What is the monthly expense of running a popular paysite?

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  • BJ
    Confirmed User
    • Mar 2002
    • 5590
    #1

    What is the monthly expense of running a popular paysite?

    taking out paying affiliates (if any) what does it cost to run a paysite such as maxcash, ars, adult.com, etc.

    Im talking bandwidth, employee costs, content, and everthing else.

    My guess is 250k

    edit: I may be way off
    Tags: None
    • Gary
      Confirmed User
      • Aug 2001
      • 6110
      #2
      1 billllllllion dollars

      Up to 35$ per join...!

        Comment

        • lil2rich4u2
          ICQ: 175171926
          • Oct 2002
          • 11046
          #3
          Originally posted by Gary
          1 billllllllion dollars
          I think you left out the visa fee
          HEY!!

          Unbeatable hosting! Customer service is top notch!

          --> ISPrime <-- Do a search on any board, their reputation is rock solid .. for years!!

            Comment

            • m0rph3us
              Confirmed User
              • Mar 2001
              • 2033
              #4
              define 'popular'
              1k members or 100k?
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                Comment

                • psyko514
                  See sig. Join Epic Cash.
                  • Oct 2002
                  • 22366
                  #5
                  Originally posted by Gary
                  1 billllllllion dollars
                  fucking a. i was gonna say 1 milllllion dollars.
                  bastard.

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                    Comment

                    • lil2rich4u2
                      ICQ: 175171926
                      • Oct 2002
                      • 11046
                      #6
                      Originally posted by m0rph3us
                      define 'popular'
                      1k members or 100k?
                      Interesting point.

                      Id be curious to know how many members it takes to push a profit. Never really thought about it
                      HEY!!

                      Unbeatable hosting! Customer service is top notch!

                      --> ISPrime <-- Do a search on any board, their reputation is rock solid .. for years!!

                        Comment

                        • m0rph3us
                          Confirmed User
                          • Mar 2001
                          • 2033
                          #7
                          Originally posted by lil2rich4u2


                          Interesting point.

                          Id be curious to know how many members it takes to push a profit. Never really thought about it
                          profit = revenue - costs
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                            • juicylinks
                              So Fucking Banned
                              • Apr 2001
                              • 122992
                              #8
                              take the angle of the dangle and divide it by the motion in the ocean times the push in the bush

                                Comment

                                • BJ
                                  Confirmed User
                                  • Mar 2002
                                  • 5590
                                  #9
                                  Originally posted by m0rph3us
                                  define 'popular'
                                  1k members or 100k?
                                  top of the tier only. $10 mil gross+ a month (If that exists)

                                  Im not asking anyone to open their books, just trying to get a general idea of certain ratios.

                                    Comment

                                    • lil2rich4u2
                                      ICQ: 175171926
                                      • Oct 2002
                                      • 11046
                                      #10
                                      Originally posted by m0rph3us


                                      profit = revenue - costs
                                      heh

                                      Problem is, i dont know the exact figures involved in starting/running a site, and i also dont know the income a single signup can bring. So its hard for me to figure out ... just figured someone had it down to a science by now.
                                      HEY!!

                                      Unbeatable hosting! Customer service is top notch!

                                      --> ISPrime <-- Do a search on any board, their reputation is rock solid .. for years!!

                                        Comment

                                        • m0rph3us
                                          Confirmed User
                                          • Mar 2001
                                          • 2033
                                          #11
                                          Originally posted by lil2rich4u2

                                          just figured someone had it down to a science by now.
                                          some people do but they'd be stupid to post their forumlas and insider info on a public forum to show their competition
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                                            • Sly_RJ
                                              Live Hard - Die Hard
                                              • Feb 2002
                                              • 17042
                                              #12
                                              Originally posted by lil2rich4u2


                                              heh

                                              Problem is, i dont know the exact figures involved in starting/running a site, and i also dont know the income a single signup can bring. So its hard for me to figure out ... just figured someone had it down to a science by now.
                                              Grab a pen and paper and start writing down reasonable numbers. It isn't that hard to come up with an estimate on the overall cost of starting a paysite. It's the other stuff that gets tricky...
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                                                • lil2rich4u2
                                                  ICQ: 175171926
                                                  • Oct 2002
                                                  • 11046
                                                  #13
                                                  Originally posted by m0rph3us


                                                  some people do but they'd be stupid to post their forumlas and insider info on a public forum to show their competition
                                                  True ... but if they were smart enough to think of that, they would be smart enough to convince people it takes a bazilion members to make a profit. That should eliminate some future competition, lol
                                                  HEY!!

                                                  Unbeatable hosting! Customer service is top notch!

                                                  --> ISPrime <-- Do a search on any board, their reputation is rock solid .. for years!!

                                                    Comment

                                                    • BJ
                                                      Confirmed User
                                                      • Mar 2002
                                                      • 5590
                                                      #14
                                                      Originally posted by Sly_RJ

                                                      Grab a pen and paper and start writing down reasonable numbers. It isn't that hard to come up with an estimate on the overall cost of starting a paysite. It's the other stuff that gets tricky...
                                                      Yes,

                                                      Im not trying to stick my nose into someones books, I just want a rough estimate, but only at the highest tier. The heavy hitters.

                                                        Comment

                                                        • Marcus
                                                          Confirmed User
                                                          • Jul 2001
                                                          • 3472
                                                          #15
                                                          I think the best guy to talk to is Mark Tiarra
                                                          http://www.lumyr.com/
                                                          He knows these numbers

                                                            Comment

                                                            • lil2rich4u2
                                                              ICQ: 175171926
                                                              • Oct 2002
                                                              • 11046
                                                              #16
                                                              Originally posted by Sly_RJ

                                                              Grab a pen and paper and start writing down reasonable numbers. It isn't that hard to come up with an estimate on the overall cost of starting a paysite. It's the other stuff that gets tricky...
                                                              Hey Sly, hows it going!

                                                              The paper idea is great, but for someone with no friends to ask about it its kind of tough.

                                                              You would need rough pricing for hosting, content, processing for starters. Once the niche and type of site has been decided you can start forcasting chargebacks, bad checks, cancels, rebill's, etc. Theres alot of stuff that just cant be guessed until you have your feet wet in that side of the world.

                                                              HEY!!

                                                              Unbeatable hosting! Customer service is top notch!

                                                              --> ISPrime <-- Do a search on any board, their reputation is rock solid .. for years!!

                                                                Comment

                                                                • m0rph3us
                                                                  Confirmed User
                                                                  • Mar 2001
                                                                  • 2033
                                                                  #17
                                                                  Originally posted by Marcus
                                                                  I think the best guy to talk to is Mark Tiarra
                                                                  http://www.lumyr.com/
                                                                  He knows these numbers
                                                                  he'll love the emails he'll get from 100k newbies
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                                                                    • BJ
                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                      • Mar 2002
                                                                      • 5590
                                                                      #18
                                                                      someone needs to find that chart posted about 6 months ago on the recurring model. It was sweet.

                                                                      If I can get some numbers here, I have a buddy that will run some crazy stats in SAS

                                                                        Comment

                                                                        • m0rph3us
                                                                          Confirmed User
                                                                          • Mar 2001
                                                                          • 2033
                                                                          #19
                                                                          Originally posted by PureMeds
                                                                          someone needs to find that chart posted about 6 months ago on the recurring model. It was sweet.

                                                                          If I can get some numbers here, I have a buddy that will run some crazy stats in SAS
                                                                          HAHA the one that assumed 100% recurring
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                                                                            Comment

                                                                            • BJ
                                                                              Confirmed User
                                                                              • Mar 2002
                                                                              • 5590
                                                                              #20
                                                                              how bout a simple expense to gross ratio

                                                                                Comment

                                                                                • SleazyDream
                                                                                  I'm here for SPORT
                                                                                  • Jul 2001
                                                                                  • 41470
                                                                                  #21
                                                                                  everything in volume gets cheaper to buy.
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                                                                                  Now read without the word dog.

                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                    • heymatty
                                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                                      • Oct 2001
                                                                                      • 2188
                                                                                      #22
                                                                                      everything in volume gets cheaper to buy.
                                                                                      Yet most companies that fail don't control expenses correctly and get into trouble because revenue can't keep up with costs.

                                                                                      Cashlantis ~ Black Book Cash

                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                        • quiet
                                                                                          we'll miss you our friend. RIP
                                                                                          • Sep 2001
                                                                                          • 25115
                                                                                          #23
                                                                                          Originally posted by PureMeds
                                                                                          how bout a simple expense to gross ratio
                                                                                          I've sat at about 70% profit margin for years. I peaked last fall at a little over 13K recurring members/month + new signups. very stable.
                                                                                          we'll miss you our friend. RIP

                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                            • BJ
                                                                                              Confirmed User
                                                                                              • Mar 2002
                                                                                              • 5590
                                                                                              #24
                                                                                              Originally posted by quiet


                                                                                              I've sat at about 70% profit margin for years. I peaked last fall at a little over 13K recurring members/month + new signups. very stable.
                                                                                              that is very good, considering most brick and mortar are lucky to operate at 15% w/ 100x more employees and over head.

                                                                                              pulling a million + in your own pocket a year is very reputable without cooking the books.

                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                • &lt;IMX&gt;
                                                                                                  Confirmed User
                                                                                                  • Jun 2002
                                                                                                  • 2728
                                                                                                  #25
                                                                                                  Estimates on costs are not that difficult, revenue streams and expected value of those revenue streams - payouts to traffic buys and affiliates...that is the tricky part.
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                                                                                                    • BJ
                                                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                                                      • Mar 2002
                                                                                                      • 5590
                                                                                                      #26
                                                                                                      I wish I could explain better where I was going w/ this...

                                                                                                      But there is no credit facility for porn.... which means that most if not all run liquid.

                                                                                                      should be taught in college.

                                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                                        • Madball
                                                                                                          Confirmed User
                                                                                                          • May 2002
                                                                                                          • 748
                                                                                                          #27
                                                                                                          Originally posted by PureMeds
                                                                                                          I wish I could explain better where I was going w/ this...

                                                                                                          But there is no credit facility for porn.... which means that most if not all run liquid.

                                                                                                          should be taught in college.
                                                                                                          The insanity of porn compared to brick and mortar is that most online porn businesses fund their exansion and investments directly out of their weekly cashflow.

                                                                                                          If You tell a seasoned accountant or some stock analyst "We don't need any cash from investors or banks, we just use our cash flow to cover all costs of overhead & investments" you will see big $$$ signs pop up in their eyes. This is widely unheard of in many brick and mortar industries.
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                                                                                                            • EscortBiz
                                                                                                              Fuck Checks, CASH only!
                                                                                                              • May 2002
                                                                                                              • 19422
                                                                                                              #28
                                                                                                              Originally posted by Madball

                                                                                                              The insanity of porn compared to brick and mortar is that most online porn businesses fund their exansion and investments directly out of their weekly cashflow.

                                                                                                              If You tell a seasoned accountant or some stock analyst "We don't need any cash from investors or banks, we just use our cash flow to cover all costs of overhead & investments" you will see big $$$ signs pop up in their eyes. This is widely unheard of in many brick and mortar industries.
                                                                                                              Well said, I second that

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                                                                                                                • Pornwolf
                                                                                                                  Drunk and Unruly
                                                                                                                  • Jan 2002
                                                                                                                  • 22712
                                                                                                                  #29
                                                                                                                  Originally posted by PureMeds
                                                                                                                  But there is no credit facility for porn.... which means that most if not all run liquid.

                                                                                                                  should be taught in college.
                                                                                                                  You are so right. All businesses should be run like this in my opinion. After I figured it out and accepted the porn philosophy I told my investors in my mainstream biz to fuck off. They couldn't fathom working in this manner. We know better.
                                                                                                                  I've trusted my sites to them for over a decade...

                                                                                                                  Webair, bitches.

                                                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                                                    • BJ
                                                                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                                                                      • Mar 2002
                                                                                                                      • 5590
                                                                                                                      #30
                                                                                                                      start-up incubators..

                                                                                                                      this used to be *hot* topic within local governence..

                                                                                                                      thinking being that attracting e-com biz would ultimately lead to self-sufficient community growth.

                                                                                                                      until they found out that multi-million operations can run w/ little to no employee overhead

                                                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                                                        • angelsofporn
                                                                                                                          Confirmed User
                                                                                                                          • Mar 2002
                                                                                                                          • 3218
                                                                                                                          #31
                                                                                                                          i know one guy on this board that spends 30k a month just on content..let alone BW.. etc

                                                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                                                            • FTVGirls
                                                                                                                              So Fucking Banned
                                                                                                                              • Oct 2002
                                                                                                                              • 1052
                                                                                                                              #32
                                                                                                                              we pay 5k a month on content, and 5k a month on bandwidth. But that is peasant pay next to the tax burden.

                                                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                                                • angelsofporn
                                                                                                                                  Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                  • Mar 2002
                                                                                                                                  • 3218
                                                                                                                                  #33
                                                                                                                                  Originally posted by FTVGirls
                                                                                                                                  we pay 5k a month on content, and 5k a month on bandwidth. But that is peasant pay next to the tax burden.
                                                                                                                                  it's all about the sub S corp

                                                                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                                                                    • UnseenWorld
                                                                                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                      • May 2001
                                                                                                                                      • 5279
                                                                                                                                      #34
                                                                                                                                      My nominee for stupidest thread of the year.
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                                                                                                                                        • BritishTwinks
                                                                                                                                          Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                          • Feb 2003
                                                                                                                                          • 357
                                                                                                                                          #35
                                                                                                                                          Originally posted by UnseenWorld
                                                                                                                                          My nominee for stupidest thread of the year.
                                                                                                                                          My nominee for stupidest post of the year

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                                                                                                                                            • psyko514
                                                                                                                                              See sig. Join Epic Cash.
                                                                                                                                              • Oct 2002
                                                                                                                                              • 22366
                                                                                                                                              #36
                                                                                                                                              Originally posted by quiet


                                                                                                                                              I've sat at about 70% profit margin for years. I peaked last fall at a little over 13K recurring members/month + new signups. very stable.
                                                                                                                                              jesus fucking christ. that's some real cash right there. adopt me.

                                                                                                                                              Bad Girl Bucks                                                                                                                                               - 50% Revshare through CCBill.
                                                                                                                                              Promote BrandyDDD, Pixie's Pillows, Action Allie and more!

                                                                                                                                              Phoenix Forum Pics | Webmaster Access Montreal pics
                                                                                                                                              email: psyko514(a)gmail.com | icq: 214-702-014

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                                                                                                                                                • NETbilling
                                                                                                                                                  Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                  • Jan 2002
                                                                                                                                                  • 8599
                                                                                                                                                  #37
                                                                                                                                                  Puremeds,

                                                                                                                                                  Chat with me tomorrow again and I will give you some estimates? Looking to step into adult?

                                                                                                                                                  Mitch


                                                                                                                                                  Mitch Farber
                                                                                                                                                  CEO - NETbilling, Inc.
                                                                                                                                                  Email / Phone: 888-357-8166 / 661-252-2456
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                                                                                                                                                    • Qumbus
                                                                                                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                      • Apr 2003
                                                                                                                                                      • 258
                                                                                                                                                      #38
                                                                                                                                                      Hard to say.... depends on how you run the site.
                                                                                                                                                      Do you buy content and update every day or once week, where do you buy the content, howmany members........
                                                                                                                                                      You can go from 1k a month for a single paysite to 20k a month for a single paysite.
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                                                                                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                                                                                        • BJ
                                                                                                                                                          Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                          • Mar 2002
                                                                                                                                                          • 5590
                                                                                                                                                          #39
                                                                                                                                                          bump

                                                                                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                                                                                            • LeeNoga
                                                                                                                                                              Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                              • Jul 2001
                                                                                                                                                              • 3043
                                                                                                                                                              #40
                                                                                                                                                              Originally posted by PureMeds
                                                                                                                                                              My guess is 250k
                                                                                                                                                              In 1997 Intergal [Dean Shannon] started his huge affiliate program for $250K in that day.

                                                                                                                                                              With affiliate programs opening up by the hundreds, I think its more along the lines of what you can afford and you hope like hell you generate what you pay out.

                                                                                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                                                                                • Rochard
                                                                                                                                                                  Jägermeister Test Pilot
                                                                                                                                                                  • Dec 2001
                                                                                                                                                                  • 75767
                                                                                                                                                                  #41
                                                                                                                                                                  Your talking about opening up a new business, which involves a ton of variables and a lot of risk.

                                                                                                                                                                  Opening up your own paysite can be down with very little investment. What do you really need? Content, a website, a host, and a few fees to get some credit card processing going.

                                                                                                                                                                  However, I'll warn you - The bigger you get, the more complicated it gets, and the more money you'll need to spend each month. Lightspeed Media is a great example. Steve started with one small cheerleader site by paying some models to pose for him and putting them on his little website. Then he hired me, and a few websites later another person, and more websites later another webmaster. By then we needed more equipment, more computers, and a phyiscal location to work out of. Now we have a real office in a office building, programmers to keep everything running, graphics designers, an attorney, and so on.

                                                                                                                                                                  And it's a lot of work; Steve and I both work a lot of hours.

                                                                                                                                                                  If you wanted my advice I'd say the following......
                                                                                                                                                                  - Go with a good credit card processing company, one that's not gonna keep your money from you (Try CCBill).
                                                                                                                                                                  - Be prepared to work a lot of hours.
                                                                                                                                                                  - Make sure you hosting company has good support and good up time.
                                                                                                                                                                  - Be careful of who you hire; Everyone you hire represents you.
                                                                                                                                                                  - Go to every show you can and meet everyone you can. It's great when you have a problem to be able to pick up the phone and call some of the most important people in the industry.

                                                                                                                                                                  If you ever want to seriously talk numbers find me at a show.
                                                                                                                                                                  Herschel Savage
                                                                                                                                                                  Brooklyn, NY

                                                                                                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                                                                                                    • BJ
                                                                                                                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                      • Mar 2002
                                                                                                                                                                      • 5590
                                                                                                                                                                      #42
                                                                                                                                                                      Originally posted by RocHard
                                                                                                                                                                      Your talking about opening up a new business, which involves a ton of variables and a lot of risk.

                                                                                                                                                                      Opening up your own paysite can be down with very little investment. What do you really need? Content, a website, a host, and a few fees to get some credit card processing going.

                                                                                                                                                                      However, I'll warn you - The bigger you get, the more complicated it gets, and the more money you'll need to spend each month. Lightspeed Media is a great example. Steve started with one small cheerleader site by paying some models to pose for him and putting them on his little website. Then he hired me, and a few websites later another person, and more websites later another webmaster. By then we needed more equipment, more computers, and a phyiscal location to work out of. Now we have a real office in a office building, programmers to keep everything running, graphics designers, an attorney, and so on.

                                                                                                                                                                      And it's a lot of work; Steve and I both work a lot of hours.

                                                                                                                                                                      If you wanted my advice I'd say the following......
                                                                                                                                                                      - Go with a good credit card processing company, one that's not gonna keep your money from you (Try CCBill).
                                                                                                                                                                      - Be prepared to work a lot of hours.
                                                                                                                                                                      - Make sure you hosting company has good support and good up time.
                                                                                                                                                                      - Be careful of who you hire; Everyone you hire represents you.
                                                                                                                                                                      - Go to every show you can and meet everyone you can. It's great when you have a problem to be able to pick up the phone and call some of the most important people in the industry.

                                                                                                                                                                      If you ever want to seriously talk numbers find me at a show.
                                                                                                                                                                      hey thanks, Ill try to icq you later this afternoon.


                                                                                                                                                                      I have what may be a good idea... I have own processing, Ive got a C corp to use for this, I have 25-30k to invest. Just no experience or desire to be deeply involved with content management.

                                                                                                                                                                      If anyone has a lot of experience, ie you've worked directly with a major paysite, are familiar with content management, can basically get the whole thing set up, plz email me at gfy at puremeds com. Preferably someone willing to put up some of their own assets to start it.

                                                                                                                                                                      Also, will lets say 15k buy a TON of highest quality content? I want to build a totally automated system.... something where you can load a years worth of content and it auto-updates.

                                                                                                                                                                      Thanks!

                                                                                                                                                                      gotta go to work now so plz email. Ill be on ICQ tonight.

                                                                                                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                                                                                                        • nike
                                                                                                                                                                          Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                          • Oct 2002
                                                                                                                                                                          • 189
                                                                                                                                                                          #43
                                                                                                                                                                          Originally posted by RocHard
                                                                                                                                                                          Your talking about opening up a new business, which involves a ton of variables and a lot of risk.
                                                                                                                                                                          Saw you made it on to the hall of fame at Attrition.org, watch out for those kids they play rough.

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