Mike South, you playing games now?

DWB, Oron did NOT TURN OFF THEIR AFFILIATE PROGRAM. Their affiliate program was invite only since the beginning of the year now, since Megaupload was shut down. They selectively remove people from it. Their affiliate program is still up and running the same as before CCBill shut their billing down.

Maybe you should wait and see what their hosting does or does not do in the next couple of weeks... who knows, things change...

Fabian, your pov makes sense

I feel you man, but what Nathan/Fabian/whatthefuckever is getting at, is once you start "pre-screening" people, you eliminate the safe harbor provisions of DMCA. It's the same for a web hosting company. Once you start going "looking for" offenders, you are basically doing some level of 'moderation' or oversight. This is where you get into trouble. It is typically why these various companies play Schultz from Hogan's Heros.

In short, there is legal landmines that play into this on some degree. Not just the piracy side, and enforcement of that. But switching their tubes from the pure theft they were when they had bought them, to slowly weeding that shit out, and bringing in legal content over time without losing their traffic, or standing in the business model as an example.

Again, I am not excusing them, or saying all of this is right or wrong. I am simply saying, they are now a huge corporate enterprise. Whether we like it or not, they have people to answer too (Playboy, investors, whomever). You are going to see them operate the same as a telco, wall street banks, CCBill, or whatever. Change will come slowly. Often times very very very slowly.

Breaking piracy rules, what are you talking about? And RYC has made it very clear they are not interested to work with us. Nate _loves_ me... ;) And why should I show you any of our DMCA's, just trying to figure out what good this will do me? I am looking into submitting them to the dmca database being discussed on xbiz.net...

Although I like the fact that it worked this time, I do not think this is a wise idea to do. 1) It will attract unneeded attention by Visa and MC to the whole adult industry and 2) The processor can always claim that people are not buying the CONTENT, they are simply buying the premium membership to the file locker. That there is illegal content on the file locker is secondary.

I am however setting up an semi in-house department right now which is going to do something similar, yes.

Uhm seriously, I dress however the fuck I want to. IF you have a problem with that, thats your problem... The "kid" that did the xbiz seminar enjoyed it, and got a ton of positive feedback after the Q&A. He has no issue doing it again, the same way. He reacted absolutely correct to all questions thrown at him after Mike's remarks. The seminar was absolutely what we expected and went quite tame at the end to be honest... Just because Mike and his friends here post and laugh how bad it looked, does not mean nobody liked the seminar. It was one of the most visited seminars at xbiz miami and got far more than 90% positive feedback from the attendees.

We have PR people, and if she is reading it she is likely shaking her head in disbelief... ;) And even if I would write "Hello" it would rattle certain people up here, and I am not going to let people deny me to speak my mind, especially not after lies get thrown around by people like Mike South as if its all fun and games... I do not care if I get flamed, it does not hurt me...

Read my first message to you. I did not speak down to you. I asked questions and made truthful comments. Your business was 100% built on piracy, even if that business was built before you took over. There is no denying that and there is proof Mansef was paying uploaders out there that I will gladly refrence if you want to see it, but I think we both know you already have and know what's up, hence the fact you can never comment on it.

That is not a personal attack on you, those are just the facts. Then you came blazing back about growing up, high-fiving buddies, and how I don't understand shit.


I stopped reading here because that is not a valid excuse. If a "webmaster" can't set up an email account for the sake of uploading content to tubes, in an attempt to better the entire industry, then I don't feel sorry for him and he loses out on your traffic.

Honestly, how sorry is a person if they can't set this up to help the entire industry? They snooze, they lose. That should not be your or my problem. I'd set up as many accounts as I had to.

And truth be told, if someone is willing to encode their videos over and over for every tube with mysite.com/yourtube on it, then they will be willing to set up some email accounts. That much I'm sure of. And if they don't, fuck 'em.

If cutting out free emails would deny half of the adult webmasters, imagine how many pirates it would deny. Now we're making progress. But why else can't you implement this one simple step?

What is this, national meltdown week?

DWB, you should not have stopped reading there, since that was the smallest reason for any of your remarks not working in connection with DMCA... But if you prefer reading what Barefootsies wrote, do that, he basically said the same thing I did just in his words not in my gibberish <G>

Regarding what Mansef did or did not do, I am sure you understand that I simply can not comment on those things. However much I would like to, I can not. Its the same as me not being able to comment publicly on their seizures of money in the US. Obviously I know more than you about it since it happened in the middle of contract negotiations, but there is things in contracts which prohibit me from speaking about it, even if I would love to openly agree or deny certain facts...

When we ever meet in person, ask me again, maybe I can answer you then.

DWB, sorry, forgot one thing... in one of your posts above you claimed that we do not have a repeat infringer policy... that is not correct, we have one and it is actively being used.

There is nothing in any law book that says they can't require a real email address. That has nothing to do with DMCA or Safe Harbor.

Facebook made me attach a phone number to my account and verify that account before I could use my account. They sent a SMS with a code that I had to enter into Facebook. Why couldn't that same method be used for other sites that allow user submitted content? At least then you know exactly who loaded it and they can be tracked if need be. But you know what, people wouldn't upload all that stolen content if their real phone number was attached to their account. And asking for it doesn't violate Safe Harbor.

And I don't believe change is coming from them, even if they claim it will come slowly. It is in their benefit to not change and keep doing what they are doing. Their traffic and success of their tube sites 99% depend on piracy via random uploaders.

BF, do you believe Fabian doesn't know what accounts were created by Mansef for inhouse and paid uploaders? Or do you believe he was told to pretend he doesn't know about them by his legal council?

Content that we had reason to believe was POSSIBLY uploaded by inhouse people has long been removed. We removed all content associated with certain accounts and those accounts themself shortly after acquiring the tube sites.

Literally broadcast thievery much ?

No, I totally understand why you can't comment on it. No need to explain. My point was that you can't, but it goes without saying you know what they did.


I vaguely remember going through this a long time ago with you. You would stop them from uploading but not delete their other videos. There was a member with something like over 2000 videos. You were going to check with your legal team about if you could or not and I don't recall seeing anything after that. All I know is YouTube does it, and they did it to me. They have a strike policy and then they delete your account and all of your videos, for any reason they see fit that you have violated their terms. Facebook does it too. You get a few warnings then they delete your entire page with all of your content. So you should be able to do that as well.

Side note, the irony of the youtube and facebook issues were due to false DMCAs sent on content I owned. It sucks, but that's how it plays out sometimes. They don't even reply to counter DMCAs, and what am I going to do, sue the two largest media companies on the internet?

That is actually good to hear. I honestly didn't think you would have done that or have been instructed legally to not acknowledge it.