what are the pros and cons from both a webmaster's and surfer's point ?
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the person with the most informative answer wins an all expense paid Caribbean cruise with [Labret] -
if it's streaming and the surfer wants to watch again, it takes more bandwith (as far as i know)
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email: psyko514(a)gmail.com | icq: 214-702-014Comment
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As long as you offer multiple formats and multiple bit rates I vote for streaming.
Perhaps it's paranoia speaking, but I like the fact that surfers cant log in, download all the videos, cancel the trial and move on.... if they are streaming, they HAVE to be in your site to watch them.
On the other hand, in order to offer multiple bitrates and multiple formats is very expensive, both hardware and software wise.
Thats my 2cents.<a href="http://www.adultplatinum.com/"><img src="http://www.adult.com/wmbanners/10dcash-468x60.gif"></a>Comment
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Originally posted by Hooper
As long as you offer multiple formats and multiple bit rates I vote for streaming.
Perhaps it's paranoia speaking, but I like the fact that surfers cant log in, download all the videos, cancel the trial and move on.... if they are streaming, they HAVE to be in your site to watch them.
On the other hand, in order to offer multiple bitrates and multiple formats is very expensive, both hardware and software wise.
Thats my 2cents.
Good answer, Hooper. Can't people download .wmv files, too, though to their computer? Or can you embed them so they can't? Also, what about compatibility? I believe mpeg1 is compatible with most anything, how about .wmv files?
I like the idea that they have to keep coming back to your site to see the streaming video. Never thought of that....ICQ: 316365783
<a href="http://www.hostultra.com/~p00p" target="_blank">TEST</a>Comment
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wmv files are the format you put on a streaming server and wmv works on windows media platforms only. that is why the key is to offer multiple formats.
as an example, on our site that is coming out shortly (which i'll begin spamming here in the next day or so ;) we offer windows media, real video and quicktime streaming... which means that we offer streams that can be viewed by 99.9% of the pc users out there.
For an example of offering multiple bitrates and multiple formats, visit our freak site, http://www.fistless.com and view the trailer.
There is really no doubt that streaming is the way to go.. but as i mentioned it is EXPENSIVE... you not only have to buy a dedicated video server but you also have to buy licenses (we currently use real networks new helix server which allows us to stream windows media, real media and quicktime all from one server) and you can expect to easily spend 10k on a license.
Additionally you have to encode your videos into every format and bitrate that you want to offer which takes about 30 minutes per 1 minute of video... so if you have 10 hours of video you can expect to have a pretty awesome machine working 24/7 encoding for almost two weeks.. plus you have to buy a cleaner5 license (which i think is like 400 bucks).
Streaming = Complicated, Expensive, Feature Rich, Very Good DRM
Downloadable Mpegs = Simple, Cheap, Limited, Little or No DRM
Now do me and Labret get to go on a trip to hawaii? ;-))<a href="http://www.adultplatinum.com/"><img src="http://www.adult.com/wmbanners/10dcash-468x60.gif"></a>Comment
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It depends completely on who you are targeting. If you have a broadband movie site you would be a fool not to stream instead of download. This is the single biggest way to ensure they come back for more. Just like Hooper said, the equipment and software is expensive but it's worth it. Real's Helix server has chopped a lot of the cost out of the equation.
If you are targeting general/dial up surfers you still have no real choice but to offer downloadable movie files. Do you like streams at 33.6k? Hell no! Neither do the surfers. I don't care what format you use or how good your compression skills are, those files suck. A surfer will more likely wait 5 hours to download a 25mb file than sit through that torture.I've trusted my sites to them for over a decade...
Webair, bitches.Comment
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Hi and Low b/w members want files that they can save.Comment
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If I was a surfer, which I am sometimes, I would definetely not stay as a member if a member section only had streaming videos. I would not even watch the streaming videos and I would immediately cancel. IMO of course.ICQ: 69767780Comment
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.Now do me and Labret get to go on a trip to hawaii? ;-))
It's a great post but due to your grammatical error, it should read[Labret] and I not me and [Labret] you automatically are withdrawn from your chances of winning this fabulous prize. I take it you didn't read the fine print. I'll be looking out for your new site. Thanks again.
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surfers definitely appreciate downloadable movie files whatever the format. But Hooper did mention a pretty good point, they can suck them all down and cancel fast, keeping them up on a media server can keep people from downloading them - there are ways to do it but 98% of surfers dont know how.
The Ox and Nasty Dollars sites dont use media servers and only offer ONE format i believe - WMV. Seems to be working out ok for them. Which is why i wonder if what people like Hooper are doing, encoding into three formats each at multiple bitrates, plus real streaming, i wonder if it's overkill.
I think if i do a plugin it will be only WMV streams, plus a downloadable MPEG or WMV file option for the dialup guys.
I think streaming at anything less than 100k, better yet 256k, is futile, i dont think any surfer enjoys watching a dialup stream, i know i don't, those guys are used to downloading mpegs and don't mind waiting for the download.I moved my sites to Vacares Hosting. I've saved money, my hair is thicker, lost some weight too! Thanks Sly!Comment
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I say fuck anybody who wants to *keep* my content but not continue to pay for it.
The membership fees somebody pays to us are a right to "view", not a right to "store and view later".
Consider the analogy of a movie theater. Do they let you pay the 10 bucks for a ticket and then videotape the movie for your later use?
Heck No! You're paying for access to the theater, and in the theater they are showing a movie. If you wanna see the movie again and you're not a content pirate you have to go buy another ticket while you sit in their theater.
If that theater decides to show a double feature, you do not have more of a right to steal their movies. What about a film festival where you get access to the theaters for 24 hours and many movies?
So why is it that when a "virtual" theater (aka paysite) decides to offer thousands of videos for 72 hours that suddenly the belief is that *its ok to take the videos* ?
Problem here is that many paysites have convinced surfers that they have a right to posess large amounts of content for trial prices... as though it's the right to "life, liberty and the posession of hooper's videos" ;-)Last edited by Hooper; 01-19-2003, 11:49 PM.<a href="http://www.adultplatinum.com/"><img src="http://www.adult.com/wmbanners/10dcash-468x60.gif"></a>Comment
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I do both.
Stream all clips and let them download 50%Send *c*cia out to deep space:<br>
Donate to <a href="http://www.impai.org/">IMPA</a>Comment
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i use only downloadable videos, and have a massive profit margin.
go figure.we'll miss you our friend. RIPComment
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I totally agree with Hooper. I look at it like this, if they were going to rent a movie it would cost around $5 for one. If they are offered hundreds at their disposal and are only stopped by a $34.95 roadblock for the entire month they should be happy to stream. Downloading allows them to leech your site and cancel before the trial. Fuk Dat.I've trusted my sites to them for over a decade...
Webair, bitches.Comment
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Maybe if the content was quality you're site would have "stickability" I don't think the surfer would bother too much about delivery methods long as they felt they were getting there money's worth and not getting shafted.Ultimately this scenerio would lead to the coveted rebills that everyone seeks . I could be wrong though, but I still see the valididty in your post Hooper.Comment
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Blah blah blah, continue with your streaming bullshit
"There he goes. One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die." -Hunter S. ThompsonComment
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Hey Hooper,
lots of good points, very good movie theatre analogy....
We provide streaming .wmv's and downloadable mpegs of preview trailers on the tours our of reality sites. We don't care if these get downloaded and viewed later.
But inside members areas, its just wmv files (offering 56 and 256 K versions)...
Fistless site is nuts btw hahaComment
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and not letting them download makes them not re-billOriginally posted by Pornwolf
Downloading allows them to leech your site and cancel before the trial. Fuk Dat.
If streaming is so good state it on your tour, tell them that all you have as streaming movies and no downloads. Also let them know that that they will not be able to save them.
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BV, I'm not stupid enough to think that dial up users want to stream anything... but if you have a broadband surfer targeted site it makes no sense to offer downloads. If you have a sniffer on your enter html switch the type of content offered for the speed of the user. A broadband user will leech everything you have to offer but they will also stay just as long because streaming isn't inconvenient for them.I've trusted my sites to them for over a decade...
Webair, bitches.Comment
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Bare minimum use an ASX file to serve the video.Originally posted by p00p
Good answer, Hooper. Can't people download .wmv files, too, though to their computer? Or can you embed them so they can't? Also, what about compatibility? I believe mpeg1 is compatible with most anything, how about .wmv files?
I like the idea that they have to keep coming back to your site to see the streaming video. Never thought of that....Last edited by Sassyass; 01-20-2003, 07:59 AM.Comment
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of course WMV fileComment
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I wouldn't worry about having all three flavors of streaming, IMHO.
Why? Look at the plugins at the larger paysites. Most of them offer one flavor. Some offer two. I can't think of one plugin that offers all three. (The newer Holio feeds offer three, but one of the choices is Java.)
So the paysite surfer is used to having to have Windows Media Player, Real Media Player and QuickTime to see all the videos; they are also used to swapping out their player as needed.
While we're on the subject, I think that ... QuickTime has the best quality for the low-end dialup; Windows Media has the best broadband and Real looks compartively shitty at all speeds. So I'd agree with Sassyass, if you're using one it should be ASX; make the broadband user the happiest, and give the dialup guys incentive to switch to broadband sooner.Comment
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Here is something else to consider:
http://www.pcworld.com/news/article/0,aid,108613,00.asp
Hopefully DRM will resolve the stream vs download debate. We provide both streaming and download with our videos. But it would be easier just to offer download and control the playback rules with DRM.
DRM will likely change our business model, but I imagine that a whole new set of issues will arise once DRM is in full swing.SIG TOO BIG! Maximum 120x60 button and no more than 3 text lines of DEFAULT SIZE and COLOR. Unless your sig is for a GFY top banner sponsor, then you may use a 624x80 instead of a 120x60.Comment
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Does anyone know where we are up to with that company that claims it owns the rights to the technology involved in serving movies on the Internet?Left intentionally blank ... just like my brainComment
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I joined bangbus when they first came out. I signed up for the trial and using my broadband connection I downloaded all the movies. I then cancelled my trial. If they had been streaming I would have had to stay to watch all the movies so they would have gotten a full month's membership.
What is the reason for allowing downloads?kevinlComment
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