How can someone who makes decent money like Obama?

Get ready to pay for illegals health care too...

advocates make lot more

PLEASE put the blame where it needs to be, which is on Congress! I'm not saying Obama and Bush aren't partly guilty for mess we are in, but until people start realizing that Congress makes the Legislation and our suppose to be looking out for us they will continue to fuck us and get free reign to do what they want because all they have to do is turn people to blame the president.

Do you pay 50% of your income to taxes? If so time to get a new accountant.

I really don't think individuals in the $100-200k range are going to see a huge impact. I think you have to make over $200k as an individual or over $250k as a couple, but I guess we won't really know until it rolls out (if it rolls out).

Also I don't mind paying a little more into taxes to make healthcare more affordable across the board. More money in peoples pockets more money for them to spend on things like, I dunno... porn? Do you pay full price for an individual healthcare plan? for me it was almost $400/mo as an individual w/ no dependants. I think family plans are like $1500 a mo or more.

I think social programs need to be policed better, but I believe in social programs. Let's say a mother of 5 loses her husband in a freak accident, he's got no life insurance. What happens? W/o social programs those kids could wind up in orphanages or worse. I'm not so blind as to say the system is perfect and there aren't abuses, there need to be sweeping changes there as well, just saying don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.

once you understand that everything a politician does is because of votes you wont ask questions like this again.

lets see he fucked with some wall street CEO's - who cares its a few bullshit votes
Hes telling the tiny % of america (semi rich - rich) to pay up for the huge % of Americas poor - that would mean huge votes, fuck the few rich

Everything he does is about votes and votes he needs to be in office another term and he cant bank on the economy or the unemployment rate being better so he has to create some sorta situation that will get the poor voting for him, because remember the poor people will not vote for him if he does nothing for them as they will really want change come next election, not because hes good or bad simply because they are doing bad and a change at least gives hope.

Wow 50%? Sounds like Canada

Paid 33.2% tax.

In one year I almost cut my thumb off and broke my nose. Turned up to the hospital and the bill was $0. Got seen within 30 mins.

People deserve medical care regardless of how wealthy they are. I do ok but I don't have an issue with someone with a smaller income getting healthcare. Anyone who does is a fucking self focused prick.

Are you willing to pay almost twice as much in tax so someone who does not try to get out of mediocrity gets free health care?

you dont understand anything do you, like 0 right?

why not force drug companies to stop with the crazy pricing?

why not take people who abuse health insurance doctors and patients and throw them in jail for life, I mean its because of them insurance is threw the roof and they are killing others who cant afford it

see the problem is the system as a whole is broken and can be fixed, but its hard to fix something when the people who need to vote on those things make most of their money from companies in the medical industry

read up educate yourself dont start with the selfish crap until you understand the basis of the problem

We already do.

Seems like you don't make enough money yet to pass less taxes.

They aren't paying 50% in Canada and other countries that have 100% state funded health care so I'm not scared my taxes are going to hit anywhere near 50% anytime in the near future.

Also not everyone has the same opportunity and ingenuity to rise above the poverty level. It's a shitty thing to say, but "the world needs ditch diggers too".

Where are these numbers coming from? Here in canada our health care is paid through taxes and no one is paying 50% of their income in taxes...

Fraud isnt driving up the price greed is. One of the largest health insurance companies the chairman got a half a billion dollar bonus. My father worked for one of the biggest health insurance companies the goal was pay as slowly as possible or deny and this was when things were good was to cut people on a weekly basis. it was getting to a point where people were getting so backed up with work because there weren't enough people to do it but they were making record profits quarter after quarter. Is there fraud no doubt but its not the reason why insurance goes up.

also this talk about well fuckem if they cant afford it. not everyone can be successful. if you own mcdonalds someone has to work there, walmart,target,gas stations etc. A healthly workforce is good for the successful people because those people are needed to grow the businesses and in our business porn its those people who buy memberships.

oh by the way it was 90 percent during eisenhower,70 percent under nixon and 50 percent under reagan. Reagan who raised taxes more in peacetime than any president in the history of this country. just a fyi

If I thought that our govt could run a universal health care program successfully, I wouldn't oppose it. But we have to face the facts - as it is, medicare and medicaid are both seriously fucked. How can anybody expect the govt to pile universal health care on top of all that and do it correctly?
If the US Govt was a business, the CEO, board of directors etc(president, congress, senate, etc) would have been replaced long ago for running it into the ground.

You're living in a fantasy world if you think that the health care in other countries is near the level that it is in the US. Countries like Canada piggyback on advances in medicine from the U.S. They do not have to research or create, just simply manufacture the drugs.


Seriously, most the people in the US without medical insurance and care DO qualify to receive it, one way or another. If you deduct the lazy fucks that DO qualify and don't sign up for health care and illegal immigrants, the percentage of people without coverage is VERY small.


So revamping the entire system for that small percentage is ludicrous. Idiotic in fact. Things being done by the modern US government (PEOPLE) are insane. The US needs to get back to being a true capitalist society. Back to the original ideas of the founding fathers.

That's what I was gonna say. People really pay taxes?

On paper I made like $13k last year. That's not even 1/4 of my mortgage.

If only people who 'do not try to get out of mediocrity' would be assisted I would be against it. The fact is, very very poor people already get healthcare for free... it's the NOT very poor people who don't have healthcare who would benefit from a universal healthcare policy.

If you earn 0 and have 0 and go to a hospital they will treat you and you wont owe a dime. That is already true, however the cost of those treatments are part of the reason why hospitals charge everyone else so much.

On the other hand, if you make 100K a year and get hit by an uninsured driver... and wind up in the hospital WITH health insurance, your coverage most likely maxes out at 1 million or 2 million dollars (read your policy some time), and any amount after that is on you. If you have money in the bank that's great... if your illness or accident costs go beyond the amount you have... they will push you into bankruptcy trying to collect every penny they can. Even worse, your insurance company has an army of employees whose only job is to go out and find ANY reason they can think of to deny the payments and drop your coverage.


The purpose of universal healthcare is to spread the cost of catastrophic coverage over a population of 300 million Americans, rather than having a private insurer spreading it over a a tiny population of 50-100 thousand people. The current system gives incentives for carriers to DROP people who get sick or injured.

It isn't about the people with no money and no insurance. It's about the people with money and insurance who still get fucked by the insurance industry. You by the way, are only one major illness or accident away from becoming one of the people who would need universal coverage.

If you qualify for financial aid to qualify for medical, whats the difference? All you have to do is have annual income less than like 20k, and you get all kinds of financial aid (thank you taxpayers!).
Please, whats the difference?

Votes = $$ A politician does nothing unless he is making money.

Universal health care is not about people who make less than 20K, it's about everyone who gets shafted by their carrier.... regardless of their income level. Unless you are paying cash out of pocket for all of your health bills, it benefits YOU because you carrier will drop you the moment they can if you are ill or injured.

The world is on pins and needles waiting for a H1N1 / Swine Flu vaccine and the company to produce the first batch is located in Switzerland. The healthcare system in that country is federally regulated and is a combo of state funded and private industry.

Just to clairify to everyone reading this thread, what is currently being proposed is not a 100% state funded health care system like Canada, but one that would offer variing levels of state provided, state provided and private subsidized, as well as totally private health insurance with incentives for people to stay on and for companies to work with private health insurance providers.

Before FDR social programs were much more minimal than what we have today. Disabled lived in asylums or on the streets, families were ripped apart, children were sent to privately run orphanages with little to no public oversight where children were often abused. You can't depend on the good nature of your fellow man to help provide for those who can't help themselves, it just doesn't happen.

You think you are rich, but you are only one accident away from poverty...

How far do you think a couple of millions gets you if you are unlucky enough to have a daughter/son born with a disease?

The mega rich don't have this problem and the poor are protected already, the people who would most benefit from universal healthcare are the upper middle class.

I'd rather pay 10% more taxes and get something back. A Canadian with a few million in the bank can relax knowing his wealth is secure, what protection do you have?

You pay almost as much tax as him shouldn't you get some of your tax dollars back when needed?

Smart man!

No I realise that, I was posting for the board not exactly in reply to you. My point is only the obvious really, which is that we already pay for everyones health care in one form or another. People always count up the costs and forget any savings that figure in as well. Really common stuff.

Did you hear Glenn Becks insane rant at a phone caller re: healthcare? omg that is priceless.

73% of republicans are over the age of 65, these are the same people that have a problem with govt health care but they sure do love their medicare. More hypocritical bullshit from republicans.

Also, pharmaceutical companies are spending almost 2 million A DAY lobbying against this. Funny how redneck idiots have been brainwashed by FOX News to be little ground warriors for the drug companies.

How christian-like of republicans to fight to keep sick people from medical care, I'm sure Jesus would be doing the same thing.

Fuck you! Canada's health care system is just as good as the US's. We have world class facilities and access to the most sophisticated medical equipment.

And who do you think is making all of the drugs in Canada? It is the same drug companies that make drugs in the US (Pfizer, Eli Lilly, Aventis, GSK). But the government doesn't let them make a 900% profit on every pill they make. Plus, they aren't allowed to advertise their drugs, or give doctors ski trips so that they can write more prescriptions, or have to worry about getting sued because somebody got a headache from taking the pill. So their expenses are substantially lower.

Most people with health insurance get screwed out of it when it comes time to make a claim. Either they have to pay a $2000 deductible. Or you have to co-pay, so whatever it is, you pay 20%. And your plan may not cover the drugs. Or it won't cover the procedure because it is considered an experiment. Or the insurance company calls it a pre-existing condition because 5 years ago, you had a headache. Or somebody at the insurance company, who has no medical training whatsoever, decides that you do not need the procedure.

And you can only go to certain doctors or hospitals that accept your insurance. You may have to drive an hour to see the doctor.

Plus doctors and hospitals can charge whatever the hell they want.

And paying $1000+ a month for this kind of insurance? What the hell is that?

The reason that costs are so high is for 2 reasons.

First, everybody wants to make a huge and obscene profit. The insurance company wants a profit. And so does the hospital. And so does the doctor. And so does the drug company. If the government runs the system, you no longer have the need for a profit. And you cut out a lot of overhead. A government run system doesn't need a marketing department, and it doesn't need lobbyists, and it doesn't need people to look for excuses to deny coverage.

And the second biggest problem is even worse. The US healthcare system is designed to fix you when you sick. And it makes sense. The hospitals only make money when you get sick, so they have no interest in keeping you healthy. So number of people who are getting sick only goes up, and so does the cost of treating them.

So there is no spending on preventative medicine. If the government runs the system, it can put money into keeping you getting sick in the first place.