Athlon64 3400+, 1GB RAM, 8x DVD-Burner, Radeon 9600XT..Like it? Check this out...

Collapse
X
 
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
  • Rhino22
    Confirmed User
    • Jan 2004
    • 2288

    #1

    Athlon64 3400+, 1GB RAM, 8x DVD-Burner, Radeon 9600XT..Like it? Check this out...

    Okay, as some of you guys know, aside from my part time gig doing adult, I also build and sell custom pc's. So here is a brand new PC that I am selling...It has not been built yet...

    The parts are sitting in a box next to me, all I need is a buyer and I will assemble, test, and ship.

    This PC retails for almost twice the price on some sites... Others will charge you around $1500 or so... I Gaurantee you will not find it cheaper. If you have questions, email me: [email protected] or ICQ: 93665589. Or simply post in this thread.

    Payment through PayPal only. Will ship anywhere within the US and Canada. Any type of shipping avaliable, insurance avaliable too.

    ------------------------------------------------
    AMD Athlon64 3400+, 1MB L2 Cache
    520 Watt PSU
    1GB PC3500 RAM
    200GB Seagate SATA hard drive
    ATi Radeon 9600xt, 128MB
    8x DVD-R/RW
    Logitech Cordless Keyboard and Mouse combo.

    $1090.00

    ------------------------------------------------

    That's just the major stuff that needs listing...obviously comes with floppy and all the other stuff needed to work. If you need pictures.

    The case is full alluminum...this baby keeps cool at all times. Any other questions, contact me.
  • buddyjuf

    #2
    wow... to know that I paid 1700 for my pc just 2 years ago...

    you can get SO much for 1000$ nowadays, it's insane

    Comment

    • MrJackMeHoff
      Confirmed User
      • Mar 2004
      • 4569

      #3
      I build machines all day long without using garbage amd's for half the price but nice try.. I guess its good for someone who is clueless.

      Comment

      • Kard63
        Confirmed User
        • Nov 2003
        • 8944

        #4
        Originally posted by MrJackMeHoff
        I build machines all day long without using garbage amd's for half the price but nice try.. I guess its good for someone who is clueless.
        I too hate amd and I would gladly build PC's all day but on Ebay they seem to go right at cost.

        Comment

        • The_Oracle_Porn
          So Fucking Banned
          • Dec 2004
          • 563

          #5
          A64 3400+ ? Are you fucking kidding me ? its socket 754 (crap)

          Get the new 939.

          Your RAM is probably crap.
          200GB seagate = crap (get Raptor 10000 rpm instead)
          Video card is total crap.

          Comment

          • MetaformX
            Confirmed User
            • Mar 2002
            • 6704

            #6
            Thats an amazing machine for that price. Although I feel a little cheated seeing this price now. JK bro

            No doubt you make quality PC's with quality components. I hope you sell it. Hit me up on icq when you have some time.

            Comment

            • toddler
              Confirmed User
              • Jun 2002
              • 1911

              #7
              Originally posted by MrJackMeHoff
              I build machines all day long without using garbage amd's for half the price but nice try.. I guess its good for someone who is clueless.
              for content creation, sure, go intel. gaming? amd.


              amd has the high end market (x86) beat hands down with the opterons. the itaniums are WAY too expensive, and just don't cut it. Don't bother trying argue the point, I have several itaniums and opteron 250s to test against. And have.
              http://www.flickr.com/photos/zoddler/

              Comment

              • The_Oracle_Porn
                So Fucking Banned
                • Dec 2004
                • 563

                #8
                Originally posted by MrJackMeHoff
                I build machines all day long without using garbage amd's for half the price but nice try.. I guess its good for someone who is clueless.
                AMD FX-55 is the fastest processor out there.
                AMD outperfoms Intel in any benchmark.

                Comment

                • NoCarrier
                  We need more free porn
                  • Mar 2002
                  • 16356

                  #9
                  Originally posted by Rhino22
                  I Gaurantee you will not find it cheaper.
                  Wrong. I can find a better system for less.

                  AMD Athlon64 3500+ 375.00$
                  Sapphire 9600XT AGP 256 MB 225.00$
                  200GB Maxtor HD SATA 159.00$
                  DVD +/- RW LG 16/8/2 99.00$
                  1GB PC3500 RAM 210.00$
                  Logitech Cordless Keyboard and Mouse combo. $99.00
                  Antec Case $89.00

                  Total : 1256.00 CDN = 1025 USD

                  Last edited by NoCarrier; 12-11-2004, 12:54 PM.

                  Comment

                  • The_Oracle_Porn
                    So Fucking Banned
                    • Dec 2004
                    • 563

                    #10
                    Originally posted by NoCarrier
                    Wrong. I can find the same sytem for less.

                    AMD Athlon64 3500+ 375.00$
                    Sapphire 9600XT AGP 256 MB 225.00$
                    200GB Maxtor HD SATA 159.00$
                    DVD +/- RW LG 16/8/2 99.00$
                    1GB PC3500 RAM 210.00$
                    Logitech Cordless Keyboard and Mouse combo.99$.00
                    Antec Case $89.00

                    Total : 1256.00 CDN = 1025 USD

                    Not to mention that A64 3500+ is much better.
                    More video RAM too.

                    Comment

                    • Rhino22
                      Confirmed User
                      • Jan 2004
                      • 2288

                      #11
                      Originally posted by The_Oracle_Porn
                      A64 3400+ ? Are you fucking kidding me ? its socket 754 (crap)

                      Get the new 939.

                      Your RAM is probably crap.
                      200GB seagate = crap (get Raptor 10000 rpm instead)
                      Video card is total crap.
                      You think you know something about computers? You're an idiot.

                      Comment

                      • The_Oracle_Porn
                        So Fucking Banned
                        • Dec 2004
                        • 563

                        #12
                        Originally posted by Rhino22
                        You think you know something about computers? You're an idiot.
                        It's easy calling people idiots.
                        Show me where I was wrong.

                        Comment

                        • KMR Stitch
                          I am cool
                          • Jul 2003
                          • 14494

                          #13
                          lol...


                          I can build it for 750.00

                          =)

                          Comment

                          • Fake Nick
                            So Fucking Banned
                            • Jul 2004
                            • 7708

                            #14
                            MrJackMeHoff
                            A D M I N

                            Registered: Mar 2004
                            Location: HAWAII =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
                            Posts: 2582



                            you suck

                            Comment

                            • Babaganoosh
                              ♥♥♥ Likes Hugs ♥♥♥
                              • Nov 2001
                              • 15841

                              #15
                              Originally posted by KMR Stitch
                              lol...


                              I can build it for 750.00

                              =)
                              I'll take 5 of them. When can you ship?
                              I like pie.

                              Comment

                              • - Jesus Christ -
                                Confirmed User
                                • Mar 2003
                                • 7197

                                #16
                                Originally posted by The_Oracle_Porn
                                It's easy calling people idiots.
                                Show me where I was wrong.
                                For starters there are socket 939 3400's now.

                                and 939 is not a lot better than 754 considering this 3400 has a 1MB cache and the 939 3400's only have 512K.

                                Also the only REAL benefit of 939 is dual channel mem (hardly makes any real prefromance difference) and the 939 use the new 90 nm tech. (cooler but also the reason they give you half the cache for the same model muber.)

                                -----------------------------

                                I'm currently running one of these

                                http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProduc...103-443&depa=0

                                overclocked I can beat a stock 3800 754
                                Motherboard and CPU came to $325

                                outperforms a $500+ chip.
                                Last edited by - Jesus Christ -; 12-11-2004, 01:40 PM.

                                Amen

                                Comment

                                • Rhino22
                                  Confirmed User
                                  • Jan 2004
                                  • 2288

                                  #17
                                  Originally posted by - Jesus Christ -
                                  For starters there are socket 939 3400's now.

                                  and 939 is not a lot better than 754 considering this 3400 has a 1MB cache and the 939 3400's only have 512K.

                                  Also the only REAL benefit of 939 is dual channel mem (hardly makes any real prefromance difference) and the 939 use the new 90 nm tech. (cooler but also the reason they give you half the cache for the same model muber.)

                                  -----------------------------

                                  I'm currently running one of these

                                  http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProduc...103-443&depa=0

                                  overclocked I can beat a stock 3800 754
                                  Motherboard and CPU came to $325

                                  outperforms a $500+ chip.
                                  I don't think most people understand the cache. I didn't want to waste my time explaining it to people like Oracle porn...

                                  Comment

                                  • strobi
                                    Confirmed User
                                    • Nov 2002
                                    • 7383

                                    #18
                                    That pc would sell for around 2000-2200$ over here

                                    Comment

                                    • The_Oracle_Porn
                                      So Fucking Banned
                                      • Dec 2004
                                      • 563

                                      #19
                                      Originally posted by Rhino22
                                      I don't think most people understand the cache. I didn't want to waste my time explaining it to people like Oracle porn...
                                      dual channel > extra cache

                                      Comment

                                      • - Jesus Christ -
                                        Confirmed User
                                        • Mar 2003
                                        • 7197

                                        #20
                                        Originally posted by The_Oracle_Porn
                                        dual channel > extra cache
                                        no... just no.

                                        Only thing dual cahnnel will "Speed Up" is synthetic benchmarks and if your manipulating large databases.


                                        an extra 512K is about equivalent to an extra 200MHz clock speed.
                                        Last edited by - Jesus Christ -; 12-11-2004, 02:26 PM.

                                        Amen

                                        Comment

                                        • The_Oracle_Porn
                                          So Fucking Banned
                                          • Dec 2004
                                          • 563

                                          #21
                                          Originally posted by - Jesus Christ -
                                          hahahah....

                                          no... just no.
                                          If 745 processors are the shit, why did they discontinue them and invented 939 instead ?



                                          and btw, FX have 1mb cache
                                          Last edited by The_Oracle_Porn; 12-11-2004, 02:28 PM.

                                          Comment

                                          • - Jesus Christ -
                                            Confirmed User
                                            • Mar 2003
                                            • 7197

                                            #22
                                            Originally posted by The_Oracle_Porn
                                            If 745 processors are the shit, why did they discontinue them and invented 939 instead ?

                                            They didnt dicontinue then first of all.

                                            Secondly its becase they want people to upgrade.

                                            939 is better but its not much better than 754 and you've proven how clueless you are when you say dual channel mem is > than extra l2 cache
                                            Last edited by - Jesus Christ -; 12-11-2004, 02:29 PM.

                                            Amen

                                            Comment

                                            • The_Oracle_Porn
                                              So Fucking Banned
                                              • Dec 2004
                                              • 563

                                              #23
                                              dual channel = faster memory access time = faster calculation speeds

                                              Comment

                                              • - Jesus Christ -
                                                Confirmed User
                                                • Mar 2003
                                                • 7197

                                                #24
                                                Originally posted by The_Oracle_Porn
                                                dual channel = faster memory access time = faster calculation speeds
                                                no, and no

                                                dual channel = more bandwidth

                                                the CLOCKSPEED of the ram controlls teh SPEED... the bandwdth is the size of the pipeline from the ram to the memory controller.

                                                becase the A64's all have ram controllers on the CPU the dual channel does not even make as much of a differnce as it did with ther previous cores.

                                                Amen

                                                Comment

                                                • NoCarrier
                                                  We need more free porn
                                                  • Mar 2002
                                                  • 16356

                                                  #25
                                                  Oh God, why did this have to turn into a geek war.

                                                  When all we wanted to prove is that Rhino22's prices are not that good.

                                                  KMR Stitch can give you the same system for 250$ less

                                                  Comment

                                                  • Yngwie
                                                    I am an Alien from space
                                                    • May 2003
                                                    • 11118

                                                    #26
                                                    Originally posted by Rhino22
                                                    I don't think most people understand the cache. I didn't want to waste my time explaining it to people like Oracle porn...
                                                    then I will try to explain lol

                                                    Cache is used to speed up the memory retrieval process. If there was no cache then everytime the CPU requested data it would send it to the main memory then back across the memory BUS (no, not something you go to school in lol) This would be a very slow process. Cache is extremely fast memory that stores the data that is accessed the most and at times the data around it. Sothis in turn allows the cpu to achieve the quickest response time (the size of the pipe plays a big role here)

                                                    So lets say a piece of data is accessed 5 times then, in most cases it will be stored in the cache since it's accessed frequently.

                                                    there is level 1 cache which is smaller (in size) but FAST
                                                    then there's level 2 cache with is BIG (in size) but a lot slower but it's still faster then the main memory.


                                                    ok, that may not explain anything to the less computer literate people lol
                                                    Last edited by Yngwie; 12-11-2004, 02:40 PM.
                                                    ICQ: 16544251 - Skype: gator37 @ eastlink.ca - email: yngwie @ isys.ca

                                                    Comment

                                                    • Yngwie
                                                      I am an Alien from space
                                                      • May 2003
                                                      • 11118

                                                      #27
                                                      in short, the cache when storing the frequently used data makes it so your cpu doesn't have to refetch the original data.. hence faster reponse times when accessing that data again.

                                                      it's just a duplicate copy in the cache
                                                      ICQ: 16544251 - Skype: gator37 @ eastlink.ca - email: yngwie @ isys.ca

                                                      Comment

                                                      • The_Oracle_Porn
                                                        So Fucking Banned
                                                        • Dec 2004
                                                        • 563

                                                        #28
                                                        And L1 cache is more than enough.
                                                        Plus it's faster than L2.

                                                        Comment

                                                        • Yngwie
                                                          I am an Alien from space
                                                          • May 2003
                                                          • 11118

                                                          #29
                                                          yes, I said that lol
                                                          ICQ: 16544251 - Skype: gator37 @ eastlink.ca - email: yngwie @ isys.ca

                                                          Comment

                                                          • KMR Stitch
                                                            I am cool
                                                            • Jul 2003
                                                            • 14494

                                                            #30
                                                            Pricewatch.com

                                                            Does wonders

                                                            Comment

                                                            • - Jesus Christ -
                                                              Confirmed User
                                                              • Mar 2003
                                                              • 7197

                                                              #31
                                                              Originally posted by The_Oracle_Porn
                                                              And L1 cache is more than enough.
                                                              Another badge to pin to your "dumbass-uniform"

                                                              Amen

                                                              Comment

                                                              • The_Oracle_Porn
                                                                So Fucking Banned
                                                                • Dec 2004
                                                                • 563

                                                                #32
                                                                Originally posted by Yngwie
                                                                yes, I said that lol
                                                                I know.
                                                                I just summarized it for Jesus Christ.

                                                                In short, 939 > 745

                                                                Comment

                                                                • - Jesus Christ -
                                                                  Confirmed User
                                                                  • Mar 2003
                                                                  • 7197

                                                                  #33
                                                                  Originally posted by The_Oracle_Porn
                                                                  I know.
                                                                  I just summarized it for Jesus Christ.

                                                                  In short, 939 > 745
                                                                  You didn't summarize... You drew and INNCORECT conclusion.

                                                                  A 2.0 3200 with 1MB l2 will match (an in some flaoting point calcs beat) a 2.2 with 512

                                                                  I know becasue i fucking own both and used to build computers for a living.

                                                                  In short your a moron.

                                                                  EDIT: by the way I never said 939 wasnt better... in fact you can scroll up and see me saying its better.... but its NOT SIGNIFICANTLY better and is mainly to sell more boards/chips.
                                                                  Last edited by - Jesus Christ -; 12-11-2004, 03:11 PM.

                                                                  Amen

                                                                  Comment

                                                                  • Doctor Dre
                                                                    Too lazy to set a custom title
                                                                    • Jan 2001
                                                                    • 51692

                                                                    #34
                                                                    Yo ... what's the best comp you can build ... (video editting and list cleaning ... needs a lot of power and disk space) .

                                                                    for 2000-2500 $ .
                                                                    Originally posted by rayadp05
                                                                    I rebooted, deleted temp files, history, cookies and everything...still cannot view the news clip. All I see is that fucking gay ass music video from "Rick Roll". Anyone else have a different link to the news clip?

                                                                    Comment

                                                                    • The_Oracle_Porn
                                                                      So Fucking Banned
                                                                      • Dec 2004
                                                                      • 563

                                                                      #35
                                                                      Originally posted by - Jesus Christ -
                                                                      You didn't summarize... You drew and INNCORECT conclusion.

                                                                      A 2.0 3200 with 1MB l2 will match (an in some flaoting point calcs beat) a 2.2 with 512

                                                                      not if you overclock that 2.2 too

                                                                      Comment

                                                                      • - Jesus Christ -
                                                                        Confirmed User
                                                                        • Mar 2003
                                                                        • 7197

                                                                        #36
                                                                        Originally posted by The_Oracle_Porn
                                                                        not if you overclock that 2.2 too
                                                                        Uh no.... STOCK.... neither overclocked.


                                                                        You need to just chill and stop trying to argue about stuff you have no experience with.

                                                                        Amen

                                                                        Comment

                                                                        • potter
                                                                          Confirmed User
                                                                          • Dec 2004
                                                                          • 6559

                                                                          #37
                                                                          Originally posted by Doctor Dre
                                                                          Yo ... what's the best comp you can build ... (video editting and list cleaning ... needs a lot of power and disk space) .

                                                                          for 2000-2500 $ .
                                                                          A very very good computer

                                                                          aim: p0773r

                                                                          Comment

                                                                          • evildick

                                                                            #38
                                                                            Originally posted by NoCarrier
                                                                            Wrong. I can find a better system for less.

                                                                            AMD Athlon64 3500+ 375.00$
                                                                            Sapphire 9600XT AGP 256 MB 225.00$
                                                                            200GB Maxtor HD SATA 159.00$
                                                                            DVD +/- RW LG 16/8/2 99.00$
                                                                            1GB PC3500 RAM 210.00$
                                                                            Logitech Cordless Keyboard and Mouse combo. $99.00
                                                                            Antec Case $89.00

                                                                            Total : 1256.00 CDN = 1025 USD

                                                                            Don't forget to add in the cost of the motherboard and OS. I assume his system would come with WinXp or something on it.

                                                                            Comment

                                                                            • NoCarrier
                                                                              We need more free porn
                                                                              • Mar 2002
                                                                              • 16356

                                                                              #39
                                                                              Originally posted by evildick
                                                                              Don't forget to add in the cost of the motherboard and OS. I assume his system would come with WinXp or something on it.
                                                                              Well KMR Stitch said he would charge 750$ for the same system, that's even better.

                                                                              Comment

                                                                              • Donny
                                                                                As you wish...
                                                                                • May 2002
                                                                                • 13754

                                                                                #40
                                                                                Originally posted by MrJackMeHoff
                                                                                I build machines all day long without using garbage amd's for half the price but nice try.. I guess its good for someone who is clueless.
                                                                                I agree with the notion that AMDs are shit. Intel... Intel... Intel.

                                                                                Better yet, buy a Mac. I've purchased 4 Macs this year. Best computers EVER.

                                                                                Comment

                                                                                • pornguy
                                                                                  Too lazy to set a custom title
                                                                                  • Mar 2003
                                                                                  • 62910

                                                                                  #41
                                                                                  Damn guys let him try to sell it. If that is what he wants to build, then let him build them.
                                                                                  PornGuy skype me pornguy_epic

                                                                                  AmateurDough The Hottes Shemales online!
                                                                                  TChicks.com | Angeles Cid | Mariana Cordoba | MAILERS WELCOME!

                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                  • AaronM
                                                                                    GFY Royality ;)
                                                                                    • Oct 2001
                                                                                    • 46917

                                                                                    #42
                                                                                    Originally posted by DonovanPhillips
                                                                                    I agree with the notion that AMDs are shit. Intel... Intel... Intel.

                                                                                    Better yet, buy a Mac. I've purchased 4 Macs this year. Best computers EVER.
                                                                                    If they are so damn good...Why do you need four of them?

                                                                                    One for you, one for Belinda, and 2 others for....?

                                                                                    Did the first 2 break down or something?

                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                    • Donny
                                                                                      As you wish...
                                                                                      • May 2002
                                                                                      • 13754

                                                                                      #43
                                                                                      Originally posted by AaronM
                                                                                      If they are so damn good...Why do you need four of them?

                                                                                      One for you, one for Belinda, and 2 others for....?

                                                                                      Did the first 2 break down or something?
                                                                                      1- For me. Powerbook G4.
                                                                                      1- For Belinda at the office. PowerPC G5.
                                                                                      1- For home. 20" iMacG5.
                                                                                      1- For Crystal at the office to use. 17" iMac G5.

                                                                                      Plus I have 4 PCs. I hate it when I have to use them, but sometimes must. They simply don't compare.
                                                                                      Last edited by Donny; 12-11-2004, 07:21 PM.

                                                                                      Comment

                                                                                      • Donny
                                                                                        As you wish...
                                                                                        • May 2002
                                                                                        • 13754

                                                                                        #44
                                                                                        Originally posted by DonovanPhillips
                                                                                        1- For me. Powerbook G4.
                                                                                        1- For Belinda at the office. PowerPC G5.
                                                                                        1- For home. 20" iMacG5.
                                                                                        1- For Crystal at the office to use. 17" iMac G5.

                                                                                        Plus I have 4 PCs. I hate it when I have to use them, but sometimes must. They simply don't compare.
                                                                                        I forgot to mention I'm buying Belinda an iBook for Christmas. After using the Mac she can't stand using a PC Notebook.

                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                        • iwantchixx
                                                                                          Too lazy to set a custom title
                                                                                          • Oct 2002
                                                                                          • 12860

                                                                                          #45
                                                                                          Originally posted by DonovanPhillips
                                                                                          I agree with the notion that AMDs are shit. Intel... Intel... Intel.

                                                                                          Better yet, buy a Mac. I've purchased 4 Macs this year. Best computers EVER.
                                                                                          I've NEVER had an AMD chip fail me yet.

                                                                                          Comment

                                                                                          • Donny
                                                                                            As you wish...
                                                                                            • May 2002
                                                                                            • 13754

                                                                                            #46
                                                                                            Originally posted by iwantchixx
                                                                                            I've NEVER had an AMD chip fail me yet.
                                                                                            I have.

                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                            • Mr. Mike
                                                                                              Confirmed User
                                                                                              • Aug 2004
                                                                                              • 913

                                                                                              #47
                                                                                              anyone who says AMD sucks has NO idea. Amd is the shit!
                                                                                              Sig for sale. ICQ: 163-545-054

                                                                                              Comment

                                                                                              • Donny
                                                                                                As you wish...
                                                                                                • May 2002
                                                                                                • 13754

                                                                                                #48
                                                                                                Originally posted by Mr. Mike
                                                                                                anyone who says AMD sucks is RIGHT ON! Amd is shit!
                                                                                                (Corrected)

                                                                                                AMD is for people who can't afford better.

                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                • - Jesus Christ -
                                                                                                  Confirmed User
                                                                                                  • Mar 2003
                                                                                                  • 7197

                                                                                                  #49
                                                                                                  Originally posted by DonovanPhillips
                                                                                                  (Corrected)

                                                                                                  AMD is for people who can't afford better.
                                                                                                  Ignorance is strength.

                                                                                                  AMD is for people who like to turn a $150-200 chip into a $500-600 chip with a $40 dollar copper cooler.

                                                                                                  And poeple who like CPUs that process more instructions per clock cycle.

                                                                                                  And.....


                                                                                                  AMD Debuts Athlon FX-55, 4000+ Chip; Cuts Prices
                                                                                                  http://www.extremetech.com/article2/...79443%2C00.asp


                                                                                                  Craig Barrett: "We've changed our direction"
                                                                                                  Asked why Intel last week canceled plans to release a 4GHz Pentium processor
                                                                                                  http://news.com.com/Barrett+still+ha...ml?tag=st.prev


                                                                                                  This post Not approved by the ministry of truth.

                                                                                                  *ding dong ding* (intel song)

                                                                                                  Amen

                                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                                  • Donny
                                                                                                    As you wish...
                                                                                                    • May 2002
                                                                                                    • 13754

                                                                                                    #50
                                                                                                    Originally posted by - Jesus Christ -
                                                                                                    Ignorance is strength.

                                                                                                    ...blahblahblah...
                                                                                                    "People who can't afford better" = People who use anything other than Macs.

                                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                                    Working...