers nearly fell on a building that had already suffered damage and was on fire for hours. Most likely the entire building was moved completely off it's foundation.
You shouldn't be surprised that Building 7 fell. Instead you should be stunned that more buildings didn't fall.
Because clearly all airline pilots former US Marines who are locked, cocked, and ready to do battle in the cockpit. Airline pilots make hundreds of routine flights a year. When people suddenly stormed the cockpit they didn't have a chance. Use some common sense here - two pilots strapped in flying an airplane were quickly and suddenly attacked from behind. Box cutters or not, they never had a chance. Chances are they were knocked out or beat a pulp before they even knew what was happening.Herschel Savage
Brooklyn, NYComment
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The thing I can never seem to get a straight answer from any truther on is is the question why. Why would the government do this? Assume Bush and his people masterminded this entire thing and pulled it off. To what gains? Money? They have tons of money. If you say "They made more by using this attack to send us to war" I'm sure there are a ton of ways they could have used various government contracts to make just as much money without risking being put to death if they are caught.
Power? Bush, like any US president, was already the most powerful person in the world. Short of world dictator there is no more powerful position to hold.
So they could pass things like the Patriot Act and control the people? Why? What good does that control give them?
Somebody please explain to me what Bush, or whoever did this, stood to gain from it.
When you look at it from a sheer logical risk vs reward point of view there is no reward worth this risk.Comment
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The US military was poised to fight external threats, not internal threats. Prior to 9/11 no one gave much thought to our own commerical planes being used against us.
Each tower took nearly thirty to forty seconds to fall. Keep in mind you saw the top fall. The rest of the building was covered in dust and we never saw it fall.
Landing is complicated. Flying a plane into a large tower is pretty easy really. Even more so when you've had flight training.
You can't compare the fire with Building 7 to any other building unless two large towers fell nearly on top of it, acting like a earthquake, with debris taking out part of the building and perhaps moving it off it's foundation. Add in it was on fire for hours completely unattended, and presto, you have a building that falls.
Simple.
You don't focus security cameras on the buildings themselves, but instead at the points where people pass through. In fact, the one camera that did catch the plane hitting wasn't focused on the building itself but rather an entry point.Herschel Savage
Brooklyn, NYComment
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They'll tell you it was because they wanted to invade Afghanistan - which makes no fucking sense what so ever. You can point out there is nothing of value in Afghanistan and they'll tell you a story about a pipeline.... Well, 9/11 happened and this imaginary pipeline STILL hasn't been built. In fact, Afghanistan is a lot less stable than now than it was before 9/11.
Anyone think Bush wanted to pass the Patriot Act? Really? Do you honestly believe that the President wanted to pass the Patriot Act to protect the US against terrorism by staging the largest terrorist attack ever?
Who did this? The CIA? The US military? You really think someone gathered up hundreds of people to pull this off and not one person since talked? It put all of the explosives in place, who killed the hundreds of people on the airplanes....
We have eye witness reports of people seeing hijackers taking over airplanes. What the fuck more proof do we need?Herschel Savage
Brooklyn, NYComment
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Yeah, that's proof of.... A fire. And nothing else.Herschel Savage
Brooklyn, NYComment
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Now that the dark art of 'False Flag Terror' is too well known, the Elite are having to focus on creating false flag revolutions and civil wars, like in Libya and Syria.Comment
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This message is hidden because wehateporn is on your ignore list.
moonbats - too much windowpane or clearlightComment
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So much data and facts except you forgot the part about impact and pressure... You think that impact may have some how possibly maybe weakened those beams? Nah.. it's all about temperature.. those beams were pristine after a hit from a jet liner, that makes perfect sense. How about gravity? Wouldn't the weight above the impact effect the beams that were melting? Yes of course it would. But you are talking about melting points in a controlled state aren't you?
you fail at physics and science in general. Learn to work a variable stop learning from youtube and blogs.webmaster at pimproll dot comComment
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Huh? Why did they pass it then, if it doesn't do them any good?
This isn't stuff they might do, the PATRIOT ACT and invasion of Iraq are not conspiracy theories, they're historical facts. They happened. And yet you're asking why would they do it, as if they haven't actually done it.
As to 9/11 itself, you don't have to believe in thermite bombs or other specific ideas to be a skeptic, all you have to do is be unconvinced by at least one thing in the official story.
And to believe that story you have to believe that everything, without exception, went down the way 19 people armed with box-cutters wanted, and everything, without exception, failed, by chance or by incompetence, on our side.
That in itself, without all the other oddities surrounding 9/11, is not credible.Last edited by helterskelter808; 09-11-2012, 07:04 AM.Comment
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+1
This should be a national day of morning and more importantly a time for reflection on our failures as a nation that led to this event.
It is not national crackpot day ...
People where eye witness to these events. The penalty for treason in the United States is death by hanging or firing squad -- if that doesn't make you think twice of being a conspirator to these supposed events you are a death wish sociopathic nut claiming paranoid delusions of conspiracy. After 10 years these accusations have only highly subjective proof just like the "grassy knoll" events of the JFK assassination near 50 years ago.
It was really work of the reptilian overlords from outer space -- now go take your thorazine and shake in the corner of the room.
How do you know if someone is a sociopath?
In: Sociopathy (Psychopathy)
Answer:
Here is a list of ways to identify a sociopath. This list is from "Profile of a Sociopath." Is is a pretty good list of sociopathic indicators.
Glibness/superficial charm
Manipulative and cunning
Grandiose sense of self
Pathological lying
Lack of remorse, shame or guilt
Shallow emotions
Incapacity for love
Need for stimulation
Callousness/lack of empathy
Poor behavioral controls/impulsive nature
Early behavior problems/juvenile delinquency
Irresponsibility/unreliability
Promiscuous sexual behavior/infidelity
Lack of realistic life plan/parasitic lifestyle
Criminal or entrepreneurial versatility
Contemptuous of those who seek to understand them
Does not perceive that anything is wrong with them
Authoritarian
Secretive
Paranoid
Only rarely in difficulty with the law, but seeks out situations where their tyrannical behavior will be tolerated, condoned, or admired
Conventional appearance
Goal of enslavement of their victim(s)
Exercises despotic control over every aspect of the victim's life
Has an emotional need to justify their crimes and therefore needs their victim's affirmation (respect, gratitude and love)
Ultimate goal is the creation of a willing victim
Incapable of real human attachment to another
Unable to feel remorse or guilt
Narcissism, grandiosity (self-importance not based on achievements)
May state readily that their goal is to rule the worldComment
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I don't question a plane hit it. I question the official story. There are multiple eye witnesses who contradict the official story, some of them are police officers. Even the taxi cab driver who had his window smashed is on video talking some crazy shit.
Large buildings like that are built to withstand earthquakes, big earthquakes, and don't fall in its own footprint unless it is brought down via demolitions. In fact, they don't fall down at all. Not to mention the police officers and firemen who have said they not only heard explosions, but were told it was going to be "pulled" and brought down.
I actually fought a guy with a box cutter once in the parking lot of Makro many years ago. I took it from him, kicked his ass, and held him until the police cam. I'm a civilian. It's only a razor blade. It's not a machete. Yea, it can cut you deep, and yea if it hits an artery you're fucked, but if the alternative is flying your plane into a building and dying, I'll take my chances with the blade. I just refuse to believe everyone on those planes were total pussies and the pilots had zero training for someone trying to take control of the cockpit. Logically it just doesn't make sense. But who knows, Americans are generally big pussies, so maybe that is exactly what happened. We'll never know.Comment
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this thread is really heating up...i might have to post some videosTelegram PhoenixBrad
https://quantads.ioComment
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Just a reminder of how things worked under the unwavering leadership of the amazing Bush Administration. Who was in charge of the country when we were attacked again?
Click Here For All The Warm And Fuzzy MemoriesComment
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I understand that these things happened. What I want to know is if people believe that Bush and others carried out the 9/11 attacks so that they could pass the Patriot Act and invade Iraq if so what did they personally have to gain from doing these things?Huh? Why did they pass it then, if it doesn't do them any good?
This isn't stuff they might do, the PATRIOT ACT and invasion of Iraq are not conspiracy theories, they're historical facts. They happened. And yet you're asking why would they do it, as if they haven't actually done it.
As to 9/11 itself, you don't have to believe in thermite bombs or other specific ideas to be a skeptic, all you have to do is be unconvinced by at least one thing in the official story.
And to believe that story you have to believe that everything, without exception, went down the way 19 people armed with box-cutters wanted, and everything, without exception, failed, by chance or by incompetence, on our side.
That in itself, without all the other oddities surrounding 9/11, is not credible.Comment
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11 years later and people like this guy...still dont buy the official story.
he needs a sit down with the geniuses here on gfy who get their information from CNN and the NIST report...lol
http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2012...craig-roberts/
i know none of them will read it though...because it isn't delivered in a 3 minutes news broadcast.Telegram PhoenixBrad
https://quantads.ioComment
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Another anniversary and another retarded thread.Bryan
skype: bryan.glass3 | ICQ 302999591Comment
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It wasn't the Jews. It was the Muslims.
But why did the Muslims do it? Because of the Jews.
Conspiracy theories aren't necessary when the truth yields the same answer.Comment
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Power? Money? The usual things. Again, the fact that they did those things demonstrates that they had something to gain from it, otherwise they would not have done it.
I've only read the start of that so far, but I wish there were more people making this point:
"One is that according to the official story, a handful of Arabs [...] outwitted not only the CIA, FBI, and National Security Agency, but all 16 US intelligence agencies, along with all security agencies of America’s NATO allies and Israel’s Mossad. Not only did the entire intelligence forces of the Western world fail, but on the morning of the attack the entire apparatus of the National Security State simultaneously failed. Airport security failed four times in one hour. NORAD failed. Air Traffic Control failed. The US Air Force failed. The National Security Council failed. Dick Cheney failed. Absolutely nothing worked. The world’s only superpower was helpless at the humiliating mercy of a few undistinguished Arabs."
That's essentially my main argument and position, in fact it's what I said in above, in post 124, that to believe the official story you have to believe in something that is simply not believable.
It's funny how so many learned opponents of people who question aspects of 9/11, people who know so much better, can't do anything more than hurl insults, without contributing anything remotely substantial to the discussion.Comment
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Again, I understand that they passed the Patriot Act and invaded Iraq. They did so as a response (IMO unneeded) to the 9/11 attacks.
Are you then saying that they orchestrated the 9/11 attacks so that they could carry these things out? If so what really did they stand to gain from doing so? Power? You could argue that Bush had less power after invading Iraq. After 9/11 the world stood at our backs. When he decided to invade Iraq many of those countries were against us and he cost us a lot of credibility.
Money? There are a million ways companies like Halliburton can make a ton of money from government contracts without taking the risks that a 9/11 attacks would put on them.
So I still see no real answer as to why our leaders would carry this attack out on us.Last edited by kane; 09-11-2012, 10:51 AM.Comment
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What is it that doesn't make sense? That pilots strapped to their seats weren't able kick the shit out of trained killers rushing the cockpit? My guess is their throats were slit by the muscle hijackers before they even knew what happened. In any case I doubt the widows to the pilots recall their former husbands as pussies as you categorise them.
A shame it wasn't you or Jackie Chan flying the planes, then we would have had 19 beaten up and arrested hijackers instead. Would also have saved us from all these conspiracy theories.Comment
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I think his point got lost. I think he was trying to say and he can correct me if i am wrong here of course. Is that the hijackers weren't the roided up version that you see in True Lies who smash porcelain toilet fixtures with their bare hands. No these were skinny, small pathetic twerps, of the slack jawed variety, with a barely coherent look in their eyes.
Facing them on each of the four planes were men, and women from the U.S.A. and Canada, who both outweighed them and were far stronger. Men who all their life growing up had not just sat by and watched as chaos unfolded around them. Anywhere i go in the world i always see some American or some Canadian ready to poke his nose into the business of others when things don't jive with their particular world view. It is actually an endearing quality to put your own safety on the back burner to stick up for rights that some people are not even aware of.
Now my point in that tirade? Have you ever seen a crowd in an emergency situation? Heard the noise? It is ludricous and naive to think that the hijackers of that plane were able to keep the noise down. The pilots would have known exactly what was going on if there were indeed hijackers taking over the plane with some small razor blades. You know a 150 pound man standing 5^6 walking by a 280lb 6^4 guy who probably is missing the last time he got to smash someone.
Sorry it doesn't add up. The noise alone would have alerted the pilots to what was going on. I don't believe a skinny short dude from a cave stands much of a chance against another grown man when it is life on the line. I could believe one plane....but not four.
Sorry.Telegram PhoenixBrad
https://quantads.ioComment
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I wonder if the fbi etc thought it was 'just a bunch of thick as shit arabs' as seems to be the case a fair bit here, that contributed to 'just a bunch of thick fuck arabs' "outwitting" the super duper americaland security. I mean, it's not like there's any kind of history of friendly-fire, and other almighty cock-ups throughout history where the so-called clever people are concerned is it.
It's also actually quite funny seeing the 'wait, but we are *americans*!!!! No-one can outwit such a clever and advanced race as us!' comments lol, gimme a fucking break
ps I do like Americans, so this isn't a slight on all of you by any means
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yes yes i see your point. Everyone loves themselves.
however do you think that the entire plane was quiet allowing your super operatives from the desert to sneak up to the cock pit? maybe they were all shushing each other?
shhh...lets let these guys sneak up the planeTelegram PhoenixBrad
https://quantads.ioComment
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Suggest you watch the film "United 93" .
There you can see a realistic portrayal of what happened aboard the plane.
The are conspiracies, they are well know and documented. The "gulf of Tolkin" , attempts to kill Castro, the overthrow of the 1950's Iran gov etc.
It is not too difficult to find out the truth about these matters as for governments they only have to fool most of the people not all of the people.
The idea that 9/11 was a conspiracy is to think that those in power are far cleverer than they are.Comment
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It doesn't add up because you haven't bothered to get the facts.
First off, the muscle hijackers were seated very near the front of the plane, in first class. They didn't have to subdue anybody on the planes or create any noise at all. It would have taken nearly no time at all to kick down the cockpit door and slit the pilot's throats. By the time anybody could react, the planes were already in the hands of the hijackers.
Secondly, while size and strength are part of any fighting equation, training is always more important. Don't believe me? You're what, 6'0+ and more than 200 pounds? I know hundreds of guys much smaller than you that could take you out in under a minute flat. Worse than that, I know a handful of girls that could do the exact same thing.Last edited by WarChild; 09-11-2012, 11:13 AM..Comment
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one fitty .............Morons
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