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For those of you who watched last night's debate, and heard "answers" for ANY of America's problems, please look into the mirror when you say I am the partisan here.
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I did. And I saw some things I agree with and some things I did not. Just like I do when I listen to Obama.
That's why I voted for Obama in 2008, and why I will probably vote for a Republican in 2012.
That's the difference I'm trying to point out to you. You are completely partisan. It wouldn't matter to you if a Republican came out with everything you believe in. You would call him names and never vote for him or even acknowledge the points he made.
And you won't acknowledge the huge mistake that Obama has made by not focusing on the economy and instead letting Reid & Pelosi pretty much screw the country.
Dude...come on. The Dems gained control of both houses in 2006.
Then they had Obama as President.
That was TOTAL control from 2008 to 2010. They should have passed the CORRECT health care in a week. They should have been able to pass some kind of jobs bill in the first month.
Instead they couldn't even pass a budget. And they took a bad situation and in my mind made it worse.
That's not the Republicans fault. That was pure Democratic Senate & Congress greed and corruption fighting over their pork barrel spending.
And no...I don't think it was ideology. I think it was Obama being a young and very inexperienced guy (not only in politics...but in any position of authority or business, etc.) and he respectfully deferred to the much older and experienced Reid & Pelosi.
They led him the wrong way. And he should have had much better advisors around him to tell him to stand up and LEAD and not follow those two.
Now it's time to pay the piper.
Here is my NON-partisan view: I voted for Obama. I wanted to believe all the things he said. And like the millions of independents who have abandoned him...I was sorely disappointed. And now I'm looking for anybody with STRONG leadership qualities.
I hoped that Obama would pull his shit together in the second two years like Bill Clinton did. But apparently he is no Clinton.
Instead he is out doing what he really loves: Giving speeches and campaigning.
Very disappointing to me.
And the crazy thing is folks like you who are just purely 100% political party oriented refuse to see what happened. Just like in 2010...2012 is going to be a slaughter. It didn't have to be.
As I said, Bill Clinton was super smart. And when he saw what happened in 1994, he turned himself and the country around. Obama sadly did not. He continued to let Reid & Pelosi "guide" him and that led to gridlock.Last edited by Robbie; 10-19-2011, 06:59 AM.-Robbie
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You DO know that arguing with someone as stupid as bft3k is a fruitless endeavor and when he gets his ass kicked and leaves the thread, the discussion becomes logical and objective again, right?Last edited by The Demon; 10-19-2011, 07:04 AM.Greed is Good
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There may have been a couple of people on that stage that Obama could "out debate", but Newt Gingrich... who really is a brilliant guy... would mop up the floor with Obama. Obama would also not fare well against Romney who's a very polished speaker, nor would he do well against Jon Huntsman... who was not there last night.
The broader picture though is that Obama has absolutely nothing to run on... no success stories that people will feel he should be rewarded for... no reason at all to give him a second chance. His only strategy... and it's a shaky one... would be to launch very personal attacks against whoever the GOP sends against him.,, and that usually backfires against the attacker.Comment
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Funny listening to the mentally challenged who don't understand the first thing about policies, our economy or infrastructure call anyone on either side a moron. What a joke.
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Come on dude.
Remember the saying: "Never discuss religion or politics".
Just because BFT3K has strong political beliefs doesn't make him "stupid". It's just a discussion. His views are just as relevant as mine or yours. When you guys call each other names it's just childish and makes your viewpoint irrelevant in the conversation to people reading it.
I've met the guy. He isn't stupid at all. And he is 100% in this business. He obviously has life experiences that have led him to be a staunch Democrat. He's not alone. Just like there are millions of folks who are staunch Republicans.
My whole point is that I believe things would be better if people stopped playing party politics and started really looking at individual issues and individual candidates. And doing so with no pre-conceived notions.-Robbie
ClaudiaMarie.ComComment
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Okay, that's all very nice. So you voted for Obama, gave him one term (actually just 3 years), and now you are are ready to throw in the towel. Cool.
He wasn't able to fix every problem in the country in 3 years (so far) while fighting against a Republican opposition who has done nothing but filibuster since day one, but okay, he is a giant failure now. Cool.
You think voting for another Republican - the party that is responsible for the lionshare of the troubles we're in - will "fix" the country's problems. Cool.
You think the GOP will bring everyone together in 2012? Cool.
You think the GOP will suddenly care about the 99% over the top 1%, as they've shown themselves to do, time and time again? Cool.
You think the GOP will not favor the healthcare insurance companies over the care of the people? Cool.
You think the GOP will balance the budget in an equal and fair way, as opposed to doing so on the backs of the poor and middle class? Cool.
You think the GOP will allow the Bush tax cuts to expire? Cool.
You think the GOP will be better than Obama, based upon their "great new ideas" that I have yet to hear? Cool.
Yeah, I am the partisan? Cool.Last edited by BFT3K; 10-19-2011, 07:11 AM.Comment
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Robbie I can respect everything in the above post but I also consider it wrong. You say that the dems had a majority in both houses and Obama in the white house. On paper that is true but they did not have a super majority. They could not pass anything because the republicans simply stomped their feet, held their breath and cried filibuster on everything. The dems were also shackled by blue dogs that got the DNC's cash for their campaigns but NEVER voted with the party... pulling them to the right on every single vote.
The republicans were unanimous and moved as a block. They may have been the minority party but they wielded huge amounts of power and control. Add that to the fact that Obama had all the leadership qualities of a medicated infant he and the dems have been at the mercy of republican whims. Because of the gains the tea party made in the mid term the extreme on the right has been emboldened and now I think the leadership in the RNC might be seeing that their deal with the devil cannot give them long term success. It is generally considered to be common wisdom that to win the primaries the candidate will have to cater to the desires of the extreme right which will hurt them exponentially in the general campaign.
If Romney can make it through the primaries and get the nomination I think he stands a very good chance of toppling Obama I really do. But when I see people criticizing Obama for what he did or did not do and places no blame on the republican bullies who have refused to govern at all since 08 it gets me a bit riled up.
my apologies for long postComment
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The GOP's midterm mantra was "jobs jobs jobs" - but then as soon as they got power back, it's all back to Planned Parenthood, gay marriage, union busting, redistricting, voter suppression, etc.
If the people who believed the GOP in 2010 want to believe in them again, well, I have nothing more to say...Last edited by BFT3K; 10-19-2011, 07:16 AM.Comment
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I don't mind different political beliefs. I mind blatant stupidity which BFT3K is a master of. Guys like Kane and I share opposing views or Gonzo and I, but they can bring in an intellectual debate. Clinically retarded human beings like BFT3K do nothing but make random anti right wing threads all day and then start crying when nobody agrees with them. It's humorous really but the point is, if you can debate logically, you can be on opposite sides of the table. There's a reason I don't always agree with 12clicks too.
Also, as many of you have caught on to BFT3K's retarded game, he was claiming the GOP has no plans as a means of misdirection, while the fact of the matter is, the left is in the exact same boat. The only difference is, between the plans that do exist, the left is incompetent in every aspect.Last edited by The Demon; 10-19-2011, 07:28 AM.Greed is GoodComment
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What the republicans understand and the democrats don't want to believe is that out of control spending has damaged the confidence that business has in government. According to almost everyone there are hundreds of billions of dollars sitting in the accounts of business.
With this huge deficit,it's no surprise that savvy people are not going to invest that money when there is a real chance that these left wing policies are going to push us right into another recession. Having the credit rating lowered was a major blow. It hurt us locally and with every potential lender.
Until a leader steps forward and takes control of the deficit, the economy will simply stagnate.
Obama continues to demonstrate that he clearly is NOT the one that can do it.You might not be as anonymous as you think you are.Comment
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repubs don't understand anything any more than the dems. they just speculate out of their ass like everyone else does.
all that money in business' accounts isn't sitting there simply because lack of government confidence. it's also because some don't want to spend it unless they can do so in the same manner that got us where we are today. capitalism means that you have the right to profit as much as possible. but unfortunately that means you have the right to do so even to the disadvantage of your own country and it's people.
the lack of leadership is not solely the fault of obama... it's the entire presidential system - president, house and senate - that is dropping the ball here because they can't come together. all this blaming obama for his "lack of leadership" is the biggest load of shit being shoveled. the system is set up so that everyone has to agree to move forward on something. repubs in the system are throwing a temper tantrum to gum up the works, and we all know why.flexx [dot] aeon [at] gmailComment
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Gingrich is a discredited kook with more skeletons in his closet than vincent price.Comment
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I like Cain, his 999 plan is not bad at all, problem nobody is really savvy enough to understand this concept.
Cain has a lot of strong business experience behind him.
Romney also is doing well, he could be a strong candidate.
I have a lot of respect for Mormons, they have a work ethic out of this world.
Perry is too liberal to get past the GOP.
either case the election could look like this:
black vs mormom
black vs black
and i still think Obama has a decent chance for a second term.
everyone hve to be reminded he took over at the worst of times, Bush was so beaten by the enormous problems he even let Obama sit in on financial discussions way before he was in office..
healthcare and social security have been a bull nobody wanted to take by the horns since Reagan I think, this is why we have the deficit problems today, not Obama's doing imho."Obscenity is whatever gives the Judge an erection." -- Author UnknownComment
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He did take over at a bad, bad time. And he came in preaching that he was going to kick some ass and get this country back on track.
And then...nothing. He proceeded to listen to the wrong people. First thing he did was strike a behind closed doors deal with the big pharmacy companies and then produced a "health care" bill that was written by Reid and Pelosi's cronies.
Remember Pelosi telling us all that we need to "pass the bill, so we can read it" lol
You don't hear the people who are completely partisan to the Democratic party ever address that big pharmacy deal and subsequent Insurance Company Bailout called "health care".
Obama had the highest approval numbers I've ever seen when he came into office. He had both houses of Congress. The Republicans were on life support.
And he totally blew it.
So no, he wasn't President when it started. Bush was (and for 7 of the 8 years Bush was President our economy was roaring...too bad he started those fucking wars and ruined it).
But since Obama HAS been president...he hasn't shown that he can handle it.
When Reagan took office he walked into a bad situation. Many of y'all weren't alive then...but I was 18 years old. The country was in deep recession, Iran had our hostages, their were gas lines and people were only allowed to get gas on odd and even days according to their license plates.
He turned that shit around quickly.
Back when FDR took office...he came in at The Great Depression. MUCH WORSE than what Obama faced. In his first year in office he turned that shit around.
Obama has failed. And now he is out campaigning while people are jobless and losing their homes. There are protests on Wall Street and around the country.
Nothing to be proud of for this President. That's why he isn't campaigning on his ACCOMPLISHMENTS.
He's still campaigning against Republicans like it's 2007 and he's not yet the president...not FOR what he has done.
I think he needs a miracle to get re-elected. And I don't see one coming on the campaign trail.
Partisan folks say that the Republicans are blocking everything. But they leave out the fact that the Democrats are also blocking every Republican plan.
I say...VOTE THEM ALL OUT!
And whoever wins the Presidency in 2012? Vote his ass out in 2016 no matter what he does or doesn't do.
Don't let ANY of them stay in power more than one term if you want to clean up govt.-Robbie
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No success stories? You serious? If you want even a small slice, look at last year's lame duck congress and all that got passed.
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Of course there is. Every social and fiscal policy that this administration has proposed comes from the left and/or the far left.
Obama set the table with his healthcare reform. Stuffing that garbage bill down the throats of the country and basically telling the republicans TOO BAD,we got the power. The supreme court will have to waste their time determining if it's even constitutional. A wide majority of the country is against it.
That was his defining moment. He pissed in the rights wheaties and they haven't forgotten.
Nor will they. And we will see in 12 months if the country has.You might not be as anonymous as you think you are.Comment
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Don't be a moron yourself.. One of the biggest complaints the right wing had of Obama prior to his election was they thought he would be soft on the war on terror.
The fact is he has done a pretty damn outstanding job in regard to the so called war on terror. He's pulled the bulk of our troops out of Iraq and refocused on Afghanistan and went after the tangos into Pakistan. Just like he promised in his campaign.
The right wing wont say shit about that even though it was their "biggest" worry prior to his election. Obama took out bin laden and continues to get high priority tango kills. Going into Pakistan like Obama did is something Bush would have never done in a million years.
Bush was more worried about giving Pakistan a bunch of tax payers money so they could buy arms from American companies and "pretend" to be out allies, while fucking us in the back side.
Obama did what needed to be done , end of argument and the very fact the right wing ignores anything to do with the wars shows they know he has done good on his promise and would be foolish to claim otherwise.
Now his healthcare plan didn't go so well and IMO he caved far sooner than he should have.. So I give him a bad grade on that.
On the economy..sure he hasn't done as well as I would have liked and maybe he's done a bad job there. Yet what have the Republicans done to help him or this country? They have done nothing but fight anything Obama has wanted to do, so if you blame Obama for not preforming well on the economy then you must also blame the house & senate whom are controlled by Republicans.
Not to mention Republicans have filibustered Obama more times in 2 years than what has ever been done in the history of this country. So you want to blame Obama for a Republican Congress & Senate that will not work with a Democrat regardless of what it is. Get real, I'd say Republicans are to blame on the economy at this point as the president can only get things done if the house and senate work with him for the good of the country not whats good for the next election.
On the Banking issue I wasn't happy with it but not like Republicans would of done any different. Let's not forget George Bush Jr also gave the banks a bail out.Last edited by crockett; 10-19-2011, 11:43 AM.In November, you can vote for America's next president or its first dictator.Comment
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Obama is a corporatist, he's very far from left, his policies and those of say Canada - are very different. Obamacare is a clear sign of his corporate ties. At that, it is the Republican healthcare plan, again... very far from left.
55 to 45 on appeal is not a wide majority. Before all the incorrect mass media hype about it, it had overwhelming support.Last edited by TheDoc; 10-19-2011, 11:43 AM.
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Cain is the latest fad. His numbers will be dropping soon, if not already. It will most likely be Romney. I really wish Pawlenty didn't drop out, they gave Huntsman more attention along with Johnson, and Christie entered the race(even tho i am no fan of Christie, he's at least funny.)-uno
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policies can come from as far left as the day is long, but c'mon. not every dem is a communist tree hugger just like not every repub is a evangelist racist. shit has to be somewhere in the middle or it gets thrown out.
but see what i mean? people say they want obama to "show some leadership" and when he does something like lead people into the health care bill, suddenly it's been "stuffed down throats". the same type of health care that the republican front runner romney has already imposed. the "wide majority" is against health care? please. the "wide majority" is just againt obama.
repubs weren't complaining when he extended the bush policies (the ones that that got us here....by the way) but the first policy he gets that he wants is already the 'defining moment' and the last straw.
you're right - we will see what's up in 12 months but don't think that people haven't been paying attention to the way the repubs are acting.flexx [dot] aeon [at] gmailComment
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I just wanted to say I got a kick out of ABC's title for their story on the debate..
"GOP Bickering: Candidates Butt Heads"
The title is of course longer but on he main page it's shorted and looks like they are calling the GOP candidates butt heads.
Last edited by crockett; 10-19-2011, 12:23 PM.In November, you can vote for America's next president or its first dictator.Comment
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I don't disagree that somewhere in the middle has merit.
I do disagree that people are not against the healthcare bill,but against Obama. Afterall,he did win the election. For whatever reason,he won the job fair and square. And the healthcare reform bill as it should've been would also have merit. Not the bill that was passed. And more importantly the way it was passed. All the talk about transparency became nothing but a joke. Forcing people to buy a product. Adding much staff to the IRS to make sure they do.
While the country is in a severe recession,this administration needed to be focused on one thing. And they didn't do that.
I do give Obama high marks on how he is handling the middle east. He is insisting that the people that know how to win do their jobs.
However,it takes him too long to make a decision. Even if he isn't leading by committee,it appears as if he is.You might not be as anonymous as you think you are.Comment
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They were acting like children on a playground.I just wanted to say I got a kick out of ABC's title for their story on the debate..
"GOP Bickering: Candidates Butt Heads"
The title is of course longer but on he main page it's shorted and looks like they are calling the GOP candidates butt heads.
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yeah it does take too long. 3 years and we're still in the same mess we were in when he got here. but that's probably because he's fighting an uphill battle. after all, he's merely a politician amongst the rest with checked power. ALL of these politicians have personal and/or political agendas, and they do shit to accomplish those agendas, sometimes in spite of whats good for the people. sadly, one of those current agendas it to get obama out of office.flexx [dot] aeon [at] gmailComment
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I just wanted to say I got a kick out of ABC's title for their story on the debate..
"GOP Bickering: Candidates Butt Heads"
The title is of course longer but on he main page it's shorted and looks like they are calling the GOP candidates butt heads.
awesome
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What was that? You hear something? Was that a mosquito?
Where's my fucking fly swatter?...Comment
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I find it amusing that anyone thinks there is any difference between the two parties. They are both a bunch of war mongering banking owned c*nts.Dear USA, Your 9/11 is our 24/7, Sincerely Palestine xxComment
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Carbon is not the problem, it makes up 0.041% of our atmosphere , 95% of that is from Volcanos and decomposing plants and stuff. So people in the US are responsible for 13% of the carbon in the atmosphere which 95% is not from Humans, like cars and trucks and stuff and they want to spend trillions to fix it while Solar Panel plants are powered by coal plants
think about thatComment
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Arguing with a troll is a lot like wrestling in the mud with a pig, after a couple of hours you realize the pig likes it.Comment
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BFT3K you are solid motherfucker but you dont go hard enough on these righty slime bags. You should lose the gloves manThe Slut Boat soon will be making another run
The Slut Boat promises something for everyoneComment
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yeah BFT obama is a dead duck. america does not like a pussy for president. all the dems are gonna stay home, no energy. Mitts not gonna scare 'em to the polls. you should rethink everything you stand for & try being a republican for a day. you'll feel much better just caring about yourself instead of those 99% dead enders.Comment
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