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#1

serious post. NSF checks.

02-14-2003, 10:03 PM

Ok..

I am getting rapped on check signups. seriously.

Should I get rid of them all together? I dont do anything but monthly on checks.. and when they come back returned, or NSF, declined or whatever.. I get fucked. we are talking about 2k a week in bad checks..

The upside.. I also have alot of successful signups with checks that DONT come back NSF, but I am thinking that even though they prefer using a check.. If I do not offer that option they will whip out the credit card no?

IS there a place that can scrub a bit better? or some solution to eliminating(or minimizing) this loss?
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Brown Bear

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#2

02-14-2003, 10:06 PM

you're gettin 2000 bad checks a week? or $2000 in NSF fees a week?

Surrender all your independent thinking and Click Here for re-programming.
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#3

02-14-2003, 10:07 PM

I would love to see your postcount for all combined versions of Pimpdog.
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#4

02-14-2003, 10:07 PM

Dropped checks a long time ago. Nothing but a pain in the ass.
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#5

02-14-2003, 10:08 PM

Fuck Off..I hate people that grab a wad of cash and wave it in the air..

YOUR INFORMATION HERE
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#6

02-14-2003, 10:09 PM

Ged rid of them.
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#7

02-14-2003, 10:11 PM

Probilling offers a new online check system...
http://www.probilling.com/documents/directCheck.cfm

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#8

02-14-2003, 10:12 PM

spunky1 I am not bragging about anything at all.. I am actually very pissed off about it. I am complaining like a, lil bitch..

yea I get around 2k a week in checks (from members) that signup to one of my sites.. and a few days later I get a post back from my processor saying that particualr member can not be charged.. reason varies.. but I am losing my ass on paying affiliates for the signup.. and then the signup turns out to be unbillable.

I was just msg'd on ICQ by a good friend that suggested I put a delay on check signups.

not giving the member access till the check clears, and also not giving credit to the affiliate till the check clears.. seems to make perfect sense to me... If it dont clear nobody gets paid. Inclusing me.
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#9

02-14-2003, 10:19 PM

Originally posted by p`mpd0g
.....not giving the member access till the check clears, and also not giving credit to the affiliate till the check clears.. seems to make perfect sense to me... If it dont clear nobody gets paid. Inclusing me.

I've heard of this before, and the best solution I heard of was the last one you mentioned....

Investor with 5m - 15m USD to invest. Do you have a site or network of sites earning 50k - 200k a month income? Email your contact and preliminary data to: domain.cashventures (at) gmail.com....Please...no tire kickers...serious offers and inquiries only.
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#10

02-14-2003, 10:22 PM

40% of my check signups are bad, I dont pay any NSF fees and when they are returend myself and the affiliate take the hit.

I have tons of check signups that have been recurring for 7 months, I think that i'll keep checks for now

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#11

02-14-2003, 10:25 PM

Originally posted by EscortBiz
40% of my check signups are bad, I dont pay any NSF fees and when they are returend myself and the affiliate take the hit.

I have tons of check signups that have been recurring for 7 months, I think that i'll keep checks for now

exactly.. I dont want to eliminate that income.. But it needs to be overhauled and perfected..

making them wait till it clears is the only solution without getting rid of the option to join with a check.

3 day wait isnt so bad.. if they want it that bad, they can get a creditcard from their wallet.. other wise, they can wait.

glad i started this thread.
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chupacabra

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#12

02-14-2003, 10:27 PM

we quit taking online checks over a year ago, over the course of 9 months we were seeing a 60-70% rate of returned (bad) check transactions, total bullshit, and not worth our lost bandwidth for the few that turned out to be valid... thieving fuckers..

...promise her a defamation, tell her where the rain will fall..
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#13

02-14-2003, 10:32 PM

2000 bad check signups a week? I find that kinda hard to believe. I find it hard to believe that you would even be doing 2000 check sign ups total (with both good and bad checks). For most paysites that use checking account billing as an option, check signups only make up about 10% of their total sales.

So assuming check signups are only 10% of your sales, that would mean you are doing over 20,000 sign-ups a week (2,857 a day).

Even assuming check signups were 20% of your total sales, that would mean you would be doing over 10,000 sales a week (1,428 a day).

There aren't many affiliate programs that do that many signups a day. Thats why it makes your claim a little unlikely.

So are you really sure you get that many bad check signups a week?

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#14

02-14-2003, 10:34 PM

Originally posted by Brown Bear
2000 bad check signups a week? I find that kinda hard to believe. I find it hard to believe that you would even be doing 2000 check sign ups total (with both good and bad checks). For most paysites that use checking account billing as an option, check signups only make up about 10% of their total sales.

So assuming check signups are only 10% of your sales, that would mean you are doing over 20,000 sign-ups a week (2,857 a day).

Even assuming check signups were 20% of your total sales, that would mean you would be doing over 10,000 sales a week (1,428 a day).

There aren't many affiliate programs that do that many signups a day. Thats why it makes your claim a little unlikely.

So are you really sure you get that many bad check signups a week?

I thought he meant 2k dollars worth of

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#15

02-14-2003, 10:37 PM

Originally posted by Brown Bear
2000 bad check signups a week? I find that kinda hard to believe. I find it hard to believe that you would even be doing 2000 check sign ups total (with both good and bad checks). For most paysites that use checking account billing as an option, check signups only make up about 10% of their total sales.

So assuming check signups are only 10% of your sales, that would mean you are doing over 20,000 sign-ups a week (2,857 a day).

Even assuming check signups were 20% of your total sales, that would mean you would be doing over 10,000 sales a week (1,428 a day).

There aren't many affiliate programs that do that many signups a day. Thats why it makes your claim a little unlikely.

So are you really sure you get that many bad check signups a week?

lol i wish man.

I mean $2k worth of bad checks.. not 2k signups.
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#16

02-14-2003, 10:41 PM

Originally posted by p`mpd0g

lol i wish man.

I mean $2k worth of bad checks.. not 2k signups.

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#17

02-14-2003, 10:56 PM

Originally posted by p`mpd0g

exactly.. I dont want to eliminate that income.. But it needs to be overhauled and perfected..

making them wait till it clears is the only solution without getting rid of the option to join with a check.

3 day wait isnt so bad.. if they want it that bad, they can get a creditcard from their wallet.. other wise, they can wait.

glad i started this thread.

Yeah, I agree with you on that. I've seen some sites where it's a little cheaper to sign-up by check, but you that waiting period. Sometimes the $5 or so less rather than using a credit card is worth it to the surfer.

Good thread BTW.

Fuseblown
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#18

02-14-2003, 11:16 PM

I love how you now have to introduce your threads as "serious posts" when you need something. Hehe....

Ok, well, I would suggest the delay on the check processing but this might deter surfers from signing up. After all, the whole idea behind the sales is getting a surfer aroused, wet and to then get their payment and give them "instant access". Impose a clearance time and this might really piss off the surfer. Just something you might want to consider since it could affect sales...

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#19

02-14-2003, 11:25 PM

Originally posted by p`mpd0g
Ok..

I am getting rapped on check signups. seriously.

Should I get rid of them all together? I dont do anything but monthly on checks.. and when they come back returned, or NSF, declined or whatever.. I get fucked. we are talking about 2k a week in bad checks..

The upside.. I also have alot of successful signups with checks that DONT come back NSF, but I am thinking that even though they prefer using a check.. If I do not offer that option they will whip out the credit card no?

IS there a place that can scrub a bit better? or some solution to eliminating(or minimizing) this loss?

I know the feeling. its usually the same scamming freeloaders getting into the site with bullshit checking info. I have blocked a shitload of ip's but they usually figure out a way to get in. Not too long ago someone from netbilling said they can actually check to see if the account had money in it the night before, that would pretty much solve everything right there. Probably 98% of the checks that you think are comming back NSF are not even a real bank account.

Date Range: 2002-12-15 to 2003-02-15

Site Location: Transactions help

Title Quantity Amount

SubAccount: 0000 New Recurring Sales 830 25,671.70
New Regular Sales 0 0.00
Rebilling Customers 433 13,105.67
Refunds 24 719.76
Returns 488 15,295.12
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#20

02-14-2003, 11:29 PM

OK. Carry on your pimpin duties, and remember....Domokun is watching.

Domo, Domo... hentai tetsugako..!

...promise her a defamation, tell her where the rain will fall..
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#21

02-14-2003, 11:47 PM

Originally posted by WiredGuy
I love how you now have to introduce your threads as "serious posts" when you need something. Hehe....

Ok, well, I would suggest the delay on the check processing but this might deter surfers from signing up. After all, the whole idea behind the sales is getting a surfer aroused, wet and to then get their payment and give them "instant access". Impose a clearance time and this might really piss off the surfer. Just something you might want to consider since it could affect sales...

WG

lol yea.. its sad pimpdog is not taken seriously alot of the time.. but i bring it on myself.. so I can handle the trade off with having to label my threads 'serious' hehe..

anyways.. now that I think about it, you are right.. nobody wants to wait for a check to clear to bust a nut.. that defeats the entire point of what we are doing in this business..

so, that still leaves the question of a solution tot his problem...

epassporte? I havent seen any positive or negative effects of using it, so I dont know..

paypal? fuck them.

1-900? lol no fukin way.

dialer? last last resort..

checks? yep.... maybe:
could
a. use a different processor to process checks, which would mean more programming to intergrate with my current system=more investment into the program financially, but overall would yeild results.. IE netbilling like they claim can handle this issue.

b. delay on the signup until it clears.. bad idea.. pissed off surfers.

c. get rid of checks.. nope, to much money to be made with checks to ignore them.

d. Im running out of ideas... anyone care to expand on the possible options?
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#22

02-15-2003, 12:02 AM

There is also the option of not telling the surfer about the delay on processing checks. It would irritate surfers to complete the form thinking access will be given instantly only to find out they have to wait 2-3 days, but it is an option. Just be careful not to phrase your marketing as instant access from the check join page.

It is a little deceptive but in this business, it wouldn't be anything new. Just a thought....

By the way, i'm hearing paypal payments are starting to get quite popular, especially as an alternative to checks. May want to consider it...

WG

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#23

02-15-2003, 02:19 AM

pimpdog dude , do you have ICQ ? can i get it please ?

no thanx.
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#24

02-18-2003, 11:45 PM

p`mpd0g,

Sorry for the delayed response. Let me know if you would like to discuss our verification options for ACH.

Toll Free within the US: (888)357-8166
Outside the US: (661)252-2456

ICQ: 117496436

Thank you, Mitch Farber

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Email / Phone: 888-357-8166 / 661-252-2456
Transaction processing & 24/7 call center services with exceptional rates and flexibility, since 1998!
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#25

02-19-2003, 12:09 AM

Did anyone EVER think of adding a disclaimer to the check signup page telling the surfer that you will pursue fraud or attempted fraud charges on anyone attempting to signup knowing their checking accounts were empty? That might cut down on some of it. It is a crime after all.

<center><a target="_blank" href="http://dev.datedollars.com/index.php?s=signup&aid=535&cfg=aac"><img border="0" src="http://216.130.172.224/gfy/gsig.gif" width="490" height="100"></a><br><a href="http://dev.datedollars.com/index.php?s=signup&aid=535&cfg=aac" target="_blank"><b><font face="Arial"><font color="#FF99FF"> Buy me away from Slavedriver Smokey!<br>It's May Sig Sweeps!<font></b></center>
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#26

02-19-2003, 12:32 AM

You might switch to Globill:

"By default, check signups are set to not have real-time access. Typically checks take 4-10 days to clear, and when the check clears, the customer will get an email mentioning that their membership has started and that they can now log in.

"You can change it so that your check customers have real-time access by using your Update Site Prefs page. Note that setting real-time access could result in more bounced checks for you. We advise you to try both ways to see which way works best for your web site."

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#27

02-19-2003, 12:54 AM

I'm not naming any names but processors defaulting to not allowing pretty much instant access on check sales is just dying to give out refunds on them...

Look at it this way Trey -- it's a cost of doing business, just like the suck ass surfer who could get approved for 3 bucks but is short the credit for the 35 dollar rebill... it IS going to happen.

Bottom line is that checks should add at least 10% to your bottom line.

Don't pay the resellers until 7 days past the check date, that will stop the reseller fraud cold -- and believe me that is probably a large part of your problem.

But you gotta let the surfers in... otherwise by the time their trial is up their check hasn't cleared, what a fucking mess that would make...

However -- be sure to bang those check sales for an extra 5 bucks a month on the rebill, they will pay it.
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#28

02-19-2003, 12:57 AM

fuck checks they are a waste
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#29

02-19-2003, 01:17 AM

I wouldn't go the delay route. Personally, if I signed up for a site and found out afterwards I had to wait for it to clear I'd cancel immediately and find another site to spend my money at.
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#30

02-19-2003, 01:20 AM

Originally posted by Mastin
pimpdog dude , do you have ICQ ? can i get it please ?

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#31

02-19-2003, 01:29 AM

Originally posted by Shooter
I wouldn't go the delay route. Personally, if I signed up for a site and found out afterwards I had to wait for it to clear I'd cancel immediately and find another site to spend my money at.

WHATS UP SHOOTER!!!! Long time no talk, what are you doing these days?
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#32

02-19-2003, 03:16 AM

This is what I do to ease my mind with the checks.

When I check my stats and see sales, I don't count the checks as valid sales in my head...So if you get 10 sales, 6 of them are credit cards and 4 are checks, I'll only count 6 signups in my head. The only "sales" that I'll credit for the day for checks will be rebills.

That way, it's easier to look at the returned check line total later on because you weren't really counting them anyway. The checks that do go through and rebill for a shitlong time is what I consider icing on the cake.

That's the only solution that you'll have. But the difference is that you have to pay your affiliates on those check signups. I just absorb my losses myself. So therefore, If I were you, I'd get rid of the check option for now.

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#33

02-19-2003, 03:26 AM

Originally posted by chupacabra
we quit taking online checks over a year ago, over the course of 9 months we were seeing a 60-70% rate of returned (bad) check transactions, total bullshit, and not worth our lost bandwidth for the few that turned out to be valid... thieving fuckers..

That's your anger talking....I have a HIGH check return rate. It used to make me very angry. But then I'll go into the stats and see somebody who has had a check recur for 11 months and I started to soften. Check rebills are the longest rebills you're gonna get. You're getting money straight out of the same account that their paycheck goes in. That's tapped gold right there.

And as for bandwidth, I haven't noticed any problems due to the theiving muthafuckas....

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#34

02-23-2003, 11:04 AM

Originally posted by Kimmykim
I'm not naming any names but processors defaulting to not allowing pretty much instant access on check sales is just dying to give out refunds on them...

Look at it this way Trey -- it's a cost of doing business, just like the suck ass surfer who could get approved for 3 bucks but is short the credit for the 35 dollar rebill... it IS going to happen.

Bottom line is that checks should add at least 10% to your bottom line.

Don't pay the resellers until 7 days past the check date, that will stop the reseller fraud cold -- and believe me that is probably a large part of your problem.

But you gotta let the surfers in... otherwise by the time their trial is up their check hasn't cleared, what a fucking mess that would make...

However -- be sure to bang those check sales for an extra 5 bucks a month on the rebill, they will pay it.

KK is right on the money.

-- Rand

Payment Industry - Communications - Quality Assurance
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#35

02-23-2003, 11:09 AM

Security on online checks is stupid. If you have ever *seen* one of someone's checks, you can charge stuff to it online.

Checks cost more than they make you. Most of the people who sign up using checks (except the ones who are cheating from the get-go) will just as happily sign up with their credit or debit card. Just kill the check option.

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#36

02-23-2003, 11:25 AM

Originally posted by BVF

That's your anger talking....I have a HIGH check return rate. It used to make me very angry. But then I'll go into the stats and see somebody who has had a check recur for 11 months and I started to soften. Check rebills are the longest rebills you're gonna get. You're getting money straight out of the same account that their paycheck goes in. That's tapped gold right there.

And as for bandwidth, I haven't noticed any problems due to the theiving muthafuckas....

I have two small paysites that accept checks. First is a female porn actress. Only about 10% of her members use checks and she has a check fraud rate of about 80%.

Second is a male dancer/bodybuilder marketed to gays. 25% of his members are on checks, they rarely cancel, and only one membership has been "returned" - and that was some chick who did it.

I'll take a gay mans check anyday - it's the others who are crooks.
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#37

02-23-2003, 11:44 AM

We had an 80% NSF rate on checks when we accepted them through a normal program. We now accept them throughh Paypal and have very few problems, less than 1% NSF.
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