Manwin's Fabian Thylmann: "likely the biggest porn tycoon on the planet" - Page 2 - GoFuckYourself.com

Phoenix · 02-01-2011, 08:05 AM

50 people holding Fabians jock

CaptainHowdy · 02-01-2011, 08:09 AM

Is this a christian board?? If so my name is Jonah...

JA$ON · 02-01-2011, 08:10 AM

Here, I'll fix it for them...

Manwin's Fabian Thylmann: "likely the biggest front man for a group of behind the scenes porn tycoons on the planet"

Paul Markham · 02-01-2011, 08:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pipecrew

Will, this is kind of embarrassing at this point, your just beating a dead horse and not even thinking about other options. Did Fabian ever come out and say "I paid 100 + million cash".

When you go and buy a house or a car, do you have to pay the full amount in cash?

This business is a positive cashflow business, I am sure he didnt use a bank to finance this, but I am sure as hell betting he could have with a good financial analysis of the company.

and

if you are in the right circles, individual wealthy investors would be all over a company like this. If they are offered a % of the company or a good interest rate on the money loaned it would be no problem coming up with even 400 million dollars in a short time.

Just because you do not have 50,100, 200 million dollars to play with, does not mean others in the world do not, and I think you would be amazed at how many wealthy people have that sitting around looking to parlay it into even more.

Can you name any other company that got BIG financial backing, in the porn business from banks or legit wealthy individuals? Online porn by 2007 wasn't that good an investment to warrant people putting in $100 mill.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pipecrew

That's probably easier said than done. You have to have a proven track record and a decent amount of your "own skin in the game"

So what was his track record. He wrote NATS and had some success with SEO. Can you name one person who made $140 mill in 3 years with SEO?

My problem with Fabian is we know very little about him or his company. He's clueless about porn prior to joining NATS, was a programmer there and consistently has been caught out lying on the board.

I suspect he's just the front man for others who want to stay hidden.

theking · 02-01-2011, 08:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

If you are the biggest porn tycoon on the planet, you're a tycoon ruling over a failing industry.

A couple of statements that don't make logical sense,

"Fabian Thylmann, the current owner of the company, whom NYMag calls "likely the biggest porn tycoon on the planet", argues that the wide availability of free online porn has created more people who would be willing to eventually pay for porn."

" Thylmann made his money (NYMag estimates he spent around $140 million to build his empire) buying up niche porn sites for a handful of cash and making them almost instantly more profitable by boosting things like search engine traffic and conversions."

We all know giving the product away doesn't encourage as many new buyers as it deters old one. And we all know you don't build $140 million in 3 years by niche sites. Unless they're major niche site and you're a genius.

Clueless...it does not appear to be a failing industry for his company...as his company seems to be out to become the industry...by big dog eating the little dog.

theking · 02-01-2011, 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Can you name any other company that got BIG financial backing, in the porn business from banks or legit wealthy individuals? Online porn by 2007 wasn't that good an investment to warrant people putting in $100 mill.

So what was his track record. He wrote NATS and had some success with SEO. Can you name one person who made $140 mill in 3 years with SEO?

My problem with Fabian is we know very little about him or his company. He's clueless about porn prior to joining NATS, was a programmer there and consistently has been caught out lying on the board.

I suspect he's just the front man for others who want to stay hidden.

Clueless...clueless...clueless. BTW...what lies has he been caught in...be specific?

Mutt · 02-01-2011, 08:29 AM

so transparent - Brazzers gave the writer the story they want the industry and the world to know, journalists are lazy, this wasn't investigative, it was a puff piece about some Arab Canadian kids making it big in internet porn - surprised that the Canadian government which forces multiculturalism down our throats hasn't given them the Order of Canada medal.

pretty obvious that they weren't comfortable being the kings of porn with bullseyes on their backs, the 24 hour protection they felt they needed - they're obviously smart young guys, they faked their own 'death' so to speak.

Nathan's the front man now, and I don't doubt the Brazzers kids sold off some equity, cash is nice to have, and reorganized the corporate setup to keep themselves hidden, the same way they attempted to cover their porn industry tracks in the search engines with bogus shit.

it's a private company, nobody knows the truth except them.

Caligari · 02-01-2011, 08:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theking

Clueless...it does not appear to be a failing industry for his company...as his company seems to be out to become the industry...by big dog eating the little dog.

wise man say "big dog stronger than little dog, but many little dogs beat shit out of big dog"

DWB · 02-01-2011, 08:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

If you are the biggest porn tycoon on the planet, you're a tycoon ruling over a failing industry.
.

Paul, I don't think you get it.

What's that old saying, "Buy when there is blood on the streets."

Well, there is blood on the streets and Manwin is buying. Manwin is buying up as much real estate as possible. They are probably turning record profits, and they don't care about if you are making money or not.

After they control the best real estate and most everyone has closed shop or sold out, who do you think is going to literally online porn? Short of some niche mom and pop operations, it's going to be a few large companies running everything.

It doesn't matter who Nathan is or isn't. As much as I don't like the tube side of their business, and as much as it sometimes infuriates me to no end, it doesn't matter, they have changed the game. And while I don't advocate working with them, you can either complain from the bench or get in the game and either do your own thing to secure your place in a changing industry, or try to work with them and the current trends and see where that takes you.

I don't like it as much as you, but I'm smart enough to know the game has changed and I need to change too, so I have. I'm adapting to the situation and implementing plans for my future. What I personally think of Nathan or the tubes at this point is irrelevant. We're all here to make money, and while this business model may be hurting a lot of us, it's fuck or walk. Get in where you fit in or go plant flowers with your wife.

cocetz3 · 02-01-2011, 08:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackCrayon

so basically the guy is who is he us simply because he found a couple good investors? in that case, he does not deserve all of this attention. anyone can do that with the right contacts.

so basically, why didnt you do it?

didnt have the right contacts or what?

DWB · 02-01-2011, 08:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caligari

wise man say "big dog stronger than little dog, but many little dogs beat shit out of big dog"

You do know what I do to dogs, don't you?

theking · 02-01-2011, 09:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DirtyWhiteBoy

Paul, I don't think you get it.

What's that old saying, "Buy when there is blood on the streets."

Well, there is blood on the streets and Manwin is buying. Manwin is buying up as much real estate as possible. They are probably turning record profits, and they don't care about if you are making money or not.

After they control the best real estate and most everyone has closed shop or sold out, who do you think is going to literally online porn? Short of some niche mom and pop operations, it's going to be a few large companies running everything.

It doesn't matter who Nathan is or isn't. As much as I don't like the tube side of their business, and as much as it sometimes infuriates me to no end, it doesn't matter, they have changed the game. And while I don't advocate working with them, you can either complain from the bench or get in the game and either do your own thing to secure your place in a changing industry, or try to work with them and the current trends and see where that takes you.

I don't like it as much as you, but I'm smart enough to know the game has changed and I need to change too, so I have. I'm adapting to the situation and implementing plans for my future. What I personally think of Nathan or the tubes at this point is irrelevant. We're all here to make money, and while this business model may be hurting a lot of us, it's fuck or walk. Get in where you fit in or go plant flowers with your wife.

Excellent critique.

Nicky · 02-01-2011, 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seth Manson

What ever happened to Daniel, from Sweden?

My name is Daniel and I'm from Sweden. I don't even have $1mil(yet) though

GonZo · 02-01-2011, 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seth Manson

What ever happened to Daniel, from Sweden?

hes probably writing some more code that runs a fake virus scan that makes your cd drawer pop out.

Hope he likes living in the Ukraine!

BlackCrayon · 02-01-2011, 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pipecrew

That's probably easier said than done. You have to have a proven track record and a decent amount of your "own skin in the game"

I'm sure it is. Unless he knew the investors personally. Are the investors from Montreal, foreign..who knows. It doesn't really matter but how much of his own money is in it and how much does he really get to keep. Thats what I wonder anyways.

BlackCrayon · 02-01-2011, 09:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cocetz3

so basically, why didnt you do it?

didnt have the right contacts or what?

i don't know rich people and i just like to do my thing on my own. i don't want employees or partners. i'm not aiming for the sky. just want to make a living. maybe i'm not ambitious enough.

Caligari · 02-01-2011, 09:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DirtyWhiteBoy

You do know what I do to dogs, don't you?

I'll take a wild guess and say it involves a jar of vaseline and bag of Kibbles And Bits

Supz · 02-01-2011, 09:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackCrayon

so basically the guy is who is he us simply because he found a couple good investors? in that case, he does not deserve all of this attention. anyone can do that with the right contacts.

You are correct that anyone can get money with a good idea. Not many people can turn it into profit. Just because you have money from investors does not mean you know what to do with it.

Si · 02-01-2011, 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Supz

You are correct that anyone can get money with a good idea. Not many people can turn it into profit. Just because you have money from investors does not mean you know what to do with it.

http://iporn.com comes to mind

Elli · 02-01-2011, 09:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caligari

wise man say "big dog stronger than little dog, but many little dogs beat shit out of big dog"

Are you trying to say, "Even a rabbit can bite the ear of a sleeping bear?"

signupdamnit · 02-01-2011, 09:44 AM

Quote:

I don't like it as much as you, but I'm smart enough to know the game has changed and I need to change too, so I have. I'm adapting to the situation and implementing plans for my future. What I personally think of Nathan or the tubes at this point is irrelevant. We're all here to make money, and while this business model may be hurting a lot of us, it's fuck or walk. Get in where you fit in or go plant flowers with your wife.

Just a couple years ago I was able to find sites where I was able to send 15 new sign ups to in one day with as little as 400 hits. Not paid traffic but organic stuff all without spamming anyone. It was all about knowing what you were promoting and finding the right audience. The game was putting out those feelers in order to find these sites and traffic sources. That is what took the skill.

There isn't as much point in doing this now because those sites and surfers are becoming more rare. Even if you find a great converting site you are at the mercy of too many external variables. Will a rip get posted somewhere next week? Are Manwin's tubes going to start popping up on the first page of Google with 100 video from the member area tomorrow?

In 2011 the feat of sending 400 hits and making 15 $29.95 signups in one day without spamming seems like some kind of miracle. But in 2009 even it was easily obtainable if you knew what you were doing.

I've stopped making new sites dedicated to selling pay sites. I've stopped putting out those feelers looking for the next high converting site or traffic source to sell pay sites to. I won't take down what I already have because it's still profitable but I think it's time to sell something that some asshole next to me isn't giving away for free.

As for the assholes giving away the product and destroying my business they shouldn't count on getting any business from me in the future. I have a long memory.

ShellyCrash · 02-01-2011, 09:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mutt

so transparent - Brazzers gave the writer the story they want the industry and the world to know, journalists are lazy, this wasn't investigative, it was a puff piece about some Arab Canadian kids making it big in internet porn - surprised that the Canadian government which forces multiculturalism down our throats hasn't given them the Order of Canada medal.

pretty obvious that they weren't comfortable being the kings of porn with bullseyes on their backs, the 24 hour protection they felt they needed - they're obviously smart young guys, they faked their own 'death' so to speak.

Nathan's the front man now, and I don't doubt the Brazzers kids sold off some equity, cash is nice to have, and reorganized the corporate setup to keep themselves hidden, the same way they attempted to cover their porn industry tracks in the search engines with bogus shit.

it's a private company, nobody knows the truth except them.

Paul Markham · 02-01-2011, 09:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DirtyWhiteBoy

Paul, I don't think you get it.

What's that old saying, "Buy when there is blood on the streets."

Well, there is blood on the streets and Manwin is buying. Manwin is buying up as much real estate as possible. They are probably turning record profits, and they don't care about if you are making money or not.

After they control the best real estate and most everyone has closed shop or sold out, who do you think is going to literally online porn? Short of some niche mom and pop operations, it's going to be a few large companies running everything.

It doesn't matter who Nathan is or isn't. As much as I don't like the tube side of their business, and as much as it sometimes infuriates me to no end, it doesn't matter, they have changed the game. And while I don't advocate working with them, you can either complain from the bench or get in the game and either do your own thing to secure your place in a changing industry, or try to work with them and the current trends and see where that takes you.

I don't like it as much as you, but I'm smart enough to know the game has changed and I need to change too, so I have. I'm adapting to the situation and implementing plans for my future. What I personally think of Nathan or the tubes at this point is irrelevant. We're all here to make money, and while this business model may be hurting a lot of us, it's fuck or walk. Get in where you fit in or go plant flowers with your wife.

No you don't get it.

Teaching people not to pay for porn so you can make a quick buck off the few that do isn't long term good business. The reason the business is shrinking isn't that Tubes are free. It's;

TUBES ARE BETTER FOR MOST PORN CONSUMERS AND CUSTOMERS THAN PAID PORN.

And the more people who turn onto that the less that buy. So you're "getting into the game" of giving away your product to attract the few buyers left. And the next guy gets into the game, and the next, and the next, and the next and it leaves the porn consumer with even more reasons not to buy.

I don't need to change, made my money when the going was good. I feel sympathy for those who need to stay in the game and don't have the opportunity to get out or change their game.

The real problem started long before Tubes. The business model of spending 50% or more on driving traffic and 5% to 10% on the actual product was flawed. It invited people in with little clue how to shoot and the real expertise was in driving traffic. Now we have a situation with 1,000s of sites all with the same bland content and little to sell. People spending more and more on traffic that performs worse because the customer isn't that interested. And free porn.

But blaming the downturn of the business on Tubes is much easier than working out why so many prefer Pornhub to a paysite. And the solution takes real skill to bring about.

Paul Markham · 02-01-2011, 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by signupdamnit

Just a couple years ago I was able to find sites where I was able to send 15 new sign ups to in one day with as little as 400 hits. Not paid traffic but organic stuff all without spamming anyone. It was all about knowing what you were promoting and finding the right audience. The game was putting out those feelers in order to find these sites and traffic sources. That is what took the skill.

There isn't as much point in doing this now because those sites and surfers are becoming more rare. Even if you find a great converting site you are at the mercy of too many external variables. Will a rip get posted somewhere next week? Are Manwin's tubes going to start popping up on the first page of Google with 100 video from the member area tomorrow?

In 2011 the feat of sending 400 hits and making 15 $29.95 signups in one day without spamming seems like some kind of miracle. But in 2009 even it was easily obtainable if you knew what you were doing.

I've stopped making new sites dedicated to selling pay sites. I've stopped putting out those feelers looking for the next high converting site or traffic source to sell pay sites to. I won't take down what I already have because it's still profitable but I think it's time to sell something that some asshole next to me isn't giving away for free.

As for the assholes giving away the product and destroying my business they shouldn't count on getting any business from me in the future. I have a long memory.

That's the solution. Now has anyone got the idea, brains and will, to bring it about?

fatfoo · 02-01-2011, 10:12 AM

Congratulations, Fabian Thylmann, with porn success.

Agent 488 · 02-01-2011, 10:14 AM

the piece was lacking in many ways, such as details about the washrooms at manwin hq.

babymaker · 02-01-2011, 10:15 AM

good article, but has a bunch of bs like only 1 million porn surfers 10 years ago lol the hun had 15million a day alone back then.

CaptainHowdy · 02-01-2011, 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fatfoo

Congratulations, Fabian Thylmann, with porn success.

I'd print this one and frame it...

signupdamnit · 02-01-2011, 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

That's the solution. Now has anyone got the idea, brains and will, to bring it about?

People already are to varying degrees. Even some pay sites still fit in with that classification (I could give a few examples but it would not be in my best interests to do so) because they haven't been hit with the piracy problem.....yet. But for the most part the opportunity is outside of adult pay sites right now and it will stay that way at least until the weak DMCA is fixed.

I think you actually make some great points and you're on the money. I don't agree with everything you have ever said in regards to this but the problem isn't just the tubes and the piracy, it's also the conditions which have made them ripe for the taking and the other contributory factors such as people banging cards or having shitty member's areas full of scams. The first thing I do before handing over my credit card online is search for negative reports from other consumers. That's one of the basic things we have overlooked in this industry. It applies not only to a individual paysite but also a processor too. If as an average Joe consumer I see that I'm going to be billed by CCBill and thusI search and find bad reports on ripoffreport.com, do you think I would feel good about continuing with the transaction - especially when I see some bullshit about being charged $49.95 if I don't cancel in 3 days? Yes, you're right. There are many examples of shitty business practices in this industry which are common place and these have all contributed. Ab-so-fucking-lute-ly. It's just that people didn't want to change it since they made money in the short term.

Love Sex · 02-01-2011, 10:20 AM

PORNHUB for the Win

TheDoc · 02-01-2011, 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

That's the solution. Now has anyone got the idea, brains and will, to bring it about?

That would be the Answer.

The solution is various technologies, from drm, mobile, augmented, iptv, and others.

Plenty of people willing to pay on the pc web - people haven't stopped buying. Let alone buying on on various technologies, all of which offer better/unique privacy over the web. If the people "wanted" free porn - if that was the drive "at all", they would just go get it on the pc - but that simply isn't the case.

DWB · 02-01-2011, 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elli

Are you trying to say, "Even a rabbit can bite the ear of a sleeping bear?"

Who are you, Confucius with tits?

MaDalton · 02-01-2011, 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DirtyWhiteBoy

Who are you, Confucius with tits?

with nice tits and a nice booty

jimmy-3-way · 02-01-2011, 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DirtyWhiteBoy

Who are you, Confucius with tits?

Classic.

DWB · 02-01-2011, 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

No you don't get it.

Teaching people not to pay for porn so you can make a quick buck off the few that do isn't long term good business. The reason the business is shrinking isn't that Tubes are free.

Paul, I do get it. And I don't like it. But take a look around you man.

This is not a matter of "teaching" people to not pay for porn, they have "taught" people not to.

This argument should have been had like 3 years ago. It's too late now. That's my point.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

And the more people who turn onto that the less that buy. So you're "getting into the game" of giving away your product to attract the few buyers left. And the next guy gets into the game, and the next, and the next, and the next and it leaves the porn consumer with even more reasons not to buy.

I'm in a position to have a unique product. I've always been in niche markets and there are only a handful of people in the entire WORLD shooting where I do. And while my pay sites have taken a hit due to many reasons, they are still very profitable.

In addition to pay sites, where do you think so many girls from SE Asia learn about webcams? Only a handful of people there too, and tubes are not ruining cams. You can't just think in terms of content / pay sites.

I don't care what happens to the next guy. He's not my problem. He's probably an asshole anyway. My eyes are on my ball.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

I don't need to change, made my money when the going was good. I feel sympathy for those who need to stay in the game and don't have the opportunity to get out or change their game.

So why all the complaining? Really man, if you have no dog in the fight, go spend time with your wife and don't waste your time on an industry that's already changed. Key word is changed. It's not changing.

It doesn't make sense, and neither does a world that is dependent on oil. But it's there and happening right now.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

The real problem started long before Tubes. The business model of spending 50% or more on driving traffic and 5% to 10% on the actual product was flawed. It invited people in with little clue how to shoot and the real expertise was in driving traffic. Now we have a situation with 1,000s of sites all with the same bland content and little to sell. People spending more and more on traffic that performs worse because the customer isn't that interested. And free porn.

Porn business models have always been fucked. That's what you get when you get a bunch of people running businesses who lucked into having a successful business. I'd bet 8 out of 10 of these people could not replicate their success if they started today.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

But blaming the downturn of the business on Tubes is much easier than working out why so many prefer Pornhub to a paysite. And the solution takes real skill to bring about.

Tubes, torrents, boards.... free is good for surfers. But the cats out of the bag and there is no changing that until laws on a GLOBAL level are changed. In the meantime, we all still have to make money. As much as I don't like what has happened, it did happen and here we are.

You, Will, myself and a million other people here could cry all day about PornHub, and you know where it would get us? NOWHERE. While you're complaining about who Nathan is and if he knows what toilets he has in the office, he is making money and not giving a shit. If he owns Manwin, so be it. If he doesn't and he's just a front man, HE IS DOING A DAMN GOOD JOB at making sure YOUR EYES are not on the ball. If he is the front man, he deserves a raise, because while everyone attacks, him, Manwin is making power moves while you're busy playing with your pecker.

The game has changed Paul. You don't like it, I don't like it, most people don't like it... but unless you are going to burn down Manwin's office and kill them all, give it a rest man. And even then, rid the world of them and another one will pop up in their place. That's how it works.

There is NOTHING you are going to say to anyone to change anything.

Go be retired man, enjoy life, enjoy the precious time you have with your wife. Don't waste another minute of your life on this stupid shit. It's stealing from you much more than it's stealing from the industry... your time.

Paul Markham · 02-01-2011, 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDoc

That would be the Answer.

The solution is various technologies, from drm, mobile, augmented, iptv, and others.

Plenty of people willing to pay on the pc web - people haven't stopped buying. Let alone buying on on various technologies, all of which offer better/unique privacy over the web. If the people "wanted" free porn - if that was the drive "at all", they would just go get it on the pc - but that simply isn't the case.

Not as many people are willing to pay for porn this month as were last month. Or this year as to last year.

You're right people will still pay for porn, but the numbers are reducing. Most Tubes are now supported by advertising from Dating, Web Cams and penis pills adverts.

The solution isn't to jump onto the bandwagon and give away more free porn. We've been going down that road for over 12 years and look where it got us to.

Just make sure you have an exit plan.

Elli · 02-01-2011, 10:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DirtyWhiteBoy

Who are you, Confucius with tits?

It's a Russian saying, but I'll take Ms. Confucius ftw

billywatson · 02-01-2011, 10:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Just make sure you have an exit plan.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Just make sure you have an exit plan.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Just make sure you have an exit plan.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Just make sure you have an exit plan.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Just make sure you have an exit plan.

I think this sums it up pretty well.

Paul Markham · 02-01-2011, 10:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DirtyWhiteBoy

Paul, I do get it. And I don't like it. But take a look around you man.

This is not a matter of "teaching" people to not pay for porn, they have "taught" people not to.

This argument should have been had like 3 years ago. It's too late now. That's my point.

Right, but we continue on the same route of giving it away in increasing numbers. Instead of thinking how to compete. Much easier to join them and make some money today.

Quote:

I'm in a position to have a unique product. I've always been in niche markets and there are only a handful of people in the entire WORLD shooting where I do. And while my pay sites have taken a hit due to many reasons, they are still very profitable.

In addition to pay sites, where do you think so many girls from SE Asia learn about webcams? Only a handful of people there too, and tubes are not ruining cams. You can't just think in terms of content / pay sites.

I don't care what happens to the next guy. He's not my problem. He's probably an asshole anyway. My eyes are on my ball.

The solution as you said isn't in paysites with pre recorded porn. Even if it's unique, it's a small niche.

Quote:

So why all the complaining? Really man, if you have no dog in the fight, go spend time with your wife and don't waste your time on an industry that's already changed. Key word is changed. It's not changing.

It doesn't make sense, and neither does a world that is dependent on oil. But it's there and happening right now.

I care about this industry. It's been kind to me and kept me for 3 decades plus. None of you will know what that's like.

Quote:

Porn business models have always been fucked. That's what you get when you get a bunch of people running businesses who lucked into having a successful business. I'd bet 8 out of 10 of these people could not replicate their success if they started today.

Wrong and right. It wasn't always fucked. But right about those who started years ago and wouldn't make it now.

Quote:

Tubes, torrents, boards.... free is good for surfers. But the cats out of the bag and there is no changing that until laws on a GLOBAL level are changed. In the meantime, we all still have to make money. As much as I don't like what has happened, it did happen and here we are.

So why haven't we changed?

Quote:

The game has changed Paul. You don't like it, I don't like it, most people don't like it... but unless you are going to burn down Manwin's office and kill them all, give it a rest man. And even then, rid the world of them and another one will pop up in their place. That's how it works.

There is NOTHING you are going to say to anyone to change anything.

The game has changed. So why are so many players not changing with it?

Quote:

Go be retired man, enjoy life, enjoy the precious time you have with your wife. Don't waste another minute of your life on this stupid shit. It's stealing from you much more than it's stealing from the industry... your time.

It's too cold here to go out. LOL

Otherwise I'm already enjoying myself.

Fabien · 02-01-2011, 11:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by signupdamnit

Just a couple years ago I was able to find sites where I was able to send 15 new sign ups to in one day with as little as 400 hits. Not paid traffic but organic stuff all without spamming anyone. It was all about knowing what you were promoting and finding the right audience. The game was putting out those feelers in order to find these sites and traffic sources. That is what took the skill.

There isn't as much point in doing this now because those sites and surfers are becoming more rare. Even if you find a great converting site you are at the mercy of too many external variables. Will a rip get posted somewhere next week? Are Manwin's tubes going to start popping up on the first page of Google with 100 video from the member area tomorrow?

In 2011 the feat of sending 400 hits and making 15 $29.95 signups in one day without spamming seems like some kind of miracle. But in 2009 even it was easily obtainable if you knew what you were doing.

I've stopped making new sites dedicated to selling pay sites. I've stopped putting out those feelers looking for the next high converting site or traffic source to sell pay sites to. I won't take down what I already have because it's still profitable but I think it's time to sell something that some asshole next to me isn't giving away for free.

As for the assholes giving away the product and destroying my business they shouldn't count on getting any business from me in the future. I have a long memory.

This is the number ONE reply i've ever seen

Sums it up.

Agent 488 · 02-01-2011, 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by signupdamnit

Just a couple years ago I was able to find sites where I was able to send 15 new sign ups to in one day with as little as 400 hits. Not paid traffic but organic stuff all without spamming anyone. It was all about knowing what you were promoting and finding the right audience. The game was putting out those feelers in order to find these sites and traffic sources. That is what took the skill.

There isn't as much point in doing this now because those sites and surfers are becoming more rare. Even if you find a great converting site you are at the mercy of too many external variables. Will a rip get posted somewhere next week? Are Manwin's tubes going to start popping up on the first page of Google with 100 video from the member area tomorrow?

In 2011 the feat of sending 400 hits and making 15 $29.95 signups in one day without spamming seems like some kind of miracle. But in 2009 even it was easily obtainable if you knew what you were doing.

I've stopped making new sites dedicated to selling pay sites. I've stopped putting out those feelers looking for the next high converting site or traffic source to sell pay sites to. I won't take down what I already have because it's still profitable but I think it's time to sell something that some asshole next to me isn't giving away for free.

As for the assholes giving away the product and destroying my business they shouldn't count on getting any business from me in the future. I have a long memory.

sounds like you wont have any business to give if you wanted, to be honest.

but i agree, the paysite model is dead/dying.

frank7799 · 02-01-2011, 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pipecrew

Just because you do not have 50,100, 200 million dollars to play with, does not mean others in the world do not, and I think you would be amazed at how many wealthy people have that sitting around looking to parlay it into even more.

Exactly. And Nathan obviously knows what he does. Nothing succeeds like success. His businessmodel works and without making profit he wouldn´t have been mentioned in the article.

TheDoc · 02-01-2011, 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Not as many people are willing to pay for porn this month as were last month. Or this year as to last year.

You're right people will still pay for porn, but the numbers are reducing. Most Tubes are now supported by advertising from Dating, Web Cams and penis pills adverts.

The solution isn't to jump onto the bandwagon and give away more free porn. We've been going down that road for over 12 years and look where it got us to.

Just make sure you have an exit plan.

The old technologies/methods aren't selling like yesterday/year, etc.. but porn itself is selling more today than ever before, with a larger global reach, than ever before.

You're confusing porn, an entire Industry filled with 1000's of ways to make money, with a single way that is harder to make money in today.... if tubes/free porn doesn't cut it for you, make money a different way.

The solution is to be in every market you can be in, including free porn. No reason to ignore single billing method worth a billion dollars a year - simply because a few less people are buying, your products.

No exit plan for a failed porn industry is needed unless I want to waste my time doing something that I'll never use and wont make me any money, now or in the future.

Porn will never die.... only the people that supply it will.

frank7799 · 02-01-2011, 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

He's clueless about porn prior to joining NATS, was a programmer there

Maybe that is what makes him so successful today. He was not involved in old fashioned businessmodels - most of the old companies dind´t even have one - and he can now develop new ones.

signupdamnit · 02-01-2011, 11:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Agent 488

sounds like you wont have any business to give if you wanted, to be honest.

but i agree, the paysite model is dead/dying.

Compared to Manwin, no. But as said I'm just one of many dogs.

I did around 75% in adult paysites last month. I'm looking to make that number 33% or less by the end of the year. It's been an adventure but I'm finally starting to learn how to convert cams and dating. Actually dating I already did a bit for several years but cams was new for me. I'd gladly take the old days of converting paysites under 1:500 routinely though. I bet you would as well.

I actually see a lot of opening in both dating and cams. The big players have some really wide gaps and aren't doing the game as well as they could. Lots of opportunity exists if one can take advantage of it. Then again maybe we will see dating and cams crash just as badly as the pay site model has? Always mainstream too I guess.

Roald · 02-01-2011, 11:24 AM

Did they mention the amount of toilets in the ManWin building?

nickey1952 · 02-01-2011, 11:32 AM

I believe it was in 2005 or 2006 Three guys flew down from Canada to have a meeting with producers like myself and introduced themselves as the Brazzer's team. I believe they had six employees at the time. One of them was Stephan Manos. We had a meeting at the Universal Hilton and discussed shoots, budgets and plans. Soon after I was the second producer working for them. At first they just had a few sites and my first shoot was for "Baby got boobs" with Brandy Taylor. He was far from the typical porn owner, a very nice guy that knew the internet and had no idea about producing porn all he knew he wanted the best that could possible be produced and was not worried about the budget. The first shoot grew into 10 a month, then 30 a month and then 40 a month. As a producer they are the perfect client. Deliver the goods that are what they want and get paid well and on time. In fact they paid 100% in full before the shoots and never questioned the invoices. There is a great trust. Soon the company grew and their dreams and demands increased. They added sites and tried new areas of the internet. I was always amazed and enjoyed working for them. The next time I met with Steven he had close to 125 employees and everyday a team of script writers would send scripts and scene descriptions, trust me it made things a lot easier to work with. I was proud to work for them and still are. I have been a content supplier since 30 years, I took my first nude when I was well below the legal age, (15). In the past years my clients have been a slew of A list clients including, Vogue, Glamour, Penthouse , Hustler, Score, Bang Bros, Porn.com, Twistys, EuroRevenue, Private, and a ton of smaller companies. By far Brazzers has raised the bar for content production and it has paid off. I knew they were investing millions into their product and creating a brand. I have heard all the discussions about tube sites ruining online porn but as Mr. Larry Flynt has stated "Water is free from the tap, but people continue to make it a billion dollar industry" Brazzers hasn't ruined online porn, poor production and cheap owners have by not moving forward and exploring different areas. Has Goldman Sachs ruined the banking industry? We continue to support them and pay the same people huge money to get us out of the financial jam that they got us in. Big business is just what it is big business, that is the way of the world so get use to it and think bigger then your pea sized brains tell you to do. Brazzers did, so why not you... good on you Stephan and good on you Fabien....

Paul Markham · 02-01-2011, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by frank7799

Maybe that is what makes him so successful today. He was not involved in old fashioned businessmodels - most of the old companies dind´t even have one - and he can now develop new ones.

Clueless reply. If you're going to sell a product a basic knowledge of that product and the business is fundamental. If you're going to get backing to the tune of $100 million having no knowledge of the business isn't a great starting point.

You need to understand where the old business models were wrong, to not repeat the mistakes.

Agent 488 · 02-01-2011, 01:43 PM

paul the manwin paysites probably have hundreds if not thousands of joins a day. people paying for porn. how are the doing it wrong?

Paul Markham · 02-01-2011, 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nickey1952

By far Brazzers has raised the bar for content production and it has paid off. I knew they were investing millions into their product and creating a brand.

Congrats on getting some work out of them.

Not sure what this means because I recently reviewed some scenes. Some were terrible and some were average. There was nothing that "raised the bar" in regards to what they were adding recently. Cheap, average "porn by numbers" is the best description.

I'm sure a lot of people like this porn, but it's everywhere, the market is saturated with it. The Tubes are saturated with it. I did expect something far better after listening to Fabian tell us they spend as much on a scene as Vivid, or was it Wicked. My estimate is they spend no more that the industry average and probably less.

Are you still working for them?

02-01-2011, 08:05 AM	#51
Phoenix BACON BACON BACON Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Poems everybody, the laddie fancies himself a poet Posts: 35,457	50 people holding Fabians jock __________________ Skype Phoenixskype1 Telegram PhoenixBrad https://quantads.io

02-01-2011, 08:09 AM	#52
CaptainHowdy Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Happy in the dark. Posts: 93,145	Is this a christian board?? If so my name is Jonah... __________________ FLASH SALE INSANITY! deal with a 100% Trusted Seller Buy Traffic Spots on a High-Quality Network 1 Year or Lifetime — That’s Right, Until the Internet Explodes!

02-01-2011, 08:29 AM	#57
Mutt Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 34,431	so transparent - Brazzers gave the writer the story they want the industry and the world to know, journalists are lazy, this wasn't investigative, it was a puff piece about some Arab Canadian kids making it big in internet porn - surprised that the Canadian government which forces multiculturalism down our throats hasn't given them the Order of Canada medal. pretty obvious that they weren't comfortable being the kings of porn with bullseyes on their backs, the 24 hour protection they felt they needed - they're obviously smart young guys, they faked their own 'death' so to speak. Nathan's the front man now, and I don't doubt the Brazzers kids sold off some equity, cash is nice to have, and reorganized the corporate setup to keep themselves hidden, the same way they attempted to cover their porn industry tracks in the search engines with bogus shit. it's a private company, nobody knows the truth except them. __________________ I moved my sites to Vacares Hosting. I've saved money, my hair is thicker, lost some weight too! Thanks Sly!

02-01-2011, 10:12 AM	#75
fatfoo ICQ:649699063 Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 27,763	Congratulations, Fabian Thylmann, with porn success. __________________ Send me an email: [email protected]

02-01-2011, 10:15 AM	#77
babymaker Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: philly Posts: 4,752	good article, but has a bunch of bs like only 1 million porn surfers 10 years ago lol the hun had 15million a day alone back then. __________________ $99mo Hosted CMS From ElevatedX! ICQ 293125596

02-01-2011, 08:10 AM	#53
JA$ON Confirmed User Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: I'm from Downtown....Im from Mitch & Murry Posts: 1,329	Here, I'll fix it for them... Manwin's Fabian Thylmann: "likely the biggest front man for a group of behind the scenes porn tycoons on the planet"

02-01-2011, 10:14 AM	#76
Agent 488 Registered User Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 22,511	the piece was lacking in many ways, such as details about the washrooms at manwin hq.

02-01-2011, 10:20 AM	#80
Love Sex Confirmed User Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,905	PORNHUB for the Win

02-01-2011, 11:24 AM	#96
Roald SecretFriends.com Industry Role: Join Date: May 2001 Location: IMC Headquarters Posts: 27,880	Did they mention the amount of toilets in the ManWin building? __________________ WE ARE BUYING PAY SITES! CONTACT ME ClubSweethearts \| ManUpFilms \| SinfulXXX \| HOT * AdultPrime * HOT Paying webmasters since 1996! Contact: r.riepen @ sansylgroup.com \| telegram: roaldr

02-01-2011, 11:32 AM	#97
nickey1952 Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: los angeles Posts: 669	In support of Brazzers>>> Way to go.. I believe it was in 2005 or 2006 Three guys flew down from Canada to have a meeting with producers like myself and introduced themselves as the Brazzer's team. I believe they had six employees at the time. One of them was Stephan Manos. We had a meeting at the Universal Hilton and discussed shoots, budgets and plans. Soon after I was the second producer working for them. At first they just had a few sites and my first shoot was for "Baby got boobs" with Brandy Taylor. He was far from the typical porn owner, a very nice guy that knew the internet and had no idea about producing porn all he knew he wanted the best that could possible be produced and was not worried about the budget. The first shoot grew into 10 a month, then 30 a month and then 40 a month. As a producer they are the perfect client. Deliver the goods that are what they want and get paid well and on time. In fact they paid 100% in full before the shoots and never questioned the invoices. There is a great trust. Soon the company grew and their dreams and demands increased. They added sites and tried new areas of the internet. I was always amazed and enjoyed working for them. The next time I met with Steven he had close to 125 employees and everyday a team of script writers would send scripts and scene descriptions, trust me it made things a lot easier to work with. I was proud to work for them and still are. I have been a content supplier since 30 years, I took my first nude when I was well below the legal age, (15). In the past years my clients have been a slew of A list clients including, Vogue, Glamour, Penthouse , Hustler, Score, Bang Bros, Porn.com, Twistys, EuroRevenue, Private, and a ton of smaller companies. By far Brazzers has raised the bar for content production and it has paid off. I knew they were investing millions into their product and creating a brand. I have heard all the discussions about tube sites ruining online porn but as Mr. Larry Flynt has stated "Water is free from the tap, but people continue to make it a billion dollar industry" Brazzers hasn't ruined online porn, poor production and cheap owners have by not moving forward and exploring different areas. Has Goldman Sachs ruined the banking industry? We continue to support them and pay the same people huge money to get us out of the financial jam that they got us in. Big business is just what it is big business, that is the way of the world so get use to it and think bigger then your pea sized brains tell you to do. Brazzers did, so why not you... good on you Stephan and good on you Fabien.... __________________ LoveHerBoobs.com

02-01-2011, 01:43 PM	#99
Agent 488 Registered User Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 22,511	paul the manwin paysites probably have hundreds if not thousands of joins a day. people paying for porn. how are the doing it wrong?