Senate Fails to Pass Auto Bailout and Declares It Dead

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  • Redrob
    Confirmed User
    • Oct 2004
    • 4791
    #1

    Senate Fails to Pass Auto Bailout and Declares It Dead

    Stock markets are falling around the world tonight.

    I think tomorrow on Wall Street is going to be a blood bath unless the Prez steps in.

    Any thoughts or ideas?
    Tags: None
    • Robbie
      Leaner, Meaner, Faster
      • Aug 2002
      • 20960
      #2
      Yeah, I think we have to let them go bankrupt and start over. I saw a Senator on the news this morning who pointed out that Chrysler is owned by a parent company that has 25 billion dollars in assets. And that parent company refuses to bail out it's own holdings (Chrysler) because it sees any money that if puts in as lost.

      I feel that's what will happen with taxpayer money. It pretty much will be just throwing the money away and buying a month or two of time. Because the auto makers are going to continue to fail. Sucks.
      -Robbie
      ClaudiaMarie.Com

        Comment

        • Sly
          Let's do some business!
          • Sep 2004
          • 31379
          #3
          Originally posted by Robbie
          Yeah, I think we have to let them go bankrupt and start over. I saw a Senator on the news this morning who pointed out that Chrysler is owned by a parent company that has 25 billion dollars in assets. And that parent company refuses to bail out it's own holdings (Chrysler) because it sees any money that if puts in as lost.

          I feel that's what will happen with taxpayer money. It pretty much will be just throwing the money away and buying a month or two of time. Because the auto makers are going to continue to fail. Sucks.
          Cerberus owns 51%. It isn't like they have $25 billion laying around to throw into a company though, that isn't how it works.

          They will get the loan, somebody somewhere will just need to make some concessions. And on principle I suppose taxpayers can be upset, but the money will come back at some point or another. This isn't the first time this has happened, will not be the last. I don't like the idea of a bail out because I think it fosters bad business practices, but much more can be lost by just letting them drop off the face of the earth. They do need to take some heavy heavy hits though to pay their price.
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            Comment

            • Sly
              Let's do some business!
              • Sep 2004
              • 31379
              #4
              Oops looks like they own 80% now.
              Vacares - Web Hosting, Domains, O365, Security & More - Paxum and BTC Accepted

              Windows VPS now available
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                • Robbie
                  Leaner, Meaner, Faster
                  • Aug 2002
                  • 20960
                  #5
                  Originally posted by Sly
                  Oops looks like they own 80% now.
                  Yeah, that's what the Senator was saying on the news. He pointed out that company refuses to bail out chrysler because they see it as money lost. And yet...U.S. taxpayers are supposed to take that very loss. wtf?

                  I've been wondering also...if we keep bailing out all these banks, and we keep bailing out all these companies...where is the money supposed to come from? Everybody is losing their jobs. Last month it was 22,000 people a day losing their job. So if everyone is losing their jobs, that means less people paying taxes. And with all the companies going bankrupt that means less companies paying taxes.

                  So less incoming revenue + HUGE bank bailout + BIG car company bailout + HUGE cost of two wars = Does Not Compute
                  -Robbie
                  ClaudiaMarie.Com

                    Comment

                    • MetaMan
                      I AM WEB 2.0
                      • Jan 2003
                      • 28682
                      #6
                      is it just me or does everything seem way to planned? i for some reason feel a new world order coming on and i hope to god i am wrong.

                        Comment

                        • MetaMan
                          I AM WEB 2.0
                          • Jan 2003
                          • 28682
                          #7
                          Basically the way i see it is the govt is going to bankrupt the people take over all the banks which they are basically already doing and then start everything over with complete control. and i see this happening on a global scale.

                            Comment

                            • JD
                              Too lazy to set a custom title
                              • Sep 2003
                              • 22651
                              #8
                              totally agree MetaMan... can't believe I said that since I'm not a tinfoil ranger but it's sure looking like that's the direction the world is heading in :/

                                Comment

                                • iMind
                                  Confirmed User
                                  • Nov 2007
                                  • 937
                                  #9
                                  Originally posted by JD
                                  totally agree MetaMan... can't believe I said that since I'm not a tinfoil ranger but it's sure looking like that's the direction the world is heading in :/
                                  it's EXACTLY the way the world is headed..

                                  They have handed over 7 TRILLION dollars over to banks no questions asked... Hell even the federal reserve got bailout money ( but aren't they the guys that PRINT the money? ) but the automakers had to BEG for a measly 25 Billion?

                                  People need to see what's coming , Great Depression 2.0

                                  You are about to watch the greatest deflation of a nation in history..
                                  buckle up.
                                  Last edited by iMind; 12-11-2008, 11:28 PM.

                                    Comment

                                    • iMind
                                      Confirmed User
                                      • Nov 2007
                                      • 937
                                      #10


                                      Man, how the fuck do you guys post youtube vids!?!

                                        Comment

                                        • iMind
                                          Confirmed User
                                          • Nov 2007
                                          • 937
                                          #11
                                          Man, I can't wait till the morning LOL..

                                          I got some MAJOR "I Told ya so's" to collect....

                                          I called this shit weeks ago.

                                            Comment

                                            • CyberHustler
                                              Masterbaiter
                                              • Feb 2006
                                              • 28784
                                              #12
                                              Originally posted by iMind


                                              Man, how the fuck do you guys post youtube vids!?!
                                              “If you can convince the lowest white man he’s better than the best colored man, he won’t notice you’re picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he’ll empty his pockets for you.”

                                                Comment

                                                • iMind
                                                  Confirmed User
                                                  • Nov 2007
                                                  • 937
                                                  #13
                                                  Originally posted by Nick Decker
                                                  did you fix what I posted? I only see a white square.. but it's fine in your quote..

                                                    Comment

                                                    • GatorB
                                                      The Demon & 12clicks
                                                      • Oct 2001
                                                      • 18208
                                                      #14
                                                      Originally posted by Robbie
                                                      Yeah, I think we have to let them go bankrupt and start over. I saw a Senator on the news this morning who pointed out that Chrysler is owned by a parent company that has 25 billion dollars in assets. And that parent company refuses to bail out it's own holdings (Chrysler) because it sees any money that if puts in as lost.

                                                      I feel that's what will happen with taxpayer money. It pretty much will be just throwing the money away and buying a month or two of time. Because the auto makers are going to continue to fail. Sucks.
                                                      Yeah start over right after the Great Depression part 2 is over. yeah Wall Street rich guys that produce NOTHING get $700 billion people who bust their ass everyday WORKING get nothing. By the way the amount they were asking for $14 billion was only 1/4 of Bill Gates bank account.

                                                      People don't get it once these companies go belly up it's not just the auto workers that are out of the job, factories that make the parts for the cars will go belly up. Place that supply those factories will go belly up. Now that you have hundreds of thousands of more workers in towns all over America without jobs places like stores and restaurants that depend on those workers coming in and buying things won't have those workers coming in because they don't have jobs. So those businesses will either layoff workers or go out of business.

                                                      Oh yeah all these people that will now no longer have jobs will get unemployment and food stamps. Where does that mney come from? Yes we the tax payer. And it's going to be a hell of a lot more than $14 billion.

                                                      By the way this was a LOAN not a bailout. The 2nd Great Depression has now begun. enjoy.

                                                        Comment

                                                        • qxm
                                                          Confirmed User
                                                          • Jul 2006
                                                          • 5970
                                                          #15
                                                          shit will hit the fan at the stock market in a few mins....

                                                          ICQ: 266990876

                                                            Comment

                                                            • cykoe6
                                                              Confirmed User
                                                              • Apr 2005
                                                              • 4499
                                                              #16
                                                              So much stupidity in one thread. An impressive display as always.
                                                              бабки, шлюхи, сила

                                                                Comment

                                                                • MetaMan
                                                                  I AM WEB 2.0
                                                                  • Jan 2003
                                                                  • 28682
                                                                  #17
                                                                  Originally posted by JD
                                                                  totally agree MetaMan... can't believe I said that since I'm not a tinfoil ranger but it's sure looking like that's the direction the world is heading in :/
                                                                  i am far from a tinfoil type person also, many educated and rich friends of mine also agree with me, some have even bought arms "just incase" this is not one of those Y2K type things imho.

                                                                    Comment

                                                                    • PSSuperstars
                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                      • Jan 2006
                                                                      • 1477
                                                                      #18
                                                                      So where's the doom and gloom on the market today?
                                                                      All my stocks are up..
                                                                      and I picked up BAC with its fall this morning.
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                                                                        Comment

                                                                        • geedub
                                                                          Confirmed User
                                                                          • Jun 2005
                                                                          • 3489
                                                                          #19
                                                                          Originally posted by GatorB
                                                                          Yeah start over right after the Great Depression part 2 is over. yeah Wall Street rich guys that produce NOTHING get $700 billion people who bust their ass everyday WORKING get nothing. By the way the amount they were asking for $14 billion was only 1/4 of Bill Gates bank account.

                                                                          People don't get it once these companies go belly up it's not just the auto workers that are out of the job, factories that make the parts for the cars will go belly up. Place that supply those factories will go belly up. Now that you have hundreds of thousands of more workers in towns all over America without jobs places like stores and restaurants that depend on those workers coming in and buying things won't have those workers coming in because they don't have jobs. So those businesses will either layoff workers or go out of business.

                                                                          Oh yeah all these people that will now no longer have jobs will get unemployment and food stamps. Where does that mney come from? Yes we the tax payer. And it's going to be a hell of a lot more than $14 billion.

                                                                          By the way this was a LOAN not a bailout. The 2nd Great Depression has now begun. enjoy.

                                                                          a few of my cousins work for a local factory by my parent's home town that makes the transparent plastic pieces that go in dash boards to make all the gauges light up or whatever. they're pretty much going under right now, a bunch of the plants closed, the main one laying people off and losing mad work
                                                                          Reliable web host that actually cares, tell em geedub sent ya. Vacares

                                                                            Comment

                                                                            • IllTestYourGirls
                                                                              Ah My Balls
                                                                              • Feb 2007
                                                                              • 14311
                                                                              #20
                                                                              Originally posted by GatorB
                                                                              Yeah start over right after the Great Depression part 2 is over. yeah Wall Street rich guys that produce NOTHING get $700 billion people who bust their ass everyday WORKING get nothing. By the way the amount they were asking for $14 billion was only 1/4 of Bill Gates bank account.

                                                                              People don't get it once these companies go belly up it's not just the auto workers that are out of the job, factories that make the parts for the cars will go belly up. Place that supply those factories will go belly up. Now that you have hundreds of thousands of more workers in towns all over America without jobs places like stores and restaurants that depend on those workers coming in and buying things won't have those workers coming in because they don't have jobs. So those businesses will either layoff workers or go out of business.

                                                                              Oh yeah all these people that will now no longer have jobs will get unemployment and food stamps. Where does that mney come from? Yes we the tax payer. And it's going to be a hell of a lot more than $14 billion.

                                                                              By the way this was a LOAN not a bailout. The 2nd Great Depression has now begun. enjoy.

                                                                              Those jobs are going to be lost no matter what. What are all these people going to make? Who is going to buy it? Sure keep making cars no one is going to buy and just park them on Detroit streets for the homeless to live in.

                                                                                Comment

                                                                                • Brad
                                                                                  Confirmed User
                                                                                  • Jan 2007
                                                                                  • 2510
                                                                                  #21
                                                                                  Originally posted by JD
                                                                                  totally agree MetaMan... can't believe I said that since I'm not a tinfoil ranger but it's sure looking like that's the direction the world is heading in :/
                                                                                  just because you question something does not make you a "tinfoil" ranger. When you don't ask questions and seek knowledge you end up in a spot like pre WWII Germany.
                                                                                  Affiliate Manager/Media Buyer
                                                                                  ICQ 376 978 529
                                                                                  Skype: bradleyjwscott
                                                                                  [email protected]

                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                    • Snake Doctor
                                                                                      I'm Lenny2 Bitch
                                                                                      • Mar 2001
                                                                                      • 13449
                                                                                      #22
                                                                                      What pisses me off about the failure to pass this is that it wasn't an up or down vote. They needed 60 to avoid a filibuster....a filibuster from lame duck republicans who lost in the last election.....yet these same people are going to use the few days they have left to hold our economy hostage.

                                                                                      I totally understand republicans voting against this on principle...but to use procedural roadblocks to prevent an up or down vote on something that affects 3 million jobs is just fucking ridiculous.
                                                                                      sig too big

                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                        • tony299
                                                                                          lurker
                                                                                          • Aug 2002
                                                                                          • 57021
                                                                                          #23
                                                                                          Originally posted by iMind
                                                                                          it's EXACTLY the way the world is headed..

                                                                                          They have handed over 7 TRILLION dollars over to banks no questions asked... Hell even the federal reserve got bailout money ( but aren't they the guys that PRINT the money? ) but the automakers had to BEG for a measly 25 Billion?

                                                                                          People need to see what's coming , Great Depression 2.0

                                                                                          You are about to watch the greatest deflation of a nation in history..
                                                                                          buckle up.
                                                                                          its about the right wanting to kill unions once and for all. You are right I didnt see them beating up aig about how much their employees make. Its also funny the loudest voices against have foreign car plants in their states.
                                                                                          Last edited by tony286; 12-12-2008, 09:02 AM.

                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                            • PSSuperstars
                                                                                              Confirmed User
                                                                                              • Jan 2006
                                                                                              • 1477
                                                                                              #24
                                                                                              Still waiting guys..
                                                                                              Where's the doom and gloom?

                                                                                              My bank stocks are up.
                                                                                              My retail stocks are up.
                                                                                              and
                                                                                              SHOCK
                                                                                              my auto stocks are up.

                                                                                              Doom? Gloom? Where?

                                                                                              I thought today was going to be HORRRRRRRRRRIBLE.
                                                                                              Right?
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                                                                                                • JP-pornshooter
                                                                                                  Confirmed User
                                                                                                  • Sep 2006
                                                                                                  • 4007
                                                                                                  #25
                                                                                                  i said from the begin, NO BAIL OUTS, not for AIG, not for anyone.. let the markets do their work.
                                                                                                  the real issue with the US auto industry is the unions, can you believe they are not willing to give concessions..
                                                                                                  the unions in US are not like in other countries, the union people live like kings, they make 3 - 5 times the salary of regular workers, plus they get health care and retirement second to none..
                                                                                                  i have union friends who have "given" their girlfriends boob jobs, covered 100% by their health insurance, and they were not even married.

                                                                                                  Unions are ruining so much business in USA by being greedy.
                                                                                                  Airlines will go bankrupt
                                                                                                  Car manufacturers will go bankrupt

                                                                                                  Stupid unions dont even realize that they are digging their own graves..

                                                                                                  we must let the automakers go bankrupt, another company buys them out but does not sign with united autoworkers.. run it like toyota or honda or bmw factories who are successfully making cars in usa and making coin. this is the only way.
                                                                                                  "Obscenity is whatever gives the Judge an erection." -- Author Unknown

                                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                                    • Brad
                                                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                                                      • Jan 2007
                                                                                                      • 2510
                                                                                                      #26
                                                                                                      Globalization is a bitch isn't it.
                                                                                                      Affiliate Manager/Media Buyer
                                                                                                      ICQ 376 978 529
                                                                                                      Skype: bradleyjwscott
                                                                                                      [email protected]

                                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                                        • ztik
                                                                                                          Confirmed User
                                                                                                          • Aug 2001
                                                                                                          • 5196
                                                                                                          #27
                                                                                                          Originally posted by geedub
                                                                                                          a few of my cousins work for a local factory by my parent's home town that makes the transparent plastic pieces that go in dash boards to make all the gauges light up or whatever. they're pretty much going under right now, a bunch of the plants closed, the main one laying people off and losing mad work
                                                                                                          its that businesses fault for putting all their eggs in one basket
                                                                                                          .

                                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                                            • jmcb420
                                                                                                              So Fucking Drunk
                                                                                                              • Oct 2006
                                                                                                              • 2155
                                                                                                              #28
                                                                                                              i'm still alive, but this is a bad day for alot of people around me. This effects the local economy where I am royaly. lol, land is about to get real cheap around here.
                                                                                                              On the other hand, I hold ownership in a local construction company. Just this morning we bid on a good sized project and if we get the job, we're good til at least the beging of February. After that, who the hell knows? When things start going to shit it dosen't really take long.
                                                                                                              I'm funner than AIDS, and easier to explain to your parents.

                                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                                • tony299
                                                                                                                  lurker
                                                                                                                  • Aug 2002
                                                                                                                  • 57021
                                                                                                                  #29
                                                                                                                  Originally posted by JP-pornshooter
                                                                                                                  i said from the begin, NO BAIL OUTS, not for AIG, not for anyone.. let the markets do their work.
                                                                                                                  the real issue with the US auto industry is the unions, can you believe they are not willing to give concessions..
                                                                                                                  the unions in US are not like in other countries, the union people live like kings, they make 3 - 5 times the salary of regular workers, plus they get health care and retirement second to none..
                                                                                                                  i have union friends who have "given" their girlfriends boob jobs, covered 100% by their health insurance, and they were not even married.

                                                                                                                  Unions are ruining so much business in USA by being greedy.
                                                                                                                  Airlines will go bankrupt
                                                                                                                  Car manufacturers will go bankrupt

                                                                                                                  Stupid unions dont even realize that they are digging their own graves..

                                                                                                                  we must let the automakers go bankrupt, another company buys them out but does not sign with united autoworkers.. run it like toyota or honda or bmw factories who are successfully making cars in usa and making coin. this is the only way.
                                                                                                                  That's actually not true the 70 bucks an hour is bullshit they make about 28 dollars an hour for back breaking work and foreign car companies have an advantage government health care.Alabama gave foreign car companies over a billion dollars in tax breaks and subsites.Also 3 million people go out of work plan on going out of business with them.

                                                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                                                    • tony299
                                                                                                                      lurker
                                                                                                                      • Aug 2002
                                                                                                                      • 57021
                                                                                                                      #30
                                                                                                                      Originally posted by ztik
                                                                                                                      its that businesses fault for putting all their eggs in one basket
                                                                                                                      its their fault ? that's funny.

                                                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                                                        • Robbie
                                                                                                                          Leaner, Meaner, Faster
                                                                                                                          • Aug 2002
                                                                                                                          • 20960
                                                                                                                          #31
                                                                                                                          Originally posted by tony404
                                                                                                                          for back breaking work
                                                                                                                          Huh? It's an assembly line isn't it? When I was a teenager I dug post holes all day during highschool in one of my Dad's cattle pastures in the hot sun. THAT was back breaking work. I was friends with quite a few guys and girls who worked the assembly lines in Michigan in the late 1980's and early 1990's when my band used to play all through Michigan (Flynt, Jackson, Detroit, Muskegon) and they all made great money and seemed to be doing real well and were happy. Didn't look like they were doing "back breaking work" for low pay. Not saying that they were overpaid, just saying...
                                                                                                                          -Robbie
                                                                                                                          ClaudiaMarie.Com

                                                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                                                            • tony299
                                                                                                                              lurker
                                                                                                                              • Aug 2002
                                                                                                                              • 57021
                                                                                                                              #32
                                                                                                                              Originally posted by Robbie
                                                                                                                              Huh? It's an assembly line isn't it? When I was a teenager I dug post holes all day during highschool in one of my Dad's cattle pastures in the hot sun. THAT was back breaking work. I was friends with quite a few guys and girls who worked the assembly lines in Michigan in the late 1980's and early 1990's when my band used to play all through Michigan (Flynt, Jackson, Detroit, Muskegon) and they all made great money and seemed to be doing real well and were happy. Didn't look like they were doing "back breaking work" for low pay. Not saying that they were overpaid, just saying...
                                                                                                                              I built cars for gm in the mid 80's for the tarrytown plant . Buick century and Pontiac 6000, we made a big 11 buck an hour plus benefits which was a decent wage in the day. The work was hard, hot and very suckful. In the two yrs I was there 2 guys died from plant accidents. Things you take for granted like being able to go to the bathroom when you like and had to learn to take aspirin without water because there was none near my place on the line.
                                                                                                                              How come no one was screaming about what banks, wall street and aig employees make? They gave aig what 85 billion and told them nothing about how to run their business.Maybe it was because the senators against this the same ones that voted for the 700 billion dollar bail out didnt have a interest like they do with those foreign plants in their states.

                                                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                                                • Luscious Media
                                                                                                                                  Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                  • Feb 2005
                                                                                                                                  • 785
                                                                                                                                  #33


                                                                                                                                  My father-in-law worked as a consultant for the big 3. He tells me stories of how the unions require two workers for a particular job, yet the job can be done by one person. He found guys who, instead of sharing the load, have one do the work while the other sleeps off the partying from the night before. The next night they switch places.

                                                                                                                                  He also saw guys that had been laid off sitting in the breakroom drinking coffee and reading the paper. Why were they there? Union rules. Were they getting paid? You betcha.

                                                                                                                                  Overblown salaries, huge pensions, benefit packages...it all adds up to greed. How many of you are making $70 an hour? How many of you are guaranteed $35 an hour if you get laid off? How many of you are guaranteed health care for life? Hell, I'm retired military and don't have health care for life.

                                                                                                                                  Unions had their place years ago when guys were walking steel 50 stories high with no safety requirements. Now the unions are out for themsleves. Money is the key to their success and will also be their downfall.

                                                                                                                                  The management are also to blame. They're begging for a bailout to retool? Are you fucking kidding me? The time to retool was 10 years ago. What do they say about that? "We had no idea it would happen like this." Bullshit! That's their fucking job and they failed.

                                                                                                                                  Imagine any one of them having the foresight to make a fuel efficient car 10 years ago. Then take that car and make it even better. By now it would be getting 100mpg and be selling like hotcakes. No, instead they build Hummers by the thousands. Not one of those fuckers earning millions a year saw any of this coming? I mean...wtf?!! Isn't that why they are chosen to run their company?

                                                                                                                                  So I say wooohooo! No bailout for you.
                                                                                                                                  Luscious Media
                                                                                                                                  ICQ: 293-550-859
                                                                                                                                  CFNM Cash

                                                                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                                                                    • Robbie
                                                                                                                                      Leaner, Meaner, Faster
                                                                                                                                      • Aug 2002
                                                                                                                                      • 20960
                                                                                                                                      #34
                                                                                                                                      Tony, I'm thinking the union wasn't doing it's job if you couldn't go to the bathroom. The most recent people I know that work at a car plant are in South Carolina at the BMW plant. They don't have a union. And EVERYBODY wants to get on there because they make great money, have tremendous vacation packages and health benefits that make the rest of the poor rednecks in that area living in trailers very envious.

                                                                                                                                      I guess it's all a matter of perspective. I think the auto workers have a pretty good gig as far as jobs go. But they may not have a job at all if their unions can't make concessions. If hard times are indeed coming...then those workers are either going to have to make a LOT less money...or they will make no money at all. Something is better than nothing.
                                                                                                                                      Last edited by Robbie; 12-12-2008, 10:38 AM.
                                                                                                                                      -Robbie
                                                                                                                                      ClaudiaMarie.Com

                                                                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                                                                        • BlackCrayon
                                                                                                                                          Too lazy to set a custom title
                                                                                                                                          • Jun 2003
                                                                                                                                          • 19634
                                                                                                                                          #35
                                                                                                                                          Originally posted by Luscious Media


                                                                                                                                          My father-in-law worked as a consultant for the big 3. He tells me stories of how the unions require two workers for a particular job, yet the job can be done by one person. He found guys who, instead of sharing the load, have one do the work while the other sleeps off the partying from the night before. The next night they switch places.

                                                                                                                                          He also saw guys that had been laid off sitting in the breakroom drinking coffee and reading the paper. Why were they there? Union rules. Were they getting paid? You betcha.

                                                                                                                                          Overblown salaries, huge pensions, benefit packages...it all adds up to greed. How many of you are making $70 an hour? How many of you are guaranteed $35 an hour if you get laid off? How many of you are guaranteed health care for life? Hell, I'm retired military and don't have health care for life.

                                                                                                                                          Unions had their place years ago when guys were walking steel 50 stories high with no safety requirements. Now the unions are out for themsleves. Money is the key to their success and will also be their downfall.

                                                                                                                                          The management are also to blame. They're begging for a bailout to retool? Are you fucking kidding me? The time to retool was 10 years ago. What do they say about that? "We had no idea it would happen like this." Bullshit! That's their fucking job and they failed.

                                                                                                                                          Imagine any one of them having the foresight to make a fuel efficient car 10 years ago. Then take that car and make it even better. By now it would be getting 100mpg and be selling like hotcakes. No, instead they build Hummers by the thousands. Not one of those fuckers earning millions a year saw any of this coming? I mean...wtf?!! Isn't that why they are chosen to run their company?

                                                                                                                                          So I say wooohooo! No bailout for you.
                                                                                                                                          Assembly line workers are not making 70 an hour...and just about any decent government or private industry job offers benefits for life. You pay into it the entire time you are working, same as your pension.
                                                                                                                                          you don't know you're wearing a leash if you sit by the peg all day..

                                                                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                                                                            • tony299
                                                                                                                                              lurker
                                                                                                                                              • Aug 2002
                                                                                                                                              • 57021
                                                                                                                                              #36
                                                                                                                                              Originally posted by Luscious Media


                                                                                                                                              My father-in-law worked as a consultant for the big 3. He tells me stories of how the unions require two workers for a particular job, yet the job can be done by one person. He found guys who, instead of sharing the load, have one do the work while the other sleeps off the partying from the night before. The next night they switch places.

                                                                                                                                              He also saw guys that had been laid off sitting in the breakroom drinking coffee and reading the paper. Why were they there? Union rules. Were they getting paid? You betcha.

                                                                                                                                              Overblown salaries, huge pensions, benefit packages...it all adds up to greed. How many of you are making $70 an hour? How many of you are guaranteed $35 an hour if you get laid off? How many of you are guaranteed health care for life? Hell, I'm retired military and don't have health care for life.

                                                                                                                                              Unions had their place years ago when guys were walking steel 50 stories high with no safety requirements. Now the unions are out for themsleves. Money is the key to their success and will also be their downfall.

                                                                                                                                              The management are also to blame. They're begging for a bailout to retool? Are you fucking kidding me? The time to retool was 10 years ago. What do they say about that? "We had no idea it would happen like this." Bullshit! That's their fucking job and they failed.

                                                                                                                                              Imagine any one of them having the foresight to make a fuel efficient car 10 years ago. Then take that car and make it even better. By now it would be getting 100mpg and be selling like hotcakes. No, instead they build Hummers by the thousands. Not one of those fuckers earning millions a year saw any of this coming? I mean...wtf?!! Isn't that why they are chosen to run their company?

                                                                                                                                              So I say wooohooo! No bailout for you.
                                                                                                                                              they dont make 70 bucks an hour or 30 when laid off.They dont make that not even close.

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                                                                                                                                                • tony299
                                                                                                                                                  lurker
                                                                                                                                                  • Aug 2002
                                                                                                                                                  • 57021
                                                                                                                                                  #37
                                                                                                                                                  Originally posted by BlackCrayon
                                                                                                                                                  Assembly line workers are not making 70 an hour...and just about any decent government or private industry job offers benefits for life. You pay into it the entire time you are working, same as your pension.
                                                                                                                                                  People are sheep really, the white collar guys on wall st are fine no questioning what they make.But the line worker is the villain its too funny and then they wonder why wages are steadily dropping in this country.

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                                                                                                                                                    • cykoe6
                                                                                                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                      • Apr 2005
                                                                                                                                                      • 4499
                                                                                                                                                      #38
                                                                                                                                                      Originally posted by JP-pornshooter
                                                                                                                                                      i said from the begin, NO BAIL OUTS, not for AIG, not for anyone.. let the markets do their work.
                                                                                                                                                      the real issue with the US auto industry is the unions, can you believe they are not willing to give concessions..
                                                                                                                                                      the unions in US are not like in other countries, the union people live like kings, they make 3 - 5 times the salary of regular workers, plus they get health care and retirement second to none..
                                                                                                                                                      i have union friends who have "given" their girlfriends boob jobs, covered 100% by their health insurance, and they were not even married.

                                                                                                                                                      Unions are ruining so much business in USA by being greedy.
                                                                                                                                                      Airlines will go bankrupt
                                                                                                                                                      Car manufacturers will go bankrupt

                                                                                                                                                      Stupid unions dont even realize that they are digging their own graves..

                                                                                                                                                      we must let the automakers go bankrupt, another company buys them out but does not sign with united autoworkers.. run it like toyota or honda or bmw factories who are successfully making cars in usa and making coin. this is the only way.
                                                                                                                                                      It is nice to know that some people have some sense.
                                                                                                                                                      бабки, шлюхи, сила

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                                                                                                                                                        • Ayla_SquareTurtle
                                                                                                                                                          Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                          • Sep 2005
                                                                                                                                                          • 3550
                                                                                                                                                          #39
                                                                                                                                                          Originally posted by tony404
                                                                                                                                                          they dont make 70 bucks an hour or 30 when laid off.They dont make that not even close.
                                                                                                                                                          Well, it's a lot easier to justify sending the little guy up the river if you can make yourself believe he's been making bank for nothing.
                                                                                                                                                          gone. long gone.

                                                                                                                                                          aylasquareturtle .."a"t".. gmail dawt com

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                                                                                                                                                            • Kudles
                                                                                                                                                              Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                              • Feb 2003
                                                                                                                                                              • 5477
                                                                                                                                                              #40
                                                                                                                                                              Big shocker!!
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                                                                                                                                                                • OMG Jim
                                                                                                                                                                  Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                  • Oct 2005
                                                                                                                                                                  • 3153
                                                                                                                                                                  #41
                                                                                                                                                                  Originally posted by iMind
                                                                                                                                                                  Man, how the fuck do you guys post youtube vids!?!
                                                                                                                                                                  Use the Embed code vs. the URL
                                                                                                                                                                  ICQ: 254 914 537 - Skype: AlmightyJim

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                                                                                                                                                                    • JP-pornshooter
                                                                                                                                                                      Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                      • Sep 2006
                                                                                                                                                                      • 4007
                                                                                                                                                                      #42
                                                                                                                                                                      Originally posted by tony404
                                                                                                                                                                      they dont make 70 bucks an hour or 30 when laid off.They dont make that not even close.
                                                                                                                                                                      if you know, why dont you tell us what they make?

                                                                                                                                                                      and it is not fair to say "lets compare their benefits to the top tier white collar", instead lets compare them to regular americans, mid management, office workers, bank tellars, service industry workers..
                                                                                                                                                                      By far all these people who work in free enterprise (not unions) are getting short changed compared to these union workers.
                                                                                                                                                                      Now you are asking those free enterprise tax payers to give the union members their tax money, thats just plain insane.. if i were them, i would tell the auto union workers to GFY
                                                                                                                                                                      "Obscenity is whatever gives the Judge an erection." -- Author Unknown

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                                                                                                                                                                        • Luscious Media
                                                                                                                                                                          Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                          • Feb 2005
                                                                                                                                                                          • 785
                                                                                                                                                                          #43
                                                                                                                                                                          Originally posted by BlackCrayon
                                                                                                                                                                          Assembly line workers are not making 70 an hour...and just about any decent government or private industry job offers benefits for life. You pay into it the entire time you are working, same as your pension.
                                                                                                                                                                          You are correct. I misstated the facts. What I meant and should have said was, it costs over $70 per hour on average to employ a union auto worker. That includes their hourly pay, plus the benefits they?re receiving and all the other costs to the companies, including legacy costs ? retirement costs, pensions and more. Compare that to the $50 an hour companies like Honda and Nissan are paying their employees. That's a huge diffence when averaged company wide. Huge!

                                                                                                                                                                          I still say...Stay the fuck out of my pocket! That goes for the auto industry as well as Wall Street. If they must spend 14 BILLION DOLLARS then give it to a company that will prosper. Not 3 that have shown they know dick about making a profit or a decent car for that matter. As for Wall Street...well...that ship has sailed...unfortunately.
                                                                                                                                                                          Luscious Media
                                                                                                                                                                          ICQ: 293-550-859
                                                                                                                                                                          CFNM Cash

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                                                                                                                                                                            • Shoehorn!
                                                                                                                                                                              Die With Your Boots On
                                                                                                                                                                              • Oct 2003
                                                                                                                                                                              • 22872
                                                                                                                                                                              #44
                                                                                                                                                                              Originally posted by Luscious Media


                                                                                                                                                                              My father-in-law worked as a consultant for the big 3. He tells me stories of how the unions require two workers for a particular job, yet the job can be done by one person. He found guys who, instead of sharing the load, have one do the work while the other sleeps off the partying from the night before. The next night they switch places.

                                                                                                                                                                              He also saw guys that had been laid off sitting in the breakroom drinking coffee and reading the paper. Why were they there? Union rules. Were they getting paid? You betcha.

                                                                                                                                                                              Unions had their place years ago when guys were walking steel 50 stories high with no safety requirements. Now the unions are out for themsleves. Money is the key to their success and will also be their downfall.
                                                                                                                                                                              That is spot on.

                                                                                                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                                                                                                • Tickler
                                                                                                                                                                                  Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                                  • Jul 2005
                                                                                                                                                                                  • 650
                                                                                                                                                                                  #45
                                                                                                                                                                                  Originally posted by Luscious Media
                                                                                                                                                                                  You are correct. I misstated the facts. What I meant and should have said was, it costs over $70 per hour on average to employ a union auto worker. That includes their hourly pay, plus the benefits they?re receiving and all the other costs to the companies, including legacy costs ? retirement costs, pensions and more. Compare that to the $50 an hour companies like Honda and Nissan are paying their employees. That's a huge diffence when averaged company wide. Huge!
                                                                                                                                                                                  Keep in mind that these foreign car manufactures have not been in place for 100 years to accrue the liabilities(benefits) that Detroit has.
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                                                                                                                                                                                    • GatorB
                                                                                                                                                                                      The Demon & 12clicks
                                                                                                                                                                                      • Oct 2001
                                                                                                                                                                                      • 18208
                                                                                                                                                                                      #46
                                                                                                                                                                                      Originally posted by JP-pornshooter
                                                                                                                                                                                      i said from the begin, NO BAIL OUTS, not for AIG, not for anyone.. let the markets do their work.
                                                                                                                                                                                      the real issue with the US auto industry is the unions, can you believe they are not willing to give concessions..
                                                                                                                                                                                      the unions in US are not like in other countries, the union people live like kings, they make 3 - 5 times the salary of regular workers, plus they get health care and retirement second to none..
                                                                                                                                                                                      i have union friends who have "given" their girlfriends boob jobs, covered 100% by their health insurance, and they were not even married.

                                                                                                                                                                                      Unions are ruining so much business in USA by being greedy.
                                                                                                                                                                                      Airlines will go bankrupt
                                                                                                                                                                                      Car manufacturers will go bankrupt

                                                                                                                                                                                      Stupid unions dont even realize that they are digging their own graves..

                                                                                                                                                                                      we must let the automakers go bankrupt, another company buys them out but does not sign with united autoworkers.. run it like toyota or honda or bmw factories who are successfully making cars in usa and making coin. this is the only way.
                                                                                                                                                                                      you=retard. Union workers make up LESS than 10% of the US workforce.

                                                                                                                                                                                      Wages and benefits are a very small part of the cost of a car. Funny how you aren't calling for the top magement to take a pay cut. WETF do they do? Not much since they ar running their companies into the ground.

                                                                                                                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                                                                                                                        • GatorB
                                                                                                                                                                                          The Demon & 12clicks
                                                                                                                                                                                          • Oct 2001
                                                                                                                                                                                          • 18208
                                                                                                                                                                                          #47
                                                                                                                                                                                          Originally posted by IllTestYourGirls
                                                                                                                                                                                          Those jobs are going to be lost no matter what. What are all these people going to make? Who is going to buy it? Sure keep making cars no one is going to buy and just park them on Detroit streets for the homeless to live in.
                                                                                                                                                                                          enjoy your negative attitude in the soup lines.

                                                                                                                                                                                            Comment

                                                                                                                                                                                            • TyroneGoldberg
                                                                                                                                                                                              Confirmed User
                                                                                                                                                                                              • Sep 2007
                                                                                                                                                                                              • 1081
                                                                                                                                                                                              #48
                                                                                                                                                                                              it's always the union fault....it's funny how other countries with unions doesn't have these problems...

                                                                                                                                                                                                Comment

                                                                                                                                                                                                • 2012
                                                                                                                                                                                                  So Fucking What
                                                                                                                                                                                                  • Jul 2006
                                                                                                                                                                                                  • 17189
                                                                                                                                                                                                  #49
                                                                                                                                                                                                  http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=LapTCFp6ZVQ
                                                                                                                                                                                                  best host: Webair | best sponsor: Kink | best coder: 688218966 | Go Fuck Yourself

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                                                                                                                                                                                                    • pornask
                                                                                                                                                                                                      So Fucking Banned
                                                                                                                                                                                                      • Aug 2006
                                                                                                                                                                                                      • 6518
                                                                                                                                                                                                      #50
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Originally posted by MetaMan
                                                                                                                                                                                                      is it just me or does everything seem way to planned? i for some reason feel a new world order coming on and i hope to god i am wrong.
                                                                                                                                                                                                      They've already put their man Barack Obama in the office to make it happen. He was sponsored by the bankers and corporation who have foremost interest in this.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      They've done their part and secured the office for him. He'll be expected to return the favor once he takes over. If he doesn't comply (I doubt he won't, he's genuinely evil) they will eliminate him like every other president or senator that was "in the way".
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Last edited by pornask; 12-12-2008, 06:06 PM.

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