Proud to be an American?

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  • MagicksAntics
    Confirmed User
    • Feb 2002
    • 455

    #1

    Proud to be an American?

    You're damn right I am.

    Do I agree with everything the American government does? Nope. Do I think that we fuck up sometimes? Absolutely. But that doesn't change the fact that our government provides my family with the ability to live a life that is full of happiness and freedom.

    I can worship who or what I want to worship with no fear. Or I can choose to not worship at all.

    I can voice my opinion on our government actions and policies (be they pro or con) at any time without fear of agents beating down my door and arresting me.

    I can eat a grape at the local supermarket without paying for it and not be afraid I'm going to get my hand cut off in a public square in front of my children for theft.

    I can listen to rock and roll, jazz, rap, or any other music without getting thrown in a government prison accused of treason.

    I can be gay, straight, bisexual, or a fucking nun, monk, or priest.

    I can walk down the street with the sun on my face and speak without being spoken to. My daughters can do the same.

    My husband can shave...or not. His choice.

    My daughters can grow up to be doctors, lawyers, politicians, or pornographers for that matter. They have a choice.

    I can say "FUCK" in a public place and the worst that happens is a couple dirty looks.

    The list could go on and on...all the little freedoms that I have that make my freedom precious.

    So am I proud to be an American? You're goddamn right I am. I may not agree with all of our policies, procedures, and actions, but that doesn't change the fact that my country provides to me, and more importantly to my children, the ability to live a fulfilling life.

    Americans are going to die in this war. Thank you to the men and women who are in our military, willing to risk their lives to provide myself, my family, and my friends with a life that is worth living. My respect is yours.




    He whos country has not fucked up cast the first stone.


    <br><br><br><br>
  • juicylinks
    So Fucking Banned
    • Apr 2001
    • 122992

    #2
    Too long to read

    Comment

    • Kimmykim
      bitchslapping zebras!!!!!
      • Jun 2001
      • 16015

      #3
      Well said sweetie, but you need to stop stealing grapes ;)

      Comment

      • Sly_RJ
        Live Hard - Die Hard
        • Feb 2002
        • 17042

        #4


        I can already here little feet running in here, just waiting to lash out on "American freedoms" once again. Fuck them.
        PHAT SERVERS - Quality dedicated hosting at a quality price!
        sly AT phatservers DOT com - 147479144

        Comment

        • p00p
          Confirmed User
          • Dec 2002
          • 5125

          #5
          Me too! God Bless Canamerica!
          ICQ: 316365783
          <a href="http://www.hostultra.com/~p00p" target="_blank">TEST</a>

          Comment

          • TheSenator
            Too lazy to set a custom title
            • Feb 2003
            • 13330

            #6
            FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK......lalalalala.....FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK.....lalalalala.....FUCK, FUCK, FUCK, FUCK......

            PROUD TO BE AN AMERICAN!
            ISeekGirls.com since 2005

            Comment

            • PattyeCake*
              Confirmed User
              • Jul 2001
              • 843

              #7
              Originally posted by MagicksAntics
              You're damn right I am.

              Do I agree with everything the American government does? Nope. Do I think that we fuck up sometimes? Absolutely. But that doesn't change the fact that our government provides my family with the ability to live a life that is full of happiness and freedom.

              I can worship who or what I want to worship with no fear. Or I can choose to not worship at all.

              I can voice my opinion on our government actions and policies (be they pro or con) at any time without fear of agents beating down my door and arresting me.

              I can eat a grape at the local supermarket without paying for it and not be afraid I'm going to get my hand cut off in a public square in front of my children for theft.

              I can listen to rock and roll, jazz, rap, or any other music without getting thrown in a government prison accused of treason.

              I can be gay, straight, bisexual, or a fucking nun, monk, or priest.

              I can walk down the street with the sun on my face and speak without being spoken to. My daughters can do the same.

              My husband can shave...or not. His choice.

              My daughters can grow up to be doctors, lawyers, politicians, or pornographers for that matter. They have a choice.

              I can say "FUCK" in a public place and the worst that happens is a couple dirty looks.

              The list could go on and on...all the little freedoms that I have that make my freedom precious.

              So am I proud to be an American? You're goddamn right I am. I may not agree with all of our policies, procedures, and actions, but that doesn't change the fact that my country provides to me, and more importantly to my children, the ability to live a fulfilling life.

              Americans are going to die in this war. Thank you to the men and women who are in our military, willing to risk their lives to provide myself, my family, and my friends with a life that is worth living. My respect is yours.




              He whos country has not fucked up cast the first stone.


              <br><br><br><br>

              Amen
              Big Hugs to ALL!
              PattyeCake*

              Make MORE with your sites with Rabbit's Reviews!!

              AND don't forget!!!!

              Help a Child

              Comment

              • ElvisManson
                Looking California
                • Feb 2001
                • 5476

                #8
                Originally posted by Kimmykim
                Well said sweetie, but you need to stop stealing grapes ;)
                LMAO..

                Good call Di.

                Comment

                • MagicksAntics
                  Confirmed User
                  • Feb 2002
                  • 455

                  #9
                  Originally posted by juicylinks
                  Too long to read
                  This may help:

                  http://www.chadd.org/

                  Comment

                  • MagicksAntics
                    Confirmed User
                    • Feb 2002
                    • 455

                    #10
                    Originally posted by Kimmykim
                    Well said sweetie, but you need to stop stealing grapes ;)
                    Hey...you have to live on the edge once in awhile

                    Comment

                    • LeeNoga
                      Confirmed User
                      • Jul 2001
                      • 3043

                      #11
                      Yeah, what magic said.....

                      I still say people should just go on with their lives, the shit is on, the news is everywhere so stop being glued to CNN 24/7. Love your kids & family, and say a little prayer for those you know that were sent over....

                      As any lengthy news event goes, it makes people nuts who become addicts.

                      I mean really what can you do now....except pray for a short war and economic recovery.

                      Work on getting more sites up, so many say traffic/sales are either down or way up since the threat of war, alot of net news surfing is leading them to XXX member sites....thats what some brag on other boards....

                      Comment

                      • JohnIP
                        Registered User
                        • Oct 2002
                        • 30

                        #12
                        Originally posted by MagicksAntics
                        I can say "FUCK" in a public place and the worst that happens is a couple dirty looks.

                        <br><br><br><br>
                        This apparently goes for the work place too...but I use my boot;)...and I think here in Georgia Grape stealing is at least a day in the pokey.
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                        • JohnIP
                          Registered User
                          • Oct 2002
                          • 30

                          #13
                          Originally posted by JohnIP


                          This apparently goes for the work place too...but I use my boot;)...and I think here in Georgia Grape stealing is at least a day in the pokey.
                          Actually Diane reminds me that I ave a masters in the inflected use of the word;)
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                          Comment

                          • Kimmykim
                            bitchslapping zebras!!!!!
                            • Jun 2001
                            • 16015

                            #14
                            Originally posted by MagicksAntics


                            Hey...you have to live on the edge once in awhile
                            Don't you get me started, sistah!

                            Comment

                            • directfiesta
                              Too lazy to set a custom title
                              • Oct 2002
                              • 30184

                              #15
                              Originally posted by juicylinks
                              Too long to read
                              That's a real american
                              I know that Asspimple is stoopid ... As he says, it is a FACT !

                              But I can't figure out how he can breathe or type , at the same time ....

                              Comment

                              • PattyeCake*
                                Confirmed User
                                • Jul 2001
                                • 843

                                #16
                                KimmyKim....

                                what happens in Aly's room...

                                STAYS in Aly's room! LMAO!


                                Manwich, it's not just a sandwich... it's a MEAL!
                                Big Hugs to ALL!
                                PattyeCake*

                                Make MORE with your sites with Rabbit's Reviews!!

                                AND don't forget!!!!

                                Help a Child

                                Comment

                                • MagicksAntics
                                  Confirmed User
                                  • Feb 2002
                                  • 455

                                  #17
                                  Originally posted by PattyeCake*

                                  Manwich, it's not just a sandwich... it's a MEAL!

                                  bwahahahaaaaa!!!

                                  Comment

                                  • funkmaster
                                    So Fucking Banned
                                    • Sep 2001
                                    • 7938

                                    #18
                                    "He whos country has not fucked up cast the first stone."

                                    ... must be greenland I suppose !!

                                    Comment

                                    • MagicksAntics
                                      Confirmed User
                                      • Feb 2002
                                      • 455

                                      #19
                                      Originally posted by funkmaster
                                      "He whos country has not fucked up cast the first stone."

                                      ... must be greenland I suppose !!
                                      http://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_of_Greenland

                                      LOL

                                      Comment

                                      • DearAbby
                                        Confirmed User
                                        • Nov 2002
                                        • 979

                                        #20
                                        USA! USA! USA!

                                        Comment

                                        • Rochard
                                          Jägermeister Test Pilot
                                          • Dec 2001
                                          • 75762

                                          #21
                                          "I can eat a grape at the local supermarket without paying for it and not be afraid I'm going to get my hand cut off in a public square in front of my children for theft......"

                                          Have you test this concept yet?
                                          Herschel Savage
                                          Brooklyn, NY

                                          Comment

                                          • Giorgio_Xo
                                            Confirmed User
                                            • Mar 2003
                                            • 4263

                                            #22
                                            Originally posted by MagicksAntics
                                            You're damn right I am.

                                            Do I agree with everything the American government does? Nope. Do I think that we fuck up sometimes? Absolutely. But that doesn't change the fact that our government provides my family with the ability to live a life that is full of happiness and freedom.

                                            I can worship who or what I want to worship with no fear. Or I can choose to not worship at all.

                                            I can voice my opinion on our government actions and policies (be they pro or con) at any time without fear of agents beating down my door and arresting me.

                                            I can eat a grape at the local supermarket without paying for it and not be afraid I'm going to get my hand cut off in a public square in front of my children for theft.

                                            I can listen to rock and roll, jazz, rap, or any other music without getting thrown in a government prison accused of treason.

                                            I can be gay, straight, bisexual, or a fucking nun, monk, or priest.

                                            I can walk down the street with the sun on my face and speak without being spoken to. My daughters can do the same.

                                            My husband can shave...or not. His choice.

                                            My daughters can grow up to be doctors, lawyers, politicians, or pornographers for that matter. They have a choice.

                                            I can say "FUCK" in a public place and the worst that happens is a couple dirty looks.

                                            The list could go on and on...all the little freedoms that I have that make my freedom precious.

                                            So am I proud to be an American? You're goddamn right I am. I may not agree with all of our policies, procedures, and actions, but that doesn't change the fact that my country provides to me, and more importantly to my children, the ability to live a fulfilling life.

                                            Americans are going to die in this war. Thank you to the men and women who are in our military, willing to risk their lives to provide myself, my family, and my friends with a life that is worth living. My respect is yours.




                                            He whos country has not fucked up cast the first stone.


                                            <br><br><br><br>
                                            You can't nail a chick in the ass in Georgia tho...
                                            Make Levees, Not War

                                            Comment

                                            • MagicksAntics
                                              Confirmed User
                                              • Feb 2002
                                              • 455

                                              #23
                                              Originally posted by RocHard
                                              "I can eat a grape at the local supermarket without paying for it and not be afraid I'm going to get my hand cut off in a public square in front of my children for theft......"

                                              Have you test this concept yet?
                                              More often than I care to admit


                                              Originally posted by Giorgio_Xo
                                              "You can't nail a chick in the ass in Georgia tho..."
                                              I beg to differ

                                              Comment

                                              • Aly-Python
                                                Confirmed User
                                                • Mar 2002
                                                • 1439

                                                #24
                                                You steal grapes AND swear in public places?!

                                                THAT'S IT! Someone arrest this woman!
                                                (Then send her my way for appropriate disciplinary action.)

                                                SIG TOO BIG! Maximum 120x60 button and no more than 3 text lines of DEFAULT SIZE and COLOR. Unless your sig is for a GFY top banner sponsor, then you may use a 624x80 instead of a 120x60.

                                                Comment

                                                • sherie
                                                  Confirmed User
                                                  • Feb 2002
                                                  • 7020

                                                  #25
                                                  Originally posted by juicylinks
                                                  Too long to read
                                                  Your attention span cannot be that bad! It was a great read, I suggest you take the time out of your busy posting schedule and read it!
                                                  AIM sherierocks
                                                  ICQ 127-296-286
                                                  Skype traffichor

                                                  Comment

                                                  • Kimmykim
                                                    bitchslapping zebras!!!!!
                                                    • Jun 2001
                                                    • 16015

                                                    #26
                                                    Originally posted by Aly-Python
                                                    You steal grapes AND swear in public places?!

                                                    THAT'S IT! Someone arrest this woman!
                                                    (Then send her my way for appropriate disciplinary action.)

                                                    Oh you soooo wish, don't you ;)

                                                    Comment

                                                    • sweetums
                                                      Confirmed User
                                                      • Feb 2003
                                                      • 2534

                                                      #27
                                                      Originally posted by Aly-Python
                                                      You steal grapes AND swear in public places?!

                                                      THAT'S IT! Someone arrest this woman!
                                                      (Then send her my way for appropriate disciplinary action.)


                                                      Aly....not before she gets sent my way!!! Dang it all...miss my sistahs

                                                      All you stay safe...hopefully, this will be over soon...

                                                      *Hugs*
                                                      ICQ: 114549321

                                                      Comment

                                                      • Libertine
                                                        sex dwarf
                                                        • May 2002
                                                        • 17860

                                                        #28
                                                        Take pride in your actions, not in your coincidences.
                                                        /(bb|[^b]{2})/

                                                        Comment

                                                        • MagicksAntics
                                                          Confirmed User
                                                          • Feb 2002
                                                          • 455

                                                          #29
                                                          Originally posted by punkworld
                                                          Take pride in your actions, not in your coincidences.
                                                          Interesting statement...care to elaborate?

                                                          Comment

                                                          • mika
                                                            Confirmed User
                                                            • Sep 2001
                                                            • 1561

                                                            #30
                                                            Not sure what HE means, but to me it sounds something like why be proud of something that is based on pure luck (=place of your birth)?

                                                            Your actions are not based (solely) on luck and coincidence

                                                            Comment

                                                            • MagicksAntics
                                                              Confirmed User
                                                              • Feb 2002
                                                              • 455

                                                              #31
                                                              Originally posted by mika
                                                              Not sure what HE means, but to me it sounds something like why be proud of something that is based on pure luck (=place of your birth)?

                                                              Your actions are not based (solely) on luck and coincidence
                                                              That doesn't make any sense...if that were the case, then we could be proud of absolutely nothing. Our entire lives are shaped by where we are born. The same person that was born in Chechnya would be a completely different person if he had been born in London, Paris, Montreal, or anywhere on earth. Different teachings, different educations, etc.

                                                              Any successes that you accomplish in your life are all coincidences. Depending on where you were born, you would act upon opportunities presented to you differently. Not only that, but the opportunites themselves would be different as well.

                                                              So how can it be said that we can basically be proud of nothing...not even ourselves?
                                                              <br><br><br>

                                                              Comment

                                                              • mika
                                                                Confirmed User
                                                                • Sep 2001
                                                                • 1561

                                                                #32
                                                                Of course your decisions matter. You can guide your life and be proud of your actions.. If you disagree, this world will become ridiculously absurd for you. Like you said, everything would become a coincidence. Not too realistic

                                                                However, you CANNOT affect the place of your birth, your parents, childhood etc. Thus, to some extent you cannot affect many aspects of your life. But within the framework that you are given, you are pretty free to live your life and take a stand

                                                                Comment

                                                                • TheLastReploid
                                                                  Registered User
                                                                  • Mar 2003
                                                                  • 56

                                                                  #33
                                                                  Well put.
                                                                  No matter how I might disagree with the war we're in, the good here FAR outweighs the bad, and I could never look poorly on our country as a whole.


                                                                  http://www.Fluffersmut.com -- You know you dig the fluffer.

                                                                  Comment

                                                                  • Sly_RJ
                                                                    Live Hard - Die Hard
                                                                    • Feb 2002
                                                                    • 17042

                                                                    #34
                                                                    Originally posted by punkworld
                                                                    Take pride in your actions, not in your coincidences.
                                                                    Who said she wasn't proud of her actions as an American?
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                                                                    Comment

                                                                    • Libertine
                                                                      sex dwarf
                                                                      • May 2002
                                                                      • 17860

                                                                      #35
                                                                      Originally posted by MagicksAntics


                                                                      That doesn't make any sense...if that were the case, then we could be proud of absolutely nothing. Our entire lives are shaped by where we are born. The same person that was born in Chechnya would be a completely different person if he had been born in London, Paris, Montreal, or anywhere on earth. Different teachings, different educations, etc.

                                                                      Any successes that you accomplish in your life are all coincidences. Depending on where you were born, you would act upon opportunities presented to you differently. Not only that, but the opportunites themselves would be different as well.

                                                                      So how can it be said that we can basically be proud of nothing...not even ourselves?
                                                                      <br><br><br>
                                                                      I have no intention of repeating the whole determinism vs. non-determinism debate of the past few thousand years for you. If you do not want to believe you possess free will, that's your problem. Reading into Kant a bit might be a good idea though. He has a few good arguments for free will, of which one is inescapable.

                                                                      However, the idea of being proud of one's country is flawed in many more ways. I do not care enough to write it all down though.
                                                                      /(bb|[^b]{2})/

                                                                      Comment

                                                                      • Libertine
                                                                        sex dwarf
                                                                        • May 2002
                                                                        • 17860

                                                                        #36
                                                                        Originally posted by Sly_RJ

                                                                        Who said she wasn't proud of her actions as an American?
                                                                        Since she didn't mention those, I see no point in debating that matter.
                                                                        /(bb|[^b]{2})/

                                                                        Comment

                                                                        • MagicksAntics
                                                                          Confirmed User
                                                                          • Feb 2002
                                                                          • 455

                                                                          #37
                                                                          Originally posted by punkworld


                                                                          I have no intention of repeating the whole determinism vs. non-determinism debate of the past few thousand years for you. If you do not want to believe you possess free will, that's your problem. Reading into Kant a bit might be a good idea though. He has a few good arguments for free will, of which one is inescapable.

                                                                          However, the idea of being proud of one's country is flawed in many more ways. I do not care enough to write it all down though.
                                                                          LOL Ok Punkworld...you are entitled to your opinion...no need to get defensive

                                                                          But your interpretation of my post was flawed. I do believe in free will. However, what happens as a result of our free will is directly affected by our environment as well as the opportunities we are presented with. Our environment is directly connected to where we are born.

                                                                          I find the writings of the Prussian philosopher interesting as well...right along with the writings of Plato, Aristotle, Descartes, and others. But thanks for the suggestion If you have any other suggestions for authors I would genuinely like to hear them.

                                                                          On another note, here is something to make this thread a little more interesting:





                                                                          <br><br><br>

                                                                          Comment

                                                                          • MagicksAntics
                                                                            Confirmed User
                                                                            • Feb 2002
                                                                            • 455

                                                                            #38
                                                                            Originally posted by Sly_RJ

                                                                            Who said she wasn't proud of her actions as an American?
                                                                            LOL thanks Sly_RJ...nice to know somebody actually understood my post

                                                                            Comment

                                                                            • Libertine
                                                                              sex dwarf
                                                                              • May 2002
                                                                              • 17860

                                                                              #39
                                                                              Originally posted by MagicksAntics


                                                                              LOL Ok Punkworld...you are entitled to your opinion...no need to get defensive

                                                                              But your interpretation of my post was flawed. I do believe in free will. However, what happens as a result of our free will is directly affected by our environment as well as the opportunities we are presented with. Our environment is directly connected to where we are born.

                                                                              I find the writings of the Prussian philosopher interesting as well...right along with the writings of Plato, Aristotle, Descartes, and others. But thanks for the suggestion If you have any other suggestions for authors I would genuinely like to hear them.

                                                                              On another note, here is something to make this thread a little more interesting:



                                                                              <br><br><br>
                                                                              How can free will exist if it is fully determined by other factors? In that case, it would be a mechanism, not free will.
                                                                              If it is, however, not fully determined by other factors, it makes little sense to take pride in the coincidences we happen upon, since those are not our doing.

                                                                              Oh, and about authors: From the authors you named, it looks like you've mostly focused on the older parts of philosophy. There is however quite a bit of newer stuff you might enjoy.
                                                                              For ethics (which is most closely related to the discussion at hand) I would suggest Dworkin (goes deeply into the subject of free will vs determism in "The theory and practice of autonomy"), Korsgaard, Moore, Ross, Rawls (postulates a very interesting new foundation for semi-objective ethics), Nozick (his answer to Rawls' idea of the veil of ignorance is simply fantastic). For an overview of ethics you could try Sidgwick (a bit dated, but still good), Singer or Rachels (short but good, although not quite objective).
                                                                              For other subjects a few good ones are Latour, Habermas, Foucault, Rorty, Dennett, Feenberg, Beck, Popper, Quine, Chalmers, Marcuse, Wittgenstein, Nagel, Carnap, Weber, Smullyan, Russel, Searle, Axelrod, Lyotard, Benjamin, Adorno, Baudrillard, Durkheim, Haraway.
                                                                              /(bb|[^b]{2})/

                                                                              Comment

                                                                              • Libertine
                                                                                sex dwarf
                                                                                • May 2002
                                                                                • 17860

                                                                                #40
                                                                                Originally posted by MagicksAntics


                                                                                LOL thanks Sly_RJ...nice to know somebody actually understood my post
                                                                                Then where exactly did your actions come into play in that post?

                                                                                "So am I proud to be an American? You're goddamn right I am. I may not agree with all of our policies, procedures, and actions, but that doesn't change the fact that my country provides to me, and more importantly to my children, the ability to live a fulfilling life. "

                                                                                What did you do to create that country? Did you write the constitution, make the laws, rule the country or do any other thing that made the country into what it is, apart from coincidentally being born there and living by the rules that were given to you?
                                                                                /(bb|[^b]{2})/

                                                                                Comment

                                                                                • MagicksAntics
                                                                                  Confirmed User
                                                                                  • Feb 2002
                                                                                  • 455

                                                                                  #41
                                                                                  I'm not to argue with you punkworld, you are obviously much smarter and more enlightened than I.

                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                  • adamneve
                                                                                    LIVING LA VITA LOCA
                                                                                    • Oct 2002
                                                                                    • 13333

                                                                                    #42
                                                                                    Originally posted by MagicksAntics



                                                                                    On another note, here is something to make this thread a little more interesting:





                                                                                    <br><br><br>
                                                                                    ThickCash.com - Premium Network

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                                                                                    Telegram: @adamsc23

                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                    • Aly-Python
                                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                                      • Mar 2002
                                                                                      • 1439

                                                                                      #43
                                                                                      Originally posted by MagicksAntics
                                                                                      I'm not to argue with you punkworld, you are obviously much smarter and more enlightened than I.

                                                                                      AAAAAAWWWW!!! You're not?! Too damn bad! This debate is rather gripping!

                                                                                      Thanks to both of you for that! LOL

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                                                                                      • CDSmith
                                                                                        Too lazy to set a custom title
                                                                                        • May 2001
                                                                                        • 51460

                                                                                        #44
                                                                                        Originally posted by p00p
                                                                                        Me too! God Bless Canamerica!
                                                                                        p00p for president!!
                                                                                        Promote Wildmatch, ImLive, Sexier.com, and more!!

                                                                                        ALWAYS THE HIGHEST PAYOUTS: Big Bux/ImLive SIGNUP ON NOW!!!

                                                                                        Put some PUSSYCA$H in your pocket.
                                                                                        ICQ me at: 31024634

                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                        • MagicksAntics
                                                                                          Confirmed User
                                                                                          • Feb 2002
                                                                                          • 455

                                                                                          #45
                                                                                          Originally posted by Aly-Python


                                                                                          AAAAAAWWWW!!! You're not?! Too damn bad! This debate is rather gripping!

                                                                                          Thanks to both of you for that! LOL

                                                                                          Nope ;) I never argue simply for the sake of arguing...it's a waste of time and energy. If I expect people to respect my opinion, then I have to respect theirs as well But you are more than welcome to take up where I left off! I would love to see you get into a good piss hehehe


                                                                                          adamneve, you liked that eh? Here's another one for you




                                                                                          Heh if you keep posting we may make it through the whole set

                                                                                          Comment

                                                                                          • jas1552
                                                                                            Confirmed User
                                                                                            • May 2002
                                                                                            • 1462

                                                                                            #46
                                                                                            Hmm... Are we allowed to be proud of America and glad to be american?

                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                            • xdcdave
                                                                                              Confirmed User
                                                                                              • Feb 2003
                                                                                              • 1911

                                                                                              #47

                                                                                              Comment

                                                                                              Working...