Running a firewall could send you to jail

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  • Lizzie
    Registered User
    • Apr 2002
    • 76
    #1

    Running a firewall could send you to jail

    If you live in one of these states that have passed laws
    (Colorado, Delaware, Illinois, Michigan, Oregon, Pennsylvania and Wyoming) against using firewalls you could be breaking the law

    "So if you live in one of these states, you are now breaking the law if you run a firewall. And if you're an IT admin that has all of your internal systems running on NAT, you could face as much as five years in prison and up to a quarter-million-dollar fine. "

    http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,3959,1033071,00.asp

    Interesting!!
    Liz
    Tags: None
    • asuna
      Confirmed User
      • May 2002
      • 8743
      #2
      no law like this in canada
      <img src="http://canflag.ptbcanadian.com/images/animated/provi/ca-flag1.gif">

        Comment

        • HungSolo
          Registered User
          • Dec 2002
          • 582
          #3
          routers?

            Comment

            • -=HOAX=-
              Confirmed User
              • Dec 2001
              • 4365
              #4
              One of the common aspects of these laws is that they make illegal any device or program that can "conceal or to assist another to conceal from any communication service provider or from any lawful authority the existence or place of origin or destination of any communication."
              Insert Value Here.

                Comment

                • smack
                  Push Porn Like Weight.
                  • Mar 2002
                  • 10652
                  #5
                  proxies gonna be next? this is gonna make home networking kinda hard.
                  Cry havoc and let slip the dogs of war.

                    Comment

                    • Kristoffer
                      So Fucking Banned
                      • Apr 2003
                      • 140
                      #6
                      you know the song that goes something like this; "in the land of the (something) and the home of the (somethin else) " ?

                        Comment

                        • Thorin
                          Registered User
                          • May 2002
                          • 44
                          #7
                          Yeah, this was on slashdot a while ago. Another case of moronic politicos passing legislation about things they know nothing about. Unfortunately we have to pay the price

                            Comment

                            • netstarz
                              Confirmed User
                              • Aug 2002
                              • 367
                              #8
                              Yet another GREAT Fucking reason to get out of Michigan! That's it! The final straw.............. I am out of here. What''s a good warm place to relocate? Any computer running widows xp has a firewall as part of the OS.
                              Kiss a piano player today

                                Comment

                                • gornyhuy
                                  Chafed.
                                  • May 2002
                                  • 18041
                                  #9
                                  This country is getting really fucked up.

                                  Everytime I turn around there is some other restriction on my "electronic rights" with some ridiculous penalty associated with everyday software and networking functionality.

                                  icq:159548293

                                    Comment

                                    • Lizzie
                                      Registered User
                                      • Apr 2002
                                      • 76
                                      #10
                                      Originally posted by asuna
                                      no law like this in canada
                                      <img src="http://canflag.ptbcanadian.com/images/animated/provi/ca-flag1.gif">
                                      Nope. Guess we live in the land of the .....
                                      Liz

                                        Comment

                                        • playa
                                          Confirmed User
                                          • Feb 2001
                                          • 6432
                                          #11
                                          classic example why you don't want government to regulate the internet.

                                          and you want the government to make a law about spam and it ends up being illegal to send emails period.

                                          just like how there trying to stop porn just to protect the "children" which btw, is comming to the supreme court again

                                            Comment

                                            • HungSolo
                                              Registered User
                                              • Dec 2002
                                              • 582
                                              #12
                                              How exactly is it infinging on our freedom to not be able to hide our identities? You cannot wallk on the streets with fake ID, why should we be able to surf the net with fake IDs?

                                                Comment

                                                • Libertine
                                                  sex dwarf
                                                  • May 2002
                                                  • 17860
                                                  #13
                                                  Originally posted by HungSolo
                                                  How exactly is it infinging on our freedom to not be able to hide our identities? You cannot wallk on the streets with fake ID, why should we be able to surf the net with fake IDs?
                                                  So, if the government would tell you to go live in a glass house with the doors permanently unlocked, you'd be okay with that?
                                                  /(bb|[^b]{2})/

                                                    Comment

                                                    • AdultNex
                                                      Confirmed User
                                                      • Feb 2003
                                                      • 8985
                                                      #14
                                                      That's bs.

                                                      I live in PA, and the bill was passed in 2000. I haven't even heard of this case before, so it looks like the government is really taking an aggressive scale on eliminating firewall applications.

                                                        Comment

                                                        • HungSolo
                                                          Registered User
                                                          • Dec 2002
                                                          • 582
                                                          #15
                                                          Originally posted by punkworld


                                                          So, if the government would tell you to go live in a glass house with the doors permanently unlocked, you'd be okay with that?
                                                          There are ways to protect your cpu and/or network without hiding your identity. Besides, if you own a home, it is a matter of public record that you own said home.

                                                            Comment

                                                            • Fletch XXX
                                                              GFY HALL OF FAME DAMMIT!!!
                                                              • Jan 2002
                                                              • 60840
                                                              #16
                                                              so can smoking and growing pot.

                                                              http://www.norml.com/index.cfm?Group_ID=3454

                                                              ;)

                                                              Want an Android App for your tube, membership, or free site?

                                                              Need banners or promo material? Hit us up (ICQ Fletch: 148841377) or email me fletchxxx at gmail.com - recent work - About me

                                                                Comment

                                                                • jreaka
                                                                  Confirmed User
                                                                  • Mar 2002
                                                                  • 1096
                                                                  #17
                                                                  Don't know........I am agoing to have to consult with AaronnM, he is up on the laws.

                                                                    Comment

                                                                    • Libertine
                                                                      sex dwarf
                                                                      • May 2002
                                                                      • 17860
                                                                      #18
                                                                      Originally posted by HungSolo


                                                                      There are ways to protect your cpu and/or network without hiding your identity. Besides, if you own a home, it is a matter of public record that you own said home.
                                                                      "to conceal from any communication service provider or from any lawful authority the <b>existence or place of origin or destination of any communication</b>"

                                                                      Read it, think about it, think about the implications.
                                                                      /(bb|[^b]{2})/

                                                                        Comment

                                                                        • HungSolo
                                                                          Registered User
                                                                          • Dec 2002
                                                                          • 582
                                                                          #19
                                                                          Originally posted by punkworld


                                                                          "to conceal from any communication service provider or from any lawful authority the <b>existence or place of origin or destination of any communication</b>"

                                                                          Read it, think about it, think about the implications.

                                                                          I honestly do not see why this would bother anyone that is not doing anything wrong. This would seriously hamper the efforts of spammers and people that have illegal stuff on their computers, though. If a police officer were to ask you on the street where you lived, you would be legally obligated to tell him... if he asked your name and age, you'd have to tell him.

                                                                            Comment

                                                                            • playa
                                                                              Confirmed User
                                                                              • Feb 2001
                                                                              • 6432
                                                                              #20
                                                                              Originally posted by HungSolo

                                                                              If a police officer were to ask you on the street where you lived, you would be legally obligated to tell him... if he asked your name and age, you'd have to tell him.

                                                                              your not obligated to tell him nothing,, its called the fifth amendment

                                                                              speaking of US law of course

                                                                                Comment

                                                                                • TheJimmy
                                                                                  ICQ- five seven 0 2 5 5 0
                                                                                  • Jan 2001
                                                                                  • 10747
                                                                                  #21
                                                                                  <img src="http://this-administration.blewme.com/consumeobey.gif">

                                                                                  Canada is looking more and more appealing every day...

                                                                                  Not because the US isn't worth fighting for, but because the majority of the fucking cows in our country don't give a shit anymore and go along with their elected leaders on stupid shit like this...

                                                                                  Investor with 5m - 15m USD to invest. Do you have a site or network of sites earning 50k - 200k a month income? Email your contact and preliminary data to: domain.cashventures (at) gmail.com....Please...no tire kickers...serious offers and inquiries only.

                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                    • tony299
                                                                                      lurker
                                                                                      • Aug 2002
                                                                                      • 57021
                                                                                      #22
                                                                                      Originally posted by playa



                                                                                      your not obligated to tell him nothing,, its called the fifth amendment

                                                                                      speaking of US law of course

                                                                                      Playa, i think that only counts if you are arrested. A police officer can ask to see your id and if you are not guilty why not tell him. I think the one good thing about stopping surfing invisible would do is stop friendly credit card fraud. If the ip can be tracked right to your address its alot harder to say it wasnt me.

                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                        • Libertine
                                                                                          sex dwarf
                                                                                          • May 2002
                                                                                          • 17860
                                                                                          #23
                                                                                          Originally posted by HungSolo



                                                                                          I honestly do not see why this would bother anyone that is not doing anything wrong. This would seriously hamper the efforts of spammers and people that have illegal stuff on their computers, though. If a police officer were to ask you on the street where you lived, you would be legally obligated to tell him... if he asked your name and age, you'd have to tell him.
                                                                                          You really don't get it, do you...

                                                                                          1: People doing illegal stuff WILL NOT be affected by this. They will do it illegally. Duh.
                                                                                          2: People doing legal stuff WILL be affected by this. It severely hinders the security of your computer and networks. You are now legally bound to "keep the door open" for hackers. Hackers, that will themselves not follow such laws, and will conceal their identity.

                                                                                          Now, when you say that there are alternatives, you are forgetting something - right now we do not have enough security. Hackers and even crackers can get into almost every network. Now, if you take away a large part of security, it is comparable to opening the doors to the bank and saying "come on in" to any and all possible robbers - right after firing all security guards and replacing the vault with a cardboard box with a sign on it saying "Do not touch - please... we beg you".
                                                                                          /(bb|[^b]{2})/

                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                            • TheJimmy
                                                                                              ICQ- five seven 0 2 5 5 0
                                                                                              • Jan 2001
                                                                                              • 10747
                                                                                              #24
                                                                                              Originally posted by tony404



                                                                                              Playa, i think that only counts if you are arrested. A police officer can ask to see your id and if you are not guilty why not tell him. I think the one good thing about stopping surfing invisible would do is stop friendly credit card fraud. If the ip can be tracked right to your address its alot harder to say it wasnt me.

                                                                                              so, you're willing to give up more of your privacy to our jack-booted thugs we call our leaders now?

                                                                                              fuck that, there are other ways of finding and prosecuting criminals...hiding behind a firewall or proxy is ludacris and can be uncovered pretty easily if the crime is serious enough to warrant it...


                                                                                              I guess you support the Patriot Act? lack of judicial oversight when it comes to watching our every move, purchase etc?


                                                                                              a fan of Total Information Awareness ?


                                                                                              ;-)


                                                                                              Just something to thing about man....
                                                                                              Investor with 5m - 15m USD to invest. Do you have a site or network of sites earning 50k - 200k a month income? Email your contact and preliminary data to: domain.cashventures (at) gmail.com....Please...no tire kickers...serious offers and inquiries only.

                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                • playa
                                                                                                  Confirmed User
                                                                                                  • Feb 2001
                                                                                                  • 6432
                                                                                                  #25
                                                                                                  Originally posted by tony404



                                                                                                  Playa, i think that only counts if you are arrested. A police officer can ask to see your id and if you are not guilty why not tell him. I think the one good thing about stopping surfing invisible would do is stop friendly credit card fraud. If the ip can be tracked right to your address its alot harder to say it wasnt me.
                                                                                                  no way man,, You do not have to say anything if you don't want too .. now the police can arrest you if they have reasonable suspicion and if you do not say anything than it's reasonable enough

                                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                                    • HungSolo
                                                                                                      Registered User
                                                                                                      • Dec 2002
                                                                                                      • 582
                                                                                                      #26
                                                                                                      Originally posted by punkworld


                                                                                                      You really don't get it, do you...

                                                                                                      1: People doing illegal stuff WILL NOT be affected by this. They will do it illegally. Duh.
                                                                                                      2: People doing legal stuff WILL be affected by this. It severely hinders the security of your computer and networks. You are now legally bound to "keep the door open" for hackers. Hackers, that will themselves not follow such laws, and will conceal their identity.

                                                                                                      Now, when you say that there are alternatives, you are forgetting something - right now we do not have enough security. Hackers and even crackers can get into almost every network. Now, if you take away a large part of security, it is comparable to opening the doors to the bank and saying "come on in" to any and all possible robbers - right after firing all security guards and replacing the vault with a cardboard box with a sign on it saying "Do not touch - please... we beg you".

                                                                                                      Routers offer protection without hiding identity. You are right, though that there is always a way to get at something if someone is determined enough. What the part of the law that you quoted says is not to hide your identity, not to go unprotected.


                                                                                                      And, yes Playa, the 5th only applies if you are being charged with a crime. US citizens are required to carry ID for many reasons, one of which is so that the law can know who you are.

                                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                                        • theking
                                                                                                          Nice Kitty
                                                                                                          • Sep 2002
                                                                                                          • 21053
                                                                                                          #27
                                                                                                          Originally posted by playa



                                                                                                          your not obligated to tell him nothing,, its called the fifth amendment

                                                                                                          speaking of US law of course
                                                                                                          Wrong. The 5th is not applicable in that scenario.
                                                                                                          When you're running down my country hoss...you're walking on the fighting side of me!

                                                                                                          FOR THE LYING LOWLIFE POSTING AS PATHFINDER...http://gfy.com/fucking-around-and-pr...athfinder.html

                                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                                            • HungSolo
                                                                                                              Registered User
                                                                                                              • Dec 2002
                                                                                                              • 582
                                                                                                              #28
                                                                                                              Originally posted by playa


                                                                                                              no way man,, You do not have to say anything if you don't want too .. now the police can arrest you if they have reasonable suspicion and if you do not say anything than it's reasonable enough
                                                                                                              You would be arrested for vagrancy until they could determine who you are.

                                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                                • Toker
                                                                                                                  Confirmed User
                                                                                                                  • Feb 2003
                                                                                                                  • 891
                                                                                                                  #29
                                                                                                                  Originally posted by playa



                                                                                                                  your not obligated to tell him nothing,, its called the fifth amendment

                                                                                                                  speaking of US law of course
                                                                                                                  You're right but you can't lie to him, only tell him nothing!
                                                                                                                  PeaceAlive and kicking

                                                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                                                    • playa
                                                                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                                                                      • Feb 2001
                                                                                                                      • 6432
                                                                                                                      #30
                                                                                                                      Originally posted by HungSolo

                                                                                                                      And, yes Playa, the 5th only applies if you are being charged with a crime. US citizens are required to carry ID for many reasons, one of which is so that the law can know who you are.

                                                                                                                      i am telling you can plea the fifth. You have the right not to self-incriminate yourself. Just because you are arrested or tooken in the police doesn't mean you are charged with a crime. No one can force you to talk

                                                                                                                      there is no law that says you have to have an ID. IE, kids under 16 that do not have Driver license don't have ID.

                                                                                                                      though it'll be hard to cash checks or buy alcohol

                                                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                                                        • theking
                                                                                                                          Nice Kitty
                                                                                                                          • Sep 2002
                                                                                                                          • 21053
                                                                                                                          #31
                                                                                                                          Originally posted by playa



                                                                                                                          i am telling you can plea the fifth. You have the right not to self-incriminate yourself. Just because you are arrested or tooken in the police doesn't mean you are charged with a crime. No one can force you to talk

                                                                                                                          there is no law that says you have to have an ID. IE, kids under 16 that do not have Driver license don't have ID.

                                                                                                                          though it'll be hard to cash checks or buy alcohol
                                                                                                                          You can refuse to identify yourself if you are willing to pay the consequences, but the 5th is not applicable.
                                                                                                                          When you're running down my country hoss...you're walking on the fighting side of me!

                                                                                                                          FOR THE LYING LOWLIFE POSTING AS PATHFINDER...http://gfy.com/fucking-around-and-pr...athfinder.html

                                                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                                                            • HungSolo
                                                                                                                              Registered User
                                                                                                                              • Dec 2002
                                                                                                                              • 582
                                                                                                                              #32
                                                                                                                              Originally posted by playa



                                                                                                                              i am telling you can plea the fifth. You have the right not to self-incriminate yourself. Just because you are arrested or tooken in the police doesn't mean you are charged with a crime. No one can force you to talk

                                                                                                                              there is no law that says you have to have an ID. IE, kids under 16 that do not have Driver license don't have ID.

                                                                                                                              though it'll be hard to cash checks or buy alcohol

                                                                                                                              http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitut...lofrights.html


                                                                                                                              Amendment V

                                                                                                                              No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a grand jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the militia, when in actual service in time of war or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

                                                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                                                • iroc409
                                                                                                                                  Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                  • Jan 2003
                                                                                                                                  • 4728
                                                                                                                                  #33
                                                                                                                                  Originally posted by HungSolo



                                                                                                                                  Routers offer protection without hiding identity. You are right, though that there is always a way to get at something if someone is determined enough. What the part of the law that you quoted says is not to hide your identity, not to go unprotected.


                                                                                                                                  And, yes Playa, the 5th only applies if you are being charged with a crime. US citizens are required to carry ID for many reasons, one of which is so that the law can know who you are.
                                                                                                                                  most routers and hardware firewalls these days use NAT, or nat combined with SPI or something.

                                                                                                                                  NAT by nature conceals the origination of the network traffic, an thus breaking the law.

                                                                                                                                  it's not hiding your identity, it's hiding your location.
                                                                                                                                  <a href="http://www.iroc409.com/"><img src="http://www.iroc409.com/adv/120x60.gif" border=0></a>


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                                                                                                                                    • HungSolo
                                                                                                                                      Registered User
                                                                                                                                      • Dec 2002
                                                                                                                                      • 582
                                                                                                                                      #34
                                                                                                                                      Originally posted by iroc409


                                                                                                                                      most routers and hardware firewalls these days use NAT, or nat combined with SPI or something.

                                                                                                                                      NAT by nature conceals the origination of the network traffic, an thus breaking the law.

                                                                                                                                      it's not hiding your identity, it's hiding your location.
                                                                                                                                      My router tells my IP. I bought the most common one.

                                                                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                                                                        • Libertine
                                                                                                                                          sex dwarf
                                                                                                                                          • May 2002
                                                                                                                                          • 17860
                                                                                                                                          #35
                                                                                                                                          Originally posted by HungSolo

                                                                                                                                          Routers offer protection without hiding identity. You are right, though that there is always a way to get at something if someone is determined enough. What the part of the law that you quoted says is not to hide your identity, not to go unprotected.
                                                                                                                                          No, that's not what it says. Read it again.
                                                                                                                                          /(bb|[^b]{2})/

                                                                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                                                                            • Libertine
                                                                                                                                              sex dwarf
                                                                                                                                              • May 2002
                                                                                                                                              • 17860
                                                                                                                                              #36
                                                                                                                                              HungSolo, just out of curiosity, what exactly is your knowledge of computer security? Are you a pro specializing in that area?
                                                                                                                                              /(bb|[^b]{2})/

                                                                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                                                                • HungSolo
                                                                                                                                                  Registered User
                                                                                                                                                  • Dec 2002
                                                                                                                                                  • 582
                                                                                                                                                  #37
                                                                                                                                                  Originally posted by punkworld


                                                                                                                                                  No, that's not what it says. Read it again.
                                                                                                                                                  Why don't you just tell me what it says, then? I can read english very well, and it tells me that they want to be able to find out who/where you are if needed. You are simply assuming that giving your location to the authorities will somehow compromise your 'virtual safety'.

                                                                                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                                                                                    • HungSolo
                                                                                                                                                      Registered User
                                                                                                                                                      • Dec 2002
                                                                                                                                                      • 582
                                                                                                                                                      #38
                                                                                                                                                      Originally posted by punkworld
                                                                                                                                                      HungSolo, just out of curiosity, what exactly is your knowledge of computer security? Are you a pro specializing in that area?
                                                                                                                                                      No, I am not a pro. Are you?

                                                                                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                                                                                        • Libertine
                                                                                                                                                          sex dwarf
                                                                                                                                                          • May 2002
                                                                                                                                                          • 17860
                                                                                                                                                          #39
                                                                                                                                                          Originally posted by HungSolo


                                                                                                                                                          No, I am not a pro. Are you?
                                                                                                                                                          Glad you asked. Yes, I am.

                                                                                                                                                          This is not about giving up valuable info to the authorities - it's about giving that info to everyone else. Since your network has no good way to distinguish the authorities from the rest of the world, the rest of the world can find out pretty easily any communication you send, if you send it, where you send it, and where you send it from (otherwise, the authorities couldn't do that either). Now, the only thing the hacker needs to do is find out <b>what</b> you are sending, which is a lot easier this way.
                                                                                                                                                          /(bb|[^b]{2})/

                                                                                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                                                                                            • HungSolo
                                                                                                                                                              Registered User
                                                                                                                                                              • Dec 2002
                                                                                                                                                              • 582
                                                                                                                                                              #40
                                                                                                                                                              Originally posted by punkworld


                                                                                                                                                              Glad you asked. Yes, I am.

                                                                                                                                                              This is not about giving up valuable info to the authorities - it's about giving that info to everyone else. Since your network has no good way to distinguish the authorities from the rest of the world, the rest of the world can find out pretty easily any communication you send, if you send it, where you send it, and where you send it from (otherwise, the authorities couldn't do that either). Now, the only thing the hacker needs to do is find out <b>what</b> you are sending, which is a lot easier this way.

                                                                                                                                                              What info being sent would be so hurtful? Credit Card info? If so, you are suggesting that people should accept credit cards 'blindly' for online transactions?

                                                                                                                                                              It has been my understanding that Firewalls were designed to keep people out of your system, not to hide/protect/encrypt info that you send out.

                                                                                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                                                                                • UnseenWorld
                                                                                                                                                                  Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                  • May 2001
                                                                                                                                                                  • 5279
                                                                                                                                                                  #41
                                                                                                                                                                  I'm not ready to take my firewall down yet. And in fact, having a router (necessary to have a network, no?) is effectively having a firewall in some sense, isn't it?
                                                                                                                                                                  SIG TOO BIG! Maximum 120x60 button and no more than 3 text lines of DEFAULT SIZE and COLOR. Unless your sig is for a GFY top banner sponsor, then you may use a 624x80 instead of a 120x60.

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                                                                                                                                                                    • iroc409
                                                                                                                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                      • Jan 2003
                                                                                                                                                                      • 4728
                                                                                                                                                                      #42
                                                                                                                                                                      Originally posted by HungSolo


                                                                                                                                                                      My router tells my IP. I bought the most common one.
                                                                                                                                                                      ok, look at it this way. you go down to best buy and get a netgear cable/dsl router, because you want to hook up 4 machines at home at the same time to your cable modem.

                                                                                                                                                                      so, you plug it in, and what happens?

                                                                                                                                                                      your modem takes your external ip that's visible to the world.

                                                                                                                                                                      the 4 internal computers have their own IP, that is HIDDEN from the outside world. the router translates the traffic from the inside network to the outside network (via NAT).

                                                                                                                                                                      now, magically the data's origin is hidden, which is against this law.

                                                                                                                                                                      to take it further, what if someone were hiding their identity by using a routing device to bounce the connetion from somewhere else? the data connection looks like it goes into your outside cable ip, and disappears.

                                                                                                                                                                      yay beer.
                                                                                                                                                                      <a href="http://www.iroc409.com/"><img src="http://www.iroc409.com/adv/120x60.gif" border=0></a>


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                                                                                                                                                                        • iroc409
                                                                                                                                                                          Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                          • Jan 2003
                                                                                                                                                                          • 4728
                                                                                                                                                                          #43
                                                                                                                                                                          Originally posted by UnseenWorld
                                                                                                                                                                          I'm not ready to take my firewall down yet. And in fact, having a router (necessary to have a network, no?) is effectively having a firewall in some sense, isn't it?
                                                                                                                                                                          yes, a router using NAT is a fairly effective firewall.
                                                                                                                                                                          <a href="http://www.iroc409.com/"><img src="http://www.iroc409.com/adv/120x60.gif" border=0></a>


                                                                                                                                                                          icq: 1 7 6 4 2 0 9 6 0
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                                                                                                                                                                            • Libertine
                                                                                                                                                                              sex dwarf
                                                                                                                                                                              • May 2002
                                                                                                                                                                              • 17860
                                                                                                                                                                              #44
                                                                                                                                                                              Originally posted by HungSolo

                                                                                                                                                                              What info being sent would be so hurtful? Credit Card info? If so, you are suggesting that people should accept credit cards 'blindly' for online transactions?
                                                                                                                                                                              Passwords, for example.

                                                                                                                                                                              Now, please do some reading on hacking and security, and learn a bit about this shit before starting arguments about things you very clearly have very limited knowledge of. There are a great number of things you don't seem to realize about network security, and one of them is that there is a huge difference between identification and communication online and offline.

                                                                                                                                                                              A good place to start reading:
                                                                                                                                                                              http://astalavista.com/library/basics/guides/
                                                                                                                                                                              /(bb|[^b]{2})/

                                                                                                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                                                                                                • HungSolo
                                                                                                                                                                                  Registered User
                                                                                                                                                                                  • Dec 2002
                                                                                                                                                                                  • 582
                                                                                                                                                                                  #45
                                                                                                                                                                                  Originally posted by punkworld


                                                                                                                                                                                  Passwords, for example.

                                                                                                                                                                                  Now, please do some reading on hacking and security, and learn a bit about this shit before starting arguments about things you very clearly have very limited knowledge of. There are a great number of things you don't seem to realize about network security, and one of them is that there is a huge difference between identification and communication online and offline.

                                                                                                                                                                                  A good place to start reading:
                                                                                                                                                                                  http://astalavista.com/library/basics/guides/
                                                                                                                                                                                  I never started an argument about the technical aspects of security. Re-read my second post, please.


                                                                                                                                                                                  On a sidenote, I find it very refreshing that we had this entire discussion without name calling. Thank you.

                                                                                                                                                                                  Thanks for the link, too.
                                                                                                                                                                                  Last edited by HungSolo; 04-23-2003, 02:46 PM.

                                                                                                                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                                                                                                                    • Libertine
                                                                                                                                                                                      sex dwarf
                                                                                                                                                                                      • May 2002
                                                                                                                                                                                      • 17860
                                                                                                                                                                                      #46
                                                                                                                                                                                      Originally posted by HungSolo

                                                                                                                                                                                      I never started an argument about the technical aspects of security. Re-read my second post, please.
                                                                                                                                                                                      The effects of this are technical. That's the whole problem, you assume things but fail to see the tech that lies behind it. The same mistake the lawmakers made, they thought "well, it can't be all that bad", but didn't have a clue as to the technical implications.
                                                                                                                                                                                      /(bb|[^b]{2})/

                                                                                                                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                                                                                                                        • HungSolo
                                                                                                                                                                                          Registered User
                                                                                                                                                                                          • Dec 2002
                                                                                                                                                                                          • 582
                                                                                                                                                                                          #47
                                                                                                                                                                                          Originally posted by punkworld


                                                                                                                                                                                          The effects of this are technical. That's the whole problem, you assume things but fail to see the tech that lies behind it. The same mistake the lawmakers made, they thought "well, it can't be all that bad", but didn't have a clue as to the technical implications.
                                                                                                                                                                                          There surely must be people on the government staff, though, that are professional hacking and security experts??

                                                                                                                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                                                                                                                            • Libertine
                                                                                                                                                                                              sex dwarf
                                                                                                                                                                                              • May 2002
                                                                                                                                                                                              • 17860
                                                                                                                                                                                              #48
                                                                                                                                                                                              Originally posted by HungSolo

                                                                                                                                                                                              On a sidenote, I find it very refreshing that we had this entire discussion without name calling. Thank you.

                                                                                                                                                                                              Thanks for the link, too.
                                                                                                                                                                                              Noob

                                                                                                                                                                                              The point about this is that indeed, if you look at it without the technical aspects, it doesn't seem all that bad. That's where the whole thing went wrong, lawmakers did the same thing.

                                                                                                                                                                                              Ofcourse, you are right that identification to the authorities shouldn't be a problem - but this is more than just identification to the authorities, unfortunately.
                                                                                                                                                                                              /(bb|[^b]{2})/

                                                                                                                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                                                                                                                • Libertine
                                                                                                                                                                                                  sex dwarf
                                                                                                                                                                                                  • May 2002
                                                                                                                                                                                                  • 17860
                                                                                                                                                                                                  #49
                                                                                                                                                                                                  Originally posted by HungSolo


                                                                                                                                                                                                  There surely must be people on the government staff, though, that are professional hacking and security experts??
                                                                                                                                                                                                  I somehow have my doubts toward that. It's like with that australian politician who spent 4 million on his website - most governments lack technological know-how. They don't understand the internet.
                                                                                                                                                                                                  /(bb|[^b]{2})/

                                                                                                                                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                                                                                                                                    • iroc409
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                                                      • Jan 2003
                                                                                                                                                                                                      • 4728
                                                                                                                                                                                                      #50
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Originally posted by HungSolo


                                                                                                                                                                                                      There surely must be people on the government staff, though, that are professional hacking and security experts??

                                                                                                                                                                                                      people on the government staff, yes.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      lawmakers, no.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      <a href="http://www.iroc409.com/"><img src="http://www.iroc409.com/adv/120x60.gif" border=0></a>


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