Why do virtually all wp themes fail so badly?

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  • Libertine
    sex dwarf
    • May 2002
    • 17860
    #1

    Why do virtually all wp themes fail so badly?

    It's as if virtually every designer out there believes that sites are only made to show off stock phtography and spiffy ajax features, don't need any ad-specific space, and have no use whatsoever for designs that actually lead visitors to other content on the site.

    Seriously, what the fuck?
    /(bb|[^b]{2})/
    Tags: None
    • Machete_
      WINNING!
      • Oct 2002
      • 14579
      #2
      Because knowing photoshop well and being able to draw dont make someone a designer

        Comment

        • Libertine
          sex dwarf
          • May 2002
          • 17860
          #3
          Originally posted by ebus_dk
          Because knowing photoshop well and being able to draw dont make someone a designer
          But you'd think there would at least some capable designers out there selling themes.

          As it stands, maybe 0.1% of paid themes out there are usable for commercial purposes - and that's being generous.
          /(bb|[^b]{2})/

            Comment

            • Mike Semen
              Confirmed User
              • Dec 2001
              • 2924
              #4
              Its because any fucker can throw up a site and call themselves a designer without knowing anything about useability, conversions and even god forbid how to build a site that SE's like.

              That's why.
              ICQ 1454 81 522 |

                Comment

                • Voodoo
                  ♥ ♦ ♣ ♠
                  • Sep 2002
                  • 10600
                  #5
                  Guaranteed that 98% of the designers out there have never sold anything in their lives, and have no clue how to develop a concept or brand larger than their Photoshop window. The entire purpose of their skillset is to SELL the product and / or develop something useful. Not to make something purty.

                  "I'm selflessly supporting the common good, but only coincidentally looking out for No.1."

                    Comment

                    • Mike Semen
                      Confirmed User
                      • Dec 2001
                      • 2924
                      #6
                      Originally posted by Voodoo
                      The entire purpose of their skillset is to SELL the product and / or develop something useful. Not to make something purty.
                      Amen.
                      ICQ 1454 81 522 |

                        Comment

                        • Johnny G
                          Confirmed User
                          • May 2005
                          • 516
                          #7
                          Originally posted by Libertine
                          It's as if virtually every designer out there believes that sites are only made to show off stock phtography and spiffy ajax features, don't need any ad-specific space, and have no use whatsoever for designs that actually lead visitors to other content on the site.

                          Seriously, what the fuck?
                          It has been my experience that you never give a designer free reign and expect to be 100% satisfied. It has to be a collaboration between designer and owner. I have ideas for my sites and no one knows my business as well as me. An outsider cannot just come in and put out materials that will blow the competition away. Consequently this collaboration always costs more as you may go through several meetings and drafts until you get what you want. You cannot expect award winning work when you are only paying a few dollars for their time.

                          Most of the designers I have worked with over the years are fully capable of extrordinary work, but you need to communicate your needs and wants and give them the time and money to develop something big. Originality does not get pulled from one's butt.
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                            Comment

                            • AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE
                              best designer on GFY
                              • Mar 2003
                              • 30307
                              #8
                              More than 1/2 my clients provide less than satisfactory information for a site design and expect me the designer to know everything about what they are attempting.

                              The more info I have and the client is willing to tell me the better a production becomes.

                              But a vast majority of my clients come to me and expect I know everything. I only claim to know it all on GFY but professionaly I am only as good as I am instructed to be...

                                Comment

                                • gimme-website
                                  Confirmed User
                                  • Jun 2008
                                  • 1589
                                  #9
                                  Originally posted by Johnny G
                                  It has been my experience that you never give a designer free reign and expect to be 100% satisfied. It has to be a collaboration between designer and owner. I have ideas for my sites and no one knows my business as well as me. An outsider cannot just come in and put out materials that will blow the competition away. Consequently this collaboration always costs more as you may go through several meetings and drafts until you get what you want. You cannot expect award winning work when you are only paying a few dollars for their time.

                                  Most of the designers I have worked with over the years are fully capable of extrordinary work, but you need to communicate your needs and wants and give them the time and money to develop something big. Originality does not get pulled from one's butt.
                                  I love you.
                                  www.gimme-website.com

                                    Comment

                                    • Libertine
                                      sex dwarf
                                      • May 2002
                                      • 17860
                                      #10
                                      Originally posted by Johnny G
                                      It has been my experience that you never give a designer free reign and expect to be 100% satisfied. It has to be a collaboration between designer and owner. I have ideas for my sites and no one knows my business as well as me. An outsider cannot just come in and put out materials that will blow the competition away. Consequently this collaboration always costs more as you may go through several meetings and drafts until you get what you want. You cannot expect award winning work when you are only paying a few dollars for their time.

                                      Most of the designers I have worked with over the years are fully capable of extrordinary work, but you need to communicate your needs and wants and give them the time and money to develop something big. Originality does not get pulled from one's butt.
                                      I'm talking about wp themes here, though. I regularly need them for quick deployment of sites, but there are *very* few good ones out there. Hiring a designer is also an option, of course, but it usually adds at least a week to development.

                                      Come to think of it... I should team up with a designer, and produce high-quality commercially oriented premium themes. They'd sell like hotcakes.

                                      Any designer up for a project?
                                      /(bb|[^b]{2})/

                                        Comment

                                        • Max - RiotDesign
                                          Confirmed User
                                          • Oct 2008
                                          • 246
                                          #11
                                          See sig

                                            Comment

                                            • psili
                                              Confirmed User
                                              • Apr 2003
                                              • 5526
                                              #12
                                              Originally posted by Libertine
                                              I'm talking about wp themes here, though. I regularly need them for quick deployment of sites, but there are *very* few good ones out there. Hiring a designer is also an option, of course, but it usually adds at least a week to development.

                                              Come to think of it... I should team up with a designer, and produce high-quality commercially oriented premium themes. They'd sell like hotcakes.

                                              Any designer up for a project?
                                              Just from the thread, I'd pick Voodoo or Mike Semen as both seem to understand that something "purrty" does not mean it's functional.
                                              Your post count means nothing.

                                                Comment

                                                • Libertine
                                                  sex dwarf
                                                  • May 2002
                                                  • 17860
                                                  #13
                                                  Originally posted by Max - RiotDesign
                                                  See sig
                                                  The designs in your portfolio are really good, yet the design of your own site is god-awful. And by god-awful I mean truly, utterly, completely horrible. One of the worst I have ever seen on any design company's website.

                                                  Since you're obviously a talented designer, judging by the designs in your portfolio, I can't help but wonder why you'd present yourself like that...
                                                  /(bb|[^b]{2})/

                                                    Comment

                                                    • brassmonkey
                                                      Pay It Forward
                                                      • Sep 2005
                                                      • 77390
                                                      #14
                                                      well ok then
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                                                        • Max - RiotDesign
                                                          Confirmed User
                                                          • Oct 2008
                                                          • 246
                                                          #15
                                                          Originally posted by Libertine
                                                          The designs in your portfolio are really good, yet the design of your own site is god-awful. And by god-awful I mean truly, utterly, completely horrible. One of the worst I have ever seen on any design company's website.

                                                          Since you're obviously a talented designer, judging by the designs in your portfolio, I can't help but wonder why you'd present yourself like that...
                                                          "The shoemaker's son always goes barefoot." Theres my excuse.

                                                          But seriously, I guess it comes down to taste, and in the case of my website probably I pushed it a bit to the extreme, but personally I like it (I wouldnt have done it that way if I didnt).

                                                          Anyways, thanks for the compliments!

                                                            Comment

                                                            • AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE
                                                              best designer on GFY
                                                              • Mar 2003
                                                              • 30307
                                                              #16
                                                              Originally posted by Max - RiotDesign
                                                              "The shoemaker's son always goes barefoot." Theres my excuse.

                                                              But seriously, I guess it comes down to taste, and in the case of my website probably I pushed it a bit to the extreme, but personally I like it (I wouldnt have done it that way if I didnt).

                                                              Anyways, thanks for the compliments!
                                                              Its the background thats killin it, other that everything is nice on your site
                                                              Fuck the way the site looks the work is awesome.
                                                              Yer a guy I would definatly say is a good designer and would refer work to and probably will when the season picks up.

                                                                Comment

                                                                • marktruman
                                                                  Confirmed User
                                                                  • Aug 2004
                                                                  • 1026
                                                                  #17
                                                                  Originally posted by Max - RiotDesign
                                                                  "The shoemaker's son always goes barefoot." Theres my excuse.

                                                                  But seriously, I guess it comes down to taste, and in the case of my website probably I pushed it a bit to the extreme, but personally I like it (I wouldnt have done it that way if I didnt).

                                                                  Anyways, thanks for the compliments!
                                                                  quite excellent blog designs, I think I will be hitting you up in the next few weeks regarding a blog design for me

                                                                    Comment

                                                                    • Libertine
                                                                      sex dwarf
                                                                      • May 2002
                                                                      • 17860
                                                                      #18
                                                                      Originally posted by Max - RiotDesign
                                                                      "The shoemaker's son always goes barefoot." Theres my excuse.

                                                                      But seriously, I guess it comes down to taste, and in the case of my website probably I pushed it a bit to the extreme, but personally I like it (I wouldnt have done it that way if I didnt).

                                                                      Anyways, thanks for the compliments!
                                                                      Sorry, but it's not just a matter of taste.

                                                                      There's also the matter of usability. In the case of your site's design, usability is extremely low. Apart from the background quite literally hurting my eyes when I open it, you have a flash "contact" button which is a mailto link in an age where many people use webbased mail, a flash button saying "our blog" which doesn't appear to do anything, and the center of the page dedicated to what at first glance appear to be dead images. Quite frankly, it looks rather unprofessional.

                                                                      The main website in your portfolio is always your own. From a marketing perspective (note that I am not talking about an artistic perspective here), this one is simply bad.
                                                                      /(bb|[^b]{2})/

                                                                        Comment

                                                                        • sortie
                                                                          Confirmed User
                                                                          • Mar 2007
                                                                          • 7771
                                                                          #19
                                                                          Originally posted by Libertine
                                                                          It's as if virtually every designer out there believes that sites are only made to show off stock phtography and spiffy ajax features, don't need any ad-specific space, and have no use whatsoever for designs that actually lead visitors to other content on the site.

                                                                          Seriously, what the fuck?
                                                                          When I have an issue like you are describing I fix it by learning how to
                                                                          do something for myself.

                                                                            Comment

                                                                            • Libertine
                                                                              sex dwarf
                                                                              • May 2002
                                                                              • 17860
                                                                              #20
                                                                              Originally posted by sortie
                                                                              When I have an issue like you are describing I fix it by learning how to
                                                                              do something for myself.

                                                                              Then you must have a lot of spare time
                                                                              /(bb|[^b]{2})/

                                                                                Comment

                                                                                • CurrentlySober
                                                                                  Too lazy to wipe my ass
                                                                                  • Aug 2002
                                                                                  • 38985
                                                                                  #21
                                                                                  So we are talking 'off the shelf' themes yeah?

                                                                                  I ask that because I have NEVER used a paid custom theme, until recently...

                                                                                  But I recently sprung for a custom job from a good design studio... And so far I am REALLY IMPRESSED...

                                                                                  So, I dont quite get what you mean?
                                                                                  ️ ️

                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                    • Max - RiotDesign
                                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                                      • Oct 2008
                                                                                      • 246
                                                                                      #22
                                                                                      Originally posted by AlienQ
                                                                                      Its the background thats killin it, other that everything is nice on your site
                                                                                      Fuck the way the site looks the work is awesome.
                                                                                      Yer a guy I would definatly say is a good designer and would refer work to and probably will when the season picks up.
                                                                                      Yeah man almost everyone I showed the website to hated the background, I should definitely change it sometime... thanks for the nice comments!

                                                                                      Originally posted by marktruman
                                                                                      quite excellent blog designs, I think I will be hitting you up in the next few weeks regarding a blog design for me
                                                                                      Thanks! Looking forward to it!

                                                                                      Originally posted by Libertine
                                                                                      Sorry, but it's not just a matter of taste.

                                                                                      There's also the matter of usability. In the case of your site's design, usability is extremely low. Apart from the background quite literally hurting my eyes when I open it, you have a flash "contact" button which is a mailto link in an age where many people use webbased mail, a flash button saying "our blog" which doesn't appear to do anything, and the center of the page dedicated to what at first glance appear to be dead images. Quite frankly, it looks rather unprofessional.

                                                                                      The main website in your portfolio is always your own. From a marketing perspective (note that I am not talking about an artistic perspective here), this one is simply bad.
                                                                                      I know man, it's a strange site and there's lots of room for improvement... (dont even look at the code )

                                                                                      But thanks for the constructive criticism, much appreciated!

                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                        • collegeboobies
                                                                                          So Fucking Banned
                                                                                          • Jul 2004
                                                                                          • 3644
                                                                                          #23
                                                                                          because they are made for no other reason than backlinks

                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                            • Johnny G
                                                                                              Confirmed User
                                                                                              • May 2005
                                                                                              • 516
                                                                                              #24
                                                                                              Originally posted by gimme-website
                                                                                              I love you.
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                                                                                                • Deej
                                                                                                  I make pixels work
                                                                                                  • Jun 2005
                                                                                                  • 24386
                                                                                                  #25
                                                                                                  My eyes hurt...

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                                                                                                    • Barefootsies
                                                                                                      Choice is an Illusion
                                                                                                      • Feb 2005
                                                                                                      • 42635
                                                                                                      #26
                                                                                                      Originally posted by Johnny G
                                                                                                      It has been my experience that you never give a designer free reign and expect to be 100% satisfied. It has to be a collaboration between designer and owner. I have ideas for my sites and no one knows my business as well as me. An outsider cannot just come in and put out materials that will blow the competition away. Consequently this collaboration always costs more as you may go through several meetings and drafts until you get what you want. You cannot expect award winning work when you are only paying a few dollars for their time.

                                                                                                      Most of the designers I have worked with over the years are fully capable of extrordinary work, but you need to communicate your needs and wants and give them the time and money to develop something big. Originality does not get pulled from one's butt.
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                                                                                                        • devine
                                                                                                          Confirmed User
                                                                                                          • Jul 2006
                                                                                                          • 620
                                                                                                          #27
                                                                                                          I know A LOT of wp themes that are marketing oriented and beautiful at the same time. Even a few free ones. So maybe you didn't find the right ones. Of course, most free themes are free because they lack a lot of stuff, hence you'll need to pay for some goodies. But as I said, there are A LOT of excellent mainstream WP themes.

                                                                                                          Of course, good adult WP themes is another song...

                                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                                            • Libertine
                                                                                                              sex dwarf
                                                                                                              • May 2002
                                                                                                              • 17860
                                                                                                              #28
                                                                                                              Originally posted by devine
                                                                                                              I know A LOT of wp themes that are marketing oriented and beautiful at the same time. Even a few free ones. So maybe you didn't find the right ones. Of course, most free themes are free because they lack a lot of stuff, hence you'll need to pay for some goodies. But as I said, there are A LOT of excellent mainstream WP themes.

                                                                                                              Of course, good adult WP themes is another song...
                                                                                                              If you know a lot of them, you've been looking in different places than I have.


                                                                                                              Here's an example of one of the better ones I've found:
                                                                                                              http://www.woothemes.com/demo/freshnews/

                                                                                                              It might look good, but let's take a quick look at the problems with it, from a marketing point of view:

                                                                                                              - wastes banner space on the search form, that needs to be fixed
                                                                                                              - not enough effective integrated ad spots, those need to be added
                                                                                                              - wastes the footer, one needs to be added
                                                                                                              - relies strongly on images to look good, which means extra expenses in stock photography
                                                                                                              - does not present enough opportunities for slapping attractive content on the front page above the fold - increased bounce rate

                                                                                                              To fix it:
                                                                                                              Use smaller logo, put standard-sized ad in place of search thingy, add search thingy to nav bar.
                                                                                                              Fix front page to show more featured content above the fold. Major redesign, but completely essential.
                                                                                                              Add a productive footer.

                                                                                                              So you'd end up having to fix the header, the main content presentation and the footer. Essentially, a complete redesign.

                                                                                                              Remember, beauty is unimportant. You want to cut bounce rates, increase pages/visit, increase bookmarks and increase ad clicks. Other things don't really matter.
                                                                                                              /(bb|[^b]{2})/

                                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                                • AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE
                                                                                                                  best designer on GFY
                                                                                                                  • Mar 2003
                                                                                                                  • 30307
                                                                                                                  #29
                                                                                                                  I'll ad that I think the design of a WP is absolutely meaningless. Most Adult BLogs copy and back link each other they are all nothing but dumb drones of repetition.

                                                                                                                  Its the content, If it sucks and says everything everyone else does you are basically gonna be standing there holding your dick wondering why you got 100 of them and the guy next to you has 1 that does better than all 100 of yours.

                                                                                                                  SHooting the retarded designer that you paid to design it over the matter rather silly for two reasons.

                                                                                                                  A: You paid someone to Design a WP for you when there are literally thousands of free templates.
                                                                                                                  B: Think design matters on WP.
                                                                                                                  Last edited by AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE; 01-24-2009, 07:12 PM.

                                                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                                                    • Libertine
                                                                                                                      sex dwarf
                                                                                                                      • May 2002
                                                                                                                      • 17860
                                                                                                                      #30
                                                                                                                      Originally posted by AlienQ
                                                                                                                      I'll ad that I think the design of a WP is absolutely meaningless. Most Adult BLogs copy and back link each other they are all nothing but dumb drones of repetition.

                                                                                                                      Its the content, If it sucks and says everything everyone else does you are basically gonna be standing there holding your dick wondering why you got 100 of them and the guy next to you has 1 that does better than all 100 of yours.

                                                                                                                      SHooting the retarded designer that you paid to design it over the matter rather silly for two reasons.

                                                                                                                      A: You paid someone to Design a WP for you when there are literally thousands of free templates.
                                                                                                                      B: Think design matters on WP.
                                                                                                                      First, I'm not talking about adult.

                                                                                                                      Second, you're an idiot if you think design doesn't affect bounce rates and average pages/visit. And hey, guess what? Bounce rates and pages/visit directly affect my bottom line.
                                                                                                                      /(bb|[^b]{2})/

                                                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                                                        • Deej
                                                                                                                          I make pixels work
                                                                                                                          • Jun 2005
                                                                                                                          • 24386
                                                                                                                          #31
                                                                                                                          now my brain hurts...

                                                                                                                          Deej's Designs n' What Not
                                                                                                                          Hit me up for Design, CSS & Photo Retouching


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                                                                                                                            • Mike Semen
                                                                                                                              Confirmed User
                                                                                                                              • Dec 2001
                                                                                                                              • 2924
                                                                                                                              #32
                                                                                                                              Originally posted by psili
                                                                                                                              Just from the thread, I'd pick Voodoo or Mike Semen as both seem to understand that something "purrty" does not mean it's functional.
                                                                                                                              I'm not a designer.
                                                                                                                              ICQ 1454 81 522 |

                                                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                                                • chupachups
                                                                                                                                  Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                  • Dec 2002
                                                                                                                                  • 6576
                                                                                                                                  #33
                                                                                                                                  Originally posted by ebus_dk
                                                                                                                                  Because knowing photoshop well and being able to draw dont make someone a designer

                                                                                                                                  Because knowing photoshop well and being able to draw dont make someone a designer, but an artist. (and that sums it up)

                                                                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                                                                    • Jdoughs
                                                                                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                      • Mar 2004
                                                                                                                                      • 5794
                                                                                                                                      #34
                                                                                                                                      How many personal websites or web logs (the true definition of the term) need banner space.

                                                                                                                                      None do. So now re-ask the question, why do they all fail at marketing and generating sales.

                                                                                                                                      Because its not what they are made for.
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                                                                                                                                        • ContentPimp
                                                                                                                                          Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                          • Nov 2008
                                                                                                                                          • 3184
                                                                                                                                          #35
                                                                                                                                          That is why there are designers that make templates with Ad spaces, and a goal to sell a product.
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                                                                                                                                            • Pornwolf
                                                                                                                                              Drunk and Unruly
                                                                                                                                              • Jan 2002
                                                                                                                                              • 22712
                                                                                                                                              #36
                                                                                                                                              99% of those design fuckers have no clue how to make money on the interwebs.

                                                                                                                                              So, all we see are good looking templates that aren't made to make money.
                                                                                                                                              I've trusted my sites to them for over a decade...

                                                                                                                                              Webair, bitches.

                                                                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                                                                • CarlosTheGaucho
                                                                                                                                                  Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                  • Oct 2005
                                                                                                                                                  • 9571
                                                                                                                                                  #37
                                                                                                                                                  Originally posted by Pornwolf
                                                                                                                                                  99% of those design fuckers have no clue how to make money on the interwebs.

                                                                                                                                                  So, all we see are good looking templates that aren't made to make money.


                                                                                                                                                  Exactly my thoughts for 99 pct. of them,

                                                                                                                                                  Where are the banner spots?

                                                                                                                                                  What's with all that SEO unfriendly bullshit?

                                                                                                                                                  Why is the navigation / categories so overcomplicated - to distract attention from what should be the main point of the site?

                                                                                                                                                  I've picked up a theme for my mainstream stuff already, it's pretty light and simple, but I'll anyway need to modify it myself so it fits my needs.
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                                                                                                                                                    • fris
                                                                                                                                                      I have to go potty
                                                                                                                                                      • Aug 2002
                                                                                                                                                      • 55814
                                                                                                                                                      #38
                                                                                                                                                      you arent looking hard enough, or you arent modding it right.
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                                                                                                                                                        • Matyko
                                                                                                                                                          PsyHead
                                                                                                                                                          • Aug 2005
                                                                                                                                                          • 8674
                                                                                                                                                          #39
                                                                                                                                                          I do love my first blogs which were designed by Rochard's great team, but since that I followed the advice to start fine-tuning the default skin with a unique header and some useful plugins and I am satisfied with the results.
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                                                                                                                                                            • Libertine
                                                                                                                                                              sex dwarf
                                                                                                                                                              • May 2002
                                                                                                                                                              • 17860
                                                                                                                                                              #40
                                                                                                                                                              Originally posted by fris
                                                                                                                                                              you arent looking hard enough, or you arent modding it right.
                                                                                                                                                              Hmm. Would you have any recommendations for places with good themes?
                                                                                                                                                              /(bb|[^b]{2})/

                                                                                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                                                                                • fris
                                                                                                                                                                  I have to go potty
                                                                                                                                                                  • Aug 2002
                                                                                                                                                                  • 55814
                                                                                                                                                                  #41
                                                                                                                                                                  Originally posted by Libertine
                                                                                                                                                                  Hmm. Would you have any recommendations for places with good themes?
                                                                                                                                                                  What kind of look are you going for?
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                                                                                                                                                                    • Libertine
                                                                                                                                                                      sex dwarf
                                                                                                                                                                      • May 2002
                                                                                                                                                                      • 17860
                                                                                                                                                                      #42
                                                                                                                                                                      Originally posted by fris
                                                                                                                                                                      What kind of look are you going for?
                                                                                                                                                                      Magazine/glossy type, not too dark, space for several headlines above the fold, not too image-dependent, ads incorporated in the design, lots of space reserved for presentation of content.
                                                                                                                                                                      /(bb|[^b]{2})/

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