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lawpal

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#1

t-shirt censors - what happened to free speech?

02-19-2003, 02:04 PM

Whats more important? Free Speech? or protection of the status quo to avoid shaking things up?

Anti-Bush T-shirt Banned At Michigan High School

DEARBORN, Michigan (AP) -- School officials ordered a 16-year-old student to either take off a T-shirt emblazoned with the words "International Terrorist" and a picture of President Bush and or go home, saying they worried it would inflame passions at the school where a majority of students are Arab-American.
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#2

02-19-2003, 02:22 PM

The kid's in school. He's got no fuckin rights.
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#3

02-19-2003, 02:29 PM

Patriot Act will make tis country lose all rights

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#4

02-19-2003, 02:29 PM

The kid's in school. He's got no fuckin rights.

No shit. Kids like that are the reason some schools put dress codes in place.

Now if he was out on the street and somebody told him to take his shirt off, he should be encouraged to tell them to fuck off and die.
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#5

02-19-2003, 02:29 PM

Ok, now take this

You have a daughter lets say around 15 and her name is lets say Jane and some guys at school wear t-shirts saying

"Girls are nothing but whores, expecially Jane"

Would you want it banned as a father? Or would you rather have the free speech sign around your neck.

School is not the place for it. Period!!

When Roe vs Wade was real high on the priority list some kids in our school wore t-shirts with fetuses and sayin Pro Choice = Babykillers.

Not right, I don't need to send my kids to school for political war I send them to school so they can learn about different things and than make up their own mind.
Thank you but I don't need help from other kids telling my kids what to think.

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#6

02-19-2003, 02:31 PM

I like his t-shirt.
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#7

02-19-2003, 02:33 PM

School definitely isn't the place for free speech. I got suspended in hugh school for wearing a bear whiz beer shirt and refusing to take it off when told to. I thought it was a violation of my rights at the time, but now that I am an adult I understand the reason.

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#8

02-19-2003, 02:33 PM

Quite simple... schools have policies and students either abide by them or go to the house..

If there are judgement calls to be made, then so be it.. Students aren't there to exercise their rights of free speech.. they're there to get an education.

That shirt was worn for no other reason than to get a little attention.

School is no place to try to buck the system.. That dog won't hunt..
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#9

02-19-2003, 02:33 PM

I'm sure they will ban all shirts that support Bush as well?

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#10

02-19-2003, 02:37 PM

Originally posted by Mr.Fiction
I'm sure they will ban all shirts that support Bush as well?

Some schools very well may.

But there's a difference than saying I'm pro Bush, or Pro Gore, or Anti-Bush, or Anti-Gore than saying...Bush is a terrorist.

The last being something made to purposefully incite responses both positive and negative.

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#11

02-19-2003, 02:38 PM

Originally posted by Mr.Fiction
I'm sure they will ban all shirts that support Bush as well?

Maybe not, but I do know many schools have strict rules regarding religious "items".

Let the fucker wear the shirt, see how far he goes without getting his ass kicked.

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#12

02-19-2003, 02:39 PM

If memory serves me, I believe a kid was sent home from school for wearing a t-shirt that said "proud to be straight". I agree schools are not political forums, rather institutions of learning.
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#13

02-19-2003, 02:40 PM

Who cares, why did he buy that shirt in the first place? to fucking stir shit up!
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#14

02-19-2003, 02:40 PM

heh, i looked at it again.. its a pretty funny shirt... about my other post, Im not saying bush is a terrorist or anything, I wouldn't wear it, but its stillpretty funny
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#15

02-19-2003, 02:51 PM

Originally posted by MattO
The kid's in school. He's got no fuckin rights.

No doubt this stuff is usually the parents pimping their kids with their own views. Sickos. 16 year olds kids don't have their own developed political views....

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#16

02-19-2003, 02:53 PM

I hate to see this, but Free Speech isn't guaranteed. The only party forbidden to stifle free speech, according to the First, is the government. A school, or an individual, can stifle all the speech they want.

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#17

02-19-2003, 03:33 PM

Originally posted by gothweb
I hate to see this, but Free Speech isn't guaranteed. The only party forbidden to stifle free speech, according to the First, is the government. A school, or an individual, can stifle all the speech they want.

Not everyone would agree.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp...&notFound=true

Many many more including things worn in school.

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#18

02-19-2003, 03:37 PM

Originally posted by LiveDose

16 year olds kids don't have their own developed political views....

Some 16 year old kids have more developed political views than people who are older who don't pay attention or care about politics. It depends on the person.

If free speech rights were judged by whether people thought for themselves or had their own ideas, then Rush Limbaugh's listeners would be fucked.

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#19

02-19-2003, 03:39 PM

Originally posted by Mr.Fiction

Some 16 year old kids have more developed political views than people who are older who don't pay attention or care about politics. It depends on the person.

You mean if they agree with you, right? 16 year old kids don't know shit...

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#20

02-19-2003, 03:41 PM

Yea when you turn a certain age you just magically accumulate the ability to think for yourself.

I would hope 10 year old could see how big of a retard Bush is.

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#21

02-19-2003, 03:42 PM

Keep that shit out of the playground.

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#22

02-19-2003, 03:45 PM

Originally posted by LiveDose

You mean if they agree with you, right? 16 year old kids don't know shit...

Nice attitude.

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#23

02-19-2003, 03:46 PM

Originally posted by Mr.Fiction

Nice attitude.

You too big guy...

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#24

02-19-2003, 03:48 PM

Originally posted by LiveDose

You too big guy...

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#25

02-19-2003, 03:52 PM

Saw a real lady wearing one the other day that said

"If God Hadn't Made Pussy To Be Eaten
He Wouldn't Have It Look Like A Taco!"

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#26

02-19-2003, 03:58 PM

Originally posted by EscortBiz
Patriot Act will make tis country lose all rights

That's no shit! We're losing the very principal that we're fighting for...
Another Oxymoron like Government Intelligence!

There used to be a joke that in Russia they had TVs but they watched you!
Wonder who's laughing now..!!!

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#27

02-19-2003, 04:52 PM

Free Speech doesn't mean you can yell "fire" in a crowded movie theater.
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#28

02-19-2003, 04:57 PM

yeah, let's get all these small government republicans and libertarians out here telling us why anti-government speech should be banned
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#29

02-19-2003, 05:12 PM

Originally posted by dig420
yeah, let's get all these small government republicans and libertarians out here telling us why anti-government speech should be banned

What anti-government speech?

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#30

02-19-2003, 05:18 PM

Originally posted by Lensman
Free Speech doesn't mean you can yell "fire" in a crowded movie theater.

Sorry, I don't see the connection.

We're talking about a t-shirt here.
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#31

02-19-2003, 05:19 PM

Private school I could understand.

Public school that gets its money from the Government then fuck them.

I am not sure when people automaticly assumed that kids are not protected by the same rights as adults in this country. The constitution only mentions age when it comes to your right to vote and the age requirements for becoming president.

Children have the same rights to a fair trial. They are protected from illegal search and seizure while in public etc.

Schools have student governments, it is not like politics are not discussed rutinely. Many schools have jr. republican and democrate groups on campus that do work for the actual parties.

To say one does not have free speach just because they are in school is lame.

Age appropriate censorship can be understood, an example would be children wearing shirts with alcohol or ciggerette advertisments on them since they are not of legal age to use such products. Outright selective banning of certain clothing should not be tolerated, unless a standard uniform is issued to all students.

These same kids are being taught what it is to be an American and the rights that are granted to them. To say oh by the way you do not have access to this right because your 16 is wrong. They are slowly brainwashing individuals into becoming mindless sheep who do whatever the authority tells them they must do.

Do I not recall yellow ribbons at school, or fund raising and red ribbons for AIDS research. What about a peace symbol or publicly wearing a crucifix around your neck?

Would you feel the same if he wrote a report on his views of Bush and he was told write something else or you get an F.

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#32

02-19-2003, 05:22 PM

Originally posted by steffie
Ok, now take this

"Girls are nothing but whores, expecially Jane"

I saw that shirt on tshirt hell and got 4 of them
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#33

02-19-2003, 05:26 PM

Originally posted by freeadultcontent
Private school I could understand.

Public school that gets its money from the Government then fuck them.

I am not sure when people automaticly assumed that kids are not protected by the same rights as adults in this country. The constitution only mentions age when it comes to your right to vote and the age requirements for becoming president.

Children have the same rights to a fair trial. They are protected from illegal search and seizure while in public etc.

Schools have student governments, it is not like politics are not discussed rutinely. Many schools have jr. republican and democrate groups on campus that do work for the actual parties.

To say one does not have free speach just because they are in school is lame.

Age appropriate censorship can be understood, an example would be children wearing shirts with alcohol or ciggerette advertisments on them since they are not of legal age to use such products. Outright selective banning of certain clothing should not be tolerated, unless a standard uniform is issued to all students.

These same kids are being taught what it is to be an American and the rights that are granted to them. To say oh by the way you do not have access to this right because your 16 is wrong. They are slowly brainwashing individuals into becoming mindless sheep who do whatever the authority tells them they must do.

Do I not recall yellow ribbons at school, or fund raising and red ribbons for AIDS research. What about a peace symbol or publicly wearing a crucifix around your neck?

Would you feel the same if he wrote a report on his views of Bush and he was told write something else or you get an F.

Well said!
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#34

02-19-2003, 07:15 PM

Joe,

While I somewhat agree with you in principle about the government ran schools (why they are fucking running schools is a different matter altogether), you're wrong. Period.

It's allready a well established fact kids in schools have zero rights. They can be subjected to search any time, their posessions gone through, etc. Going to school is a privilege, not a right. The inner city school I went to we were searched every day going in to class. Whatever.

This is just a loose form of "dress code". If the shirt had said anything non-political yet still inciteful, they would have banned it as well. No big deal.

In all actuallity, schools should force a dress code, then you don't have idiots like this, or idiots on the other end of the spectrum trying to stir shit up. School is to learn, not make statements.

Now, had this been on the street and a city government or whatever banned it. THEN I would be up in arms about it, even though I disagree. I just don't think this is anywhere close to the "slippery slope".

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#35

02-19-2003, 07:18 PM

Originally posted by Lensman
Free Speech doesn't mean you can yell "fire" in a crowded movie theater.

What if I shouted "Movie!" in a crowded fire house?

Seriously, though, that's a very astute statement.

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#36

02-19-2003, 07:24 PM

If the clothing is interfering with the ability of the students to pay attention and learn, or the ability of the teachers to keep their attention so they can teach, then it needs to go.

That is the reasoning behind most school dress codes.

Personally I like the uniform deal, makes it soooo much easier to get a kid dressed and out the door in the morning.
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#37

02-19-2003, 07:26 PM

Originally posted by EscortBiz
Patriot Act will make tis country lose all rights

The recent legislation in congress also concerns me greatly

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#38

02-19-2003, 07:27 PM

Originally posted by Joe Sixpack

Sorry, I don't see the connection.

We're talking about a t-shirt here.

The connection is it's appropriateness.

In other words you can stand on a corner and say that you disagree with the homosexual lifestyle...even be so blunt as to write a sign that says..."God hates fags."

But stand on that corner and yell, "God hates fags" and people should kill them...well you can be arrested for disturbing the peace, inciting a riot, and if someone in that crowd kills a gay man in that crowd you may even be brought up on civil rights violations.

This whole free speech thing goes round and round especially when it comes to the schools.

Christians want the right to pray before a football game...I say give them that right, but allow every other religion to take turns each week praying before the football game. Once the Wiccans show up I guarantee you the Christians will be up in arms and willl change their minds.

Same goes with this t-shirt. If you want this kid to have the right to wear a t-shirt like this then kids should be able to stand in the hallway preaching out of the bible.

But they don't let them. Why? They give them more appropriate times, and locations to do such things, such as the morning prayers around the flag BEFORE school begins, the bible study groups that meet on campus in a class room BEFORE school begins, or during lunch and other class breaks.

Because first and foremost the purpose of school is to provide a safe haven for a variety of religious, ethnic, and even political backgrounds to learn about the 3 r's.
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#39

02-19-2003, 07:30 PM

the best president we had was John F. kennedy.

and the rest of are presidents have stuck us in wars that we dont even belong in but they think that is will help them get re elected.

and that is just my
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#40

02-19-2003, 07:31 PM

Originally posted by big fan jenna jameson
the best president we had was John F. kennedy.

and the rest of are presidents have stuck us in wars that we dont even belong in but they think that is will help them get re elected.

and that is just my

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#41

02-19-2003, 07:32 PM

and yea i agrre with the kids shirt he has his own opinion of his president and i happen to agree with him on that. bush is a terrorist in his own right
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#42

02-19-2003, 07:33 PM

Originally posted by eroswebmaster

The connection is it's appropriateness.

In other words you can stand on a corner and say that you disagree with the homosexual lifestyle...even be so blunt as to write a sign that says..."God hates fags."

But stand on that corner and yell, "God hates fags" and people should kill them...well you can be arrested for disturbing the peace, inciting a riot, and if someone in that crowd kills a gay man in that crowd you may even be brought up on civil rights violations.

This whole free speech thing goes round and round especially when it comes to the schools.

Christians want the right to pray before a football game...I say give them that right, but allow every other religion to take turns each week praying before the football game. Once the Wiccans show up I guarantee you the Christians will be up in arms and willl change their minds.

Same goes with this t-shirt. If you want this kid to have the right to wear a t-shirt like this then kids should be able to stand in the hallway preaching out of the bible.

But they don't let them. Why? They give them more appropriate times, and locations to do such things, such as the morning prayers around the flag BEFORE school begins, the bible study groups that meet on campus in a class room BEFORE school begins, or during lunch and other class breaks.

Because first and foremost the purpose of school is to provide a safe haven for a variety of religious, ethnic, and even political backgrounds to learn about the 3 r's.
Readin'...ritin' and rithmetic.

I agree.
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