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Quotealex

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Advertising Internet Gambling is Illegal

11-18-2003, 06:54 AM

I was make nice going with my casino portals and now I get this news:

Breaking News!

It appears that the Department of Justice believes that advertising Internet Gambling is illegal. At least one portal site has been subpoenaed to appear in a United States federal court in relation to advertising online gambling services. Interactive Gaming News has obtained a copy of a subpoena to testify Oct. 29 before a grand jury in the Eastern District of Missouri. Among information requested in the subpoena was all the "names and all identifying and contact information you have for every point of contact for each such gambling advertiser. . . . To view the full article, Click Here
http://www.igamingnews.com/index.cfm...sting&tid=4553
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#2

11-18-2003, 06:56 AM
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doober

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#3

11-18-2003, 06:57 AM

dont pass Go or collect 200$
go directly to jail

thank you
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InsaneGreen

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#4

11-18-2003, 06:57 AM

then stop promoting it.

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Quotealex

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#5

11-18-2003, 07:02 AM

Originally posted by InsaneGreen
then stop promoting it.

They start with casinos, them they will ban porn sites, then all other "vices" sites. Where will it end?
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Quotealex

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#6

11-18-2003, 07:04 AM

Man I'm pissed that I can"t even write properly.
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rebel23

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#7

11-18-2003, 07:12 AM

the DoJ are total assholes. have they started a campaign for a misrable life?

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InsaneGreen

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#8

11-18-2003, 07:14 AM

Originally posted by Alex from Montreal

They start with casinos, them they will ban porn sites, then all other "vices" sites. Where will it end?

arent you in canada? or somthin lol

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josipk

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#9

11-18-2003, 07:15 AM

why are you promoting it if it's illegal.
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#10

11-18-2003, 07:34 AM

I'm not worried
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brand0n

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#11

11-18-2003, 07:35 AM

thats fucked up, who do they think they are to tell you what you can and cannot advertise?

sounds pretty ghestoish to me

want to buy this spot for cheap? it is of course for sale. long term deals are always the best bet. brand0n/ at/ a o l dot commies.
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sexyclicks

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#12

11-18-2003, 07:35 AM

Originally posted by josipk
why are you promoting it if it's illegal.

why can I buy gambling related keywords from google when it's illegal?
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Quotealex

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#13

11-18-2003, 07:39 AM

Originally posted by InsaneGreen

arent you in canada? or somthin lol

Yes I'm from Montreal (Canada) but my sites and most gaming resources I use are based in the US.
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#14

11-18-2003, 07:53 AM

Its mainly anti US law makers who think gambling online or anything related to gambling online is illegal.

Its pretty sad

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Sly_RJ

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#15

11-18-2003, 07:56 AM

Gambling in the United States is highly regulated. John Ashcr0ft is from Missouri and when was in power fought gambling quite a bit.

This really isn't much of a surprise, why the shock?

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Gemini

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#16

11-18-2003, 08:09 AM

So go set a casino up in your backyard! ...Oh wait! It's not LEGAL to do that!! Imagine that. So what is different about the internet?!

Its also a crime for citizens to gamble ON those websites if it's not legal in their area. They just haven't figured out how to get them yet. They will.

I imagine at some point it will be legalized but you'll be paying that cut to the Feds and State just like Vegas. As it should be.

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#17

11-18-2003, 08:16 AM

Yes why the shock when over 18 months ago an online cassino
running in callifornia was shut down and all there afiliates in states that that dont have legal gambling were worned not to promote gambeling any more, it was all over the net and news.
heck i even got my email and snail mail notice about it.
If you live in the states and your state does not have gambling then dont caught promoting it.

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Dusen

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#18

11-18-2003, 08:22 AM

Originally posted by Alex from Montreal
I was make nice going with my casino portals and now I get this news.

I checked into it long ago, as a Canadian it's very illegal. I avoided it.

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Quotealex

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#19

11-18-2003, 11:54 AM

Originally posted by Dusen

I checked into it long ago, as a Canadian it's very illegal. I avoided it.

Some of the top casino sponsors are located in Canada (Montreal and Toronto, mainly). Even some companies that make casino softwares are in Canada...
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Sly_RJ

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#20

11-18-2003, 11:57 AM

Originally posted by Alex from Montreal

Some of the top casino sponsors are located in Canada (Montreal and Toronto, mainly). Even some companies that make casino softwares are in Canada...

Physically, maybe. But where are their corporation papers filed?

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Quotealex

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#21

11-18-2003, 12:19 PM

Originally posted by Sly_RJ

Physically, maybe. But where are their corporation papers filed?

Indian reserves, Carabean Islands and other tax heaven places
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#22

11-18-2003, 12:48 PM

Originally posted by Alex from Montreal

Indian reserves, Carabean Islands and other tax heaven places

So that is where you set up your bank accounts and a shell company, and run your servers from Holland or something.
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#23

11-18-2003, 12:56 PM

Originally posted by Alex from Montreal

They start with casinos, them they will ban porn sites, then all other "vices" sites. Where will it end?

They'll never get the pornsites, they make too much money off them!

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#24

11-18-2003, 12:59 PM

Originally posted by sexyclicks
I'm not worried
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#25

11-18-2003, 12:59 PM

Don't be lazy, protect free speech: ACLU | Free Speech Coalition | EFF | IMPA
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Quotealex

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#26

11-18-2003, 02:41 PM

Originally posted by JDog

They'll never get the pornsites, they make too much money off them!

jDoG

And you think they don't make lots of money with gaming sites!
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#27

11-18-2003, 03:12 PM

What about people residing in Australia?

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#28

11-18-2003, 04:53 PM

Originally posted by Alex from Montreal
I was make nice going with my casino portals and now I get this news:

Breaking News!

It appears that the Department of Justice believes that advertising Internet Gambling is illegal. At least one portal site has been subpoenaed to appear in a United States federal court in relation to advertising online gambling services. Interactive Gaming News has obtained a copy of a subpoena to testify Oct. 29 before a grand jury in the Eastern District of Missouri. Among information requested in the subpoena was all the "names and all identifying and contact information you have for every point of contact for each such gambling advertiser. . . . To view the full article, Click Here
http://www.igamingnews.com/index.cfm...sting&tid=4553

ok but we're in Canada. What does that matter to you?? It's a case in the US.
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#29

11-18-2003, 05:09 PM

Originally posted by Rorschach

So that is where you set up your bank accounts and a shell company, and run your servers from Holland or something.

I don't think I should have to do all that since I'm not a casino owner. I'm just an affiliate that advertise sponsors casino sites thru my casino portals.
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Quotealex

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#30

11-18-2003, 05:13 PM

Originally posted by BuggyG

ok but we're in Canada. What does that matter to you?? It's a case in the US.

Because alot of the places (PPC, SE, Directories, etc.) we advertise casino sites are located in the USA . If we can no longer advertise in the USA, our income will drop considerably...
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#31

11-18-2003, 05:22 PM

So a front end as an affiliate like this http://casino.sincity-erotica.net for sportsbetting and worldgaming is illegal? Damn I didn't know being an affiliate was illegal, I knew owning one in the USA without being licensed was illegal

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#32

11-18-2003, 05:24 PM

It's all pritty stupid. What they can't tax, they must shut down.

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#33

11-18-2003, 05:24 PM

hehehe, that is good news - we are all becoming illegal, we are all comming-to-be deeper and deeper underground.

well, that's nice! =)

but all we need is to find a domain registrar which is hard-to-kill. I have found a dynamic dns solution, so my sites will be never down, but the domains are still big issue. maybe you know a bullet-proof one? please tell me what registrar is the most reliable these hard days. =)

thank you for your time, people.

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#34

11-18-2003, 05:25 PM

Originally posted by PornPope
Yes why the shock when over 18 months ago an online cassino
running in callifornia was shut down and all there afiliates in states that that dont have legal gambling were worned not to promote gambeling any more, it was all over the net and news.
heck i even got my email and snail mail notice about it.
If you live in the states and your state does not have gambling then dont caught promoting it.

Here in Indiana we have the lottery, gambling on casino boats docked or out on the water and pull tab tickets, so I gues I am safe promoting sportsbetting

THIS FORUM SUCKS - RUDE ASS IDIOTS!!!
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MarinersFan

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#35

11-18-2003, 07:56 PM

The issue of whether it is legal to advertise online gambling has been kicked around in the U.S. since I first got involved with gambling sites back in 1997.

If you look at that story, you will see that they are primarily using the gambling portal to gather information about the online casinos and sportsbooks. They may threaten criminal prosecution, but that is just to get the webmaster's cooperation.

Also note that this applies to the state of Missouri only. So if you are not in that state, you are not in danger.

As for the location of the casinos and sportsbooks, they are all located outside the U.S. Most are in Costa Rica, although some are now on an Indian Reservation in Canada.

Being an affiliate for a gambling site could someday become illegal, they have tried to pass a law to that effect several times since 1998 but it has never made it all the way through the Congress to the President's desk.

At this point, your chances of running into legal trouble for simply acting as an affiliate of an online casino, sportsbook or BINGO site (had to get that in there) are slim to none.

BUT ... anything can happen. So be very careful about what kinds of records you keep. You don't want to appear to be a "partner" in an online gambling operation.

Hope that clears up some of the confusion.
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#36

11-18-2003, 08:08 PM

Alex from Montreal:

It appears that the Department of Justice believes that advertising Internet Gambling is illegal.

Breathing will soon be illegal in the US. That's the benefit of the "values of freedom" held so dear there!

That's why most major players in US gambling are moving to other countries. If you are not hosting within the US and actually live in Canada, - this does not affect you. These DOJ perceptions of gambling laws are those of the US.

Trade on!!! All of the rest of the western world is actually free!

XXX TLD's - Another mosquito to swat.
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#37

11-18-2003, 09:26 PM

Originally posted by Webby
Alex from Montreal:

Breathing will soon be illegal in the US. That's the benefit of the "values of freedom" held so dear there!

No it won?t be illegal it will just be privatized.
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#38

11-18-2003, 09:28 PM

Originally posted by Kingfish

No it won?t be illegal it will just be privatized.

or its gonna be monitored
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#39

11-18-2003, 09:32 PM

Originally posted by Sly_RJ
Gambling in the United States is highly regulated. John Ashcr0ft is from Missouri and when was in power fought gambling quite a bit.

This really isn't much of a surprise, why the shock?

Unless you are in Las Vegas or on an Reservation or the Water down south....

...what he said...

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Quotealex

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#40

11-19-2003, 06:40 AM

MarinersFan, Will you be attending the two days emergency legal summit that will take place in Costa Rica concerning this matter as well as others? If so, email me at webmaster (at) racanet (dot) com

Thanks

Originally posted by MarinersFan
The issue of whether it is legal to advertise online gambling has been kicked around in the U.S. since I first got involved with gambling sites back in 1997.

If you look at that story, you will see that they are primarily using the gambling portal to gather information about the online casinos and sportsbooks. They may threaten criminal prosecution, but that is just to get the webmaster's cooperation.

Also note that this applies to the state of Missouri only. So if you are not in that state, you are not in danger.

As for the location of the casinos and sportsbooks, they are all located outside the U.S. Most are in Costa Rica, although some are now on an Indian Reservation in Canada.

Being an affiliate for a gambling site could someday become illegal, they have tried to pass a law to that effect several times since 1998 but it has never made it all the way through the Congress to the President's desk.

At this point, your chances of running into legal trouble for simply acting as an affiliate of an online casino, sportsbook or BINGO site (had to get that in there) are slim to none.

BUT ... anything can happen. So be very careful about what kinds of records you keep. You don't want to appear to be a "partner" in an online gambling operation.

Hope that clears up some of the confusion.
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#41

11-19-2003, 07:59 AM

Originally posted by Alex from Montreal
I don't think I should have to do all that since I'm not a casino owner. I'm just an affiliate that advertise sponsors casino sites thru my casino portals.

The law thinks so.

Part VII Section 202 of the Canadian Criminal Code.

PART VII: 202 (1) Every one commits an offence who
(i) wilfully and knowingly sends, transmits, delivers or receives any message by radio, telegraph, telephone, mail or express that conveys any information relating to book-making, pool-selling, betting or wagering, or that is intended to assist in book-making, pool-selling, betting or wagering; or

Don't be disillusioned. Stop until you consult an attorney, he will tell you the same. You CAN go to jail - you even admit doing this in a public forum.

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Dusen

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#42

11-19-2003, 08:36 AM

Just as a further comment:

Definitions
197. (1) In this Part,

"bet" «pari»
"bet" means a bet that is placed on any contingency or event that is to take place in or out of Canada, and without restricting the generality of the foregoing, includes a bet that is placed on any contingency relating to a horse-race, fight, match or sporting event that is to take place <b><u>in or out of Canada</u></b>;

I'm not trying to give you hard time here man, I just want you to be aware of what you are doing. I thought about promoting casino sites before, and after consulting with 2 attorneys (One from Elkind, Lipton & Jacobs) I did not pursue it any further. Ignorance is NOT an excuse when the hammer comes down.

Last edited by Dusen; 11-19-2003, 08:38 AM.

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Quotealex

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#43

11-19-2003, 08:46 AM

Originally posted by Dusen
Just as a further comment:

I'm not trying to give you hard time here man, I just want you to be aware of what you are doing. I thought about promoting casino sites before, and after consulting with 2 attorneys (One from Elkind, Lipton & Jacobs) I did not pursue it any further. Ignorance is NOT an excuse when the hammer comes down.

I think there are exceptions to the rule:

Exception
(2) A place is not a common gaming house within the meaning of paragraph (a) or subparagraph (b)(ii) or (iii) of the definition "common gaming house" in subsection (1) while it is occupied and used by an incorporated genuine social club or branch thereof, if

(a) the whole or any portion of the bets on or proceeds from games played therein is not directly or indirectly paid to the keeper thereof; and

(b) no fee is charged to persons for the right or privilege of participating in the games played therein other than under the authority of and in accordance with the terms of a licence issued by the Attorney General of the province in which the place is situated or by such other person or authority in the province as may be specified by the Attorney General thereof.

But I will look into it.
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#44

11-19-2003, 08:51 AM

Originally posted by Alex from Montreal
MarinersFan, Will you be attending the two days emergency legal summit that will take place in Costa Rica concerning this matter as well as others? If so, email me at webmaster (at) racanet (dot) com

Thanks

I won't be there personally, but the owners of BingoHall.com are located in Costa Rica. They will be there. They also operate online casinos and sportsbooks.

Always have to keep an eye on the changing legal issues surrounding online gambling.
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#45

11-19-2003, 09:00 AM

Originally posted by Alex from Montreal

I think there are exceptions to the rule:

Exception
(2) A place is not a common gaming house within the meaning of paragraph (a) or subparagraph (b)(ii) or (iii) of the definition "common gaming house" in subsection (1) while it is occupied and used by an incorporated genuine social club or branch thereof, if

(a) the whole or any portion of the bets on or proceeds from games played therein is not directly or indirectly paid to the keeper thereof; and

(b) no fee is charged to persons for the right or privilege of participating in the games played therein other than under the authority of and in accordance with the terms of a licence issued by the Attorney General of the province in which the place is situated or by such other person or authority in the province as may be specified by the Attorney General thereof.

But I will look into it.

The whole 'It's not a "brick and mortar" place/house' argument will ultimately have to be tested in court. I agree, there might be something there, but I wasn't up for being the testee. However, Regardless of the LOCATION, profiting from gambling is still illegal without a license.

part (b) appears to apply to no-cost entry into money winning contests. Not gambling.

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Quotealex

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#46

11-19-2003, 09:01 AM

Originally posted by Dusen
Just as a further comment:

I'm not trying to give you hard time here man, I just want you to be aware of what you are doing. I thought about promoting casino sites before, and after consulting with 2 attorneys (One from Elkind, Lipton & Jacobs) I did not pursue it any further. Ignorance is NOT an excuse when the hammer comes down.

I beleive http://www.gamingincome.com (a major online casino owner) have their office and their client service right here in Montreal. How are they pulling this off?
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#47

11-19-2003, 09:11 AM

Originally posted by Dusen

The whole 'It's not a "brick and mortar" place/house' argument will ultimately have to be tested in court. I agree, there might be something there, but I wasn't up for being the testee. However, Regardless of the LOCATION, profiting from gambling is still illegal without a license.

part (b) appears to apply to no-cost entry into money winning contests. Not gambling.

I'm contacting every major casino sponsors that allowed me, a Canadian, as their affiliate with no problem (and yes some countries were excluded in the list) concerning this matter.

Also it is the sponsors that have licenses to exploit casinos, and I'm here as your local stores selling tickets or your newspaper promoting their casinos for non canadian residents.

Again I'm looking into this, as I think it is important.
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#48

11-19-2003, 10:26 AM

So far I got this response concering promoting casino sites from Canada:

Dear Alex,

Gaming Income is the affiliate program that represents BetonUSA, Pyramid
Casino and Interchamps. Most of our very successful affiliates are
Canadian and, at this moment, no regulations are affecting Canadian
webmasters to promote gaming properties.

As well, Gaming Income is located in Montreal, Quebec and operates
legally the affiliate program for its sponsoring properties. On the
other hand, American affiliates are not allowed to promote any gaming
properties because of the recent US attorney legislation. They will
have to operate their portals from offshore or Canadian locations.

You can contact us at 514-748-1950 or by email at [email protected].
Regards,

I am waiting reponses from a donzen other casino sponsors...
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