150 U.S. troops killed in Iraq today
-
-
How about becaue if you tried to rise up against saddam, he killed you and your entire family. If enough of you rose up, he gassed you all at once.Originally posted by tony404
Answer the question I posed ,they didnt fight against Saddam but they are fighting against us why. Think, I know it will hurt a little bit.
The very fact that the people in Iraq can protest, and "raise up" speaks to the FACT that America IS acting like liberators.
If ALL of Iraq were against the US, wouldn't we see MILLIONS of insurgents raised up as an army on the streets? Look at Palestine. Every man, woman, child HATES the jews. And they're all willing to die, to kill Jews.
Can't we assume by the fact that the MAJORITY of Iraqis are NOT rallying in the streets against the US ... that the people who are, are in fact, the minority in the country?
God I'd kill for an Iraqi to be able to post, see what the people really think..Comment
-
You dont see how i can complain about that and tie that in with terrorism?Originally posted by Roger
Saddam paid the families of suicide bombers who get there homes destroyed. I don't see how you can complain about that.
Really he showed Al-Qaeda how to make bombs? I think they have enough CIA training to know how to do that.
No truck bombing info was recovered by a couple european news agency's. From Iraqi Intelligence files along with a few other things.
The people who are fighting are not normal iraqi citizens. Muqtada al-Sadr Is leading the battle going on right now. Research him. People protesting for america to give back the country to an iraqi gov and leave?? Is that the people your talking about rising up? Comon these are driven by political groups with agendas.
Actually the statement I was blasting was in regard to this ignorant paragraph:Originally posted by Roger
Do you understand that there's ethnic cleansing in Sudan as we speak? Do you understand that Kim Jong Il is doing things that Saddam wouldn't even come close to doing? So just what exactly are you trying to come to? That Saddam was not nice?
I dont think it was as bad in Iraq as they told us. Things get shitty people rise up , we werent going in to help the Iraqi freedom fighters. There were none , people said they couldnt rise up they were so afraid of Saddam. I believed that once I dont believe now
Trust no one there all snakesComment
-
That sucks!Visit the PornPosse to see what we can do for you!
Comment
-
You can safely assume that, if only because it is seems to be a universal disease for people to stay home and leave it to others to organize their lives. By the same token, your comment about the Palestinians was wildly inaccurate.Originally posted by WarChild
Can't we assume by the fact that the MAJORITY of Iraqis are NOT rallying in the streets against the US ... that the people who are, are in fact, the minority in the country?
I doubt you can take much comfort from some peoples' ability to be apathetic even in extreme conditions. Your other assumptions are postively dangerous because in Iraq, the US is attempting the magic trick of moving the country to democracy, while trying to ensure that the 60% Shi'ite population (sympathetic to Iran) doesn't end up in control.Comment
-
So what you're saying is that the US should employ Israel's anti-terror strategy (something analogous to sending retaliatory airstrikes into refugee camps)?Originally posted by irishfury
From him paying 10k per suicide bomber to his government showing al-Qaeda how to make sophisticated truck bombs. Which if you remember back in '98 toppled a few embassy's in africa.
Yes, that has seemed to work. I haven't heard of any suicide bomber stories in YEARS.
As an aside, some poster mentioned the US as the world's only fit police force. Where was the US when 800,000 people were murdered in Rwanda?
Oh yeah, no oil there...Comment
-
They are facing death from the U.S now with protests and uprising, what makes you think they wouldn't have protested when Saddam was around if they had a reason, death is death no matter who deals it.
I think one of the main problems is that exiled Iraqi's are coming in and taking the power from the Iraqi's that have been there through-out Saddam's rule.Comment
-
How do you figure my comment about Palestinians was "wildy inaccurate".Originally posted by jayeff
You can safely assume that, if only because it is seems to be a universal disease for people to stay home and leave it to others to organize their lives. By the same token, your comment about the Palestinians was wildly inaccurate.
Who else employs women and children, to kill their enemies by blowing themselves up? Children cheer in the streets and highly respect other children that are willing to die for the cause.
We aren't seeing the people of Iraq rise up against the United States, in the same way Palestinians have risen up against Isreal. Not even close..Comment
-
The united states has not opened up on entire segments of the population with chemical weapons. Saddam did that to people that rose up against him.Originally posted by slackologist
They are facing death from the U.S now with protests and uprising, what makes you think they wouldn't have protested when Saddam was around if they had a reason, death is death no matter who deals it.
I think one of the main problems is that exiled Iraqi's are coming in and taking the power from the Iraqi's that have been there through-out Saddam's rule.
Or maybe he didn't .. Could be the Fox news / CNN conspiracy story .. We all know why no hard evidence about anything like that has come to light ... It's because people are so very good at keeping secrets..Comment
-
Exiled Iraqi's that left Iraq with billions of dollars before the first Gulf -War. Exiled Iraqi's that are still wanted in other middle east countries on charges of major fraud. The U.S Govt seems happy to prop them up though and hand them the power Saddam once had.
.
Comment
-
The sad thing is that the US orginally supplied the gas so that Iraq could use it in the war against Iran.Originally posted by WarChild
The united states has not opened up on entire segments of the population with chemical weapons. Saddam did that to people that rose up against him.
Or maybe he didn't .. Could be the Fox news / CNN conspiracy story .. We all know why no hard evidence about anything like that has come to light ... It's because people are so very good at keeping secrets.
Saddam never gassed "Iraqi's" that i know of but i think it has been proven conclusivley that he gassed many 'Kurds' that were trying to form an independant state of Kurdistan in the north of Iraq. ( I may be wrong ) Horrific and shocking as it was the U.S didn't condemn Saddam for this act until several years after the fact.Comment
-
In my books, if you live inside Iraq's borders .. You're an Iraqi.Originally posted by slackologist
The sad thing is that the US orginally supplied the gas so that Iraq could use it in the war against Iran.
Saddam never gassed "Iraqi's" that i know of but i think it has been proven conclusivley that he gassed many 'Kurds' that were trying to form an independant state of Kurdistan in the north of Iraq. ( I may be wrong ) Horrific and shocking as it was the U.S didn't condemn Saddam for this act until several years after the fact.
The Kurds have been prosecuted in Iraq for a long time, as I understand it. They tried to rise up and got gassed for it.
Are French people living in Canada not Canadians? They want to rise up and have their own state too. Alright to gas 'em then?.Comment
-
Protestors against the occupation get fired at. People have been warned that anyone who protests against the occupation may get shot or arrested.Originally posted by WarChild
The very fact that the people in Iraq can protest, and "raise up" speaks to the FACT that America IS acting like liberators.
If ALL of Iraq were against the US, wouldn't we see MILLIONS of insurgents raised up as an army on the streets? Look at Palestine. Every man, woman, child HATES the jews. And they're all willing to die, to kill Jews.
Can't we assume by the fact that the MAJORITY of Iraqis are NOT rallying in the streets against the US ... that the people who are, are in fact, the minority in the country?
God I'd kill for an Iraqi to be able to post, see what the people really think.
For you 1 year of occupation is no different than 50 years of occupation? Even in Palestine I don't see millions of insurgents raised up as an army on the streets. Not everyone is willing to fight.
I had relatives in Iraq but of course they left. I know plenty of people in the ME who's life is certainly a lot worst because of that war. What's for sure is that the ME is becoming more and more hostile towards anyone who's not Muslim. Maybe you like to live in an occupied country though.Comment
-
It would be nice if it were that simple.Originally posted by WarChild
In my books, if you live inside Iraq's borders .. You're an Iraqi.
I'm not saying it was OK or that it wasnt horrific ( in fact i did say it was horrific in my last post ) I just don't see it as being as much of a deterrent to revolt than death by overwealming military superiority.Last edited by slackologist; 04-06-2004, 11:03 PM.Comment
-
The US doesn't intend to occupy Iraq for 50 years. Nohahahaha is trying to take any Iraqi holy land.Originally posted by Roger
For you 1 year of occupation is no different than 50 years of occupation? Even in Palestine I don't see millions of insurgents raised up as an army on the streets. Not everyone is willing to fight.
We can argue about this all day .. Neither of us are going to change ours minds and agree with the other.
10 years from now .. We'll see what the Iraqi people have to say.
If the majority of Iraqis hate the United States and/or the US is still in Iraq, running the show . I will proudly admit I was wrong.
However, if in 10 years from now the people of Iraq for the most part begin to like freedom, and thank the United States .. Then I hope you'll be willing to say you were wrong, completely..Comment
-
Originally posted by slackologist
It would be nice if it were that simple.
I'm not saying it was OK or that it wasnt horrific ( in fact i did say it was horrific in my last post ) I just don't see it as being as much of a deterrent to revolt than death by overwealming military superiority.
Show me just one source verifying that "overwhelming military superiorirty" was used by the United States, specifically targeting a civilian crowd. I've yet to see anything that suggests that Apache helicopters are just specifically gunning down protestors on the street..Comment
-
Maybe you'd like to share that truck bombing story with us by providing a link?Originally posted by irishfury
No truck bombing info was recovered by a couple european news agency's. From Iraqi Intelligence files along with a few other things.
The people who are fighting are not normal iraqi citizens. Muqtada al-Sadr Is leading the battle going on right now. Research him. People protesting for america to give back the country to an iraqi gov and leave?? Is that the people your talking about rising up? Comon these are driven by political groups with agendas.
You know al-Sadra is not the only one fighting. He just started this fight a couple of days ago. There are plenty of small groups fighting.
Iraq was bad but there's plenty of countries who are much worst.Actually the statement I was blasting was in regard to this ignorant paragraph:
...Comment
-
Yup .. plenty of SMALL groups. Nowhere near representitive of the population as a whole.Originally posted by Roger
Iraq was bad but there's plenty of countries who are much worst..Comment
-
So you're saying that Iraqi militants have firepower equal to the US Military. ummm OK.Originally posted by WarChild
Show me just one source verifying that "overwhelming military superiorirty" was used by the United States, specifically targeting a civilian crowd. I've yet to see anything that suggests that Apache helicopters are just specifically gunning down protestors on the street.Comment
-
quote:Originally posted by slackologist
So you're saying that Iraqi militants have firepower equal to the US Military. ummm OK.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by slackologist
It would be nice if it were that simple.
I'm not saying it was OK or that it wasnt horrific ( in fact i did say it was horrific in my last post ) I just don't see it as being as much of a deterrent to revolt than death by overwealming military superiority.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I was originally talking about Saddam using Chemical weapons on Kurds. That's bringing overwhelming millitary power to bare on civilians. Tens of thousands of them.
Apache helicopters, chemical weapons .. It doesn't matter, it all kills civilians FAST.
Where did I ever say Iraqi Millitants had weapons equal to the US army? Of course they don't. And it doesn't have anything to do with what I've said..Comment
-
Because the same human nature which applies to your observation about the Iraqis, equally applies to the Palestinians. Most stay at home.Originally posted by WarChild
How do you figure my comment about Palestinians was "wildy inaccurate".
There are almost 2½ million Arabs in the West Bank and getting on for 1½ million in Gaza. Yet the biggest demonstrations only involve a few thousand people and most public displays only dozens or hundreds.Comment
-
No need to resort to childish name calling.Originally posted by WarChild
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by slackologist
It would be nice if it were that simple.
I'm not saying it was OK or that it wasnt horrific ( in fact i did say it was horrific in my last post ) I just don't see it as being as much of a deterrent to revolt than death by overwealming military superiority.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I was originally talking about Saddam using Chemical weapons on Kurds. That's bringing overwhelming millitary power to bare on civilians. Tens of thousands of them.
Apache helicopters, chemical weapons .. It doesn't matter, it all kills civilians FAST.
Where did I ever Iraqi Millitants had weapons equal to the US army? Of course they don't. Are you mildy retarded or do you just see things?
Read back through the thread. I was talking about Tony's ( or someone's) comment on why they did not revolt when saddam was around. They DO have a valid reason for wanting to revolt now and the fear of the US's overwealming military superiority is not stopping them ( don't tell me that they shouldnt have a reason to fear the US military), that's all i'm saying ( i'm not saying they are not fucked in the head for wanting to revolt - or that they are not being lead on by extreme religeous fuigureheads) The message seems to be - they want control of their country and they want to decide who is in control - not the US/allies.Last edited by slackologist; 04-06-2004, 11:22 PM.Comment
-
Interesting points. However, people only really rise up if they've reached some sort of personal BOILING POINT regarding the situation.
Just like any geopolitical issue, gauging a particular people's boiling point depends on ethnic, cultural, geographic, economic, and tons of other issues.
To view "rising up" as a form of Iraqi "vote" on US policies seems blind to the factors above.
Originally posted by WarChild
How about becaue if you tried to rise up against saddam, he killed you and your entire family. If enough of you rose up, he gassed you all at once.
The very fact that the people in Iraq can protest, and "raise up" speaks to the FACT that America IS acting like liberators.
If ALL of Iraq were against the US, wouldn't we see MILLIONS of insurgents raised up as an army on the streets? Look at Palestine. Every man, woman, child HATES the jews. And they're all willing to die, to kill Jews.
Can't we assume by the fact that the MAJORITY of Iraqis are NOT rallying in the streets against the US ... that the people who are, are in fact, the minority in the country?
God I'd kill for an Iraqi to be able to post, see what the people really think.Comment
-
Oh not a problem, I willOriginally posted by WarChild
The US doesn't intend to occupy Iraq for 50 years. Nohahahaha is trying to take any Iraqi holy land.
We can argue about this all day .. Neither of us are going to change ours minds and agree with the other.
10 years from now .. We'll see what the Iraqi people have to say.
If the majority of Iraqis hate the United States and/or the US is still in Iraq, running the show . I will proudly admit I was wrong.
However, if in 10 years from now the people of Iraq for the most part begin to like freedom, and thank the United States .. Then I hope you'll be willing to say you were wrong, completely.
I just wonder how can you be naïve enough to believe that a guy such as Bush who doesn't believe in freedom is there to establish freedom? Grow up, he has no problem supporting dictators like the one in Uzbekistan. He has no intention of bringing democracy to Iraq.
10 years from now I see Iraq kinda like African countries. Periods of peace followed by periods of violence and so on. Of course the US will be stuck there and everytime something bad occurs people will blame the US. We screwed up that country for good.
What's for sure is that for now Iraq is doing badly and the situation in the ME got much worst.Comment
-
I'm seeing this word "they" everywhere in this last post...
...who does "they" refer to?Originally posted by slackologist
they want control of their country and they want to decide who is in control - not the US/allies.
Al Sadr's supporters?
Iraqi Sunnis?
Iraqi Shi'ites?
Since when does "militia taking over a city" mean the same thing as "the will of the people?"Comment
-
Yeah sure, whatever you say. Somehow you got the impression that everyone who's against the occupation is gonna fight and risk his life. Yeah rightOriginally posted by WarChild
Yup .. plenty of SMALL groups. Nowhere near representitive of the population as a whole.
Live in a war-torn country and you'll quickly understand that more than 99% of the population wouldn't consider fighting and risking there lives.Last edited by Roger; 04-06-2004, 11:31 PM.Comment
-
All of a sudden al-Sadr's supporters are the only ones fighting the occupation even though they started like 2 days ago?Originally posted by spentrent
I'm seeing this word "they" everywhere in this last post...
...who does "they" refer to?
Al Sadr's supporters?
Iraqi Sunnis?
Iraqi Shi'ites?
Since when does "militia taking over a city" mean the same thing as "the will of the people?"Comment
-
Who said that?Originally posted by Roger
All of a sudden al-Sadr's supporters are the only ones fighting the occupation even though they started like 2 days ago?Comment
-
'They' refers to the people that are KILLING US Military.Originally posted by spentrent
I'm seeing this word "they" everywhere in this last post...
...who does "they" refer to?
Al Sadr's supporters?
Iraqi Sunnis?
Iraqi Shi'ites?
Since when does "militia taking over a city" mean the same thing as "the will of the people?"
When did i ever say "militia taking over a city means the same thing as the will of the people" ????Comment
-
1) Who are "the people?"Originally posted by slackologist
'They' refers to the people that are KILLING US Military.
When did i ever say "militia taking over a city means the same thing as the will of the people" ????
2) Is it a united front?
3) Do they all get fed and clothed by the same leader?
Let's explore this "they" word in more detail:
If your answers are:Originally posted by slackologist
Read back through the thread. I was talking about Tony's ( or someone's) comment on why they did not revolt when saddam was around. They DO have a valid reason for wanting to revolt now and the fear of the US's overwealming military superiority is not stopping them ( don't tell me that they shouldnt have a reason to fear the US military), that's all i'm saying ( i'm not saying they are not fucked in the head for wanting to revolt - or that they are not being lead on by extreme religeous fuigureheads) The message seems to be - they want control of their country and they want to decide who is in control - not the US/allies.
1) Iraqis
2) Yes
3) Yes
Then you've shown me that you've got a GREAT view of your large intestine right now.Comment
-
'The people' = The people killing US Soldiers.Originally posted by spentrent
1) Who are "the people?"
2) Is it a united front?
3) Do they all get fed and clothed by the same leader?
Let's explore this "they" word in more detail:
If your answers are:
1) Iraqis
2) Yes
3) Yes
Then you've shown me that you've got a GREAT view of your large intestine right now.
If you need me to fill in the lines for you further you have larger problems.Comment
-
Humor me.Originally posted by slackologist
'The people' = The people killing US Soldiers.
If you need me to fill in the lines for you further you have larger problems.
I'd like a concise breakdown. For each known militant faction, please include:
1) The leader
2) The location
3) What they want
4) Their enemies (actually, you can leave this one out, as the answer will inevitably be "all the other militant factions and the US").Comment
-
So would i, maybe you have one?Originally posted by spentrent
Humor me.
I'd like a concise breakdown. For each known militant faction, please include:
1) The leader
2) The location
3) What they want
4) Their enemies (actually, you can leave this one out, as the answer will inevitably be "all the other militant factions and the US").Comment
-
I thought you were going to fill in the lines for me?Originally posted by slackologist
So would i, maybe you have one?Comment
-
So if you live within America's borders, you're an American?Originally posted by WarChild
In my books, if you live inside Iraq's borders .. You're an Iraqi.Comment
-
well , no i wasnt and 'they' is relative, can you understand that? and ina relative sense i answered your question several times already, I don't know all the details, just as you don't know all the details and i never claimed to know all the details. have a nice day spentrent :-)Originally posted by spentrent
I thought you were going to fill in the lines for me?Comment
-
As far as I see it the Iraqis have every reason to go out and kill american and British soldiers. These countries have invaded Iraq and all these people are doing is trying to fight for their country.
Take this as an example. The russians have invaded the USA, and the soldiers have killed millions of yanks. Your brother and your wife and two children have been blown to bits by Russian helicopter gun ships. The Russians said members of your family (insurgents) were throwing stones and threatening the safety of their soldiers, so had to be dealt with with maximum force.
Your whole word has been destroyed. Your job has gone. Your house blow to smithereens by the "shock and awe" of 200 B52 bombers dumping millions of tons of bombs on your neighborhood.
Then you hear that the local priest has had enough of these invaders. He is organising a fightback, telling his congregation to stand up to the russians. You want revenge for the loss of your family. You want to kill those invaders. The local paper tells you to stand up and fight for the freedom of the USA. The russians ban the paper from being published. You sneak out at night and shoot a couple of Russians. You are a hero.
So whats the difference? That is what the Al Sadr is telling his congregation against the invaders, the good old USA.Comment
-
Sorry .. if you're born, live your life, and then die in Iraq. You are most assuredly an Iraqi.Originally posted by Joe Citizen
So if you live within America's borders, you're an American?.Comment
-
Then how can you speak for them?Originally posted by slackologist
well , no i wasnt and 'they' is relative, can you understand that? and ina relative sense i answered your question several times already, I don't know all the details, just as you don't know all the details and i never claimed to know all the details. have a nice day spentrent :-)Comment
-
I am not speaking for them, I am typing my opinions on a message board. I am speaking for myself.Originally posted by spentrent
Then how can you speak for them?Comment
-
Who are "they?"Originally posted by slackologist
I am not speaking for them, I am typing my opinions on a message board. I am speaking for myself.Comment
-
welcome to my ignore list :-)Originally posted by spentrent
Who are "they?"Comment
-
Then I welcome the company of Reason, Intelligence, and Critical Thinking.Originally posted by slackologist
welcome to my ignore list :-)Comment
-
American soldiers have not killed millions of IraqisOriginally posted by loco12
As far as I see it the Iraqis have every reason to go out and kill american and British soldiers. These countries have invaded Iraq and all these people are doing is trying to fight for their country.
Take this as an example. The russians have invaded the USA, and the soldiers have killed millions of yanks.
Show me one example, from ANY respected source, the even implies that Americans are in fact using helicopter gun ships to gun down mobs that are throwing stones, but are otherwise peaceful.Originally posted by loco12
Your brother and your wife and two children have been blown to bits by Russian helicopter gun ships. The Russians said members of your family (insurgents) were throwing stones and threatening the safety of their soldiers, so had to be dealt with with maximum force.
Many more mothers, sisters, brothers and sons have gone "missing" at the hands of Saddam Hussein, than have ever been killed by Americans. State sanctioned rape gangs, public beheadings and chemical weapon attacks aside.
Your whole world exists of having nothing, and starving anyway. Iraqis are being fed now. Their hospitals are already better than they were before the war. The state of affairs in Iraq was not Eutopia pre war.Originally posted by loco12
Your whole word has been destroyed. Your job has gone. Your house blow to smithereens by the "shock and awe" of 200 B52 bombers dumping millions of tons of bombs on your neighborhood.
The Local priest, in this case, is a fucking nut. He's been denounced by most of the major Clerics. It's like a crazy catholic running a church, after he's been excommunicated by the pope. His congregation is a bunch of thugs and murderers.Originally posted by loco12
Then you hear that the local priest has had enough of these invaders. He is organising a fightback, telling his congregation to stand up to the russians. You want revenge for the loss of your family. You want to kill those invaders. The local paper tells you to stand up and fight for the freedom of the USA. The russians ban the paper from being published. You sneak out at night and shoot a couple of Russians. You are a hero.
So whats the difference? That is what the Al Sadr is telling his congregation against the invaders, the good old USA.
If you get excited in to attacking a liberating army, by a nut bar priest ...You are not a hero. You are an idiot.
AS you can see. Your analogy is absolutely absurd. You've just made things up.Last edited by WarChild; 04-07-2004, 12:43 AM..Comment
-
for those that seem to like banging their head's against brick walls.Originally posted by slackologist
'They' refers to the people that are KILLING US Military.
Comment
-
Just a small remark here. Russian has 1000,000+ army and shitload of nuclear warhead. This is the only reason why the US government can't even dream about Russian oil. Iraq is a different story... They have not too much oil, but they are weak. Do you remember at least one case when the USA invaded some country with strong army? China and North Korea are much more dangerous for the USA than Iraq, Iran or others. But the USA will never invade China, because... I think you know the answer...Originally posted by Giorgio_Xo
Iraq is no where near second in oil. Russia is second in proven reserves.
Most of the loans weren't owed to the USA.Obey the CowgodComment
-
WhoOriginally posted by slackologist
for those that seem to like banging their head's against brick walls.
Are
The
People
That
Are
Killing
US
Soldiers
?Comment
-
2 links
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3956787/
http://www.hartford-hwp.com/archives/51/217.html
2 more things..
Stop watching CNN (because there's not on the line of fire)
and clean your own mess.. I don't care<a href="http://www.kinkydwarf.com" target="_blank"><img src="http://www.kinkydwarf.com/banner.gif" width="350" height="60" border="0"></a>Comment
-
Funny answerOriginally posted by FatBird
Country? No, bullshit religious beliefs. All of it is. Muslim or otherwise. Religion and money are the two sources of fucking evil. Dont deny it.
Obey the CowgodComment
-
http://www.cnn.com/2002/WORLD/asiapc...nistan.canada/Originally posted by WarChild
Show me one example, from ANY respected source, the even implies that Americans are in fact using helicopter gun ships to gun down mobs that are throwing stones, but are otherwise peaceful.
<a href="http://www.kinkydwarf.com" target="_blank"><img src="http://www.kinkydwarf.com/banner.gif" width="350" height="60" border="0"></a>Comment
Comment