You can argue all you want as somebody that owns a "hosting company" but your argument is weak when there are (better) companies out there doing it for free.

LOL shit

So the companies that install scripts whenever you want and keep them updated for you are what? Better?

Paging Brad Mitchell and SweetT ... what is the policy at your company for things like this?

I ask because I have experience with both of you and it seems like there isn't anything you won't do for your customers ... for free ... so what do you charge for the above requests for dedicated customers?

Is everything a sales pitch with you? Your a damn walking billboard.

Better for who? If there's a newbie webmaster and he finds a host that's willing to take care of things like updating scripts for him then yes, that host is better for him. I just think it's sad that this kind of thing is becoming the norm. A competent webmaster shouldn't need that much help.

They are free to run their business however they see fit. They are not a non-profit.

If you can't afford to pay them for babysitting the migration for you,... move.

:2 cents:

...............and how much do you pay for their servers and that level of service by comparison to many of the other web hosting companies in the market? You typically are going to pay a lot more for the same server there then you would at some place like a Secured Servers or Webair as an example.

In short, you pay a premium, and get premium service from the SweetP and MOJO's. With SweetP you will even sign a year long contract apparently. MOJO and SweetP prices are typically going to be more expensive for the same hardware, and managed support than many others in the same market. If you want to pay pennies, you get penny support. You are going to have to pay extra for those same levels of service at a budget provider.

You catching on yet champ?

:2 cents:

Natnet does it for free. Every time I asked the sites were being moved over within minutes after I talked to them. They've moved hundreds of my sites several months after I started hosting with them. It's been a while since I had a server with them but I'm sure it's still the same great support.

Yep. They do cost more than a lot of other host, you got to pay for support like that.

I'd shit a brick if someone explained the joke to me.

Maybe.

Fiddy Hawaiian shirts.
:pimp

Exactly.

MOJO and SweetP/NatNet provide a premium level of service. You will pay for that quality of support and service. It is built into their pricing and staffing levels. If you need that level of support, you go with them and pay for it upfront in the higher cost of servers.

nice biz thread but still don't see what this has to do with steve jobs.

Look closely at the left side.

I see a black girl and 5 white girls and that's all I see.

Whatever.

The joke is probably beneath me.

Most managed hosting providers will do it at no charge - take a look at a few hosts front pages and see how many offer it as a basic service. Thats why you pay a premium over non-managed, although service levels differ of course.

WebAir have never impressed me at any level. Even in this thread the rep bitched about some guys spelling before offering any explanation. Thats a sign of childish desperation to me. I guess that was before his boss with a few board skills tried to save some face.

I will save my infamous WebAir support story for another night.... :)

It must be different on a laptop screen, I will admit she made me jump on my netbook....

What our policy is isn't really relevant, it's not our customer. I wouldn't guess that either of us would, no. Not to pee in everyone's Cheerios... but it certainly wouldn't be wrong if we did. The truth of it is the reason some of us go so overboard on support is simply because that's the way it has always been for this vertical. Companies that don't specifically compete for adult business charge more for basic plans and also more for support. Generally speaking, when an "adult hoster" says fully managed hosting and support - that's what it means. It's an all you can eat buffet of skilled labor. In the "real world" it means they'll SMS you when your stuff is down and then you can fix it yourself or pay for assistance. LOL

Rare, but I agree with this statement.

Pretty much true, except two things. It's SweetT last I recall.. and quit perpetuating this myth that we're expensive, that's bullshit. While we may be another $25-$75 sometimes on the bottom end of dedicated hosting (don't refer to my web site, that's 7 years old! LOL) that doesn't make us expensive. Our "bottom" is differentiated in price based on the nuts and bolts of what is delivered. Tier IV data center, more carriers, actual use of better routes, routers, quality servers - actual infrastructure costs reflect in our base pricing. ...and that's all an aside from having full, well trained staffing. The only instances I ever see where we lose deals is if the buyer isn't educated and if the competing host is giving everything away because they don't know how else to make a sale, except for on price.

By no means am I making any comparison to Webair, in fact I don't like that I'm in another hoster thread. I very much like and respect Mike and his whole team. They do offer an exceptional value and when I suggest other hosts, they're at the top of the list.

Cheers :thumbsup

Brad

I think it's in the mind that some people rather not see somethings even when they
are clearly there.

:2 cents:

It's funny. Just take our word for it.

Update your website.
:winkwink:

As for the rest of your points of reference, it is like someone comparing Burst to Softlayer.

:2 cents:

No, on my netbook you just see a pair of freaky floating teeth until you tilt the screen a bit.

No subliminal mind games to suggest I am a closet racist. :)

Oh so budget hosting for the broke losers?

Now I understand why certain companies have threads opened about them.

Get real hosting ...

Man, I looked at the picture from left to right and then read the caption and then looked again and THEN I saw the black girl. I did get a chuckle..

Brad

You completely missed the point, but that is nothing new for you. :2 cents:

You are making the assertion that all web hosting companies should provide the same level of support and service as a MOJO/NatNet/Softlayer although many others charge significantly less for an apples to apples server.

Additionally, others offer a different level of support. Often times provide basic/semi/unmanaged dedicated, with an upgrade option for FULLY MANAGED or you pay per incident/hour. Which is why you are getting a Dual Core for $58.00 or a Quad Core for $99.00.

If a client fails to do their due diligence, and make this distinction, or read up on the differences, this is the web hosting company's fault........... how?

the girl to the far left that fell in some dark chocolate before the photo :helpme

Barefootsies way off as always.

Asserting assumptions as fact.

The reason this is an issue at all is, most hosting companies consider this a standard.

You say its only the "expensive" hosts that provide this for free.

Never once have I been billed for migration of files, DBs, Sites in general. Never. I have used host gator, gotwebhost mojohost and a plethora of others... notice they all range in pricing and credibility.

Insert your foot in your mouth. Move on.

Is this something that your "hosting" would charge a client or potential client for?

You can speak for all web hosting companies? Impressive.

I have said no such thing.

My point was the difference between a bar of support and service that a NatNat/MOJO/Softlayer provides compared to a Burst, Joe's Data Center, etc.. Typicall there is also a difference in price for that level of support and service.

Perhaps if your blind hatred for me did not repeatedly cloud your better judgement troll delight you would have followed the example as detailed and stayed on topic. Mkay, thanks.

I do not believe anyone asked.

However, I am sure that your vast online experience has you using how many different web hosts in 10 years toots? Five? Ten maybe? I am sure that makes you the definitive authority on 'the hosting industry'' and what is considered a "standard" to speak to what "all" hosting companies do as a norm.

Thanks for sharing champ. You may go now.

:2 cents:

Or maybe black people spot other black people easier than whites.

Yes you absolutely referred to the migration fee being waved for "high end" hosts since they charge for dedicated and its covered.

my point was... youre talking out your ass as always. oh and because youre a low end hosts that seems like the sort that would charge for this... by your past actions and your talk here in this thread.

Yes... in my ten years I have a vast experience with hosts... id say it lands more around 12-15. Take in mind, I have dealt with many hosts through clients I have served as well. Never have I been charged for this. Never even spoke of this. Now while this case may be a little different since he was an existing customer. Any host in my experience has been happy to do this for free just to gain and keep your business...

So the other point is... any host that would migrate files and sites for a fee is lacking customer support since this is... Heres the key phrase since youre slow... Its standard practice amongst hosts. low level or high.

wtf? you pay $99 for server and expect them to be your slaves?

christ are you serious :1orglaugh:1orglaugh

you are almost on par with pastorsinalot in playing the
http://scottystarnes.files.wordpress.../race_card.gif

Yeah, agreed

WOW. Hold the front page.

"Commercial business needs paying for doing work" shocker

Ah, I see. Cool.

I'm going to go with Barefootsies on this one. It all depends on the host and their policies. I've never in all my years in this industry asked a host to move a site for me. I always did that myself because I tend to get unmanaged servers in order to save some money. I then manage them myself. It's not exactly a quick job either to move sites. Sometimes it can take a while to make sure everything is working right and to check for configuration errors. When you are managing a server yourself it's often better to do it yourself anyway so that you know how everything is configured. This should make later maintenance easier.

Now $150 an hour does seem a little high to me under the circumstances but it's their business and their decision. Just as it is your decision whether you will do business with them.

shit, if we say its managed its managed regardless the price we charge. If a host is "managed" but wont transfer sites from somewhere else to your box then its not managed.

Its pretty simple. I don't know why the need for 2 pages of this debate. If its a 99/month managed box or a 800/month managed box. The point is.. its managed!

Agreed.

Only a ignorant trolling retard like Deej would make assertions otherwise trying to sum up the whole web hosting industry based on his meager 10-15 host experience. I can think of hosts off the top of my head that charge for OS reinstalls, among other (what I consider) minor things. That is their business model. Whatever. It must work for them. If you do not like their policies, do not host there.

That being said, you can clearly see this is more about his personal beef with me, not really the topic at hand. He's little more than an ignorant loud mouth, who relentlessly trolls people he doesn't like. You will find I rarely acknowledge his existence on GFY or in threads as I can barely tolerate his level of intelligence, if you want to call it that. In the end it really amounts to little more than "trying to prove Barefootsies wrong".


He will continue on in this thread like a dog with a bone. Typically the next follow ups by him will have something to do with "being respected" or that "he is well liked"... Ya know. All of those pedigree things that mean something in the real world when you have to pay your mortgage, or car loan. :1orglaugh :1orglaugh :1orglaugh

There could always be more to the story chief. Migration of the site could be simply moving the files, assuming that everything will work one moved. However, you and I both know there could be a lot more involved. Updating license IP's, file path routes, and trouble shooting involved.

In short, trouble shooting third party scripts. Which many hosts consider outside of normal support, hence they charge for it. Whether right, or wrong. That is how they do it. If you provide it for free, lovely. Nice sales for you. But to make the assumption all hosts will do this is simply not the case.

I do not think there is much of a debate really. It is simply a matter of defining what "managed" means at different hosts (full, basic, semi, etc.), and what they include in the price. Making an assumption of what is included is basically what can lead to these issues. Many host simply do not trouble shoot third party scripts is a good example. If I had servers at MOJO/NATNET/Softlayer I would assume I was fully managed. If I was hosting at Burst, Joe's, Wholesale, etc. I would expect to be billed extra.

I am not saying it's right or wrong. I am simply saying that just as some hosts charge $25-35 for an OS reinstall. Some will migrate your files, but they are not going to trouble shoot your third party scripts for you all afternoon for free. The policies, the costs, and "what is covered" varies wildly from one company to the next. That was essentially the 'point'.

:2 cents:

My host has done that a hundred times for me for free. Get a new hosting company.

Edit: I saw all of the drama. I have bought and sold a fair amount of sites and most hosting companies will "tar" them up or move them or whatever for free. They have pretty much all offered to do it for free without even being asked. Yes, I use managed hosting.

Agreed. If you do not like their policies, move to another host.
:thumbsup