Again.. He was very clear on what he intended to do.. Anyone whom didn't listen heard what they wanted to hear.

If people mis-understood this message they clearly did not listen..This was one of "many" times he said the same thing. Hell he even said it in the debates. If people didn't understand this, then they voted for him with-out informing themselves.

I voted for him mainly on his stance on the wars in both Iraq & Afghan, I felt the wars were the most important factor for this county at that time. He was the only guy that had a reality check as to what had to happen for us to be successful in both wars. Like him or not but Obama was spot on with his views on the wars and he has done a better job that what I personally expected from him in regard to them.

Actual information citing a source, thank you! We spend so much time arguing about stuff without bothering to get the facts first, arguing from ignorance.

Also useful information, thank you. So if I'm reading that right, if the Secretary of State, Secretary of Defense, Director of National Intelligence all three agree and submit the petition to congress, someone in the US could be arrested. That's probably good that all three of them have to sign off on an array AND submit each to congress.

The scary part: do they only have to sign off once and that's it, all Americans, at anytime, can now be detained indefinitely by the military? It doesn't say, and if it's a bill with such power, I think it should clarify such things. I'm sure that's what draws the most concern from people, is the lack of specifics and the wording which could lead to a massive abuse of power.

Here is a link to the pdf of the bill: http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/BILLS-1...12s1867pcs.pdf

It's 682 pages long. The parts that are of concern in this matter begin on page 359. Sec 1031, 1032, and 1033. Page 359 is the beginning of Sec 1031.

If you really read and make note of which sections and paragraphs apply to other sections and paragraphs you may be able to understand the document and why people are so concerned. It also apparently draws regulations from other documents, which are referenced, and makes it even more challenging to truly understand.

According to our laws, I'd imagine the Posse Comitatus Act would come into play.

Here is a link to its Wikipedia page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posse_Comitatus_Act

Yeah perhaps it should be more clear how broad a waiver can be. Perhaps each waiver needs to list the name or names of the people they want to question, so it's clear they can't get a waiver for "terrorism suspects" or similar.

I hate it when bills are real complex, with lots of cross references, so it's hard to understand. Most, especially at the state level, really aren't that difficult so it surprises me that so many people argue about them without ever reading them. Perhaps they believe Pelosi "we have to pass the bill to see what's in it."

:1orglaugh you are such a fucking kook. the message in those ads is exactly the opposite of what your wacko paranoia says it is.

i'm sure now that it's the holiday season you'll have some conspiracy theory about Santa Clause.

If modern Nazi's had funded that same advert, many wouldn't trust it; they would suspect there was more to it than met the eye. On this occasion it's the major tax exempt foundations who are partners with Think MTV; birds of a feather flock together. We know that those foundations are behind the major wars. We know that one of the same families who funded the Nazis are also behind one of the most prominent of the tax exempt organizations.

The evidence is there for those who look for it :2 cents:

sorry not even the most fervid conspiracy nut would interpret that commercial like that. i have known people irl who went down this path and ended up with them on disability, diagnosed with schizophrenia, pretty much a waste of life. prob best for you at this point to be blunt with what is going on with your family and friends and seek medical help. :2 cents:

Let's face it, if they really want to, US Government (agencies) can already do WTF they like to anyone, anywhere, home or abroad, and there isn't a thing anyone can do about it. 99% of people just happen to be not significant enough to warrant the effort.

As for people claiming life is better or more free outside the US... where are these utopias? Asia? Latin America? Russia? :1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

The only reason to live in some stinking, polluted, endemically corrupt, backwater police state in Asia or Latin America is if you're too broke to afford putas in the civilized world (where most in the third world would kill to live) and/or you're addicted to tranny cock.

And the only reason to live in Russia is if you're a criminal and/or mentally deranged.

“The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing.” Socrates

There are people who's spent decades researching advertising and how to make people respond in the way you'd like them to. There are all kinds of techniques that can be used, for example http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/s...cientists.html

Those MTV videos were made in 2008- Ron Paul picked up on them and kind of co-opted them for his own angle even though I couldn't find any direct connection to Paul and the videos.
http://www.dailypaul.com/41340/mtv-t...people-like-us

think.mtv now redirects to act.mtv and i can't find those videos on there anymore.

.

why are you quoting that? what you know about socrates and what do you think that quote means?

ok you got me there.

Psst... This is a very common 'quote' i see people using. If you took the quote in context and didn't just listen to talking points you'd know that. The clip was edited and cut short. You can view the whole thing here:



Here is the text:

Convenient that the end of the sentence is always left out when someone quotes it, isn't it?

yes looks like some people only like to do research selectively.

I don't know about people going missing, but I'm sure it happens from time to time. My comment was more about the government running people down abroad.



We have well over 100 military bases around the world. For what?

And as the troops pull out of Iraq and Afghanistan, there will be bases left behind occupied by our troops.

Lets also not forget, as troops are pulled out, the government is paying private military companies to go in and take over. So while we won't have many "American soldiers" on the streets there, we will have "American mercenaries" who have taken their place. But mercs don't make the news, so no one will care about that or the atrocities they will be involved in.


Not yet. Renouncing is the easy part, getting a 2nd citizenship is the difficult part. Unfortunately, you can't do one without the other. However, I'd like to make it happen within the next 5 years. But I have been setting up life on the ground and putting my ducks in a row. It's just the passport that is the last hurdle. Unfortunately, I don't make the kind of money needed to make it happen as fast as I'd like.

I didn't used to think I would ever want to renounce my US citizenship, but these days it's painfully clear that the country is heading in a direction I want nothing to do with. I am not proud to tell people I'm American anymore, and I find that a bit shameful. Americans are also not the most favorably looked upon abroad these days. It's amazing what a decade can do to a reputation.

However, I'm very thankful I was raised in what was at that time a great country, but now that I have a choice, I just want to be left alone and not have to worry about whatever shenanigans come from the USA. All of this nonsense has happened more or less in a decade. I can't imagine what another decade or two is going to do to the country, and heaven help everyone there if another attack is successfully pulled off on American soil. Of course I don't hope that happens, but I believe it inevitably will.

You forgot to add and they slammed coincidentally into the very place where any records for that missing money would have been kept.

Predicted Times.

It's either today, or tomorrow that this bill is going to the floor...

We do have military bases in over 130 different countries, and I don't think that's because we have an Embassy in each country. But I wouldn't call it "empire building". It's not like we are taking over those countries and running them.

FANTASTIC VIDEO!!!


:thumbsup:thumbsup:thumbsup:thumbsup:thumbsup



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If only we could be sure that Ron Paul wouldn't change his mind, go back on his word, lie to get into office, and continue to be the same old politician we've seen for as long as I can remember. If only.

When it comes to socialists and communists you can't be paranoid enough.

Here come the men in black

Totally. Scandinavian countries must be plotting something.

I am not afraid captain

so this kind of thing doesn't happen in thailand and other countries?

:(:Oh crap:helpme