HO HO HO!, the solution to the VISA shit!! - GoFuckYourself.com - Adult Webmaster Forum

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El Demonio

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#1

HO HO HO!, the solution to the VISA shit!!

10-05-2002, 04:26 PM

HA HA HA, check this!

http://www.verotel.com/ipsp.html

I knew someone will come up with something real fast.

Now remember comrades: We are hooked up with the most powerful driving force in this planet: SEX

and SEX is eternal, as greed is too. We are invincible, remember that.

WE ARE ALL ONE CIRCLE, NO BEGINNING, NO END.
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eru

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#2

10-05-2002, 04:27 PM

Interesting.

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#3

10-05-2002, 04:30 PM

Woooohooooo! BUMP
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Webby

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#4

10-05-2002, 04:33 PM

First do your research into past track records and trading history of Verotel. I am not offering comments here... get recomendations from other webmasters as to whether Verotel is or is not a good trading partner for processing.

Nuff said!

XXX TLD's - Another mosquito to swat.
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#5

10-05-2002, 04:34 PM

Shit.. mean't to add!

But what they are doing is the right path!!

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.:Frog:.

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#6

10-05-2002, 04:37 PM

There will always be a loophole.

Has anyone ever delt with them before?

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#7

10-05-2002, 04:37 PM

just wait for all the crappy billing companies to run cutting up these guys, instead of doing anything about the problem they are just putting down each other
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Shoplifter

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#8

10-05-2002, 04:39 PM

I can only hope this is true...And that even more solutions will come out of the woodwork over the next few weeks. Remember it has only been a few days, not really enough time for solutions to appear.

One thought crosses my mind...

These new regulations may have actually put USA based billers at a competitive disadvantage. These regulations may mean offshore companies have a more liberal situation with the new regulations. Different acquirers in different parts of the world will absolutely interpret things differently.

It also makes one wonder if the reason that the USA companies waited so long to announce this was to prevent migration to these other billers. If we had known even a month a go a high percentage of webmasters would have moved to offshore billers and then just allowed their rebills with US companies to expire. After all the average stay for a surfer is only a couple months, right?

I've also been hearing some things about 2000charge, as they are a German company.

Anyways I hope these new solutions are for real.

Last edited by Shoplifter; 10-05-2002, 04:48 PM.

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Catalinas

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#9

10-05-2002, 04:41 PM

I used Verotel only for a short while..but kept them for 900 number sales. The guy would call, get his auth code, it wouldn't work...he'd call Verotel and ask what to do.. their response 'sign up again and just don't pay one' .. hmm last I heard that's a chargeback. It got to the point where I 'owed' them money for chargeback fees. I would highly NOT recommend them.

Maybe someone else can say if they've had a good experience with them....
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#10

10-05-2002, 04:41 PM

Originally posted by Pipecrew
just wait for all the crappy billing companies to run cutting up these guys, instead of doing anything about the problem they are just putting down each other

Yeah, the way they are just rolling over and playing dead instead of filing suits, looking for solutions, etc., is kind of sickening.

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Webby

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#11

10-05-2002, 04:43 PM

Hi Frog

Na.. it ain't a loophole as such.. I am not any expert at this, but - VISA US is not VISA International and they are divided into .. think six banking regions. As far as I understand at the moment, all regions, with the exception of VISA US have rejected the kindly proposals for new rules.

So we have, particularly three, US based processors wincing on the prospect of losing clients (can't blame em!).

Eslewhere, least at the moment, there are no biggies concerning card transactions to "high risk" clients.

XXX TLD's - Another mosquito to swat.
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Webby

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#12

10-05-2002, 04:45 PM

Hi Calatinas

Think you summed up Verotel pretty well!!

But there will be others - stay calm!

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#13

10-05-2002, 04:46 PM

Verotel is located with its main office in Amsterdam, the Netherlands, and acquires its VISA and MasterCard transactions through its banking relationships in five different countries outside the US.

Nowhere does it say they have a presence in the US - although there is a US contact phone number? That's strange...
Either way, I'm sure the other processor PR Masters will be in here soon with their calm professional statements to convince you that Verotel is the root of all evil and will cause you to lose your business as well as rot away in horrible pain and disfigurement from the waist down.
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#14

10-05-2002, 04:47 PM

Ya said it Carrie!!

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El Demonio

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#15

10-05-2002, 04:49 PM

I remember the past problems of Verza/Verotel, i'm in the biz since 1996.

however, as of right now, they are in the biz, and they are offering the only solution till now.

I'm not concerned about the fees, i can waive that, i'm concerned about the bottom line of the VISA shit which is CENSORSHIP.

I'm amazed that no one here has figured that out, it is the bottom line of the whole scheme: fees, CB, reports, IRS, that's BS, the main thing here is CENSORSHIP, is the state-of-the-art of the Bush admin damn BS, now VISA can decide who stays and who lefts solely based in its criteria, no lawsuit, no trials, no media, is the perfect way to destroy the adult industry, taking us from the nuts, in the dark, hidden from the public, like an assasin, no one will hear our cry.

We have to fight back, to find our way to survive, we gave them too much power, then watch the consequences.

We made the Internet the way actually is, our biz invented the e-commerce, now they want to take it from us, We started a whole new era of commerce for civilization, and yet will some history book will say 'The honorable pornographers invented e-commerce and turned the internet from a dull text based exchage into the backbone of the civilization"?, No, they want to vanish us all, they want us to go quietly in to the night, to vanish, without a fight.

I started with the net back in 1987, i saw its morphing, and saw how we all reinvented commerce, so i do have a perspective.

Let's find our ways, we are the oldest biz in the world, they can't beat us.

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#16

10-05-2002, 04:50 PM

It also makes one wonder if the reason that the USA companies waited so long to announce this was to prevent migration to these other billers.

Gee, you think?
They keep shooting themselves in the foot when they repeat over and over that they've known about this for MONTHS now...
But they wait until the last minute to tell you so that you don't have time to find an alternate solution.
Would they do that on purpose? NAHHHHHHHHHHH

Damn, but I'm in a sarcastic mood tonight... maybe I should go take a nap.
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mistressofnite

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#17

10-05-2002, 04:52 PM

"HA HA HA, check this!

http://www.verotel.com/ipsp.html

I knew someone will come up with something real fast.

Now remember comrades: We are hooked up with the most powerful driving force in this planet: SEX

and SEX is eternal, as greed is too. We are invincible, remember that.

"

Oh my.
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#18

10-05-2002, 04:57 PM

I have a great idea to get around this Visa problem - Shut down all of the screwball webmasters that have high chargeback rates and are screwing surfers by cheating and bullshitting out their asses.

Oh, that's right - That's what Visa is trying to do.

Visa is trying to cut back on bullshit that goes on in this industry.

I'm working my ass off to have honest tours that don't lie to surfers and real members areas updated on a regular basis with never seen before content. My chargeback is nearly zero. We have happy members that are getting what they are paying for.

Recently someone on GFY posted a password page, and I had the chance to look at some of the member's areas of other sides. One of them was a cheerleader site, and I would have been pissed if I bought into it. The entire member's area was nothing but feeds (including our cheerleader feed).

I think Visa's actions are good for the industry. This is going to take down a lot of the dishonest webmasters....... At least for a while.

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#19

10-05-2002, 05:13 PM

Originally posted by RocHard
I have a great idea to get around this Visa problem - Shut down all of the screwball webmasters that have high chargeback rates and are screwing surfers by cheating and bullshitting out their asses.

Oh, that's right - That's what Visa is trying to do.

Visa is trying to cut back on bullshit that goes on in this industry.

I'm working my ass off to have honest tours that don't lie to surfers and real members areas updated on a regular basis with never seen before content. My chargeback is nearly zero. We have happy members that are getting what they are paying for.

Recently someone on GFY posted a password page, and I had the chance to look at some of the member's areas of other sides. One of them was a cheerleader site, and I would have been pissed if I bought into it. The entire member's area was nothing but feeds (including our cheerleader feed).

I think Visa's actions are good for the industry. This is going to take down a lot of the dishonest webmasters....... At least for a while.

Exactly right.

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#20

10-05-2002, 05:22 PM

Veddy interesting. This must be what Globill is doing as well.

I've heard a lot of bad things about Verotel but then again, anyone might be better than the big3 at this point. Verotel and Globill might have it in the bag. Jettis scores some points too for at least offering to credit back the $750.

I knew it just had to be a US thing only and that the big3 was blowing some smoke up our collective asses.

Hey, isn't pot also legal in the Netherlands?!

Whoohooo! Processing and Pot. Better than peanut butter 'n chocolate!!
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El Demonio

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#21

10-05-2002, 05:24 PM

Right but also wrong.

The day that VISA Daddy decices that they no longer like your niche/theme because is too 'obscene' you'll see what i'm talking about.

We have to think and react as one, sure we are all tired of tricky WMs, dishonest assholes who can't make a living without cheating customers, right, but visa doesn't care about the health of our biz, they only want us to make our life much more complicated, just remember the past years:

In 1996 CB Max ratio was 5%, then they lowered to 2.5% then to 1%, and we all process much less than we precessed back in 96 to mid 99, why? thanks to the fucking IPSP scrubbing. They have been nailing our coffiin slowly but firmly thru time.

And we were the only target of their policys, no other biz was, just us.

think twice.

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Webby

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#22

10-05-2002, 05:35 PM

Wonton

I ain't in no credit card business (hell.. no wish to be!!) .. this is just common sense stuff. Any processor that transacts internationally *must* have banking relationships globally.

Sadly, least as far as I can see, the Three Stoodges have thought they were "US" and that crowned all and appear to have taken no effort to cultivate any banking relationships outside of US territory, resulting in this current crap.

Also.. there are plenty processors who carry far "high risk" clients around the globe, including gambling operations. You reckon cos the US don't like Internet gambling, they are gotta stop transacting? No shit! :-)

In fact, apart from "rogue websites" in adult - gambling risk is much higher. I know several who transact many millions a month in gambling and they got no problems - so stay cool and this will resolve soon!

XXX TLD's - Another mosquito to swat.
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wonton

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#23

10-05-2002, 05:42 PM

Originally posted by Webby
Wonton

Sadly, least as far as I can see, the Three Stoodges have thought they were "US" and that crowned all and appear to have taken no effort to cultivate any banking relationships outside of US territory, resulting in this current crap.

I think you hit the nail on the head webby. The Tri-Axis of Evil have remained in the US for years, never expanding their banking relationships internationally. So when the US regulations went to shit, they got caught with their pants' down. Hee. Hee

Doh! Why am I laughing? We're getting fucked in the process!
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El Demonio

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#24

10-05-2002, 07:58 PM

How convenient and timely is this for the Bush admin, don't you think?

I think is a true conspiration, and the fact that the 3 stooges haven't said anything before is even more suspicious, add to that that they only give us a few days of warning.

how convenient Mr AssKroft, how convenient....

Typical Romulan plot....

Last edited by El Demonio; 10-05-2002, 08:04 PM.

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BV

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#25

10-05-2002, 08:11 PM

Originally posted by RocHard
I have a great idea to get around this Visa problem - Shut down all of the screwball webmasters that have high chargeback rates and are screwing surfers by cheating and bullshitting out their asses.

Oh, that's right - That's what Visa is trying to do.

Visa is trying to cut back on bullshit that goes on in this industry.

I'm working my ass off to have honest tours that don't lie to surfers and real members areas updated on a regular basis with never seen before content. My chargeback is nearly zero. We have happy members that are getting what they are paying for.

Recently someone on GFY posted a password page, and I had the chance to look at some of the member's areas of other sides. One of them was a cheerleader site, and I would have been pissed if I bought into it. The entire member's area was nothing but feeds (including our cheerleader feed).

I think Visa's actions are good for the industry. This is going to take down a lot of the dishonest webmasters....... At least for a while.

I agree 100 fucking % !

Too many people have been ripped off and pissed on by misleading scam artist webmasters and this could be Visa's answer.

We also have virtually 0 chargebacks on any of our processors.

:-(

at least now we will be rewarded for that. reward=keep your account!
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Webby

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#26

10-05-2002, 08:11 PM

El Demonio:

All this is small beans, but suspect there is a lot more going on than some VISA rules. The other six global banking regions rejected VISA's rules, apart from the US.

It leaves the question as to why they granted VISA US this freedom to fuck up everyone. Seems obvious to me that ya gotta question the "beneficiaries"... which are, the US govt for collecting data on all and sundry and the IRS to enable em to screw an extra cent outta Internet "taxes" - so fuck it!

I am quiet happy sitting offshore and got no credit card transaction problems or any damned IRS forms to fill in for "US corps" cos IBill told me I need then!

PS.. Ya can take it, I ain't bothering to "incorporate" in the US and provide em with my inside leg measurements!

XXX TLD's - Another mosquito to swat.
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El Demonio

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#27

10-05-2002, 08:17 PM

Webby, i'm foreigner too, i'm not liable for US taxes, and i intend to stay that way.

But what about this new shit applies to us intl. wm's?.

Also, notice this: RIGHT NOW WSBILLING PAY PAGES EXHIBIT A LEGEND THAT THEY ARE IN LONDON U.K.!!!

Yet, i've received the same fucking mail as everyone, why do you think they do this?

I'm sure that by the end to the next week many people will come up with many solutions and visa will be deeply hurted.

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Webby

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#28

10-05-2002, 08:29 PM

Hi El Demonio

To be honest, I can't see that it is any problem for those outside the US - tis sure a problem within it!

I have not seen one processor that has international deals on banking having *any* forms and VISA crap to fill in or *have* to incorporate in the US. They are all just trading as normal!

Suspect, but time will tell, that this is a "very US" thing and got fuck all to do with the rest of the world. It may be that ... there is this tendency to "control" within the US... and this is the problem and the reason for granting VISA's wishes for rulings.

Signup with any non US processor and fuck it!

XXX TLD's - Another mosquito to swat.
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El Demonio

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#29

10-05-2002, 08:34 PM

I really hope you are right, there is so much confusion right now because the bastards released this just friday at last hour (how convenient)

But i think we are all affected.

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#30

10-05-2002, 08:41 PM

Hi El Demonio

I may be repeating myself... but no other global banking region has accepted the "rules" for VISA, apart from the US - flat no's all round!

But there is sure a lesson here... no more first and secondary processors on signup pages and changing of goal posts where the webmaster is leaving a crap processor with a load of rebills!

Off the top of my head... can suggest ya use a few (three or four for credit cards), a couple for checks blah and rotate em pages on the hour!! *g* ... Least if any one of em fails you are not losing all your recurring rev and any smart ass can be cut off in minutes!

Thinking I think I need VISA to deposit a goodwill security amount with mutually agreeable lawyers as a penalty in the event they change the goal posts again!!!

XXX TLD's - Another mosquito to swat.
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wonton

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#31

10-05-2002, 08:44 PM

Originally posted by Webby
Hi El Demonio

To be honest, I can't see that it is any problem for those outside the US - tis sure a problem within it!

I have not seen one processor that has international deals on banking having *any* forms and VISA crap to fill in or *have* to incorporate in the US. They are all just trading as normal!

Suspect, but time will tell, that this is a "very US" thing and got fuck all to do with the rest of the world. It may be that ... there is this tendency to "control" within the US... and this is the problem and the reason for granting VISA's wishes for rulings.

Signup with any non US processor and fuck it!

Webby. I think you're right. And that certainly narrows the field of choices of processors either outside the US or with non-US banking rleations:

- Verotel
- Globill
- 2000charge
- Dutchbill

And maybe a few others? From the above, Globill and 2000charge look like the safest bets. Verotel might be worth a shot but I've just heard too many scary stories about them. Don't know if they've turned around at all since they were called Verza.

Just stay away from Turkmenistan-bill!
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#32

10-05-2002, 08:47 PM

Try Somalia-bill.
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Webby

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#33

10-05-2002, 08:49 PM

ozzymandius:

Add Verotel to your list of possibles there!!

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Fletch XXX

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#34

10-05-2002, 08:52 PM

I can dig.

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El Demonio

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#35

10-05-2002, 08:56 PM

Better try Saddambilling.com

-Absolutely NO CB
-No Setup fee
-Accepts CP/BEST
-Comission is only 1%
-Bonus pack for sites like asskroftisgay.com

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Webby

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#36

10-05-2002, 08:58 PM

Woton:

Think you are right about Globill, 2000charge and DutchBill... (shit.. I missed one someplace! Damn.. can't remember the name, but something like "old-habits-of-shaving-in-the-audiotext-business-die-hard") ...

I think we will be hearing more of others shortly! Oddly.. It may include one or more of the famous three who *may* have gotten off their asses and realized this world ain't the US!

I got two friends who do volume processing for "high risk" clients as well, - have briefed em already and this sounds like an area that appeals... so will see!

XXX TLD's - Another mosquito to swat.
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#37

10-05-2002, 09:02 PM

Ive used Verotel before. They do a fine job for me. Ok, their tech support totally sucks but. Aside from that theyre reliable. I'll use them just on principle in this scenario.

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Webby

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#38

10-05-2002, 09:04 PM

El Demonio:

I heard ya can do special deals on that 1% and no chargebacks or any costs for a trial period of a year? *g*

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El Demonio

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#39

10-05-2002, 09:08 PM

Maybe that's why George wants to him out of the biz, he will ruin the US economy!

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Webby

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#40

10-05-2002, 09:17 PM

El Demonio:

That Ol Georgie is *desperate* to find an excuse.. shit.. "reason" to cover the economy screw up!

There is also this "plan" to subject the US to total isolation on this planet - so yea, can see why VISA USA got their "rules" thru!

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El Demonio

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#41

10-05-2002, 09:21 PM

I also think that all of this is part of Ol' George ploy.....

Maybe he found out pics of his daughters in some interracial gang bang site?

Question is: What was Ol' George doing surfing nasty porn?

Answer: he was refered there by Ol' AssCrotch

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#42

10-05-2002, 09:27 PM

Originally posted by Catalinas
I used Verotel only for a short while..but kept them for 900 number sales. The guy would call, get his auth code, it wouldn't work...he'd call Verotel and ask what to do.. their response 'sign up again and just don't pay one' .. hmm last I heard that's a chargeback. It got to the point where I 'owed' them money for chargeback fees. I would highly NOT recommend them.

Maybe someone else can say if they've had a good experience with them....

I have Verotel on some of my sites. I never really had a problem with them. They wire my money, always on time.

You also have the option of sending a letter out to your members if they want to recurr. or not!!

I have heard some webmasters owned them money in the past I never did, so I can't really talk bad about them.

The time difference has been a problem with them in the past, however I offer a live support on my sites for customers and try to babysit them a lot (doesn't always work, but oh well)
another company which works for us is
http://www.globosale.com
they are in Switzerland.

Partying since '96 and not going anywhere Anna's Dorm
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El Demonio

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#43

10-05-2002, 09:37 PM

Have you checked this european billers?

They have MANY, MANY more options than the 3 stooges:

They accept 900 numbers in US/Europe
They accept: MC, VISA, AMEX, Diners, paypal, JCB, Japanese cards, paysafe, online checks.

And many more novel options.

Guys: we have been loosing our time and money to the 3 stooges for long time

Be aware Eurobillers, there it goes some 1000's of webmasters and the US economy will suffer a *LOT* more

Last edited by El Demonio; 10-05-2002, 09:38 PM.

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#44

10-05-2002, 09:41 PM

Globosale rocks,,

just my opinion, because I have lots of German customers, (I am german) and they love it..

Partying since '96 and not going anywhere Anna's Dorm
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El Demonio

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#45

10-05-2002, 09:45 PM

Steffie, what can you tell me about globosale?

Please abound in details, CB ratios, rebills, tech, scripts, reports, etc.

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#46

10-05-2002, 09:45 PM

Yep... Add Globosale to the possibles list!
The fact that they offer a wide range of payment options, cover the German market (largest in Europe) and serve what will *soon* be the largest client base on the planet (exceeding the number of online surfers in the US) - they are worth noting!

Now *g*.. their track record is next to look at!

XXX TLD's - Another mosquito to swat.
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steffie

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#47

10-05-2002, 10:33 PM

Globosale Plus

variety of billing gets you better return $
Easy webmaster interface

Downfall

Shitty Tech Support
They are pretty new
Had lots of downtime when they first started
Their english isn't very good (never bothered me, however for some out there uhm!)
Their support answering service is in Swiss.

Once youre with them they are ok, everything seems to run smoothly. They cater a lot to german surfers. I get my money wired like Verotel.
I haven't had any problems yet with them

(knocking on wood)

I have had 4 webmasters go to Globosale, its takes about one week to get setup there, they are pretty swamped right now, lots of off shore billers are, you have to send in the paperwork and a copy of your passport.

Partying since '96 and not going anywhere Anna's Dorm
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Webby

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#48

10-05-2002, 10:40 PM

Steffie:

Thanks for the feedback! I'm sure tis appreciated by a few!

XXX TLD's - Another mosquito to swat.
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Saruman

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#49

10-05-2002, 10:46 PM
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steffie

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#50

10-05-2002, 11:02 PM

One more thing about Globosale
You can set up all your sites online, do the scripting, test it, blah blah..

Then you go live!

Its pretty quick if you know your way around cgi etc,, I don't know shit so I always have to beg somebody to help me out LOL

Partying since '96 and not going anywhere Anna's Dorm
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