Michael Moore fans. Educate me!

Just read his site, it's pretty good. MichaelMoore.com

Cool. Where's the part about the KKK and the NRA?

This

Yeah, that. What is the historical connection between the KKK and the NRA that Moore alludes to? What is his point?

the year the KKK was made illegal was the year the NRA was set up

Watch it for yourself and get back to us

http://www.bowlingforcolumbine.com/m...lips/index.php

BTW it's 1. Brief History of America.

It's also the year the German Empire was formed. I got a big SO WHAT to say to that.

Do you think Moore is trying to tell us that there is a connection between the two or just that he is fascinated with the year 1871 in general?

I've seen the movie twice. Thanks. That cartoon is very funny.

You sound like you have a brain. But if you really need someone to tell you, then I'll go ahead and say Moore is trying to tell us that there is a connection between the two.

Sound like you either can't figure it out on your own, or your trying to start a flamewar. Either way, I don't think anyone cares. Its Michael mooore.

Gee........thats all good..................except that its WRONG:

The Klan was founded in 1866 in Tennessee. The NRA was founded in 1871 -- by act of the New York Legislature, at request of former Union officers.

.........and the KKK was quickly recognized as being a terrorist organization........it didn't take all those years to do so

Colin (im not a huge Michael Moore) fan but I like the way he gets people to bring him up on boards across the world EVERYDAY.

In addition, if you are not from the SOuth, its funny that you even ask about such a thing.

Im from the heart of the SOuth and have seen the KKK rallies and have seen the NRA rallies at the same time in a city, have seen the protests of blacks coming out first hand.

Have you ever been to a KKK rally? A NRA rally, and have you seen blacks protest such things?

I dont know about historical connections but they are most certainly along side each other sometimes, and until you go to college in the south and see the marches and protests the way i did going from highschool to college in the south, its funny to to see people even bring up things like this

Is Michael Moore a complete idiot, or is that just my impression?

Some info:

David T. Hardy has an excellent point-by-point refutation of just about the entire movie, which he argues is not a hahahahahahahahaary because of the sheer volume of fiction. He hahahahahas that the movie

equates the NRA with the Klan, suggesting NRA was founded in 1871, "the same year that the Klan became an illegal terrorist organization." Bowling goes on to depict Klansmen becoming the NRA and an NRA character helping to light a burning cross.
This sequence is intended to create the impression either that NRA and the Klan were parallel groups or that when the Klan was outlawed its members formed the NRA.

A nice theory, but only if you take no notice of the actual early history of the KKK and the NRA. Hardy provides a handy overview (paraphrased here):

The Klan Act and Enforcement Act [which criminalized the KKK] were signed into law by President Ulysess S. Grant, who used their provisions vigorously.
Grant's vigor in disrupting the Klan earned him unpopularity among many whites, yet after Grant left the White House, the NRA elected him as its eighth president.
After Grant's term, the NRA elected General Philip Sheridan, who had removed the governors of Texas and Lousiana for failure to suppress the KKK.
The NRA was founded by former Union officers, and eight of its first ten presidents were Union veterans.
During the 1950s and 1960s, groups of blacks organized as NRA chapters in order to obtain surplus military rifles to fight off Klansmen.

Started from nothing and won an academy award. What have you achieved?

Ive been looking into info on this as well.

I dont think its as blatant as Michael Moore has said, but it has to do with gun rights and blacks.

Heres something on Slashdot but not much into the actual words.

"In Chapter three Sunstein speaks of the gun rights movement alongside the KKK, God Hates Fags, and other hate groups in what can only be considered an attempt at guilt by association."

http://slashdot.org/books/01/03/25/1617212.shtml

its very hard to find info on this type of thing t be honest.

who knows if the KKK donates or is member of NRA? I would guess they are. Since they volunteer their srvices in times of WACO etc, they surely support guns, its that they were maybe active against allowing blacks to own guns?

possible?

YES.

(for the record, im not defending Michael Moore, i believe people like him are slobs and when you let yourself go to shit, it speaks about who you are inside)

Fletch,

That's interesting. I live in Miami. Geographically south but not culturally.

I've never seen a KKK rally nor an NRA rally.

There is alot of FACT that Micheal Moore puts out there.
Sure evryone is out to discredit him and make him look like a money grubbing attention whore but there still is alot of FACTUAL and Statistcial information to back up some of the claims he makes.
Dont be a sheep, Make your own decisions!

Both.

He's a fanatic just like Limbaugh is. And fanatics always seem to gloss over the facts or ignore them, or embellish them to support their position because they are overlyzealous and self-righteous.

Hence Moore's position at the Oscar's when he was booed off the stage..........he couldn't admit this and said it was actually his fans in the audience "booing the original booers".

He's a fanatic and he's delusional.

Ive been and have seen the protests.

ive even curated and taken part in art exhibits featuring William Christienberry, his art speaks legions more than most modern artists.

his art featured KKK related things.

http://www.alabamaarts.org/christenberry.html

Colin, there was a boy tied to a car and dragged down a rock road when I was in highschool, thats only a little over 10 years ago, and it was done by racists supported by KKK. If that is still going on in my lifetime in New Orleans, there is more than meets the eye.

NRA and KKK kind of rhyme.. I think thats the connection.

Hannity is the new Limbaugh.

ALSO: sometimes the Klan tries to link itself to groups, so this could possibly have been part of KKK propaganda to make it look like they were part of and actively supported, donated, whatever the ties be. As I said, during Waco, KKK wasd down there in full gear, ready to rock, volunteering services, Id think they support rhe NRA, and definitely try to align itself with it

http://www.chronwatch.com/content/co...171&catcode=33

"It seems that Cruz Bustamante?s ties to the separatist Hispanic group MEChA, have earned him some rather unsavory supporters. According to WorldNetDaily.com, former KKK Grand Wizard Tom Metzger, has decided to endorse Bustamante in the upcoming recall election. At least Metzger?s honest about his racism, which is more than can be said for Bustamante.

After refusing to disassociate himself from a Hispanic group critics say is as racist as the Ku Klux Klan, California gubernatorial candidate Cruz Bustamante has won an endorsement from the Klan itself. "

you got me digging, now I find this

http://www.nra-kkk.org/

HAHAHAHA

http://www.misterpoll.com/2090788171.html#

"the KKK and NRA have no ties, the NRA was founded by two northn officers who were displeased at their soldiers performance, and was ruled by northern veterans for 30 years, the NRA bought former slaves and blacks in the 1950-60s firearms to protect themselves from the clan, as well as blockaded any states who didnt crack down on the KKK, but dont take my word for it, look up facts."

That's funny.

"David T. Hardy has an excellent point-by-point refutation of just about the entire movie, which he argues is not a hahahahahahahahaary because of the sheer volume of fiction. He hahahahahas that the movie

equates the NRA with the Klan, suggesting NRA was founded in 1871, "the same year that the Klan became an illegal terrorist organization." Bowling goes on to depict Klansmen becoming the NRA and an NRA character helping to light a burning cross.
This sequence is intended to create the impression either that NRA and the Klan were parallel groups or that when the Klan was outlawed its members formed the NRA.

A nice theory, but only if you take no notice of the actual early history of the KKK and the NRA. Hardy provides a handy overview (paraphrased here):

The Klan Act and Enforcement Act [which criminalized the KKK] were signed into law by President Ulysess S. Grant, who used their provisions vigorously.
Grant's vigor in disrupting the Klan earned him unpopularity among many whites, yet after Grant left the White House, the NRA elected him as its eighth president.
After Grant's term, the NRA elected General Philip Sheridan, who had removed the governors of Texas and Lousiana for failure to suppress the KKK.
The NRA was founded by former Union officers, and eight of its first ten presidents were Union veterans.
During the 1950s and 1960s, groups of blacks organized as NRA chapters in order to obtain surplus military rifles to fight off Klansmen.
Dollars-to-dougnuts, for most of the non-NRA members in the Bowling for Columbine audience, the take-home message was that the NRA was a racist organization.

Blogger Rachel Lucas pointed out that in the recent decision upholding California's assault weapons ban, there were a few choice words on disarmament from the dissenting Judge Kozinski.

Disarmament was the tool of choice for subjugating both slaves and free blacks in the South. In Florida, patrols searched blacks' homes for weapons, confiscated those found and punished their owners without judicial process. . . . In the North, by contrast, blacks exercised their right to bear arms to defend against racial mob violence. As Chief Justice Taney well appreciated, the institution of slavery required a class of people who lacked the means to resist. . . . A revolt by Nat Turner and a few dozen other armed blacks could be put down without much difficulty; one by four million armed blacks would have meant big trouble.
As Elder comments, "Not that Moore cares, but it was America's gun-control movement that sprouted from racist soil." Sadly ironic that the NAACP and champions-of-minorities- everywhere Democrats propose gun control and disarmament, taking away the very tools that helped blacks win--and enforce--their equality."

http://www.theinternetparty.org/comm...20030526000108

Who's trying to discredit Moore? I'm new to the whole "Michael Moore is/is not a liar" debate. (I did see Columbine when it came out). My basic take on him to date is that he is an entertainer like Rush Limbaugh. He's a mouthpiece for the left like Limbaugh for the right. I see little difference between them.

So anyway, I finally took the time to look at the "Moore is a liar" websites and also read Moore's letter.

The whole KKK/NRA relationship stuck out to me as interesting. Is Moore onto something? Is he making historical claims? Is he just bullshitting? Is he lying? What's the deal?

Here is when Pete, TheFly" attended a KKK rally at his Florida campus. not sure if pics are still in the thread.

http://www.gofuckyourself.com/showth...threadid=87117

here is the pics thread, but all pics re gone.

he went to the rally and took pics.

http://www.gofuckyourself.com/showth...ighlight=rally