Killing off File Lockers - Page 76 - GoFuckYourself.com

AdultKing · 11-01-2012, 07:17 AM

Just a reminder to everyone.

Follow the progress of StopFileLockers live on Twitter. Follow @StopFileLockers http://twitter.com/StopFileLockers

or like the Facebook page at http://facebook.com/StopFileLockers

Report piracy sites at http://copycontrol.org/report-piracy/

You can cc all your DMCA & infringement reports to infringements -at- copycontrol.org

Official Copy Control updates and news at http://forum.copycontrol.org

Follow Copy Control on Twitter @CopyControlHQ http://twitter.com/CopyControlHQ

or like the Facebook page http://facebook.com/CopyControlHQ

Contributions to the Stop File Lockers project can be made using Paypal or Credit Card via Paypal using the ChipIn widget on http://stopfilelockers.com

Contributions to the Stop File Lockers project can also be made using Paxum to [email protected]

We can be contacted using the contact form on the Stop File Lockers website or on the Copy Control Website

http://stopfilelockers.com

http://copycontrol.org

Thank you to everyone who has supported this project, it wouldn't exist without you.

dgraves · 11-01-2012, 11:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nautilus

There.

Please always DMCA their billing company, or if that is a rogue billing company (which Avangate probably is), send DMCAs to VISA and MC. And also always cc them to copycontrol, to be used as evidence to demand termination of the infringing site, or termination of a rogue billing company which is processing payments for such sites.

Do not send DMCAs to hosts, unless you're happy spending most of your time scouting forums and blogs for links and playing cat and mouse game with the upload monkeys. Do not settle on merely killing some links. Help to kill file lockers which are the reason why links to your stolen content appear at piracy/warez sites.

This is a great tip. Is there a list anywhere of email addresses for the top file sharing sites along with their processor's email addresses?

Nautilus · 11-01-2012, 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dgraves

This is a great tip. Is there a list anywhere of email addresses for the top file sharing sites along with their processor's email addresses?

That is a good question indeed

A ton of them were terminated this week, so we'd need to redraft our hit list competely. I'll post the fresh one somewhere in the beginning of the next week.

dgraves · 11-01-2012, 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nautilus

That is a good question indeed

A ton of them were terminated this week, so we'd need to redraft our hit list competely. I'll post the fresh one somewhere in the beginning of the next week.

That's perfect. I'm sure most producers would be glad to contribute if that info was readily available. This is a better long-term approach than just sending the DMCA Notice to the thief and the host.

6South · 11-02-2012, 12:22 AM

While I support your efforts and would agree it is a necessary endeavor I'm curious if you've thought about the long term outcome?

What will eventually happen is the typical internet evolution. The most dedicated criminals will just move to more protected hosting and payment systems who will not cooperate like bitcoin, etc.

I think eventually you will need to move into collecting intelligence on support for the various illegal activities that tend to actually get a reaction - such as the child porn support service providing and basically perform the investigative work for law enforcement so they 1, obtain intelligence they don't have the time or budget to pursue themselves and 2, can see the possibility of winning cases.

Unfortunately most of the prosecutions at that level will be Federal (in the case of the US) and even getting the Feds to pursue a case can be close to impossible without doing most of the foundation work for them. Then, the prosecutors only take cases they have a 95 percent or better chance of winning.

I think your service will be busy for a long time to come though, there are always new players coming into the warez / piracy for profit industry and they do tend to take a very short sighted view on things. This is why the same people will keep coming back even after you manage to kill their payment processing. It's no different than the low level spam for profit field (with a lot of cross over between the participants) but as with most Internet based theft the long term players will more and more often end up being members or organized crime rings from the former USSR, Africa and Asia.

It's sad that the general public will end up killing their own freedoms. As long as so many people feel it's not only OK to not pay for services but for a few to feel they should be able to make money by stealing the work of others outright the end game solution will be a system of controls on the Internet that guarantee accountability. It's really only a matter of time, the ecommerce potential in yearly $ has grown to the critical level and the number of people using it to steal has also grown past the level where it cannot continue.

Right now the fight is still primarily being carried by content and good producers. Once finance enters the ring you will start to see more effective efforts in prosecutions and the development of controls - be that personal accountability such as tracking technologies or better and better DRM.

In all honestly while I do feel your efforts are needed and a necessary part of the process the industry as a whole would probably be better off investing in DRM technology and doing so on a basis that will keep up w/ the crackers. The model of 12 month release dates cannot compete w/ an opposition that works for free and has no release calendar.

AdultKing · 11-02-2012, 12:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 6South

While I support your efforts and would agree it is a necessary endeavor I'm curious if you've thought about the long term outcome?

Of course we have.

Quote:

What will eventually happen is the typical internet evolution. The most dedicated criminals will just move to more protected hosting and payment systems who will not cooperate like bitcoin, etc.

I have heard this all before.

Nobody hosted anywhere is safe, the only reason pirates have found safe harbour until now is because nobody has actually worked to shut down the things we shut down in the way we shut them down.

Just this week we saw a major third party billing company drop their file sharing clients because we leveraged their need to transact with other payment systems and credit cards. The threat of losing their relationships was enough, after many months of pressure, communication and hard work on our part, caused them to rethink their activities and almost 20 file sharing sites were cut loose.

I predict a great many entities who were enabling piracy will be disrupted in their activities. We have many strategies for dealing with piracy, not all of them have been put into place yet.

Quote:

I think eventually you will need to move into collecting intelligence on support for the various illegal activities that tend to actually get a reaction - such as the child porn support service providing and basically perform the investigative work for law enforcement so they 1, obtain intelligence they don't have the time or budget to pursue themselves and 2, can see the possibility of winning cases.

Rubbish, in most countries every case is investigated, the decision to prosecute usually comes down to whether enough evidence was gathered during the investigation to be able to launch a prosecution.

Quote:

Unfortunately most of the prosecutions at that level will be Federal (in the case of the US) and even getting the Feds to pursue a case can be close to impossible without doing most of the foundation work for them. Then, the prosecutors only take cases they have a 95 percent or better chance of winning.

More rubbish. We are co-operating with a number of investigations. Your assertion that prosecutors only take cases they are assured of winning is incorrect. Prosecutions are launched where there is enough evidence to support a conviction.

Quote:

I think your service will be busy for a long time to come though, there are always new players coming into the warez / piracy for profit industry and they do tend to take a very short sighted view on things. This is why the same people will keep coming back even after you manage to kill their payment processing. It's no different than the low level spam for profit field (with a lot of cross over between the participants) but as with most Internet based theft the long term players will more and more often end up being members or organized crime rings from the former USSR, Africa and Asia.

It doesn't matter where an operation is based or what technology it uses or who is behind it. If a piracy site needs to transact in the real world then they are vulnerable to our strategies, likewise if they need to be supported by a method of monetization then they are able to be disrupted.

Quote:

It's sad that the general public will end up killing their own freedoms. As long as so many people feel it's not only OK to not pay for services but for a few to feel they should be able to make money by stealing the work of others outright the end game solution will be a system of controls on the Internet that guarantee accountability. It's really only a matter of time, the ecommerce potential in yearly $ has grown to the critical level and the number of people using it to steal has also grown past the level where it cannot continue.

Just like piracy, IP theft, copying, misappropriation, passing off and brand infringements are all realities of the online age. However just because these problems each present unique challenges does not make what we do a lost cause.

Quote:

Right now the fight is still primarily being carried by content and good producers. Once finance enters the ring you will start to see more effective efforts in prosecutions and the development of controls - be that personal accountability such as tracking technologies or better and better DRM.

In all honestly while I do feel your efforts are needed and a necessary part of the process the industry as a whole would probably be better off investing in DRM technology and doing so on a basis that will keep up w/ the crackers. The model of 12 month release dates cannot compete w/ an opposition that works for free and has no release calendar.

DRM doesn't work, if something can be displayed on a screen it can be copied.

What does work is taking the supply of money away from pirates, taking away their monetization options works, we have proven it works, so now we're scaling up the fight.

I hear all sorts of arguments about why what we're doing is a waste of time, well I am not in a habit of wasting time and what we do does work.

We have seen the shutdown (completely offline) of dozens and dozens of piracy sites. Somewhere in the vicinity of 600 sites have lost one or more forms of payment processing. As we keep the pressure up and get better at what we do we'll simply become quicker and more effective at what we do.

This fight has been going for 126 days, not very long, wait and see what the scoreboard looks like at the 6 and then 12 month marks.

dgraves · 11-02-2012, 12:56 AM

There's no way of stopping theft, the best we can do is limit it. The problem with content theft is there's little to no punishment. Can you imagine how bad shop lifting would be if the only punishment was that the thief had to put the item back? That's pretty much how effective DMCA is. It's a ridiculous game and not only do the thieves steal our content, they also steal our time.

To limit content theft, many different controls have to be put in place including removing the profit for thieves, effective methods of DRM, ways to track the content to the person who uploaded it to a file sharing site, etc...

I wanted to stop offering downloadable content but it might be a little to late for that. Porn buyers are so use to joining sites that offer downloads that I think it would piss off a lot of members.

It's a complex problem that's going to require complex solutions.

6South · 11-02-2012, 07:39 AM

I'd be careful about calling things "rubbish" when you have no clue who I am or for how long I've been involved in this field.

I said repeatedly what your service is doing is necessary and is part of fighting the war, but it's not the end all solution. Even in the best case you will eventually end up with a core group of offenders who will not be reachable by your current tactics.

I've been involved in Federal prosecutions of computer crimes and your assertion that getting prosecutions is 100% is complete bullshit. There are specific circumstances where the Feds will even pursue it, for small time, one-site offenders with no proof of repeated offending you will need to hand them a case on a silver platter to even get past the first FBI / ICE agent. Your best bet would be to provide evidence of tax fraud if you want to motivate anyone and that's based on over a decade of dealing with the situation.

Yes, there are hosts, payment systems, networks and entire parts of the planet where these tactics will not work. I look at this as prohibition era crime fighting, the end result will be to eliminate the small time competition and help make the strongest offenders even stronger.

If your only interest is in painting your service as the end all / be all of anti piracy and ignore advice from real experts then I have to question your motivation and level of knowledge, sorry. That goes for the golden bit of wisdom about DRM, also. People love to toss that little gem around who have no real experience in the full capabilities of secure content. That's not anyone's fault though, up until now none of the entertainment content producers have really implemented it at an effective level, mainly because of the hardware side requirements and being willing to accept the trade off to gain wider compatibility.

This is the real problem w/ fighting piracy I've found. Too many people looking at the short term.

AdultKing · 11-02-2012, 08:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 6South

I'd be careful about calling things "rubbish" when you have no clue who I am or for how long I've been involved in this field.

No we have no clue who you are because until you show your credentials you are just another nameless, faceless critic.

Quote:

I said repeatedly what your service is doing is necessary and is part of fighting the war, but it's not the end all solution. Even in the best case you will eventually end up with a core group of offenders who will not be reachable by your current tactics.

There is no place on this planet where Visa and Mastercard act outside of the law and there is no magic jurisdiction where some form of pressure cannot be brought to bear in one form or another.

The types of sites we go after need a constant turnover of funds to keep operating. In any case where this is true then hitting their ability to monetize deals a huge blow to the viability of the site.

Quote:

I've been involved in Federal prosecutions of computer crimes and your assertion that getting prosecutions is 100% is complete bullshit. There are specific circumstances where the Feds will even pursue it, for small time, one-site offenders with no proof of repeated offending you will need to hand them a case on a silver platter to even get past the first FBI / ICE agent.

Hate to break this to you sport but we operate on the world stage, where we are based all but frivolous reports of crime are investigated. Referrals are often made between Australian law enforcement agencies and US & European law enforcement agencies.

Every case we have referred to law enforcement agencies has thus far resulted in the commencement of an investigation.

Quote:

Yes, there are hosts, payment systems, networks and entire parts of the planet where these tactics will not work. I look at this as prohibition era crime fighting, the end result will be to eliminate the small time competition and help make the strongest offenders even stronger.

It's true there are jurisdictions where there are more challenges than in others, however we go back to the need of commercial piracy operations to monetize. If you take away the money from commercial piracy then it's not commercial piracy anymore.

With 128 days, a handful of volunteers and a relentless pursuit of offenders we have brought pressure to bear on around 600 sites and we haven't even started using many of the methods we have devised for hitting the hip pocket of commercial pirates.

Quote:

If your only interest is in painting your service as the end all / be all of anti piracy and ignore advice from real experts then I have to question your motivation and level of knowledge, sorry.

We have real experts, we have legal teams with specialist capability in IP law, trade, commerce, foreign treaties and finance. We have advice of a couple law enforcement agencies and are building relationships with more.

We'll stick to taking advice from truly qualified persons, not a nameless person on a web forum.

Quote:

That goes for the golden bit of wisdom about DRM, also. People love to toss that little gem around who have no real experience in the full capabilities of secure content. That's not anyone's fault though, up until now none of the entertainment content producers have really implemented it at an effective level, mainly because of the hardware side requirements and being willing to accept the trade off to gain wider compatibility.

Your condescending tone reminds me of some other people who have posted in this thread, they each had their own agenda that was served by trying to derail our work. The simple truth is if you can display content then it can be copied. There is no way around this fact - none. DRM is part of a complex solution, it's not the final solution though.

Quote:

This is the real problem w/ fighting piracy I've found. Too many people looking at the short term.

If you knew anything about us, it's clear that you don't, then you'll know that our strategy is far from short term, we are playing the long game and have inflicted immense damage already with very few resources and a handful of volunteers.

When we're truly established we'll pose an even greater threat to commercial piracy.

dgraves · 11-02-2012, 10:07 AM

It's true that if it's displayed on a screen it can be copied but there are ways to make it more difficult for them. We all know that most thieves are lazy and go after the low hanging fruit.

AK is doing an amazing job and I support anyone dedicated to this effort. I also know that I have to do my part and can't wait around to be saved. Each producer has to take action to protect their own content. Effective laws will have to be passed and who knows when or if that will ever happen.

RegUser · 11-02-2012, 12:10 PM

Wjat is there left to save?
The 1000s of tube sites are full of millions of free videos with thousands of frsh videos being added every day.
Piracy is not only alive but thriving

dgraves · 11-02-2012, 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RegUser

Wjat is there left to save?
The 1000s of tube sites are full of millions of free videos with thousands of frsh videos being added every day.
Piracy is not only alive but thriving

There's still plenty of money to be made in porn. It's not like the thieves have a great business model. They're unethical to begin with so most of those sites are full of pop-ups, pop-unders, floating ads, viruses, malware, spam, etc. which piss a lot of people off. It's obvious that they have to force products down the surfer's throats. I see that as a sign of desperation.

I talked about this on my member's area forum and many of my members admit finding my site from tubes and file sharing sites. They joined my site because of the issues I mentioned above.

I believe many of those sites will eventually destroy themselves.

Paul Markham · 11-02-2012, 01:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RegUser

Wjat is there left to save?
The 1000s of tube sites are full of millions of free videos with thousands of frsh videos being added every day.
Piracy is not only alive but thriving

True. but it will please the Film, music, programming, Games industries. When they pick up this fight with their money. It will get 10 times better than what AK is doing.

vollenweider · 11-02-2012, 01:40 PM

Hello AdultKing,
I am Simon, we have had few conversation over icq but its been for a while since last time i saw you online so i bet i am on your shit list. Since this is a public forum, i would like to state what i had discussed with you previously regarding piracy.

I remember you saying the main goal of your project is to fight against piracy, and you have targeted the file lockers first for your reasons which i don't even care about. Reading some of the comments in this topic makes me believe that your job is effective while some of them aren't that much clear. If you remember, my question was that why don't you go after torrent sites at the same time since they are worse than file hosting sites offering FREE access to all the materials. A simple example is the following website:

rarbg.com/torrents.php?category=4

I can guarantee that you can find every single porn video/movie released on this site for free. The interesting point here is you denying to get involved with torrent websites where the amount of illegal material is simply uncountable while we see you saying that your main goal is "Fighting against the sharing of pirated and illegal content".

So lets go back to the original question, do you believe only file lockers are the headache and responsible for piracy or should we take a look at torrents too?

Thanks

dgraves · 11-02-2012, 02:52 PM

I'm getting ready to send out a DMCA to RapidShare and was wondering if anyone had the best email addresses for Visa, Master Card and American Express so I can cc them as well.

johnnyloadproductions · 11-02-2012, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dgraves

I'm getting ready to send out a DMCA to RapidShare and was wondering if anyone had the best email addresses for Visa, Master Card and American Express so I can cc them as well.

Rapidshare seems to let several things linger on their servers for a very long time.

dgraves · 11-02-2012, 03:26 PM

I've noticed that as well and that's why I like to "cc" everyone in the chain.

6South · 11-02-2012, 03:41 PM

I said "prosecutions", not "investigations". I can fill out a web form and get an investigation number from ICE. How many actual prosecutions has your system generated?

I've been an information architect designing secure content systems for governments and military clients for well over a decade. I promise you there are existing DRM technologies that do work and defeat all capture methods even videotaping a monitor if it comes to that.

The hold up on wide spread use has been a combination of limitations imposed by classified status and the need for computer hardware to cycle through the market. The older versions of this are becoming available outside of military and government markets now but even those beat anything you've seen in the commercial sphere by miles. Nothing has prevented the entertainment industry from developing the same capabilities other than misinformation and an industry mind set based on outdated methods. (Like spending millions to buy lawmakers vs. developing other solutions).

There are plenty of alternate payment methods already popular w/ the piracy crowd and there will be more. The conversion to spendable cash is easy and they can obtain everything they need including servers without ever needing a credit card.

Keep up the good work though, someone needs to do it and I do applaud the change in tactics to going after the payment processor accounts. I completely disagree that it solves everything, however.

I stand by my position that while it's necessary to keep the small fish under control the big players such as the organized crime rings will only grow stronger. You won't change the law enforcement picture in some of those places for at least another 10-20 years if that soon.

dgraves · 11-02-2012, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 6South

I promise you there are existing DRM technologies that do work and defeat all capture methods even videotaping a monitor if it comes to that.

Is that technology available?

AdultKing · 11-02-2012, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 6South

I said "prosecutions", not "investigations". I can fill out a web form and get an investigation number from ICE. How many actual prosecutions has your system generated?

You keep talking about ICE, FBI completely ignoring that fact that these are not the only federal law enforcement bodies in existence on this planet. We are working closely with several national government law enforcement bodies and I am confident that prosecutions shall be brought against individuals and companies.

Quote:

I've been an information architect designing secure content systems for governments and military clients for well over a decade. I promise you there are existing DRM technologies that do work and defeat all capture methods even videotaping a monitor if it comes to that.

At what cost and disadvantage to the consumer ?

Quote:

The hold up on wide spread use has been a combination of limitations imposed by classified status and the need for computer hardware to cycle through the market. The older versions of this are becoming available outside of military and government markets now but even those beat anything you've seen in the commercial sphere by miles. Nothing has prevented the entertainment industry from developing the same capabilities other than misinformation and an industry mind set based on outdated methods. (Like spending millions to buy lawmakers vs. developing other solutions).

I've heard the spending millions to buy lawmakers argument from the piracy sector, you have <40 posts, nobody knows you, no credentials, we don't know who you are so what you're saying is without any credibility until you back up your self professed credentials.

There are many additional issues in relation to enforcement of IP that go way outside the scope of DRM. Passing off, misuse of brands, misuse of trademarks are just a few, how does DRM solve these ? It doesn't.

I believe that the best way to hurt the pirates is by prosecuting them and taking their money, internet connectivity and monetization methods away - disincentivise them.

Quote:

There are plenty of alternate payment methods already popular w/ the piracy crowd and there will be more. The conversion to spendable cash is easy and they can obtain everything they need including servers without ever needing a credit card.

Name them.

There are 3rd party processors acting way outside Visa and Mastercard regulations and we will be dealing with them. There are 3rd party processors acting outside applicable laws in the countries in which they operate, we'll be dealing with them too. For the others we will be working to cut off the ability to transact across different payment methods.

Quote:

Keep up the good work though, someone needs to do it and I do applaud the change in tactics to going after the payment processor accounts. I completely disagree that it solves everything, however.

As I have already stated we have other strategies ready to play out, we're not going to announce them here, you'll have to watch and see.

Quote:

I stand by my position that while it's necessary to keep the small fish under control the big players such as the organized crime rings will only grow stronger. You won't change the law enforcement picture in some of those places for at least another 10-20 years if that soon.

I think you underestimate the ability of existing legislation to curb these activities on a global scale, until now few have been prepared to leverage all of the available attack vectors against piracy - we intend to change all of that and thus far we've been pretty successful.

Nautilus · 11-02-2012, 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dgraves

I'm getting ready to send out a DMCA to RapidShare and was wondering if anyone had the best email addresses for Visa, Master Card and American Express so I can cc them as well.

No VISA please for this one, for all hosts that are still using Paypal, send DMCAs to infringementreport(at)paypal.com. Or better yet use Paypal's own pdf form to submit your infringement report, they tend to pay more attention to reports submitted using their own form, it can be found here:

https://cms.paypal.com/is/cgi-bin/?c...gementRpt_full

Please ONLY cc your DMCAs to infringements(at)copycontrol.org - AK will cc them to all other relevant third parties including the ones mentioned by you in a weekly report. More cc-s will achieve nothing but to annoy them. It is a general rule to select only ONE third party service provider to send your DMCA to, the one that is getting targetted and where the chances of success are the biggest. When you cc it to several third parties someone will get on it faster and the others will get annoyed that you're sending them dead links. You need to select only one and to let them handle removals from start to finish. Let AK to handle the cc-ing part and making all other 3rd parties involved aware that their service is being used for infringement. Take one and make them fully responsible for processing of your take down request. In case of Rapidshare, that is Paypal.

Some of the hosts that are still using Paypal: Rapidshare.com, Hotfile.com, Crocko.com, Slingfile.com, Fileflyer.com, Speedyshare.com. Whenever you have links for any of them, or any other hosts that are using Paypal, send DMCAs to infringementreport(at)paypal.com (and cc them to infringements(at)copycontrol.org of course).

dgraves · 11-02-2012, 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nautilus

No VISA please for this one, for all hosts that are still using Paypal, send DMCAs to infringementreport(at)paypal.com. Or better yet use Paypal's own pdf form to submit your infringement report, they tend to pay more attention to reports submitted using their own form, it can be found here:

https://cms.paypal.com/is/cgi-bin/?c...gementRpt_full

Please ONLY cc your DMCAs to infringements(at)copycontrol.org - AK will cc them to all other relevant third parties including the ones mentioned by you in a weekly report. More cc-s will achieve nothing but to annoy them. It is a general rule to select only ONE third party service provider to send your DMCA to, the one that is getting targetted and where the chances of success are the biggest. When you cc it to several third parties someone will get on it faster and the others will get annoyed that you're sending them dead links. You need to select only one and to let them handle removals from start to finish. Let AK to handle the cc-ing part and making all other 3rd parties involved aware that their service is being used for infringement. Take one and make them fully responsible for processing of your take down request. In case of Rapidshare, that is Paypal.

Some of the hosts that are still using Paypal: Rapidshare.com, Hotfile.com, Crocko.com, Slingfile.com, Fileflyer.com, Speedyshare.com. Whenever you have links for any of them, or any other hosts that are using Paypal, send DMCAs to infringementreport(at)paypal.com (and cc them to infringements(at)copycontrol.org of course).

The last time I cc'd PayPal on a DMCA, they cancelled all my accounts. I guess that's one way of dealing with DMCA. After all, who's making them more money?

Nautilus · 11-02-2012, 04:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dgraves

The last time I cc'd PayPal on a DMCA, they cancelled all my accounts. I guess that's one way of dealing with DMCA. After all, who's making them more money?

I'm not sure what you're talking about.

halfpint · 11-02-2012, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nautilus

No VISA please for this one

Why dont you want DMCA's sent to Visa ? Thats where I would send it if it were me dealing with RapidShare Once they loose Visa they would be pretty much fucked

dgraves · 11-02-2012, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nautilus

I'm not sure what you're talking about.

I cc'd PayPal on a DMCA that I sent out and a few days later I got a reply letting me know my accounts have been "Limited" which basically means I couldn't use them. They didn't give me a specific reason, just a list of a million possibilities for the "Limit".

When I disputed it, they said my account was tied to adult sites. I don't use PayPal to sell porn so I drew my own conclusion. It was the old school "I'll give you something to complain about" method.

dgraves · 11-02-2012, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by halfpint

Why dont you want DMCA's sent to Visa ? Thats where I would send it if it were me dealing with RapidShare Once they loose Visa they would be pretty much fucked

Good question. I saw PayPal, VISA, Master Card and America Express listed as processors. Does VISA get a pass on this one?

Triple-A · 11-02-2012, 04:53 PM

http://www.debrauw.com/News/LegalAle...tober2012.aspx

interesting link for those hosting in Holland the shitty companies and filelockers...
maybe worth showing this link where necessary!

Nautilus · 11-02-2012, 05:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dgraves

I cc'd PayPal on a DMCA that I sent out and a few days later I got a reply letting me know my accounts have been "Limited" which basically means I couldn't use them. They didn't give me a specific reason, just a list of a million possibilities for the "Limit".

When I disputed it, they said my account was tied to adult sites. I don't use PayPal to sell porn so I drew my own conclusion. It was the old school "I'll give you something to complain about" method.

I understand your frustration, however, here is the reality - DMCAing VISA for hosts that are using Paypal is pointless. VISA is not going to disconnect Paypal because of your DMCA, or because of a million of DMCAs for that matter, they're too big for that. Not that we want them disconnected anyway, Paypal is cooperating just fine, you just need to use the proper reporting channels with them.

Be realistic - VISA will simply trash your report, they're not going to bother with it. To get their attention we need a TON of DMCAs to show the consistent pattern of infringements and on top of it a follow up from AK. Otherwise it's simply a waste of time. There are only two types of cases where DMCAing VISA is appropriate:

1. If a file locker is using their own merchant account.
2. If a file locker is using a rogue billing company which will not disconnect them no matter the amount of DMCAs they get from rights holders.

DMCAs should be sent strategically, with the aim to disconnect a file locker on the ground of repeat copyright infringement. Or to terminate a rogue billing company. You send them where the chances of termination are the best at the moment - when a file locker is using Paypal, Paypal is your best chance. Paypal is NOT rogue billing company (at least not copyright infringement wise), they WILL terminate a file locker if they get enough DMCAs - but, of course, the bigger the site, the more DMCAs they need. For Rapidshare, obviously, they still need more.

Only when Rapidshare's Paypal account is killed, and when they will switch to processing through their own merchant account, only then DMCAing VISA will become somewhat of a realistic possibility.

You may DMCA VISA of course for Rapidshare links if that is your choice, however you're not going to put even a dent in Rapidshare if you do that. But, if you'll send your DMCA to Paypal, you'll add them one more strike on file and bring them one more small step toward termination. Of course termination by Paypal is not the final death of a file locker, especially when it is big like Rapidshare. But it's a step.

Don't let your personal grudges with Paypal stand in the way of killing off file lockers. DMCA Paypal, cc to Copycontrol, and let AK handle reports to all other 3rd parties including VISA. That approach works best in the long term.

Nautilus · 11-02-2012, 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by halfpint

Why dont you want DMCA's sent to Visa ? Thats where I would send it if it were me dealing with RapidShare Once they loose Visa they would be pretty much fucked

They will not lose VISA when they're still using Paypal as a 3rd party payments processor. VISA will not nuke Paypal only to have Rapidshare account killed. They can do that for some smaller rogue billing company, but obviously not for Paypal. In theory, they can tell Paypal to drop Rapidshare, but in practice it is highly unlikely that they're going to interfere with Paypal over that issue at all. And that is absolutely not necessary - Paypal is not rogue billing company, they do have repeat infringer policy and do terminate file lockers. Unless you've been living in a cave for the past 4 or so months, you'd have known that by now. But they need DMCAs to trigger their repeat offender policy. The bigger the site, the more DMCAs they need.

dgraves · 11-02-2012, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nautilus

I understand your frustration, however, here is the reality - DMCAing VISA for hosts that are using Paypal is pointless. VISA is not going to disconnect Paypal because of your DMCA, or because of a million of DMCAs for that matter, they're too big for that. Not that we want them disconnected anyway, Paypal is cooperating just fine, you just need to use the proper reporting channels with them.

Be realistic - VISA will simply trash your report, they're not going to bother with it. To get their attention we need a TON of DMCAs to show the consistent pattern of infringements and on top of it a follow up from AK. Otherwise it's simply a waste of time. There are only two types of cases where DMCAing VISA is appropriate:

1. If a file locker is using their own merchant account.
2. If a file locker is using a rogue billing company which will not disconnect them no matter the amount of DMCAs they get from rights holders.

DMCAs should be sent strategically, with the aim to disconnect a file locker on the ground of repeat copyright infringement. Or to terminate a rogue billing company. You send them where the chances of termination are the best at the moment - when a file locker is using Paypal, Paypal is your best chance. Paypal is NOT rogue billing company (at least not copyright infringement wise), they WILL terminate a file locker if they get enough DMCAs - but, of course, the bigger the site, the more DMCAs they need. For Rapidshare, obviously, they still need more.

Only when Rapidshare's Paypal account is killed, and when they will switch to processing through their own merchant account, only then DMCAing VISA will become somewhat of a realistic possibility.

You may DMCA VISA of course for Rapidshare links if that is your choice, however you're not going to put even a dent in Rapidshare if you do that. But, if you'll send your DMCA to Paypal, you'll add them one more strike on file and bring them one more small step toward termination. Of course termination by Paypal is not the final death of a file locker, especially when it is big like Rapidshare. But it's a step.

Don't let your personal grudges with Paypal stand in the way of killing off file lockers. DMCA Paypal, cc to Copycontrol, and let AK handle reports to all other 3rd parties including VISA. That approach works best in the long term.

There's no extra work adding them to the cc field but I get where you're coming from.

It seems to me that an army of people sending in DMCA's would be more effective than all coming from one source. It's kind of like getting many complaints from one customer as opposed to getting that same complaint from many customers.

It might be David against Goliath but at least it's some action and that's better than no action.

I think we need to hire some gays to help out with this fight. They seem to be pretty good at it.

AdultKing · 11-02-2012, 06:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dgraves

I cc'd PayPal on a DMCA that I sent out and a few days later I got a reply letting me know my accounts have been "Limited" which basically means I couldn't use them. They didn't give me a specific reason, just a list of a million possibilities for the "Limit".

I find this odd, Paypal does not do business like this, there must be some other reason for your limitation. Paypal take infringement reports seriously however in some cases there needs to be a significant number of them for Paypal to take action.

Quote:

Originally Posted by halfpint

Why dont you want DMCA's sent to Visa ? Thats where I would send it if it were me dealing with RapidShare Once they loose Visa they would be pretty much fucked

You can send DMCA's to Visa however it's important to cc them to [email protected] as we are able to present a much better and broader case to them with a significant database of infringement.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RegUser

Wjat is there left to save?
The 1000s of tube sites are full of millions of free videos with thousands of frsh videos being added every day.
Piracy is not only alive but thriving

When we get enough funding to expand this effort we shall expand this effort, for now we're concentrating on File Lockers.

Quote:

Originally Posted by vollenweider

Hello AdultKing,
I am Simon, we have had few conversation over icq but its been for a while since last time i saw you online so i bet i am on your shit list. Since this is a public forum, i would like to state what i had discussed with you previously regarding piracy.

No you're not on my shitlist. I am rarely on ICQ and do not have time to speak to every person individually, especially over recent times where I have been travelling.

Quote:

I remember you saying the main goal of your project is to fight against piracy, and you have targeted the file lockers first for your reasons which i don't even care about. Reading some of the comments in this topic makes me believe that your job is effective while some of them aren't that much clear. If you remember, my question was that why don't you go after torrent sites at the same time since they are worse than file hosting sites offering FREE access to all the materials. A simple example is the following website:

As I have explained to you countless times, we are working on file lockers, we do not have the resources yet to expand this effort, if you want to contribute the resources to provide the manpower and legal backup required to expand this effort then read this post here for how you can help.

Quote:

So lets go back to the original question, do you believe only file lockers are the headache and responsible for piracy or should we take a look at torrents too?

As of today there is $862.80 in our current account and $2310.00 in our business payments account. On Monday an Invoice for $2036.41 falls due. We have legal fees falling due next week also.

My question to you is, what are you doing to help us keep going ?

Our resources are extremely limited, we cannot expand beyond what we're doing until we have more resources.

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnnyloadproductions

Rapidshare seems to let several things linger on their servers for a very long time.

We're steadily building a case against RapidShare, these things take time however.

dgraves · 11-02-2012, 06:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdultKing

I find this odd, Paypal does not do business like this, there must be some other reason for your limitation. Paypal take infringement reports seriously however in some cases there needs to be a significant number of them for Paypal to take action.

I didn't expect that either but it was a pain in the ass to get it opened again.

Paul Markham · 11-03-2012, 03:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dgraves

I didn't expect that either but it was a pain in the ass to get it opened again.

Telling Paypal someone is stealing your porn content, isn't the wisest thing to do.

Sorry to criticise you but it's kind of like saying "I use Paypal to process porn"

AdultKing · 11-03-2012, 03:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Telling Paypal someone is stealing your porn content, isn't the wisest thing to do.

Sorry to criticise you but it's kind of like saying "I use Paypal to process porn"

No, it's not.

Paypal deal with these matters professionally. If people get their accounts limited there is usually a good reason, if there isn't then there are processes in place to appeal the decision.

Paul Markham · 11-03-2012, 04:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdultKing

No, it's not.

Paypal deal with these matters professionally. If people get their accounts limited there is usually a good reason, if there isn't then there are processes in place to appeal the decision.

So we can send them a DMCA linking our our email we use on Paypal to our porn.

I'm saying be bloody careful how you DMCA them.

AdultKing · 11-03-2012, 04:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

So we can send them a DMCA linking our our email we use on Paypal to our porn.

I'm saying be bloody careful how you DMCA them.

One of the things I find annoying about this project is the large amount of misinformation people spread which is based on hearsay and urban legend.

Firstly, there is ABSOLUTELY NO DANGER in providing Paypal an infringement report of any legal content, porn or otherwise. Accounts are limited for a reason and I know for a fact that Paypal will not go limiting peoples accounts because they file an IR process report.

Secondly, anyone sending DMCA notices to Paypal should STOP doing so.

Paypal have a clearly established Infringement Report process. It is necessary to follow that process to have an infringement recorded and acted upon by Paypal.

You can get a copy of the Paypal IR process form here:

http://copycontrol.org/forms/paypali...mentreport.pdf

Sending this form with any attachments necesssary is the ONLY way to file reports with Paypal.

I would like to remind people how important it is to copy DMCA and Infringement reports to [email protected] - many more people complain about piracy here than actually bother to do this.

vollenweider · 11-03-2012, 08:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdultKing

My question to you is, what are you doing to help us keep going ?

Ok as i said before, i am particularly interested in torrents. I can't believe that piracy stops/slows down with your file lockers project therefore i would help and donate as soon as i see that your interest is PIRACY in general and not file lockers/hosters.

If you are sure about your methodologies and are indeed effective, please show me that you can go against at least rarbg.com and stop them from publishing all those materials and i will make sure to support your project whether its called "stop file lockers" or "pimp my ride".

Waiting to see your comments on this.
Thanks

johnnyloadproductions · 11-03-2012, 08:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vollenweider

Ok as i said before, i am particularly interested in torrents. I can't believe that piracy stops/slows down with your file lockers project therefore i would help and donate as soon as i see that your interest is PIRACY in general and not file lockers/hosters.

If you are sure about your methodologies and are indeed effective, please show me that you can go against at least rarbg.com and stop them from publishing all those materials and i will make sure to support your project whether its called "stop file lockers" or "pimp my ride".

Waiting to see your comments on this.
Thanks

Considering that I'm quoting you at your post count of 2 with your radical opinion, you essentially have 0 credibility or value in what you think.

I'm fairly certain you're just another upload monkey coming over here to cause trouble or just using another nick and have an agenda. Why else would you start posting in here with your first post counts?

6South · 11-03-2012, 08:43 AM

A high post count really doesn't impress me or tell me what a great person / professional someone is. It tells me they spend a shitload of time on a forum, basically.

I'll try to summarize the entire problem w/ the current approach to content protection / anti piracy w/ a simple analogy. It's not perfect but that's why it's called an analogy instead of an example...

The current approach by content producers / owners to fighting piracy is the equivalent of a bank that stores all its money in the parking lot.

Then, when people come by and steal it they say the solution is to try and make stealing "more illegal".

While it's working out great for certain business models on both sides of the issue and helping people who want to further a "police state" / "1984" society in the long term it's doomed to fail.

johnnyloadproductions · 11-03-2012, 08:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 6South

A high post count really doesn't impress me or tell me what a great person / professional someone is. It tells me they spend a shitload of time on a forum, basically.

I'll try to summarize the entire problem w/ the current approach to content protection / anti piracy w/ a simple analogy. It's not perfect but that's why it's called an analogy instead of an example...

The current approach by content producers / owners to fighting piracy is the equivalent of a bank that stores all its money in the parking lot.

Then, when people come by and steal it they say the solution is to try and make stealing "more illegal".

While it's working out great for certain business models on both sides of the issue and helping people who want to further a "police state" / "1984" society in the long term it's doomed to fail.

It's easy to bitch, doing something requires an order of magnitude more of effort.
Why are you wasting your small amount of post counts on such a cause you deem worthless? Sounds like you have priority issues, either that or this is a fake nick you proxy into (makes you a coward).

MakingItPay · 11-03-2012, 09:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 6South

A high post count really doesn't impress me or tell me what a great person / professional someone is. It tells me they spend a shitload of time on a forum, basically.

I'll try to summarize the entire problem w/ the current approach to content protection / anti piracy w/ a simple analogy. It's not perfect but that's why it's called an analogy instead of an example...

The current approach by content producers / owners to fighting piracy is the equivalent of a bank that stores all its money in the parking lot.

Then, when people come by and steal it they say the solution is to try and make stealing "more illegal".

While it's working out great for certain business models on both sides of the issue and helping people who want to further a "police state" / "1984" society in the long term it's doomed to fail.

I am not sure I see the analogy. More illegal is not what we want. We want enforcement of existing laws against stealing and profiting from our work. We want businesses like Visa, Paypal, and others to stop turning a blind eye to this theft. It seems as thought with AK's work, this is beginning to happen. I like the idea of DRM that stops theft including monitor recording. I would buy that all day long! If someone steals my work, posts it on youtube, I DMCA it, youtube tells the thief who I am, but doesn't tell me who he is. It is backwards, and we need to turn it around IMO.

AdultKing · 11-03-2012, 09:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vollenweider

Ok as i said before, i am particularly interested in torrents. I can't believe that piracy stops/slows down with your file lockers project therefore i would help and donate as soon as i see that your interest is PIRACY in general and not file lockers/hosters.

You're a broken record.

Our current project is Stop File Lockers, that's what we're working on.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 6South

The current approach by content producers / owners to fighting piracy is the equivalent of a bank that stores all its money in the parking lot.

Then, when people come by and steal it they say the solution is to try and make stealing "more illegal".

While it's working out great for certain business models on both sides of the issue and helping people who want to further a "police state" / "1984" society in the long term it's doomed to fail.

Ah yes, these are all chestnuts of the pro-piracy camp. Simple fact is in law I can leave my front and back door open, it's still illegal for you to come inside and take my TV.

Nobody is making anything "more illegal" they're just now proactively enforcing the law.

As for post counts, the low post count pro piracy sympathisers who have posted in this thread all have a characteristic that you share.

notinmybackyard · 11-03-2012, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 6South

While it's working out great for certain business models on both sides of the issue and helping people who want to further a "police state" / "1984" society in the long term it's doomed to fail.

First of all let me say that I have a low post count, I am recent to this forum, english is not my first language and I am a nobody... And I do not expect to be treated as anything else other than a nobody. If there is a possiblity of doing business and making money then I will take off my nobody hat and put on my sombody hat but not before that moment presents itself. I ask for nothing and I seek nothing

// political tirad on

This lie about a "police state" gets brought up every single time anyone tries to tackle piracy. Google funds millions porpogating this myth because searches for pirated content is almost 40% of their traffic (source forbes)

Youtube (google) propogates the myth because let us face it. No one is interested at all in some idiot's vacation videos. It is the films, television shows and music videos that keep people visiting youtube. ((( And if anyone believes the myth of viral videos understand that it is just "google directed" traffic. It works like a lottery, if someone youtube employee likes your video, he sends it a lot of traffic)))

Facebook propogates it because stolen content is also part of their business model. Let us face it, unless it is a photo of someone young girl posting flirty pictures... Facebook becomes really flat. Therefore they need photos, etc made by professionals and posted by so called « fans » or « lovers » of the image in order to keep people coming back. Again no one is interested in someone's vacation to disney world.

Pinterest... linkedin... etc etc. Their entire business model is other people's hard work and content. Therefore the moment anyone threatens that model they rile up the « no-life-always-on-line-junkies » and tell them their freedom is threaten.

And it is complete bullshit !!!

Freedom existed before the Internet AND IN FACT it seems to me there was a hell of a lot more freedom going around before all this crazyness started.

I will tell you what is killing freedom.

1) It is the « fact-fuck-no-life » that sits on Facebook 24 hours a day searching for a pice of ass or a free cyber jerk off session that gets bored and starts downloading films to pass his time between pokes. If he just got off his fat ass and went to a park and said « hello » to a girl, he would loose weight and probably end up doing something other than his hand. This « fat-fuck-no-life » does nothing online worth protecting and he will not get off his dumb ass unless it is to protect his source of free downloads. And the « no-life-internet-junkie » is mega dumb! For exemple look at the Occupy mouvement, a bunch of Internet-junkies that took over parks and started blogging and trying to Facebook like social change and end gouvernement corruption.

2) Big United States corporation are kiling freedom. (Sorry for any anti-americain sentement that may be expressed.. I am not doing it on purpose).

* Look at Apple, they use slave labour in China to build the « no-life's dream » of a a Star Trek future. Giving up what little money they have and killing jobs and the local economy
*Look at Google and how they are seeking to control the flow of all information and dialog in the world. (just look at the people crying over their website's ranks if you think I am wrong on this)
* Look at the corporation of the Department of Defense (D.O.D) that invented GPS. You can not go anywhere in the world now without them knowing where you are if you have one of these devices.

I could make a list that spans pages but each time you see the same formula over and over again. It is a version of George Orwell's 1984 being played out. Ignorance is strength.. Strength that flows from the dummies for the gouvernements and the corporations. So since you are concerned about freedom.. I will tell you how to stop the police state from happening.

Just switch off the consumer electronics.

Learn to read a map... Learn to talk to someone face to face... learn how to get laid without using your own hand and a tube site.

Because freedom is stepping out into the sunshine and ignoring the monsters trying to distract you from getting a tan.

// Political tirad off

In the mean time the « no-life-internet-junkies » threaten my honest business model based on hard work, skill and respect. You should learn that freedom is not something that can be downloaded. However hardwork, skill and respect for yourself and others are the allies of freedom and in abudance in a free society. Therefore I support all and any efforts to stop them. Including Adult King's file locker efforts.

DWB · 11-03-2012, 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vollenweider

Ok as i said before, i am particularly interested in torrents. I can't believe that piracy stops/slows down with your file lockers project therefore i would help and donate as soon as i see that your interest is PIRACY in general and not file lockers/hosters.

If you are sure about your methodologies and are indeed effective, please show me that you can go against at least rarbg.com and stop them from publishing all those materials and i will make sure to support your project whether its called "stop file lockers" or "pimp my ride".

Waiting to see your comments on this.
Thanks

Oh great, another one.

dgraves · 11-03-2012, 10:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Telling Paypal someone is stealing your porn content, isn't the wisest thing to do.

Sorry to criticise you but it's kind of like saying "I use Paypal to process porn"

It seems like I was guilty by association. Nothing else happened to provoke that and they couldn't give me a solid reason why they put a limit on my account.

Anyway, it's not a big deal because we resolved the issue. I just don't want to send them DMCA's because I need that account to pay for stuff like site design work.

AdultKing · 11-03-2012, 10:49 AM

After months of discussions and ongoing pressure including the risk to Avangate of losing relationships important to it's ongoing business we saw Avangate finally remove payment processing from a large batch of file hosts. However the process is not complete and we shall be placing Avangate under pressure to drop all IP infringing merchants.

http://stopfilelockers.com/avangate-...nt-processing/

18 Sites have lost payment processing through Avangate, more will follow.

Bitshare.com
Cepzo.com
Extabit.com
Filefactory.com
Filefolks.com
Filerio.in
Filestay.com
Freakshare.com
Luckyshare.net
Lumfile.com
Megaload.it
Novafile.com
Oteupload.com
Prefiles.com
Ryushare.com
Sharedbit.net
Upfile.biz
Upsto.re

Thanks to the whole Copy Control team for the months of hard work on this issue.

Tjeezers · 11-03-2012, 10:53 AM

Someone clicked my sig, it`s not fair!!

SKUP · 11-03-2012, 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdultKing

After months of discussions and ongoing pressure including the risk to Avangate of losing relationships important to it's ongoing business we saw Avangate finally remove payment processing from a large batch of file hosts. However the process is not complete and we shall be placing Avangate under pressure to drop all IP infringing merchants.

http://stopfilelockers.com/avangate-...nt-processing/

18 Sites have lost payment processing through Avangate, more will follow.

Bitshare.com
Cepzo.com
Extabit.com
Filefactory.com
Filefolks.com
Filerio.in
Filestay.com
Freakshare.com
Luckyshare.net
Lumfile.com
Megaload.it
Novafile.com
Oteupload.com
Prefiles.com
Ryushare.com
Sharedbit.net
Upfile.biz
Upsto.re

Thanks to the whole Copy Control team for the months of hard work on this issue.

WOW, cool, congrats.

DWB · 11-03-2012, 11:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdultKing

After months of discussions and ongoing pressure including the risk to Avangate of losing relationships important to it's ongoing business we saw Avangate finally remove payment processing from a large batch of file hosts. However the process is not complete and we shall be placing Avangate under pressure to drop all IP infringing merchants.

http://stopfilelockers.com/avangate-...nt-processing/

18 Sites have lost payment processing through Avangate, more will follow.

Bitshare.com
Cepzo.com
Extabit.com
Filefactory.com
Filefolks.com
Filerio.in
Filestay.com
Freakshare.com
Luckyshare.net
Lumfile.com
Megaload.it
Novafile.com
Oteupload.com
Prefiles.com
Ryushare.com
Sharedbit.net
Upfile.biz
Upsto.re

Thanks to the whole Copy Control team for the months of hard work on this issue.

Fantastic news!!!

Nautilus · 11-03-2012, 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdultKing

After months of discussions and ongoing pressure including the risk to Avangate of losing relationships important to it's ongoing business we saw Avangate finally remove payment processing from a large batch of file hosts. However the process is not complete and we shall be placing Avangate under pressure to drop all IP infringing merchants.

http://stopfilelockers.com/avangate-...nt-processing/

Great statement

11-02-2012, 12:22 AM	#3755
6South Registered User Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 84	While I support your efforts and would agree it is a necessary endeavor I'm curious if you've thought about the long term outcome? What will eventually happen is the typical internet evolution. The most dedicated criminals will just move to more protected hosting and payment systems who will not cooperate like bitcoin, etc. I think eventually you will need to move into collecting intelligence on support for the various illegal activities that tend to actually get a reaction - such as the child porn support service providing and basically perform the investigative work for law enforcement so they 1, obtain intelligence they don't have the time or budget to pursue themselves and 2, can see the possibility of winning cases. Unfortunately most of the prosecutions at that level will be Federal (in the case of the US) and even getting the Feds to pursue a case can be close to impossible without doing most of the foundation work for them. Then, the prosecutors only take cases they have a 95 percent or better chance of winning. I think your service will be busy for a long time to come though, there are always new players coming into the warez / piracy for profit industry and they do tend to take a very short sighted view on things. This is why the same people will keep coming back even after you manage to kill their payment processing. It's no different than the low level spam for profit field (with a lot of cross over between the participants) but as with most Internet based theft the long term players will more and more often end up being members or organized crime rings from the former USSR, Africa and Asia. It's sad that the general public will end up killing their own freedoms. As long as so many people feel it's not only OK to not pay for services but for a few to feel they should be able to make money by stealing the work of others outright the end game solution will be a system of controls on the Internet that guarantee accountability. It's really only a matter of time, the ecommerce potential in yearly $ has grown to the critical level and the number of people using it to steal has also grown past the level where it cannot continue. Right now the fight is still primarily being carried by content and good producers. Once finance enters the ring you will start to see more effective efforts in prosecutions and the development of controls - be that personal accountability such as tracking technologies or better and better DRM. In all honestly while I do feel your efforts are needed and a necessary part of the process the industry as a whole would probably be better off investing in DRM technology and doing so on a basis that will keep up w/ the crackers. The model of 12 month release dates cannot compete w/ an opposition that works for free and has no release calendar. __________________ -= Software / Systems Architect and Server Geek =-

11-02-2012, 12:56 AM	#3757
dgraves Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Scottsdale Posts: 2,283	There's no way of stopping theft, the best we can do is limit it. The problem with content theft is there's little to no punishment. Can you imagine how bad shop lifting would be if the only punishment was that the thief had to put the item back? That's pretty much how effective DMCA is. It's a ridiculous game and not only do the thieves steal our content, they also steal our time. To limit content theft, many different controls have to be put in place including removing the profit for thieves, effective methods of DRM, ways to track the content to the person who uploaded it to a file sharing site, etc... I wanted to stop offering downloadable content but it might be a little to late for that. Porn buyers are so use to joining sites that offer downloads that I think it would piss off a lot of members. It's a complex problem that's going to require complex solutions. __________________ Gloryhole Swallow \| Cumpsters \| Spy Tug \| Cum Clinic \| Chica's Place

11-02-2012, 07:39 AM	#3758
6South Registered User Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 84	I'd be careful about calling things "rubbish" when you have no clue who I am or for how long I've been involved in this field. I said repeatedly what your service is doing is necessary and is part of fighting the war, but it's not the end all solution. Even in the best case you will eventually end up with a core group of offenders who will not be reachable by your current tactics. I've been involved in Federal prosecutions of computer crimes and your assertion that getting prosecutions is 100% is complete bullshit. There are specific circumstances where the Feds will even pursue it, for small time, one-site offenders with no proof of repeated offending you will need to hand them a case on a silver platter to even get past the first FBI / ICE agent. Your best bet would be to provide evidence of tax fraud if you want to motivate anyone and that's based on over a decade of dealing with the situation. Yes, there are hosts, payment systems, networks and entire parts of the planet where these tactics will not work. I look at this as prohibition era crime fighting, the end result will be to eliminate the small time competition and help make the strongest offenders even stronger. If your only interest is in painting your service as the end all / be all of anti piracy and ignore advice from real experts then I have to question your motivation and level of knowledge, sorry. That goes for the golden bit of wisdom about DRM, also. People love to toss that little gem around who have no real experience in the full capabilities of secure content. That's not anyone's fault though, up until now none of the entertainment content producers have really implemented it at an effective level, mainly because of the hardware side requirements and being willing to accept the trade off to gain wider compatibility. This is the real problem w/ fighting piracy I've found. Too many people looking at the short term. __________________ -= Software / Systems Architect and Server Geek =- Last edited by 6South; 11-02-2012 at 07:42 AM..

11-02-2012, 10:07 AM	#3760
dgraves Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Scottsdale Posts: 2,283	It's true that if it's displayed on a screen it can be copied but there are ways to make it more difficult for them. We all know that most thieves are lazy and go after the low hanging fruit. AK is doing an amazing job and I support anyone dedicated to this effort. I also know that I have to do my part and can't wait around to be saved. Each producer has to take action to protect their own content. Effective laws will have to be passed and who knows when or if that will ever happen. __________________ Gloryhole Swallow \| Cumpsters \| Spy Tug \| Cum Clinic \| Chica's Place

11-02-2012, 02:52 PM	#3765
dgraves Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Scottsdale Posts: 2,283	I'm getting ready to send out a DMCA to RapidShare and was wondering if anyone had the best email addresses for Visa, Master Card and American Express so I can cc them as well. __________________ Gloryhole Swallow \| Cumpsters \| Spy Tug \| Cum Clinic \| Chica's Place

11-01-2012, 07:17 AM	#3751
AdultKing Raise Your Weapon Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Outback Australia Posts: 15,602	Just a reminder to everyone. Follow the progress of StopFileLockers live on Twitter. Follow @StopFileLockers http://twitter.com/StopFileLockers or like the Facebook page at http://facebook.com/StopFileLockers Report piracy sites at http://copycontrol.org/report-piracy/ You can cc all your DMCA & infringement reports to infringements -at- copycontrol.org Official Copy Control updates and news at http://forum.copycontrol.org Follow Copy Control on Twitter @CopyControlHQ http://twitter.com/CopyControlHQ or like the Facebook page http://facebook.com/CopyControlHQ Contributions to the Stop File Lockers project can be made using Paypal or Credit Card via Paypal using the ChipIn widget on http://stopfilelockers.com Contributions to the Stop File Lockers project can also be made using Paxum to [email protected] We can be contacted using the contact form on the Stop File Lockers website or on the Copy Control Website http://stopfilelockers.com http://copycontrol.org Thank you to everyone who has supported this project, it wouldn't exist without you.

11-02-2012, 12:10 PM	#3761
RegUser Confirmed User Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,472	Wjat is there left to save? The 1000s of tube sites are full of millions of free videos with thousands of frsh videos being added every day. Piracy is not only alive but thriving

11-02-2012, 01:40 PM	#3764
vollenweider Registered User Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Jersey Posts: 40	Hello AdultKing, I am Simon, we have had few conversation over icq but its been for a while since last time i saw you online so i bet i am on your shit list. Since this is a public forum, i would like to state what i had discussed with you previously regarding piracy. I remember you saying the main goal of your project is to fight against piracy, and you have targeted the file lockers first for your reasons which i don't even care about. Reading some of the comments in this topic makes me believe that your job is effective while some of them aren't that much clear. If you remember, my question was that why don't you go after torrent sites at the same time since they are worse than file hosting sites offering FREE access to all the materials. A simple example is the following website: rarbg.com/torrents.php?category=4 I can guarantee that you can find every single porn video/movie released on this site for free. The interesting point here is you denying to get involved with torrent websites where the amount of illegal material is simply uncountable while we see you saying that your main goal is "Fighting against the sharing of pirated and illegal content". So lets go back to the original question, do you believe only file lockers are the headache and responsible for piracy or should we take a look at torrents too? Thanks

11-02-2012, 03:26 PM	#3767
dgraves Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Scottsdale Posts: 2,283	I've noticed that as well and that's why I like to "cc" everyone in the chain. __________________ Gloryhole Swallow \| Cumpsters \| Spy Tug \| Cum Clinic \| Chica's Place

11-02-2012, 03:41 PM	#3768
6South Registered User Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 84	I said "prosecutions", not "investigations". I can fill out a web form and get an investigation number from ICE. How many actual prosecutions has your system generated? I've been an information architect designing secure content systems for governments and military clients for well over a decade. I promise you there are existing DRM technologies that do work and defeat all capture methods even videotaping a monitor if it comes to that. The hold up on wide spread use has been a combination of limitations imposed by classified status and the need for computer hardware to cycle through the market. The older versions of this are becoming available outside of military and government markets now but even those beat anything you've seen in the commercial sphere by miles. Nothing has prevented the entertainment industry from developing the same capabilities other than misinformation and an industry mind set based on outdated methods. (Like spending millions to buy lawmakers vs. developing other solutions). There are plenty of alternate payment methods already popular w/ the piracy crowd and there will be more. The conversion to spendable cash is easy and they can obtain everything they need including servers without ever needing a credit card. Keep up the good work though, someone needs to do it and I do applaud the change in tactics to going after the payment processor accounts. I completely disagree that it solves everything, however. I stand by my position that while it's necessary to keep the small fish under control the big players such as the organized crime rings will only grow stronger. You won't change the law enforcement picture in some of those places for at least another 10-20 years if that soon. __________________ -= Software / Systems Architect and Server Geek =-

11-02-2012, 04:53 PM	#3777
Triple-A Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: Hartford CT Posts: 535	http://www.debrauw.com/News/LegalAle...tober2012.aspx interesting link for those hosting in Holland the shitty companies and filelockers... maybe worth showing this link where necessary! __________________ Triple A Spanking - AAAspanking Affiliate Program Contact me if you want to help promote our niche

11-03-2012, 08:43 AM	#3789
6South Registered User Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 84	A high post count really doesn't impress me or tell me what a great person / professional someone is. It tells me they spend a shitload of time on a forum, basically. I'll try to summarize the entire problem w/ the current approach to content protection / anti piracy w/ a simple analogy. It's not perfect but that's why it's called an analogy instead of an example... The current approach by content producers / owners to fighting piracy is the equivalent of a bank that stores all its money in the parking lot. Then, when people come by and steal it they say the solution is to try and make stealing "more illegal". While it's working out great for certain business models on both sides of the issue and helping people who want to further a "police state" / "1984" society in the long term it's doomed to fail. __________________ -= Software / Systems Architect and Server Geek =-

11-03-2012, 10:49 AM	#3796
AdultKing Raise Your Weapon Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Outback Australia Posts: 15,602	After months of discussions and ongoing pressure including the risk to Avangate of losing relationships important to it's ongoing business we saw Avangate finally remove payment processing from a large batch of file hosts. However the process is not complete and we shall be placing Avangate under pressure to drop all IP infringing merchants. http://stopfilelockers.com/avangate-...nt-processing/ 18 Sites have lost payment processing through Avangate, more will follow. Bitshare.com Cepzo.com Extabit.com Filefactory.com Filefolks.com Filerio.in Filestay.com Freakshare.com Luckyshare.net Lumfile.com Megaload.it Novafile.com Oteupload.com Prefiles.com Ryushare.com Sharedbit.net Upfile.biz Upsto.re Thanks to the whole Copy Control team for the months of hard work on this issue.

11-03-2012, 10:53 AM	#3797
Tjeezers Webmaster Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: BP4L - NL/RO Posts: 16,429	Someone clicked my sig, it`s not fair!! __________________ Enroll in the SWAG Affiliate Asian Live Cam Program and receive a minimum of 2 bonus backlinks by placing your Affiliate Link on your website. The higher your link's position, the more bonus backlinks you'll receive. Request your bonus links here upon signing up.