Wis. GOP bypasses Dems, cuts collective bargaining

[Rangermoore]

Good Stuff... There is more than one way LMAO

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_wisconsin_budget_unions

[GatorB]

Good Stuff... There is more than one way LMAO

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_wisconsin_budget_unions

If you think that's good you're retarded. Nothing like doing things like some dictatorship. Now I'm understand why the GOP uses the color RED. Just like China and the old USSR.

[Tom_PM]

It was an illegal action and will not stand.

[ThunderBalls]

May 1933 - Hitler busted the unions in Germany. Republicans are fascists, no two ways about it.

[woj]

May 1933 - Hitler busted the unions in Germany. Republicans are fascists, no two ways about it.

[Wolfy]

It always amazes me how liberal webmasters tend to be, in spite of hte fact that we're all supposed to be entrepreneurs and working for ourselves.

Do you all realize that you're here working your ass off... just to give it back to "your" party?

I mean, I know the left is more tolerant of porn... but the left doesn't necessarily encourage people to work hard and prosper.

It was an illegal action and will not stand.

I fucking hope it stands. Those assfuck Democrat whining shitface douchebags needed to come back to work a long time ago, and if this is what it takes to get things done, then so be it. The state voted, chose Walker, and now he's doing his job. I didn't vote for our president, but I would never support any senator or congressman not going to work.

[Sausage]

It always amazes me how liberal webmasters tend to be, in spite of hte fact that we're all supposed to be entrepreneurs and working for ourselves.

Do you all realize that you're here working your ass off... just to give it back to "your" party?

I mean, I know the left is more tolerant of porn... but the left doesn't necessarily encourage people to work hard and prosper.



I fucking hope it stands. Those assfuck Democrat whining shitface douchebags needed to come back to work a long time ago, and if this is what it takes to get things done, then so be it. The state voted, chose Walker, and now he's doing his job. I didn't vote for our president, but I would never support any senator or congressman not going to work.

Yeah well said.

Surprised the guys who aren't turning up to work aren't fired. Would happen in any other job.

[The Demon]

Well said.. I think thunderballs wins the award for "dumbest comment of the year".

[MetaMan]

Fuck public sector workers. A bunch of useless idiots in the entire lot. If you don't like your job or pay QUIT. Why should private sector have to pay for someones retirement on top of it?

Where do these idiots think the money comes from? What do they think is happening to the economy? A bunch of whiny fuck tards.

[ThunderBalls]

Well said.. I think thunderballs wins the award for "dumbest comment of the year".

Says the biggest troll on GFY who has to suck his step dads cock to have a roof over his head. Ever consider doing something with your life other than being a troll on a porn board?

[kane]

While I don't agree with how this all went down, I do agree that public sector workers should have benefits that are on par with private sector workers and not just be handed a full pension that they pay nothing out of their own pocket for and other great benefits just because they work for the government.

[cwd]

If Walker was truely serious he would have included all public sector workers, pussy.

[The Demon]

Says the biggest troll on GFY who has to suck his step dads cock to have a roof over his head. Ever consider doing something with your life other than being a troll on a porn board?

I rest my case..

[BlackCrayon]

It always amazes me how liberal webmasters tend to be, in spite of hte fact that we're all supposed to be entrepreneurs and working for ourselves.

Do you all realize that you're here working your ass off... just to give it back to "your" party?

I mean, I know the left is more tolerant of porn... but the left doesn't necessarily encourage people to work hard and prosper.



I fucking hope it stands. Those assfuck Democrat whining shitface douchebags needed to come back to work a long time ago, and if this is what it takes to get things done, then so be it. The state voted, chose Walker, and now he's doing his job. I didn't vote for our president, but I would never support any senator or congressman not going to work.

neither party works in favor of the american people. its all just about money. you are working your ass off so corporations can exploit the world, so bankers can pull pump and dump scams on the american people and then get bailed out when things don't go their way. i could go on and on..why people are taking some kind of stand on this issue when there have been so many instances of the american people being raped lately, i just don't get. these workers should have the right to fight for whatever wages they want. if they don't get it, they will either have to go back to work or leave. what is the issue really? some private sector strikes last for years..why isn't everyone shitting on them?

[BlackCrayon]

While I don't agree with how this all went down, I do agree that public sector workers should have benefits that are on par with private sector workers and not just be handed a full pension that they pay nothing out of their own pocket for and other great benefits just because they work for the government.

huh? they aren't paying into a pension? how does that work? everyone who pays into a pension gets a big chunk of their pay taken off for it...

[Vendzilla]

The state needs to make changes when a Wisconsin Bus Driver makes $159,000 per year!!!
This will allow that to happen.
12 states already put an end to collective bargaining in their state and President Carter put an end to collective bargaining for federal employee's.

The Democrats were suppose to clean up the mess the GOP made by putting in change, that was what they ran on in 2006, now the GOP ran on cleaning up the mess in 2010 and they are doing just that!

[The Demon]

The state needs to make changes when a Wisconsin Bus Driver makes $159,000 per year!!!
This will allow that to happen.
12 states already put an end to collective bargaining in their state and President Carter put an end to collective bargaining for federal employee's.

The Democrats were suppose to clean up the mess the GOP made by putting in change, that was what they ran on in 2006, now the GOP ran on cleaning up the mess in 2010 and they are doing just that!

You forget Vendzilla, it's all Bush's fault. Remember?

[cwd]

if this is all about saving money for the state, why is Walker only targeting certain unions and not all? he needs to get serious and get rid of them all.

[IllTestYourGirls]

huh? they aren't paying into a pension? how does that work? everyone who pays into a pension gets a big chunk of their pay taken off for it...

In the past 10 years the WI public workers have only paid in 5% to 6% of what the government has paid out in pensions. That is how they are not "paying for it".

[Vendzilla]

You forget Vendzilla, it's all Bush's fault. Remember?

I'm not blaming anyone, just seems that we are worse off after 4 years of democrat control than we were before, now that everything is fucked, the GOP has a plan to fix it with a plan that a Democrat President used during his presidency. Carter ended collective bargaining for the federal employee's and they are doing just fine, but the liberals are screaming foul against the GOP based on passion and not common sense.

When a Bus driver is making 159k a year and the Teachers union last year fought to get Viagra added to their benefits, things are way out there and need to be changed.

The problem with public unions in that they are bagaining with the same people they are helping to get elected and get the perks like this.
This has to stop, I just hope this comes to California, but that pussy Brown will never let that happen.

[cykoe6]

Fuck public sector workers. A bunch of useless idiots in the entire lot. If you don't like your job or pay QUIT. Why should private sector have to pay for someones retirement on top of it?

Where do these idiots think the money comes from? What do they think is happening to the economy? A bunch of whiny fuck tards.

I could not say it any better.

[BlackCrayon]

In the past 10 years the WI public workers have only paid in 5% to 6% of what the government has paid out in pensions. That is how they are not "paying for it".

Well I am not sure on the average amount put in. I know you get more back than you put in but this is because the money is invested. Its still their money thats being invested, so they deserve to get back more than whatever they put in. Of course if they invest it poorly it creates problems but typically these are invested in 'safe' stocks that may not pay out the most but aren't so volatile.

As for the example of a bus driver making that much, that is the exception, not the norm. There might be a handful of these people in the entire USA but its just used to get people worked up. If the guy paid his dues and put his entire life into it, I'd say he deserves what was promised to him.

[cwd]

I'm not blaming anyone, just seems that we are worse off after 4 years of democrat control than we were before, now that everything is fucked, the GOP has a plan to fix it with a plan that a Democrat President used during his presidency. Carter ended collective bargaining for the federal employee's and they are doing just fine, but the liberals are screaming foul against the GOP based on passion and not common sense.

When a Bus driver is making 159k a year and the Teachers union last year fought to get Viagra added to their benefits, things are way out there and need to be changed.

The problem with public unions in that they are bagaining with the same people they are helping to get elected and get the perks like this.
This has to stop, I just hope this comes to California, but that pussy Brown will never let that happen.

damn, 159k a year to be a bus driver...I picked the wrong profession.

[BlackCrayon]

damn, 159k a year to be a bus driver...I picked the wrong profession.

don't fall for the red herring. its just a dumbo stat they throw out there that one or two guys might be making. you should also note, they didn't start off making this. they probably worked 40 years (i'd want to shoot myself after 40 years of driving a bus) and probably rarely if ever called in sick, etc. its not the norm! its just put out there to get the simpletons worked up.

[cwd]

don't fall for the red herring. its just a dumbo stat they throw out there that one or two guys might be making. you should also note, they didn't start off making this. they probably worked 40 years (i'd want to shoot myself after 40 years of driving a bus) and probably rarely if ever called in sick, etc. its not the norm! its just put out there to get the simpletons worked up.

oh I see, he has an actual salary of around 50k...gee, with all the facts, things get a little more tricky


"Nelson earned $159,258 in 2009, including $109,892 in overtime and other pay."

http://host.madison.com/wsj/news/loc...cc4c002e0.html

[BlackCrayon]

oh I see, he has an actual salary of around 50k...gee, with all the facts, things get a little more tricky


"Nelson earned $159,258 in 2009, including $109,892 in overtime and other pay."

http://host.madison.com/wsj/news/loc...cc4c002e0.html

I wonder how many hours a day he had to work to build up al that overtime. Sounds like they need to hire more bus drivers then they wouldn't need guys for overtime.

[cwd]

I'm not blaming anyone, just seems that we are worse off after 4 years of democrat control than we were before, now that everything is fucked, the GOP has a plan to fix it with a plan that a Democrat President used during his presidency. Carter ended collective bargaining for the federal employee's and they are doing just fine, but the liberals are screaming foul against the GOP based on passion and not common sense.

When a Bus driver is making 159k a year and the Teachers union last year fought to get Viagra added to their benefits, things are way out there and need to be changed.

The problem with public unions in that they are bagaining with the same people they are helping to get elected and get the perks like this.
This has to stop, I just hope this comes to California, but that pussy Brown will never let that happen.

I still don't get why only certain public workers unions are being targeted? If there is such a need to save money as is claimed, then wouldn't you try to save as much as possible, meaning ALL unions? What makes one better than the other?

[woj]

I still don't get why only certain public workers unions are being targeted? If there is such a need to save money as is claimed, then wouldn't you try to save as much as possible, meaning ALL unions? What makes one better than the other?

maybe it's just a start? perhaps targeted unions are where most of the $$ is wasted?

[woj]

oh I see, he has an actual salary of around 50k...gee, with all the facts, things get a little more tricky


"Nelson earned $159,258 in 2009, including $109,892 in overtime and other pay."

http://host.madison.com/wsj/news/loc...cc4c002e0.html

no matter how anyone spins it, there is some major incompetence/fraud somewhere...
at the end of the day nothing will be done about it...
if push comes to shove, we'll just raise taxes and business will continue as usual...

[woj]

don't fall for the red herring. its just a dumbo stat they throw out there that one or two guys might be making. you should also note, they didn't start off making this. they probably worked 40 years (i'd want to shoot myself after 40 years of driving a bus) and probably rarely if ever called in sick, etc. its not the norm! its just put out there to get the simpletons worked up.

red herring, come on, there is no reason why 110k in overtime should have been paid out to anyone... it's not like the job requires high level of skill... you could take some random guy off the street, train him for a week, and you have another bus driver ready to go...

[cwd]

maybe it's just a start? perhaps targeted unions are where most of the $$ is wasted?

maybe, I mean I can see why people might think that, I am sure we all know some public school teachers who are making bank. although FoxNews has an interesting take on it.

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/shep-smit...s-is-malarkey/

[BlackCrayon]

red herring, come on, there is no reason why 110k in overtime should have been paid out to anyone... it's not like the job requires high level of skill... you could take some random guy off the street, train him for a week, and you have another bus driver ready to go...

Obviously they needed someone to fill those shifts. Should the workers who cover those shifts be punished because they aren't hiring enough drivers?

[woj]

Obviously they needed someone to fill those shifts. Should the workers who cover those shifts be punished because they aren't hiring enough drivers?

"punished" in what sense? That someone might start cleaning up this mess and opportunity to make 159k/year might go away?

[Vendzilla]

damn, 159k a year to be a bus driver...I picked the wrong profession.

These guys are milking the system

Obviously they needed someone to fill those shifts. Should the workers who cover those shifts be punished because they aren't hiring enough drivers?

Ok, just to educate you,


Overtime is high for several reasons, says Metro general manager Chuck Kamp:
?Metro employees are exhausting sick leave time, taking advantage of the federal Family Medical Leave Act and have high rate of absenteeism without pay.
?For example, use of the medical leave act by Metro employees jumped 44 percent to 28,340 hours from 2008 to 2009, Kamp said, calling it "the driving factor" for overtime last year.
Source: Dean Mosiman, "Madison Metro driver highest paid city employee," Wisconsin State Journal, February 7, 2010.

Yet he made more than the Mayor of the same city, more than the Police Chief.

[cwd]

These guys are milking the system



Ok, just to educate you,


Overtime is high for several reasons, says Metro general manager Chuck Kamp:
?Metro employees are exhausting sick leave time, taking advantage of the federal Family Medical Leave Act and have high rate of absenteeism without pay.
?For example, use of the medical leave act by Metro employees jumped 44 percent to 28,340 hours from 2008 to 2009, Kamp said, calling it "the driving factor" for overtime last year.
Source: Dean Mosiman, "Madison Metro driver highest paid city employee," Wisconsin State Journal, February 7, 2010.

Yet he made more than the Mayor of the same city, more than the Police Chief.

ok, so we go after the overpaid bus drivers and teachers, but not the police officers or firefighters? I don't get it. If Wisc is in such a financial mess, why do some get a free ride and not others?

[Vendzilla]

ok, so we go after the overpaid bus drivers and teachers, but not the police officers or firefighters? I don't get it. If Wisc is in such a financial mess, why do some get a free ride and not others?

Can't answer that

[12clicks]

If you think that's good you're retarded. Nothing like doing things like some dictatorship. Now I'm understand why the GOP uses the color RED. Just like China and the old USSR.

hahahaha. christ, this clown doesn't even understand the simple terms he throws around.
dear child, the house voted on it, the senate voted on it and the governor will sign it.
thats called democracy.
the days of the idiot left are numbered

[Vendzilla]

hahahaha. christ, this clown doesn't even understand the simple terms he throws around.
dear child, the house voted on it, the senate voted on it and the governor will sign it.
thats called democracy.
the days of the idiot left are numbered

Anyone that compares the GOP to the USSR doesn't understand what socialism is, I doubt if he can tie his own shoes, that's why I have him on ignore.

[_Richard_]

wonder what the right will turn out to be, was funny reading the policies 60 years ago or so

[kane]

huh? they aren't paying into a pension? how does that work? everyone who pays into a pension gets a big chunk of their pay taken off for it...

It can vary from state to state and it also depends on what job you do. There are many government workers who pay nothing into their pensions and get full benefits after a certain period of time. Often even when they pay into their pensions it is not on par with what the average private sector worker pays into theirs.

Most private sector workers would have a 401K and they put a percentage of their pay into that. Often employers will match the contribution up to a certain percentage and then that money is invested to help it grow. For example, say you put in 3% of your income and your employer matches it. Now 6% of your income is being put away. That money is normally invested into the stock market on your behalf. If the market crashes, you could be out of luck and lose a big chunk of that and how much you end up actually getting when you retire is heavily dependent on how well the investments do.

Many government workers might put 1-2% of their income in, but are guaranteed a certain retire amount no matter what the economy/stock market does. This often ends up costing the tax payers a lot. For example, in New York the city pensions are guaranteed to grow at 8% per year and if investments don't cover that, the tax payers do. What has ended up happening there is that for every $1 the government worker has put into their pension the tax payers have had to kick in $8.60.

Another sticking point is that many government pensions also include free or very low cost health insurance where a private sector retirement likely does not. When you retire getting health insurance on your own is nearly impossible so likely you will end up on Medicare with some kind of a supplemental policy that could end up being fairly expensive.

I'm not saying we should strip government workers of all their benefits, but I think they need to be brought more inline with what a similar person in the private sector might earn.

[Tom_PM]

When I said it was an illegal act and will not stand, I was basing that on the apparent meeting laws and memo written only last August by that states attorney general. According to him, this was an illegal act.

That is, according to his memo from last August, it would be considered illegal. Will the state attorney general now step up or just tow a party line? Who is he beholden to, his oath of office, or his party? Guess this will be his test.

[BlackCrayon]

ok, so we go after the overpaid bus drivers and teachers, but not the police officers or firefighters? I don't get it. If Wisc is in such a financial mess, why do some get a free ride and not others?

how about overpaid politicians! i don't see them looking to cut their own salaries.

[BlackCrayon]

These guys are milking the system



Ok, just to educate you,


Overtime is high for several reasons, says Metro general manager Chuck Kamp:
?Metro employees are exhausting sick leave time, taking advantage of the federal Family Medical Leave Act and have high rate of absenteeism without pay.
?For example, use of the medical leave act by Metro employees jumped 44 percent to 28,340 hours from 2008 to 2009, Kamp said, calling it "the driving factor" for overtime last year.
Source: Dean Mosiman, "Madison Metro driver highest paid city employee," Wisconsin State Journal, February 7, 2010.

Yet he made more than the Mayor of the same city, more than the Police Chief.

so whats the solution? don't give them sick time? no overtime? people are talking like its the guy salary but he had to work many man long hours to get that pay. seems to me they just need to hire more drivers..

[Wizzo]

Right to work is the only way to go, unions are well beyond their usefulness...

[TheDoc]

Walker wasn't voted in to do this. He never once said or wrote that he would bust the unions or end collective bargaining.

The State was never hurt/hit or broke because of the Unions, it was the Eco fall of 07 that did it, very easy to research. Everything 'was fine' until after the States all over forced our Tax Dollars into that crap market that ended up sucking the nation dry.

Today this is not about Unions or a bullshit budget, it never has been. This is about Corporate take over and money. Now that Corps can give as much money as they want to politicians, they are.

He's being backed by the Koch brothers, openly... and some people still think this is about Unions.

The Bill didn't actually end collective bargaining, it restricted it, however he also took away pension on money already earned by people, something they already worked for and paid for.

The Unions had agreed to everything in the bill, then he pushed this shit in and created a shit storm. IE: He had everything taken care of that 'was budget related' then still shit on everyone.

It's illegal what they did.

The Bill limits the right to assemble, which is kinda against the Constitution, you know this part... "the right to peaceably assemble" ~ Firing a person because they protest you, is well a slap in every Americans face.

Just sad... so sad to watch the supporters of this action, do so with no actual understanding of what is really going on. Wake up... the media is twisting you to blame people and not focus on the truth or the real problem. It's happening, right in front of you - they admit it, and you still... don't believe it.

That's sad...

[PornoMonster]

CWD I also was not aware of the difference between Public and Gov Unions.
After long google searches, I now see why GOV and some Private unions are so bad...

[PornoMonster]

how about overpaid politicians! i don't see them looking to cut their own salaries.

That is one thing Neither side will cut!

[NaughtyVisions]

...last year fought to get Viagra added to their benefits, things are way out there and need to be changed.

I don't know about you, but my productivity drops dramatically unless I have a constant raging hard on.

[cwd]

so, this really has nothing to do with balancing the budget...

[GregE]

I'm not blaming anyone, just seems that we are worse off after 4 years of democrat control than we were before, now that everything is fucked, the GOP has a plan to fix it with a plan that a Democrat President used during his presidency. Carter ended collective bargaining for the federal employee's and they are doing just fine, but the liberals are screaming foul against the GOP based on passion and not common sense.

Please tell me that you're not citing the actions of the 2nd worst president in American history as justification for that Wisconsin teabagger's actions.

Talk about reaching