lock up your 2257's!!!

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  • xenigo
    Confirmed User
    • Jan 2001
    • 8067
    #1

    lock up your 2257's!!!

    I did a shoot last Thursday with two models, and had the 2257 docs sitting on my kitchen table. They came back Friday afternoon to finish the shoot, and said they had 45 minutes before they needed to leave. I wanted to finish up one detail of the shoot from the day before, but I stepped into the bathroom for no longer than 30 seconds.

    One of the models was sitting at the table. Fast forward to now, and I just realized the 2257 docs are GONE. Does anyone know if I can still legally use the content?? They signed the docs, and then they stole them. The 1st model has been paid, and we haven't finished the shoot involving the 2nd model so he hasn't been paid.
    Tags: None
    • boneprone
      Hall Of Fame
      • Jan 2001
      • 34415
      #2
      Hmmm......

      Not sure if this helps or not, but.........


      I fucked em.

      Industry Hall Of Fame Legend Mike Jones
      Bow to the Power - Still BP4L
      http://gfyawards.com/hall-of-fame
      Learn about it kids.

        Comment

        • ShellyCrash
          Confirmed User
          • Jun 2004
          • 6708
          #3
          Have you tried contacting her?

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            Comment

            • ronaldo
              Confirmed User
              • Jan 2002
              • 5475
              #4
              C'mon, you know the answer to this.

              Without them, you can't use them. Or, use them at your own risk.

              If you're asked to prove their age at the time of the shoot, can you do it? Do you have their written permission to use them?

              Shitty deal though. You'd probably have to sue her to get back a couple hundred dollars or the documents themselves.

              Consider it a lesson learned I guess.

                Comment

                • DutchTeenCash
                  I like Dutch Girls
                  • Feb 2003
                  • 21684
                  #5
                  no 2257 no pics id say sucks... call them ask whats up maybe they took them by mistake...

                  ICQ 16 91 547 - SKYPE dutchteencash
                  bob AT dutchteencash DOT com
                  ... did you see our newest Sweet Natural Girl Priscilla (18)?

                    Comment

                    • Raven
                      Confirmed User
                      • Jul 2001
                      • 6874
                      #6
                      Originally posted by xenigo
                      I did a shoot last Thursday with two models, and had the 2257 docs sitting on my kitchen table. They came back Friday afternoon to finish the shoot, and said they had 45 minutes before they needed to leave. I wanted to finish up one detail of the shoot from the day before, but I stepped into the bathroom for no longer than 30 seconds.

                      One of the models was sitting at the table. Fast forward to now, and I just realized the 2257 docs are GONE. Does anyone know if I can still legally use the content?? They signed the docs, and then they stole them. The 1st model has been paid, and we haven't finished the shoot involving the 2nd model so he hasn't been paid.
                      It's hard to form words....I keep wondering why a model would consent to a shoot and then steal the very papers which make the shoot legal....

                      Having said that, I certainly would not pay any more money until the docs are returned...and, I'd be asking them WTF, too....
                      Raven

                      ~RETIRED~

                        Comment

                        • Gynecologist
                          Confirmed User
                          • Sep 2004
                          • 2184
                          #7
                          Are they friends? Tell them the 2nd model does not get paid until you get another copy of the docs. Don't let them know you think they stole them. Just tell them you need to get another copy because you lost them.

                            Comment

                            • webmaster x
                              Confirmed User
                              • Mar 2004
                              • 4400
                              #8
                              Originally posted by ShellyCrash
                              Have you tried contacting her?
                              you better contact them
                              Click 9500 FHG Text Descriptions--Only $89!

                                Comment

                                • xenigo
                                  Confirmed User
                                  • Jan 2001
                                  • 8067
                                  #9
                                  Originally posted by ronaldo
                                  C'mon, you know the answer to this.

                                  Without them, you can't use them. Or, use them at your own risk.

                                  If you're asked to prove their age at the time of the shoot, can you do it? Do you have their written permission to use them?

                                  Shitty deal though. You'd probably have to sue her to get back a couple hundred dollars or the documents themselves.

                                  Consider it a lesson learned I guess.
                                  I talked to my brother who's in law school. He says that I should file a police report. I have photos of their ID's on hand, as well as the ID's being held next to their smiling faces. He also said that just because they steal the documents doesn't mean I don't have the right to use the content... considering theft is illegal.

                                    Comment

                                    • bdld
                                      $100,000
                                      • Dec 2001
                                      • 11452
                                      #10
                                      no docs, no legal pics, simple as that.

                                        Comment

                                        • ronaldo
                                          Confirmed User
                                          • Jan 2002
                                          • 5475
                                          #11
                                          Originally posted by xenigo
                                          I talked to my brother who's in law school. He says that I should file a police report. I have photos of their ID's on hand, as well as the ID's being held next to their smiling faces. He also said that just because they steal the documents doesn't mean I don't have the right to use the content... considering theft is illegal.
                                          That's true. I hadn't thought about just filing a police report.

                                          Looking at it from that perspective, I'd let them know that you're gonna do that and see if they hand them over.

                                          Then I'd call the police and check it out. If she says she didn't take them and you must have misplaced them, I think you'd be shit out of luck though.

                                          Without them though I'm pretty sure most lawyers would tell you, you can't prove you have the right to use them, regardless of whether you have the id's.

                                          Remember, she was conscious enough to take them (presumably), so she might very well be on the lookout for them to appear somewhere.

                                            Comment

                                            • trogdor
                                              Confirmed User
                                              • Jun 2004
                                              • 817
                                              #12
                                              stop shooting thugs from the ghetto and maybe u won't get jacked so much

                                                Comment

                                                • baddog
                                                  So Fucking Banned
                                                  • Apr 2001
                                                  • 107089
                                                  #13
                                                  Hello, Oakland PD? I was just taking some naked pics of these girls and they stole the docs that said I could plaster them over the Internet. Can you help?

                                                    Comment

                                                    • nnweb
                                                      Confirmed User
                                                      • Apr 2004
                                                      • 725
                                                      #14
                                                      Originally posted by baddog
                                                      Hello, Oakland PD? I was just taking some naked pics of these girls and they stole the docs that said I could plaster them over the Internet. Can you help?



                                                      i was thinking the same thing....

                                                        Comment

                                                        • xenigo
                                                          Confirmed User
                                                          • Jan 2001
                                                          • 8067
                                                          #15
                                                          Originally posted by ronaldo
                                                          That's true. I hadn't thought about just filing a police report.

                                                          Looking at it from that perspective, I'd let them know that you're gonna do that and see if they hand them over.

                                                          Then I'd call the police and check it out. If she says she didn't take them and you must have misplaced them, I think you'd be shit out of luck though.

                                                          Without them though I'm pretty sure most lawyers would tell you, you can't prove you have the right to use them, regardless of whether you have the id's.

                                                          Remember, she was conscious enough to take them (presumably), so she might very well be on the lookout for them to appear somewhere.
                                                          I have the pics of the ID's held next to their [smiling] faces. I'm not sure if that's enough to prove consent, or what. But I'm really upset about this situation. If I've wasted my time, and my money... I'll be real mad.

                                                            Comment

                                                            • xenigo
                                                              Confirmed User
                                                              • Jan 2001
                                                              • 8067
                                                              #16
                                                              Originally posted by trogdor
                                                              stop shooting thugs from the ghetto and maybe u won't get jacked so much
                                                              thanks for that brilliant bit of advice.

                                                                Comment

                                                                • abyss_al
                                                                  **LOOKING FOR TRADES**
                                                                  • Oct 2003
                                                                  • 15605
                                                                  #17
                                                                  don't do anything 'til you have the forms back
                                                                  EMAIL: allen @ vasmediagroup.com | ICQ: 311329761 | SKYPE: abyss.al | AIM: xABYSSxALx

                                                                    Comment

                                                                    • ShellyCrash
                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                      • Jun 2004
                                                                      • 6708
                                                                      #18
                                                                      Your probably wasting your time getting legal advice without asking them to resign first.

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                                                                        Comment

                                                                        • goBigtime
                                                                          Confirmed User
                                                                          • Nov 2002
                                                                          • 7761
                                                                          #19
                                                                          Originally posted by xenigo
                                                                          He also said that just because they steal the documents doesn't mean I don't have the right to use the content... considering theft is illegal.
                                                                          Then he isn't up to speed on 2257.

                                                                          No 2257 compliance = No right to use (sexually oriented) content.

                                                                            Comment

                                                                            • ronaldo
                                                                              Confirmed User
                                                                              • Jan 2002
                                                                              • 5475
                                                                              #20
                                                                              Originally posted by xenigo
                                                                              I have the pics of the ID's held next to their [smiling] faces. I'm not sure if that's enough to prove consent, or what. But I'm really upset about this situation. If I've wasted my time, and my money... I'll be real mad.
                                                                              That definitely doesn't prove consent.

                                                                              You and I and everyone else in the industry knows damn well what it means, but standing before a judge and jury when the prosecution is asking for proof? And the girl in the picture SAYS she never signed anything giving consent?

                                                                              It's this girl's word against the word of someone who (as stated above) wants to plaster them all over the internet.

                                                                              You'd never win.

                                                                                Comment

                                                                                • xenigo
                                                                                  Confirmed User
                                                                                  • Jan 2001
                                                                                  • 8067
                                                                                  #21
                                                                                  Originally posted by goBigtime
                                                                                  Then he isn't up to speed on 2257.

                                                                                  No 2257 compliance = No right to use (sexually oriented) content.
                                                                                  I don't believe that a model could simply steal a model release to therefore make their content illegal.

                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                    • FightThisPatent
                                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                                      • Aug 2003
                                                                                      • 4090
                                                                                      #22
                                                                                      Besides 2257 issues, without a signed model release, you can't post those pics up and make money (otherwise they could sue you and then you would sue them, etc, etc,etc).

                                                                                      Without model releases, you can't do anything with the pics.


                                                                                      Fight the Sticky Fingers!

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                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                        • Jace
                                                                                          FBOP Class Of 2013
                                                                                          • Jan 2004
                                                                                          • 35562
                                                                                          #23
                                                                                          tell them you need to shoot again

                                                                                          and corner them when they get into your studio

                                                                                          gangsta justice, old school style...

                                                                                          fuck the police, they won't do shit

                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                            • Trixxxia
                                                                                              Confirmed User
                                                                                              • Aug 2004
                                                                                              • 5600
                                                                                              #24
                                                                                              Actually, forgive the ignorance or maybe I missed a point here - but, what's the problem with asking them to come in and sign again? If the person refuses, then make a report. Also, do you not provide them with a copy? If so, ask for their copy & see how that goes.

                                                                                              If they refuse to come back in and sign it - remember to keep the pen they used (in case we get all technical & need forensics) - hopefully you had the same sheet under the original form (and they pressed hard enough to trace their signature on the bottom copy) and then go make a police report for robbery I guess - stealing legal documents should be illegal right? Do you have proof that you paid them? Did you film that part?

                                                                                              Ok - I have too much legal influence and watch too many shows, I know Good luck though - hopefully those will spark some other ideas on how to get your 2257 back - whether a new copy or the originals.

                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                • CET
                                                                                                  Confirmed User
                                                                                                  • Jul 2003
                                                                                                  • 2754
                                                                                                  #25
                                                                                                  Originally posted by xenigo
                                                                                                  I talked to my brother who's in law school. He says that I should file a police report. I have photos of their ID's on hand, as well as the ID's being held next to their smiling faces. He also said that just because they steal the documents doesn't mean I don't have the right to use the content... considering theft is illegal.
                                                                                                  The problem is proving that your stuff is legal. It may be legal, but you can't prove it without that document. The document exists, was signed, etc., but you can't prove that without the documents themselves or at least pics and/or video of the documents.
                                                                                                  Alt Journals, Blogs for Perverts!

                                                                                                  Fitness and nutrition writer, and UNIX/Linux Sys Ad in training

                                                                                                  "Just as a man who has fallen into a heap of filth ought to seek the great pond of water covered with lotuses, which is near by: even so seek thou for the great deathless lake of Nirvana to wash off the defilement of wrong. If the lake is not sought, it is not the fault of the lake."

                                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                                    • CET
                                                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                                                      • Jul 2003
                                                                                                      • 2754
                                                                                                      #26
                                                                                                      Originally posted by TopBucksTrixxxia
                                                                                                      Actually, forgive the ignorance or maybe I missed a point here - but, what's the problem with asking them to come in and sign again?
                                                                                                      I was wondering the same thing.
                                                                                                      Alt Journals, Blogs for Perverts!

                                                                                                      Fitness and nutrition writer, and UNIX/Linux Sys Ad in training

                                                                                                      "Just as a man who has fallen into a heap of filth ought to seek the great pond of water covered with lotuses, which is near by: even so seek thou for the great deathless lake of Nirvana to wash off the defilement of wrong. If the lake is not sought, it is not the fault of the lake."

                                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                                        • ronaldo
                                                                                                          Confirmed User
                                                                                                          • Jan 2002
                                                                                                          • 5475
                                                                                                          #27
                                                                                                          Originally posted by TopBucksTrixxxia
                                                                                                          Actually, forgive the ignorance or maybe I missed a point here - but, what's the problem with asking them to come in and sign again?
                                                                                                          I'm assuming that the model knew what she was doing and would refuse to sign again, making them useless.

                                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                                            • VIPimp
                                                                                                              Marina WILL have my babies!
                                                                                                              • May 2003
                                                                                                              • 9234
                                                                                                              #28
                                                                                                              Originally posted by boneprone
                                                                                                              Hmmm......

                                                                                                              Not sure if this helps or not, but.........


                                                                                                              I fucked em.

                                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                                • Shoehorn!
                                                                                                                  Die With Your Boots On
                                                                                                                  • Oct 2003
                                                                                                                  • 22872
                                                                                                                  #29
                                                                                                                  Originally posted by boneprone
                                                                                                                  Hmmm......

                                                                                                                  Not sure if this helps or not, but.........


                                                                                                                  I fucked em.
                                                                                                                  If memory serves me correctly xenigo shoots gay content. Plus, in the last sentence he said "....so HE hasn't been paid...."

                                                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                                                    • Dagwolf
                                                                                                                      President of Canada
                                                                                                                      • Sep 2003
                                                                                                                      • 23141
                                                                                                                      #30
                                                                                                                      Maybe one of them thought it was his/her copy of the documents?

                                                                                                                      Sleep well, and dream of large women.

                                                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                                                        • Scootermuze
                                                                                                                          Confirmed User
                                                                                                                          • Dec 2001
                                                                                                                          • 4513
                                                                                                                          #31
                                                                                                                          If you have their license held up to their faces, I would think that would show proof of age...

                                                                                                                          If you have signed model releases, I don't see where the problem is...

                                                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                                                            • Red Ezra
                                                                                                                              redezra.com
                                                                                                                              • May 2004
                                                                                                                              • 4678
                                                                                                                              #32
                                                                                                                              did u file a permit to shoot these pics? I wouldn't call the cops if not - also - you have to be able to prove the model took them and not someone else.

                                                                                                                              sorry to hear about this - I worry about this too - my biggest problem is incomplete paperwork - same problem but my fault for not catching it - just a good idea to square away all paperwork before any shooting or checks out.

                                                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                                                • V_RocKs
                                                                                                                                  Damn Right I Kiss Ass!
                                                                                                                                  • Nov 2003
                                                                                                                                  • 32451
                                                                                                                                  #33
                                                                                                                                  Originally posted by boneprone
                                                                                                                                  Hmmm......

                                                                                                                                  Not sure if this helps or not, but.........


                                                                                                                                  I fucked em.
                                                                                                                                  Thanks, I was pulling hair out over this and well, it is better to know. You know?

                                                                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                                                                    • makefuckingmoney
                                                                                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                      • Oct 2003
                                                                                                                                      • 3277
                                                                                                                                      #34
                                                                                                                                      i think the most you would get would be 3-5 years..so i wouldnt worry about it. unless the jail time concerns you.

                                                                                                                                      just think, in jail you would go from content provider to just content..

                                                                                                                                        Comment

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