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DamageX

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#1

Why your conversions suck balls

05-15-2003, 03:33 AM

This has been adressed before within TGP2 and it has, partly, been dealt with.

What I'm talking about? I'm talking about FREE! Everywhere you go you get free porn, free pics, free sex, free galleries, free tour, free everything!

Well, if the surfer sees FREE all over the place, do you think his mind is set to BUY something? Hell no, he'll just rub his hands and start searching for all that FREE shit y'allz promise him! Nevermind that only the tour is FREE, his mind will be set NOT to buy anything, since that's what you told him in the first place! You make the surfer anticipate all that free stuff, how the fuck do you expect him to want to pay for anything?

Marketing 101 definition of customer satisfaction: customer-perceived product value equals or exceeds the expectations created by the advertising of that product. Now you promise the surfer he'll get free porn. Or free galleries. Or free tours. Then he finds out he actually has to pay for it. Or gets console-raped. Or whatever to help him realize "this ain't fucken' free, pardner!" You think he'll pull the plastic or will he move on? Some of the savvy ones maybe will, or some of those who get so horny on a set that they just need to join the paysite advertised so they can get off. But most won't. And it's not so much the amount of readily available free porn, as it's the mindset YOU put your surfers in.

I'm not saying the amount of free porn on the net isn't a cause for the dropping conversions. It is. But it's not the only one and it's DEFINITELY not the biggest one.

What you should do? Stop using the word FREE on your sites, galleries, free sites, AVS sites, anything. Just stop fucking using it, how hard can it be? Maybe your CTR to sponsor will drop, but your conversion ratio will increase for sure! And stop using e-mail programs and programs such as Amateur Pages ClickPic that actually REQUIRE you to use the word FREE in your textlinks ("Click here to see my free pics"). I'm sure the sponsors will be thrilled in the end as well. Not only will their conversions get better, but overhead will drop along with bandwidth usage.

I took a quick look at 20-something galleries in the TGP2 pool. About half of them used the word FREE. This is way better than the regular TGP galleries. But it's way worse than what it SHOULD be.

I chose not to name my TGP2 anything with FREE in it. I know, the most traffic comes in looking for FREE stuff, so I could've named it FREE PORN GALLERIES, FREE DAILY PORN, DAILY UPDATED FREE PICS and so on. But I didn't. Why? Because I don't want the fuckers looking for free stuff on my site. I want those who will understand that the best porn is the one you pay for. I want those anticipating to buy porn, not to freeload on my sites. I want those who haven't yet set their minds on NOT paying for porn, since it's free, thus leaving me no choice but to trick them into joining a site, using means such as free trials, free membership with credit card age verification, free memberships with e-mail address, free dialer downloads and so on. These you cannot convert unless you resort to some fucking of some kind. They're set on not paying.

Think about it! And if you're smart enough for your own good, you'll see to it that the word FREE will never, EVER appear again on any html page created by you. FREE doesn't pay your rent. FREE doesn't sell. It just creates freeloaders.

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#2

05-15-2003, 03:34 AM

Wow.... really?

<a href="http://www.swoit.com/_7075fcffae0c1be1a35492ee5bbfaae3/1"><img src="http://www.swoit.com/_7075fcffae0c1be1aab68e286ae87b30/1" border="0" width="120" height="60"></img></a>
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DamageX

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#3

05-15-2003, 03:44 AM

Did you even bother reading, or did you just hit the back button as sson as you saw TGP2 mentioned?

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#4

05-15-2003, 03:45 AM

interesting..
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#5

05-15-2003, 03:46 AM

Nobody really believes that anything is "FREE"... do they?
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#6

05-15-2003, 03:49 AM

TGP's promoted as FREE! FREE! FREE! use a business model that tries to build as much traffic as possible so they can sell gallery spots. And if you are selling spots, then actual porn conversions suddenly don't matter as much.
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DamageX

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#7

05-15-2003, 03:49 AM

This says otherwise: http://inventory.overture.com/d/sear...=us&lang=en_US

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#8

05-15-2003, 03:50 AM

SEE SIG!
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DamageX

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#9

05-15-2003, 03:52 AM

Originally posted by Matt 26z
TGP's promoted as FREE! FREE! FREE! use a business model that tries to build as much traffic as possible so they can sell gallery spots. And if you are selling spots, then actual porn conversions suddenly don't matter as much.

I doesn't matter TO THEM. But the gallery makers must break even and turn a profit on the spots, or they will not buy more spots. And if gallery makers no longer buy spots then all the TGP owners are left with is some nice phone number like traffic stats and bandwidth bills with about the same amount of digits.

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#10

05-15-2003, 03:55 AM

what would be a better sale text?

CLICK HERE TO GET INSTANT ACCESS TO BLABLA . ITS DAAAAAMN EXPENSIVE DUDE SO BETTER TAKE YOUR CC OUT OF YOUR POCKET ;) before you click here

or click here for the FREE TOUR but don't forget that its expensive if you want more than only some loosy pics ;)
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DamageX

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#11

05-15-2003, 04:01 AM

Originally posted by Corleone
what would be a better sale text?

CLICK HERE TO GET INSTANT ACCESS TO BLABLA . ITS DAAAAAMN EXPENSIVE DUDE SO BETTER TAKE YOUR CC OUT OF YOUR POCKET ;) before you click here

or click here for the FREE TOUR but don't forget that its expensive if you want more than only some loosy pics ;)

Sell the girl. "Click here to see my pussy fiercely fucked! Then I take it up my ass, after which I suck it clean and swallow the entire load of cum!" Or something like that.

It's called "smack-talk". The succesful gallery makers are using this and many of them do not use the word FREE anywhere on the gallery. They SELL, the do not GIVE AWAY. They're salesmen, as opposed to the large bunch of webmasters who are just promoters. And very bad ones, mostly.

If you tell someone he can have the cow for free, do you think he'll be prepared to pay for the milk? Hell no, he'll wait you out until you give him the cow for free!

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#12

05-15-2003, 04:13 AM

Its such a damn powerful word isn't it? That's why people use it so much.

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#13

05-15-2003, 04:14 AM

Originally posted by DamageX
I doesn't matter TO THEM. But the gallery makers must break even and turn a profit on the spots, or they will not buy more spots.

I really don't think that's an issue with most TGP's yet. There's still enough newbies who'll try it at least once (especially if the TGP owner talks big on the boards).

It urks me when TGP's that don't send much traffic actually try to sell spots. They are clearly trying to scam the clueless newbie.

But once the willingness to buy gallery spots on everyone but the mega-TGP's runs out, TGP's will have to change back to the way they were.... Putting the focus on converting surfers, not webmasters.
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#14

05-15-2003, 04:16 AM

DamageX please message me : 42556263 icq
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DamageX

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#15

05-15-2003, 04:17 AM

Originally posted by KRL
Its such a damn powerful word isn't it? That's why people use it so much.

Yeah, but do they use it efficiently?

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#16

05-15-2003, 04:36 AM

Originally posted by DamageX

I doesn't matter TO THEM. But the gallery makers must break even and turn a profit on the spots, or they will not buy more spots. And if gallery makers no longer buy spots then all the TGP owners are left with is some nice phone number like traffic stats and bandwidth bills with about the same amount of digits.

nice thought, but in reality it doesn't hold. people said the same thing 4 years ago and tgp's have gotten stronger every year and it costs more for paid listings.
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#17

05-15-2003, 04:39 AM

Originally posted by DamageX

Yeah, but do they use it efficiently?

a lot of paysites have free pics and movies. they're teasers and they do work well if the content is good.
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DamageX

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#18

05-15-2003, 04:42 AM

Originally posted by FlyingIguana

a lot of paysites have free pics and movies. they're teasers and they do work well if the content is good.

This is kinda like the car salesman throwing in an extra set of hubcaps or letting you take a free ride in the Cadillac before you buy it. Nothing wrong with this, it's just good promotion.

But he doesn't promise you to give you the car for free, does he?

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#19

05-15-2003, 04:43 AM

oh DamageX you just did a revolution in tha biz
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DamageX

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#20

05-15-2003, 04:44 AM

Originally posted by TheVTheP
oh DamageX you just did a revolution in tha biz

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#21

05-15-2003, 04:45 AM

Originally posted by DamageX

This is kinda like the car salesman throwing in an extra set of hubcaps or letting you take a free ride in the Cadillac before you buy it. Nothing wrong with this, it's just good promotion.

But he doesn't promise you to give you the car for free, does he?

they're free, you can view them anytime you want. thats a very stupid example...
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DamageX

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#22

05-15-2003, 04:46 AM

Originally posted by FlyingIguana

nice thought, but in reality it doesn't hold. people said the same thing 4 years ago and tgp's have gotten stronger every year and it costs more for paid listings.

There's more of them too. Which means the gallery makers have more choices where to buy spots. That's why they need to start caring more about them.

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#23

05-15-2003, 04:50 AM

Originally posted by DamageX

There's more of them too. Which means the gallery makers have more choices where to buy spots. That's why they need to start caring more about them.

not all tgp's are equal quality wise...
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DamageX

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#24

05-15-2003, 04:52 AM

Originally posted by FlyingIguana

they're free, you can view them anytime you want. thats a very stupid example...

Ok, let's translate that into English for you.

The pornographer's product is the paysite. The care dealer's is the Cadillac.

The pornographer will let you see some pics from the paysite for free. The Cadillac dealer will let you take a test drive in the car for free.

The car dealer says "Buy the Cadillac!" The pornographer says "Get in, it's free!"

The one who wants the car knows he can only get it if he pays. The porn surfer goes in and expects it to be free.

The one who wants the car buys the car. The porn surfer realizes it ain't free and moves on to the next one advertising free.

Now, can you tell me what's wrong with this picture?

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#25

05-15-2003, 04:54 AM

yet another "whining about free porn" thread

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DamageX

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#26

05-15-2003, 04:56 AM

Originally posted by BVF
yet another "whining about free porn" thread

I'm not whining about the free porn itself. I'm whining about the way it is used to promote paysites, making every surfer and their mother thinking everything is actually free.

Television is free, but you don't see the networks promoting everything they do as FREE, do you?

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#27

05-15-2003, 05:01 AM

DamageX
good post

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#28

05-15-2003, 05:02 AM

Originally posted by DamageX

Ok, let's translate that into English for you.

The pornographer's product is the paysite. The care dealer's is the Cadillac.

The pornographer will let you see some pics from the paysite for free. The Cadillac dealer will let you take a test drive in the car for free.

The car dealer says "Buy the Cadillac!" The pornographer says "Get in, it's free!"

The one who wants the car knows he can only get it if he pays. The porn surfer goes in and expects it to be free.

The one who wants the car buys the car. The porn surfer realizes it ain't free and moves on to the next one advertising free.

Now, can you tell me what's wrong with this picture?

the movies are free. the surfer doesn't have to pay to view or keep them, whatever the case may be.

but if the customer wants to drive the car again he has to buy it. big difference...
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#29

05-15-2003, 05:06 AM

FREE*
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DamageX

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#30

05-15-2003, 05:07 AM

Originally posted by slavdogg
DamageX
good post

Thanks man. Love the sig!

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DamageX

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#31

05-15-2003, 05:10 AM

Originally posted by goBigtime
FREE*

Haha, good one! Nice illustration of my point.

See, if you see a link like that, do you expect it to be free, or do you expect that something fishy's written in the fine print and you will actually get charged? And after getting fucked and charging back, will you ever consider joining a paysite again? Why would you, if everyone's throwing free porn at you and the actually FREE paysites fuck you worse than they'd do a five dollar hoe?

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#32

05-15-2003, 05:16 AM

there will always be money to be made, no free site offers a surfer everything he wants all in one place.

If i see a girl i like, such as betty bigboobs then i may see a few free pics of her on a tgp, but if i want movies and series pics i have to pay.

get my drift?

if i could set something in my .htaccess file that would block freeloaders from my sites i would :-)
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DamageX

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#33

05-15-2003, 05:23 AM

Originally posted by a1ka1ine
there will always be money to be made, no free site offers a surfer everything he wants all in one place.

If i see a girl i like, such as betty bigboobs then i may see a few free pics of her on a tgp, but if i want movies and series pics i have to pay.

get my drift?

if i could set something in my .htaccess file that would block freeloaders from my sites i would :-)

You're right, of course. I'm not saying all the good stuff can be found for free (although I really wonder about that nowadays...), all I'm saying is that if you contribute to brainwashing the surfer offering him FREE stuff all over the place, then he'll start believing everything's for free.

Hell, ask your fellow webmasters around here, would they ever pay to join a website? No, they wouldn't. Why? Because they know you can head over to AL4A and whack off in a heartbeat, if they ever needed to.

Think surfers are different? Hell no, once they've been taught about the free stuff, you'll have to drag the plastic out of their wallet.

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#34

05-15-2003, 07:38 AM

In related news:

Somewhere on chromehorn.com I left a message about something I am giving away to another TGP2 webmaster (TGP2 newbies are encouraged to seek it out and recieve it... I can set you up with a gallery template or two if need be so you can use it!)

Be the first to contact me with the details of my giveaway and it is yours!
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#35

05-15-2003, 07:40 AM

Ever seen the ads here for Stella Artois? It's a nice french beer, and is branded as "reassuringly expensive". Not everyone wants free or cheap.

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#36

05-15-2003, 07:41 AM

wow this man is god among men

oops did i say men, i meant dog poop

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#37

05-15-2003, 07:47 AM

another "I want to win the fukin DVD (or whatever)" thread. boring.

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DamageX

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#38

05-15-2003, 07:48 AM

Originally posted by gothweb
Ever seen the ads here for Stella Artois? It's a nice french beer, and is branded as "reassuringly expensive". Not everyone wants free or cheap.

Ummm, Stella Artois is Belgian. And I don't know how pricy it is in the US, but in Europe it's not that expensive at all. Probably cheaper than Heineken or Carlsberg.

But point well taken.

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DamageX

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#39

05-15-2003, 07:50 AM

Originally posted by Wildcard
another "I want to win the fukin DVD (or whatever)" thread. boring.

So what are you doing reading/posting in it then?

Anyway, I don't give a fuck about the DVD, if I accidentally win it, you can have it. Deal?

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#40

05-15-2003, 11:02 AM

Originally posted by Wildcard
another "I want to win the fukin DVD (or whatever)" thread. boring.

I'm sure this has nothing to do with getting a DVD player.

Nice post DamagedX

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#41

05-15-2003, 11:16 AM

Hey DamagedX,

Nice post and worthwhile topic. While I don't agree with everything you've said, I think you do have many valid points.

I think the biggest issue I feel differently about is the fact that sure, once I get them to my site I don't have to hit them over the head with the FREE wording, but to get them to my site in the first place (advertising) I think FREE pulls a lot better than CC required.

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#42

05-15-2003, 11:19 AM

The guy has a point whether some here like it or not.

And sure there's always going to be someone who's going to continue to put the word free in their text.

It is all about conditioning the customer.

I've made reference to my Taco Bell past in other threads. I managed for Taco Bell for 7 years, my main job towards the last part of my time there was to be the fix it man, to fix broken stores that weren't doing well.

All stores that do badly have usually 3 key problems.

Drive thru times are horrible and order accuracy is inconsistent.

Cleanliness

And last but not least inventory problems.

What I kept preaching was that we had to condition the customer along with ourselves.

How did that happen.

By proper training, people know the measurements of food and can make it quicker.

How did that help?

It cut down on inventory loss, improved order accuracy, and customers started to learn that only 1/4 oz of cheese came on a taco and not a 1/4 pound.

The most important thing being the customer. By conditioning the customer over time that he was getting what he paid for I was able to build trust and by building trust I was able to gain more business, by gaining more business I was able to employ more people, by employing more people I was able to have the store adequately staffed, by the store being adequately staffed orders were more accurate and drive thru times dropped drastically...the end effect....customer satisfaction and customer trust.

It seems like the internet and in particular the adult internet where most people don't apply simple good business concepts to improve their bottom line.

Instead they focus on creating more and more extreme content, or building twice as many sites to make as much money as they used to with the 1.

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#43

05-15-2003, 09:04 PM

Originally posted by Matt 26z

I really don't think that's an issue with most TGP's yet. There's still enough newbies who'll try it at least once (especially if the TGP owner talks big on the boards).

It urks me when TGP's that don't send much traffic actually try to sell spots. They are clearly trying to scam the clueless newbie.

But once the willingness to buy gallery spots on everyone but the mega-TGP's runs out, TGP's will have to change back to the way they were.... Putting the focus on converting surfers, not webmasters.

hmmm... I am not going to be able to convince you to buy expensive gallery spots on Dirty-Pillows.com then. am I?

Incidentally, my FREE, FREE, FREE Hentai traffic and TGP2 gallery template is yet to be claimed y some clueless n00b!

Enough of this, its time to go feed some hungry surfers for me!
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#44

05-15-2003, 10:03 PM

Originally posted by Joe Sixpack
Nobody really believes that anything is "FREE"... do they?

on TGP they can see for example 10,000 low-res pics but for 1 mill. hi-res they need to pay. They know that, right dear visitors?

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#45

05-16-2003, 01:11 AM

eroswebmaster, you're right on the money. We need to condition the fucking freeloaders into realizing that good stuff is not free.

Originally posted by The Hammer
I think the biggest issue I feel differently about is the fact that sure, once I get them to my site I don't have to hit them over the head with the FREE wording, but to get them to my site in the first place (advertising) I think FREE pulls a lot better than CC required.

Who said you should do either? Use your imangination and you'll pull just as many surfers to your site without mentioning it's free or telling them they need a credit card.

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#46

05-16-2003, 01:18 AM

I thought someone must have bumped an old thread.

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#47

05-16-2003, 01:44 AM

Originally posted by DamageX
This says otherwise: http://inventory.overture.com/d/sear...=us&lang=en_US

weird
http://inventory.overture.com/d/sear...=us&lang=en_US

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#48

05-16-2003, 01:53 AM

I agree. When the "for free" shit programs first came out, I posted to the board I frequented at the time and demanded the program owners be publicly flogged.

The word "free" should have never been allowed to enter the porn marketing vocabulary... and especially not promoted by owners of big programs.

Of course once one of them does it, the rest have to keep up, so you can't really blame them.
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#49

05-16-2003, 01:53 AM

Originally posted by DyannaDoes

weird
http://inventory.overture.com/d/sear...=us&lang=en_US

Ok, it doesn't beat "free sex", but it's illustrating the fact that people still search for other stuff than FREE.

On the other hand, if you knew enough about Overture's search term suggestion tool then you'd know that it treats plural and singular as the same. So the it treats "woman" and "women" as the same word, which means that the number of searches done for the particular singular form of the word would be smaller.

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#50

05-16-2003, 02:23 AM

The sky is falling...
The end is near....
Fear the noobs!

Hands Free Adult - Join Once, Earn For Life

"I try to make a habit of bouncing my eyes up to the face of a beautiful woman, and often repeat “not mine” in my head or even verbally. She’s not mine. God has her set aside. She’s not mine. She’s His little girl, and she needs me to fight for her by keeping my eyes where they should be."
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