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AmeliaG

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#1

% to pay a girl when doing a site for her

08-06-2003, 04:52 AM

What do folks here think is a good percentage to pay a girl when doing a site for her? Do you figure the % on the gross or after affiliate and processor fees have been removed or on the net?

What would you give the girl for just doing cam shows and interacting with members vs. if she had a photographer or picture back catalog and/or someone to do the html vs. if she had a back catalog of images but did not want to promote the site now?

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#2

08-06-2003, 04:57 AM

50 %

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#3

08-06-2003, 04:59 AM

50%

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#4

08-06-2003, 04:59 AM

I think a 40-60 split is good, you the 60 and her the 40!
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#5

08-06-2003, 05:02 AM

No way 50%

Just pay her per hourd for the photoshoots or something like 20%
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AmeliaG

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#6

08-06-2003, 05:03 AM

Do you all vary the % based on what the girl is bringing to the table? Like if she has content she has permission to use or owns vs. if you have to create all the content? If she would be able to update the site herself vs. if you would have to have someone do it for her?

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#7

08-06-2003, 05:14 AM

Just make sure she gets a % of the net & not the gross...
Otherwise you may have a bad month for cb's etc you end up with no money yourself.

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#8

08-06-2003, 05:19 AM

Depends on the girl. It can range from Jenna to Jane Doe.

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#9

08-06-2003, 05:21 AM

Originally posted by Battuss
No way 50%

Just pay her per hourd for the photoshoots or something like 20%

I agree. She won't really be doing much more than shooting photos. I would say you should pay her like record labels pay bands. 12%.

I've trusted my sites to them for over a decade...

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#10

08-06-2003, 05:23 AM

Originally posted by Pornwolf

I agree. She won't really be doing much more than shooting photos. I would say you should pay her like record labels pay bands. 12%.

20% is indeed still a bit much...i agree with the 12%
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#11

08-06-2003, 05:28 AM

avoid partnerships with porn girls unless you have serious experience

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#12

08-06-2003, 05:30 AM

Originally posted by EscortBiz
avoid partnerships with porn girls unless you have serious experience

Once again i agree...fuck the 20% fuck the 12% just pay her per hour.
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#13

08-06-2003, 05:42 AM

Originally posted by EscortBiz
avoid partnerships with porn girls unless you have serious experience

Good advice. Pay for the shoot with model releases, pay per hour for cam shows and other stuff. If the site does well increase the pay. If the site doesn't do well, you can always sell the content elsewhere.

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#14

08-06-2003, 05:51 AM

Originally posted by EscortBiz
avoid partnerships with porn girls unless you have serious experience

I have zilcho experience with this type of partnership. But no one has more experience than I do in my niche, so I have girls asking me about doing sites pretty often. I have traffic which could sell sites for them, but a lot of times I see girls in my niche go with people who have never even done a successful site before. I have no idea what is standard to offer the girl, but at least I know how to run a site. Some of these girls seriously partner with webmasters who have never set up password protection before and who think a thousand visitors a month is mad traffic.

Besides I have collective wisdom of gfy to advise me, so I'm sure it will be easy
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#15

08-06-2003, 06:11 AM

You're spending unnecessary $$ when doing a % deal... I've sgot several single girl sites and it's all per shoot
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AmeliaG

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#16

08-06-2003, 06:15 AM

Originally posted by Pornwolf

I agree. She won't really be doing much more than shooting photos. I would say you should pay her like record labels pay bands. 12%.

I would only contract with a girl who either was interested in doing extensive promotion including personal appearances and member interaction and/or who came with a back catalog of content. No point in making a deal more extended than a standard model release, unless the girl is bringing more to the table. I'm just not sure what standard compensation for a more extended deal is.

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#17

08-06-2003, 06:19 AM

Normally, I would just pay for the shoots, rather than any partnership or percentage. After all, you have all of the expenses in a deal like that, and all of the risk.

However, it may be different if they have tangible stuff to bring to the table. Cam shows, past content, etc. could all be valuable.

Which I guess isn't helpful. It would very much depend on what they bring to the table, and how much of it. In the end, though, remember that having a partner creates hassle. Paying someone is just a cost and an invoice.

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#18

08-06-2003, 06:51 AM

We treat our models very well. We buy them clothes, pay for their hair cuts, and they know they can call us at 3AM when they get a flat tire. Our contract girls, such as Taylor Little, Jordan Capri, Raimi, Devon, and Tawnee, are on a monthly salary plus get a comission from what their site makes.

However...... No way am I going to pay them 50% of what their site makes. Our contract models do two or three days worth of photo shoots a month - There is no way I'm going to pay a model $50k a month - nearly twice I make monthly - for two days worth of work.

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#19

08-06-2003, 06:56 AM

Originally posted by sweetcuties
You're spending unnecessary $$ when doing a % deal... I've sgot several single girl sites and it's all per shoot

100% true!

Why pay them a %. Unless you had to beg them to do it while promising them lot's of money .

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#20

08-06-2003, 06:56 AM

Speaking from the amateur model perspective, I wouldnt do it for less than 50%. And that includes them extensively marketing the site for me.

Im in a partnership kinda arrangement at the moment, and its well worth what I am getting. A friend might have a much better percentage on the surface, but isnt getting that good of a deal.
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#21

08-06-2003, 06:58 AM

If you aren't going to own the pics and domain, you don't have a project worth doing. Pay her by the hour and run it like a site you've bought content for.

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#22

08-06-2003, 07:00 AM

Originally posted by StacyCat
Speaking from the amateur model perspective, I wouldnt do it for less than 50%. And that includes them extensively marketing the site for me.

Im in a partnership kinda arrangement at the moment, and its well worth what I am getting. A friend might have a much better percentage on the surface, but isnt getting that good of a deal.

So you're getting paid 50% to do what exactly? Model for a few hours? What happens when you decide you aren't going to show up anymore, you still getting 50% while they have to deal with no more updates and chargebacks?

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#23

08-06-2003, 07:26 AM

Originally posted by jact
So you're getting paid 50% to do what exactly? Model for a few hours? What happens when you decide you aren't going to show up anymore, you still getting 50% while they have to deal with no more updates and chargebacks?

Yep :-) In that partnership, I woudl get paid for pictures, cam shows, etc.

Im getting a higher percentage, but I am required to do more for my site.

There is a big difference in mentalities from professionals and amateurs. I wouldnt do the partnership with someone who has the "lets pay them and get all we can out of them" rather than "she is bringing equal amounts of stuff to the table." If you dont like it, dont do it.
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#24

08-06-2003, 08:16 AM

Originally posted by StacyCat
Speaking from the amateur model perspective, I wouldnt do it for less than 50%. And that includes them extensively marketing the site for me.

Im in a partnership kinda arrangement at the moment, and its well worth what I am getting. A friend might have a much better percentage on the surface, but isnt getting that good of a deal.

So, using my math skills here....... You expect me to do 98% of the work and you expect to make twice as much as me? I don't think so.

Our models work an average of ten hours a month total. I work an average of sixteen hours a day, usually seven days a week. And you expect to be paid twice or three times as much as me?

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#25

08-06-2003, 08:25 AM

Originally posted by RocHard

Our models work an average of ten hours a month total. I work an average of sixteen hours a day, usually seven days a week. And you expect to be paid twice or three times as much as me?

well said !!!! ---If i'm busting my ass all day everyday... I want to be paid for it...

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#26

08-06-2003, 09:01 AM

Send her to me -- I have some experimental ways to make money
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#27

08-06-2003, 09:14 AM

Originally posted by EscortBiz
avoid partnerships with porn girls unless you have serious experience

uhhh... what he said.

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#28

08-06-2003, 09:33 AM

Originally posted by StacyCat

Yep :-) In that partnership, I woudl get paid for pictures, cam shows, etc.

Im getting a higher percentage, but I am required to do more for my site.

There is a big difference in mentalities from professionals and amateurs. I wouldnt do the partnership with someone who has the "lets pay them and get all we can out of them" rather than "she is bringing equal amounts of stuff to the table." If you dont like it, dont do it.

I'm kinda looking to partner with girls I would hang out with anyway and I want to give them good deals. I've seen a bunch of the deals being offered to friends of mine and they look pretty bad to me. This is really useful, getting feedback on what people in different positions think is a good deal. I'm not really looking for what is the least I could possibly pay. I want it to be worth the girls' while to work hard. If a girl only wants to work ten hours a month, then I would book her for two or three shoots and not bother making her a site. But, for people who bring more to the table, I'd like to offer something more. On the other hand, I don't want to be a chump about it and I am in sixteen hour a day land and not ten hours if I feel like it.

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#29

08-06-2003, 10:34 AM

Every single girl partnership I did was a waste of time. The norm was 50% of net.

Single girl sites where I paid flat $$ have made me a few grand a month per site.

The benefits are 100% of the profit, and you also do not have to deal with their ideas, suggestions, and timeline for wanting the site up.

I understand trying to entice models, but it's a major headache, and most tend to have a million misconceptions about what works and what sells. If you give them control, not only are you giving up 50% of your money, but you are going to be doing twice as much work to ensure that they are happy enough to go forward and that their ego is stroked.

So yeah, it's a good deal if you want to be working for them in essence.

The start-up costs are minimal for a single girl site. Book one or two days with a girl at a few hundred to begin with.

If you want to be a mensch, you can then give them ideas for their own ventures that compliment your site. I am working with one girl who set up her own live cam show thing, and I refer people to that from the site with her that I own. She also refers her customers to my site with her pics, and gets a % off each sale.

Fancy that: She is an affiliate making commissions on sales to a site that I own with her photos. She gets session fees from me to shoot, and a percentage for sales she refers.

If you want to work with girls you are friends with and build a mega company of sites, well, this could very well ruin your friendship. Do you want to be a leader or merely a partner? If it's the latter, what are they bringing to the table aside from nudity? If their know-how rivals yours, why would they need you?

Even Suicide Girls started off paying each girl a flat fee (and not much at that), then hiring many of the girls to do work on the site... it's the adult BUSINESS. And the importance of sex aside, it's 90% BUSINESS--which is why so few sites succeed.

The utopian 50-50 partnership sounds good in theory (and a lot of guys think it will get them laid), but work for hire is the best way to go if you're serious about staying in the game and succeeding.

Last edited by AOLGuy; 08-06-2003, 10:38 AM.
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#30

08-06-2003, 10:46 AM

Originally posted by AmeliaG

I want it to be worth the girls' while to work hard. If a girl only wants to work ten hours a month, then I would book her for two or three shoots and not bother making her a site. But, for people who bring more to the table, I'd like to offer something more. On the other hand, I don't want to be a chump about it and I am in sixteen hour a day land and not ten hours if I feel like it.

It comes down to how they look and how marketable the site is.

The super-motivated ones require talks on the phone every other day, long chats online, and they have every idea for photo shoots mapped out (many wanting to do softcore, teasing, artistic photos and everything else they think is "erotic"). They brainstorm constantly for what they think would make a great site to their tastes, not the tastes of the market. They will answer each email individually, track the sales, come up with the marketing text, and take it personally if it doesn't succeed right off the bat.

Funny, they also then blame you if the sales don't meet their expectations.

Super lazy girls, when they show up for a shoot (and most do if you pay cash), do what you tell them to do and take whatever shots you want. You get to put the site and marketing together at your own pace, and choose the direction as such. And you see the girl every few weeks for another session.

Neither scenario will make any $$ unless they are attractive (and I don't mean the stereotype, I just mean attractive to some audience). But the latter usually has a far better chance of succeeding, and will make you far more $$ in the long run with far less time up front.

Since time=$$, I would rather spend $500 on a lazy girl that I thought could succeed, rather than 15-30 hours with a super motivated model I didn't have to front any $$ to.

If you really want to be cool to those people who have increased your bottom line, pay them more for each subsequent shoot and book more hours. Don't cut them in as partners from the start.
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#31

08-06-2003, 10:53 AM

Originally posted by RocHard
We treat our models very well. We buy them clothes, pay for their hair cuts, and they know they can call us at 3AM when they get a flat tire. Our contract girls, such as Taylor Little, Jordan Capri, Raimi, Devon, and Tawnee, are on a monthly salary plus get a comission from what their site makes.

However...... No way am I going to pay them 50% of what their site makes. Our contract models do two or three days worth of photo shoots a month - There is no way I'm going to pay a model $50k a month - nearly twice I make monthly - for two days worth of work.

How much just to be able to call you 3AM for a flat tire?

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#32

08-06-2003, 11:10 AM

Originally posted by AmeliaG

If a girl only wants to work ten hours a month, then I would book her for two or three shoots and not bother making her a site.... But, for people who bring more to the table, I'd like to offer something more.

this probably explains a lot of it. I have a much different perspective, because I have seen both sides of the business.

Talk with your friends, decide how much time and effort they want to put into the site. If they are willing to do work, then a partnership might be suitable. If they only want to shoot 10 hours a month, decide on a suitable hourly rate, but dont let them see how much you are making off of them. You can still make a decent site off of them, but if you are planning a site, then I would definatly make a tighter contract, giving terms and conditions if one or the other fails to hold up their end of the bargain. Say, offer them 1000 a month for 10 hours of content, then 50 or so an hour for cam chats, etc, for a minimum of one year.
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#33

08-06-2003, 11:26 AM

Originally posted by EscortBiz
avoid partnerships with porn girls unless you have serious experience

Absolutely! If you can afford it, pay up front! Mo? money in your pocket!

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#34

08-06-2003, 11:32 AM

Originally posted by RocHard
We treat our models very well. We buy them clothes, pay for their hair cuts, and they know they can call us at 3AM when they get a flat tire. Our contract girls, such as Taylor Little, Jordan Capri, Raimi, Devon, and Tawnee, are on a monthly salary plus get a comission from what their site makes.

However...... No way am I going to pay them 50% of what their site makes. Our contract models do two or three days worth of photo shoots a month - There is no way I'm going to pay a model $50k a month - nearly twice I make monthly - for two days worth of work.

RocHard,

50% in your case would be rediculous because of the amount of money you are making. However, these small time site owners don't have the resources to make as much money as you do from an amateur girl site. 50% for them is probably alot less than your girls make with your deal. It's all relative.

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#35

08-06-2003, 11:33 AM

Start them at a basic salary with % bonuses for certain levels of income the site generates. If all they do is pose for pictures and no other visible means of actual work, they get nothing for bonuses, but if they actually do some work, then offer them bonuses.

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#36

08-06-2003, 11:35 AM

Originally posted by EscortBiz
avoid partnerships with porn girls unless you have serious experience

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#37

08-06-2003, 12:09 PM

lots of factors...

who's benefiting the most gets the chunk....

see, if the girl goes and put her site in a big affiliate.... does nothing but keep doing what she did...

well, she's riding the wave on the affiliate's expenses... not much % to be given there..

but if the girl is BRINGING some business to the affiliate, making the updates and marketting/sales, then off course she deserves more...

mere talent doesn't qualify for a % in my book...

Talent + marketting/sales/maintenance is something else

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#38

08-06-2003, 12:12 PM

Originally posted by RocHard
We treat our models very well. We buy them clothes, pay for their hair cuts, and they know they can call us at 3AM when they get a flat tire. Our contract girls, such as Taylor Little, Jordan Capri, Raimi, Devon, and Tawnee, are on a monthly salary plus get a comission from what their site makes.

However...... No way am I going to pay them 50% of what their site makes. Our contract models do two or three days worth of photo shoots a month - There is no way I'm going to pay a model $50k a month - nearly twice I make monthly - for two days worth of work.

Well said. What do you think is a fair commission structure?

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#39

08-06-2003, 12:39 PM

ahhhh nothing like running your own site..being your own content..doing your own web building....the only percent i pay out is through the affiliate program and my processer fees...

I think i would have to laugh at any man that approaced me with 12% offer ...but then some girls are lazy and would rather have someone else do all the work...
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#40

08-06-2003, 02:14 PM

Originally posted by GFED
50%

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#41

08-10-2003, 11:04 AM

Okay, I think I'm going to do a % on net, but I'm trying to figure out what to deduct to determine net.

I'm thinking I will definitely deduct processing fees and affiliate payouts and any chargebacks. That would make it pretty easy to calculate.

Should I factor in costs for equipment or hosting or clothes or hair or just consider them bonuses the way I do now for regular shoots?

Oh and I think this is obvious, but my partner said that, in order to get accurate advice on this, I should mention that we don't need to do sites for individual girls to find people to shoot. They would shoot with us anyway. I'm just thinking it would be a nice bonus for our top girls.

So, now that it is the weekend, advise away! I'm still very interested in what everyone here thinks about this.

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#42

08-10-2003, 11:10 AM

It all depends.. Tawnee stone gets 50% since she converts well.. 50% is pretty much standard as long as she converts well.. If she doesnt do so well, maby cut her back to 40% or so.. Alot of it is just what the girl is willing to do it for, if she will do it for 20%, then do it for 20%.. Then increase her as she sells better..

As far as clothing,hosting and equipment.. no, you should pay for that, not the girl.
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#43

08-10-2003, 11:21 AM

Cool thread, as i've had opportunities to do some shooting , but did not know what to offer the girls.

I guess % is a good offer if you don't have a lot of money to invest upfront.

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#44

08-10-2003, 11:57 AM

Having had experience with multi-model sites (never did a site based around just one girl) I always wondered..

What do you do if the model you spent so much money on building a site around just dies suddenly? Or is in a horrible accident and winds up in a coma? Doesn't that kind of screw up the plan and all your money flies out the window?

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#45

08-10-2003, 12:04 PM

good question AG

the experienced folks here have the right answer!

pay her nothing...
I mean per shoot!

It'll keep the girls motivated and keep you form looseing your shirt.

If that doesn't work...give her a swift kick in the ass, and tell her to get back to work BIAAAATCH!

{bitch betta have my money}

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KCat

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#46

08-10-2003, 12:26 PM

If you're going to go partnership, make sure that you own the images. So many content girls end up finding god or getting a boyfriend who decides he should be running the show & they suddenly want the site down & all their pics back.

If you put in a ton of work & 3 months down the road she decides she wants the site down & doesn't want to do it anymore, you're the one who's screwed.

Good luck!

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scooby doo as scooby does

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#47

08-10-2003, 01:08 PM

I do three of these single girl sites in my niche of choice. I pay them 50% of net. In this arrangement, they provide ALL the content (they upload themselves. Galleries, thumbs etc. all done by software) and some marketing (chats, forums). I do inhouse site based marketing (my own top lists etc), design & tech stuff. I have twiddled with the amounts from time to time, but basically I base my percentages around SC (although I think I'm behind them now). After two years of this my conclusion is, don't bother. Buy the content, do yer own site. Why get married when you can have it all.

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Jayson

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#48

08-10-2003, 01:43 PM

Not that I would recommend partnering with a model but I went through the excercise once to see what would be worthwhile and came up with this:

Site Design/Maintenance/Updates/Hosting - 50%
Content - 50%

If you are shooting the content and she is the model then split the amount for the content 50/50 to cover all the shoot expenses and your time as a photographer.

And for any traffic to the site other than type-ins and what may come from search engines for the main site I would run just as if you had been an affiliate and take 50%.

So assuming the girl just tuned up for a shoot she would get around 12% of gross.

That would be the most I would offer a model but you will still be cheaper and more secure if you pay an hourly rate for the content - or if they have a back catalog buy the rights and if you really like them offer them a small bonus % depending on how the site does.

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AmeliaG

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#49

08-10-2003, 02:24 PM

Originally posted by KCat
If you're going to go partnership, make sure that you own the images. So many content girls end up finding god or getting a boyfriend who decides he should be running the show & they suddenly want the site down & all their pics back.

If you put in a ton of work & 3 months down the road she decides she wants the site down & doesn't want to do it anymore, you're the one who's screwed.

Good luck!

Word. I had a friend who I comped membership in GothicSluts.com and he went through looking for who he would like to date. Then, once he started going out with the girl, he didn't want her to do shoots any more. I guess he was worried that I would comp someone charting better than he was. Sigh. If I could only say this was something that had only happened once . . .

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AmeliaG

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#50

08-10-2003, 05:05 PM

Originally posted by scooby doo as scooby does
I do three of these single girl sites in my niche of choice. I pay them 50% of net. In this arrangement, they provide ALL the content (they upload themselves. Galleries, thumbs etc. all done by software) and some marketing (chats, forums). I do inhouse site based marketing (my own top lists etc), design & tech stuff. I have twiddled with the amounts from time to time, but basically I base my percentages around SC (although I think I'm behind them now). After two years of this my conclusion is, don't bother. Buy the content, do yer own site. Why get married when you can have it all.

SC?

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