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Probono

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#1

COPA Compliance

11-10-2004, 06:57 PM

Why are all of you in a huff about COPA? It is enjoined and has been for years but I think we can live with it. We have been COPA compliant since the law passed and it has only helped us.

COPA would mean that people need to take out their credit card to see hardcore porn, that is our goal isn't it?
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baddog

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#2

11-10-2004, 06:58 PM

COPA compliant? Is there something you want to tell us?
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Probono

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#3

11-10-2004, 07:05 PM

Originally posted by baddog
COPA compliant? Is there something you want to tell us?

Child Onilne Protection Act (COPA) the law that requires adult verification ie: a credit card before someone can view pornography on the Internet.

http://www.epic.org/free_speech/censorship/copa.html
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Easton

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#4

11-10-2004, 07:11 PM

COPA cobana

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Kimmykim

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#5

11-10-2004, 07:13 PM

Visa and Mastercard don't particularly care about COPA or it's legality. Remember they killed the AVS model when they said their brands were not age verification methods.
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baddog

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#6

11-10-2004, 07:19 PM

Originally posted by Probono
Child Onilne Protection Act (COPA) the law that requires adult verification ie: a credit card before someone can view pornography on the Internet.

http://www.epic.org/free_speech/censorship/copa.html

I know what it is, I also know the Supreme Court sent it back months ago. So, again, is there something you want to tell us?
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baddog

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#7

11-10-2004, 07:21 PM

Originally posted by Kimmykim
Visa and Mastercard don't particularly care about COPA or it's legality. Remember they killed the AVS model when they said their brands were not age verification methods.

They may not like it, but they are valid ways of verifying age, unless they have started entering non-binding contracts with minors.
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#8

11-10-2004, 07:27 PM

Originally posted by Easton
COPA cobana

You made laugh so hard, thanks

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Easton

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#9

11-10-2004, 07:30 PM

Originally posted by digifan
You made laugh so hard, thanks

thanks, glad someone saw the humor in it!

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gornyhuy

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#10

11-10-2004, 07:31 PM

I'm more concerned that they are going to end prohibition.

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Kimmykim

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#11

11-10-2004, 07:32 PM

Originally posted by baddog
They may not like it, but they are valid ways of verifying age, unless they have started entering non-binding contracts with minors.

What, like my kid with pre-paid Visa cards?

Having a Mastercard or Visa today is a totally different situation than 1998 was...

And let's don't use the words, "they may not like it", when referring to anything card association related ;)
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Probono

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#12

11-10-2004, 07:35 PM

The statute has these built in safe harbors

`(c) Affirmative Defense.--
_
``(1) Defense.--It is an affirmative defense to prosecution
under this section that the defendant, in good faith, has
restricted access by minors to material that is harmful to
minors--
_
``(A) by requiring use of a credit card, debit account,
adult access code, or adult personal identification number;
_
``(B) by accepting a digital certificate that verifies age;
or
``(C) by any other reasonable measures that are feasible
under available technology.
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NoCarrier

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#13

11-10-2004, 07:36 PM

Is there something new about COPA?

That law was never in effect.

Why do we have a thread about COPA today?
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Probono

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#14

11-10-2004, 07:37 PM

Originally posted by NoCarrier
Is there something new about COPA?

That law was never in effect.

Why do we have a thread about COPA today?

Nothing new. I just keep asking why people are concerned about it. I think COPA would increase revenues.
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baddog

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#15

11-10-2004, 09:11 PM

Originally posted by Kimmykim
What, like my kid with pre-paid Visa cards?

Having a Mastercard or Visa today is a totally different situation than 1998 was...

And let's don't use the words, "they may not like it", when referring to anything card association related ;)

Originally posted by Probono
The statute has these built in safe harbors

`(c) Affirmative Defense.--
_
``(1) Defense.--It is an affirmative defense to prosecution
under this section that the defendant, in good faith, has
restricted access by minors to material that is harmful to
minors--
_
``(A) by requiring use of a credit card, debit account,
adult access code, or adult personal identification number;
_
``(B) by accepting a digital certificate that verifies age;
or
``(C) by any other reasonable measures that are feasible
under available technology.
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baddog

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#16

11-10-2004, 09:12 PM

Originally posted by Probono
Nothing new. I just keep asking why people are concerned about it. I think COPA would increase revenues.

It would . . . . significantly.
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baddog

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#17

11-10-2004, 09:18 PM

Originally posted by Kimmykim
What, like my kid with pre-paid Visa cards?

Having a Mastercard or Visa today is a totally different situation than 1998 was...

And let's don't use the words, "they may not like it", when referring to anything card association related ;)

Answer me this . . . . why is it okay for Ebay to use a cc to verify age toi get into their adult area?

Why does JD Obenberger say a cc is a valid way of determining that you are dealing with an adult?
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Mr.Fiction

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#18

11-10-2004, 11:33 PM

Fuck off if you don't like free speech!

The internet does not have to be made 100% kid proof. Parents have to do their job of monitoring their kids. Cable TV has plenty of tits and you don't have to enter a credit card everytime you turn the channel on TV. You enter a credit card when you sign up for cable, just like you enter a credit card when you sign up for internet access. The act of signing up for internet access requires an adult, so that adult should be monitoring children's internet access just like they should be monitoring whether their kid is watching porn on HBO.

Stop thinking about making more money for a second and consider the more important issue of free speech and privacy rights, if there are any such rights left.

Don't be lazy, protect free speech: ACLU | Free Speech Coalition | EFF | IMPA
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European Lee

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#19

11-10-2004, 11:34 PM

Originally posted by baddog
They may not like it, but they are valid ways of verifying age, unless they have started entering non-binding contracts with minors.

So you have never seen a 14 year old with a Visa credit card?

My sister has one and thats how old she is

There are also 'pre-paid' credit cards now to which ANYONE can use to buy goods / services wherever Visa is accepted.

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#20

11-10-2004, 11:38 PM

Originally posted by baddog
They may not like it, but they are valid ways of verifying age, unless they have started entering non-binding contracts with minors.

As much as you might hate to think, minors can easily get access to a "credit card" and get one with their name on it. No need to be 18 unless you want a actual line of credit.

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baddog

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#21

11-10-2004, 11:40 PM

Originally posted by Steen2
As much as you might hate to think, minors can easily get access to a "credit card" and get one with their name on it. No need to be 18 unless you want a actual line of credit.

a bank card and a credit card are not the same thing
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Probono

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#22

11-11-2004, 01:45 AM

Originally posted by Probono
The statute has these built in safe harbors

`(c) Affirmative Defense.--
_
``(1) Defense.--It is an affirmative defense to prosecution
under this section that the defendant, in good faith, has
restricted access by minors to material that is harmful to
minors--
_
``(A) by requiring use of a credit card, debit account,
adult access code, or adult personal identification number;
_
``(B) by accepting a digital certificate that verifies age;
or
``(C) by any other reasonable measures that are feasible
under available technology.

The credit card is proof of age according to the statute so all other discussions of 12 year olds with Visa's are moot. The free speech argument is one dear to me, Still I ask the business question. Why does this industry oppose something that would in my opinion reduce the prolifertion of free porn and force people to take out their credit cards.

We whine collectively when we are associated with child pornography, supporting this law would be a public relations coop and increase our revenues?

Last edited by Probono; 11-11-2004, 01:46 AM.
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Probono

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#23

11-11-2004, 05:10 AM

a bump for the day crew
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#24

11-11-2004, 05:18 AM

Also what makes copa hard to enforce there is still the rest of the world.
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#25

11-11-2004, 05:21 AM

Originally posted by baddog
a bank card and a credit card are not the same thing

visa does offer teen credit cards. as a matter of fact visa and aol went into a teen visa card venture together.

the catch is that the parents have to sign off as well. therefore if the kid doesn't pay, the parents have to.

problem with that, as always, is the kid signs up for an adult site, the parents see the statement. the parents get pissed because they couldnt do their job and point the blame at the merchant thereby creating a chargeback.

it's a mess that just keeps getting messier and the association refuses to acknowledge the mess THEY have created.

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baddog

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#26

11-12-2004, 04:22 PM

Originally posted by Cassie
visa does offer teen credit cards. as a matter of fact visa and aol went into a teen visa card venture together.

the catch is that the parents have to sign off as well. therefore if the kid doesn't pay, the parents have to.

problem with that, as always, is the kid signs up for an adult site, the parents see the statement. the parents get pissed because they couldnt do their job and point the blame at the merchant thereby creating a chargeback.

it's a mess that just keeps getting messier and the association refuses to acknowledge the mess THEY have created.

So, why does Visa allow Ebay to use them as a way to verify that you are 18 to get into their adult area?
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