Who is/was more evil? Hitler, Stalin, or Bush? - GoFuckYourself.com - Adult Webmaster Forum

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basschick

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#51

07-17-2003, 06:25 AM

dunno... but hitler didn't actually kill all those people - what he did was convince the germans of his fucked up agenda. no one ever blames those people - just hitler. but c'mon - if someone came to most of us and told us a few races and religions of people were evil and should be destroyed, hopefully most of us would tell them to fuck off.

wouldn't hitler have been just as evil had he had the intent but convinved no one?

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#52

07-17-2003, 06:30 AM

This kind of reasoning excludes all of them for being evil. Neither Stalin or Saddam killed all these million people with their own hands, they just ordered.
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#53

07-17-2003, 06:35 AM
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#54

07-17-2003, 06:37 AM

Actually Stalin killed more people than Hitler and Bush put together

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#55

07-17-2003, 06:38 AM

Originally posted by alienpower
i voted for hitler .... the evil god

bush is no saint but let's get real people .... how many people did he kill ?!

He does not know himself.

During the campaign he got the question how many deathsentences had he confirmed while he was governor. He was unable to give the correct number.

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#56

07-17-2003, 06:39 AM

We in the west tend to think of the western tyrants. How about
Mao Zedong? Same category as Hitler and Stalin though more geographically limited. Just as brutal and a mindnumbing number of deaths at his hands though.

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#57

07-17-2003, 07:24 AM

i think hitler believed what he was doing was right ( he was insane, not evil). evil things were done, but that's not the question.

stalin was also thought to be insanely paranoidat times, ( i dont know enough about him( i know he had great visions for russia but little or no regard for human life and millions died under his rule)

bush is sane(from what i can tell, though history may show a different picture)

i think bush is the only person of the three capable of being called evil, if you consider any of his deeds to be evil.
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#58

07-17-2003, 07:42 AM

Anyone want to suggest some books on the subject?

While Stalin starved his people and Hitler killed anyone that didn't fit the "supreme race" description... Bush doesn't even rank with them

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#59

07-17-2003, 07:45 AM

Originally posted by slackologist
i think bush is the only person of the three capable of being called evil, if you consider any of his deeds to be evil.

Between Bush, Hitler, and Stalin you believe that Bush is the only one even CAPABLE of being called evil? Your argument is that you don't know much about Stalin except that we was insane and paranoid and that Hitler "believed what he was doing was right" and therefore could not be properly called evil but instead insane?

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#60

07-17-2003, 07:50 AM

Originally posted by Colin

Between Bush, Hitler, and Stalin you believe that Bush is the only one even CAPABLE of being called evil? Your argument is that you don't know much about Stalin except that we was insane and paranoid and that Hitler "believed what he was doing was right" and therefore could not be properly called evil but instead insane?

Well, I think we have to remember that most "kids" now a days think that Bush is so horrible because he runs around dropping bombs... They don't have parents that were alive during WWII, they don't hear the stories, they don't understand the devastation and the heartache.

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#61

07-17-2003, 07:50 AM

Originally posted by Kanoealoha
Anyone want to suggest some books on the subject?

While Stalin starved his people and Hitler killed anyone that didn't fit the "supreme race" description... Bush doesn't even rank with them

Toland's book on Hitler is classic and for good reason.

Keegan's book on WW II is a good read. His book "A History of Warfare" is very good too.

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#62

07-17-2003, 07:52 AM

Originally posted by Colin

Toland's book on Hitler is classic and for good reason.

Keegan's book on WW II is a good read. His book "A History of Warfare" is very good too.

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#63

07-17-2003, 08:01 AM

Originally posted by Kanoealoha

Well, I think we have to remember that most "kids" now a days think that Bush is so horrible because he runs around dropping bombs... They don't have parents that were alive during WWII, they don't hear the stories, they don't understand the devastation and the heartache.

Who is to blame for those kids not being educated?

Is the state of education in the world so poor that kids today are not being taught that 50 million people died during World War II or that 20 million people died at the hands of Stalin? World War II was the pivotal event of the twentieth century and Stalin and Hitler were two of it's most important figures if not the most important.

I'm not just talking about five decades old history either. Millions of people have died in more recent bloodbaths in Korea, China, Zaire, Cambodia, Aghanistan (Russo/Civil War, not US), Iran/Iraq, Rwanda. That's a shortened list of a much larger list.

The world is in conflict and it's been in conflict. George Bush is not the first to drop bombs in the world. He's not even on the radar screen of world leaders in the past century to do so.

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#64

07-17-2003, 08:02 AM

Originally posted by Kanoealoha

Thank You

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#65

07-17-2003, 08:05 AM

Originally posted by Colin

The world is in conflict and it's been in conflict. George Bush is not the first to drop bombs in the world. He's not even on the radar screen of world leaders in the past century to do so.

I think it irritates ppl that he isn't as bad as they paint him to be.

Sure he has his faults, all leaders do...but I truly believe it annoys the public hehe...

Any more reccommendations on any type of educational books would be awesome...I have lots o time

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#66

07-17-2003, 08:11 AM

Originally posted by Kanoealoha

Any more reccommendations on any type of educational books would be awesome...I have lots o time

What subjects? .

Bernard Lewis' books. "Crisis of Islam" and "What went wrong?" are good for short punctuated histories of Islam.

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Kanoealoha

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#67

07-17-2003, 08:13 AM

Originally posted by Colin

What subjects? .

Bernard Lewis' books. "Crisis of Islam" and "What went wrong?" are good for short punctuated histories of Islam.

mmm good question...

I'm interested in it all...

World Leaders, World Crisis and everything in between.

Damn, that didn't narrow it huh

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#68

07-17-2003, 08:16 AM

Originally posted by dij
what's Helsinki?

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#69

07-17-2003, 08:18 AM

Anyone not voting for Hitler here is just making a bad analogy.

Just putting Bush in the same group is insulting.

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#70

07-17-2003, 08:21 AM

Originally posted by Kanoealoha

I think it irritates ppl that he isn't as bad as they paint him to be.

Sure he has his faults, all leaders do...but I truly believe it annoys the public hehe...

Any more reccommendations on any type of educational books would be awesome...I have lots o time

Before the fall of the Soviet Union, most of the world could be said to be either in the US or the Soviet camp. Many nations the world over were in alliances with one or the other and purchased their weapons and trained under one of those two systems. The fall of the Soviet Union created a power vacuum. It's rather inevitable that attention will now be focused on the actions of the one current superpower. No one chooses between those two system anymore. To many, the US is no longer viewed as a counterweight to Soviet power but rather as the wielder of too much power. This is rather common throughout history. Plenty of people the world over despised Great Britain, Spain, and Rome much to the surprise of the British, Spanish, and Romans who thought themselves to be good people.

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#71

07-17-2003, 08:24 AM

Originally posted by Colin

To many, the US is no longer viewed as a counterweight to Soviet power but rather as the wielder of too much power. This is rather common throughout history. Plenty of people the world over despised Great Britain, Spain, and Rome much to the surprise of the British, Spanish, and Romans who thought themselves to be good people.

Yup! its pretty easy to be bitchy when you aren't the one with the power.

And believe me in no way do I think the US is better or worse
than any other country.

But when you're told you are just a peon, well ppl take that to heart...

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#72

07-17-2003, 08:31 AM

Originally posted by Kanoealoha
But when you're told you are just a peon, well ppl take that to heart...

Very true. It's a vicious circle too, isn't it? Some people start five threads a day on "what is wrong with america" and then wonder why people think they are "Anti-american". Of course, each group thinks it is the other one that started it and neither group is right. Some patterns of behavior of self-reinforcing and with little cause.

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#73

07-17-2003, 08:34 AM

Originally posted by Colin

Between Bush, Hitler, and Stalin you believe that Bush is the only one even CAPABLE of being called evil? Your argument is that you don't know much about Stalin except that we was insane and paranoid and that Hitler "believed what he was doing was right" and therefore could not be properly called evil but instead insane?

well if we're calling insane people evil today, I'll be voting for Hitler.

Maybe it's just because I'm not from a country where we call foreign powers "evil doers" like some fucked up roger ramjet cartoon. but I've always thought of those most infamous leaders as being insane, hence my point.

I have a good understanding of what ww2 was like secondhand and I have family that experienced some of the worst of it first hand so don't think I don't know just how unbelievably terrible life if you were lucky enough to have it at all was like.
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#74

07-17-2003, 08:35 AM

Originally posted by Colin

Very true. It's a vicious circle too, isn't it? Some people start five threads a day on "what is wrong with america" and then wonder why people think they are "Anti-american". Of course, each group thinks it is the other one that started it and neither group is right. Some patterns of behavior of self-reinforcing and with little cause.

I'm gonna say it...

Can't we all, just get along

It'll all go away once ppl realize that there is no reason to act like they are better than others. Someday the my dick is bigger than your's fights will be over...haha yeah...keep dreaming

edit: off to the library

Last edited by Kanoealoha; 07-17-2003, 08:38 AM.

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#75

07-17-2003, 08:39 AM

Originally posted by quiet
just three votes for stalin lol

Soviet propaganda is immortal.
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#76

07-17-2003, 08:45 AM

While there are credible reason to dislike Bush, compairing him to Hitler, or Stalin destroys any credibility of the people making arguements against Bush or his policies.

It proves they are either IGNORANT, or inflamatory, and thus should be ignored and laughed at!!

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#77

07-17-2003, 08:51 AM

What about Mao Tse-Tung? By far, Mao and Stalin have been the most evil leaders of the last 100 years. What the Nazi's did almost seems minor compared to what those two were responsible for.

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#78

07-17-2003, 08:53 AM

Originally posted by slackologist

well if we're calling insane people evil today, I'll be voting for Hitler.

Maybe it's just because I'm not from a country where we call foreign powers "evil doers" like some fucked up roger ramjet cartoon. but I've always thought of those most infamous leaders as being insane, hence my point.

I have a good understanding of what ww2 was like secondhand and I have family that experienced some of the worst of it first hand so don't think I don't know just how unbelievably terrible life if you were lucky enough to have it at all was like.

Maybe we mean the same thing.

Define evil. Define insanity.

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#79

07-17-2003, 08:54 AM

Originally posted by Mike AI
While there are credible reason to dislike Bush, compairing him to Hitler, or Stalin destroys any credibility of the people making arguements against Bush or his policies.

There are some similarities. When Hitler became the chancellor, he quickly began stripping Germans of their civil rights for the "security" of the nation. The people fell for it and actually thought it was a good idea, too. Hmmmm...

I don't think Bush is like Hitler, but you can easily compare any two historical figures on at least some levels.

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#80

07-17-2003, 08:55 AM

Originally posted by chodadog
What about Mao Tse-Tung?

Yup. I said that above too.

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#81

07-17-2003, 09:02 AM

Originally posted by Why
what did stalin do that was so bad exacly, anyone got some cliff notes on stalin?

Besides subjugating half of Europe under virtual russian rule?

The main this is the culling of the russian people. I've heard estimates as high as 40 million killed.

Gel's own piece of the pie.
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#82

07-17-2003, 09:04 AM

Originally posted by chodadog

There are some similarities. When Hitler became the chancellor, he quickly began stripping Germans of their civil rights for the "security" of the nation. The people fell for it and actually thought it was a good idea, too. Hmmmm...

I don't think Bush is like Hitler, but you can easily compare any two historical figures on at least some levels.

Exactly. You can EASILY compare two historical figures on at least some levels most of which are largely irrelevant. You take any two leaders over a wide enough range of attributes and achievements and you will find plenty of enough to point out.

See if you can make Abraham Lincoln look like Adolf Hitler. Pretty easy really. Didn't finish school, excellent public speaker, suspended civil rights (habeas corpus), invaded a neighbor (the South). I'm sure you can add to the list.

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#83

07-17-2003, 09:15 AM

The only evil one from the bunch would be Stalin.

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#84

07-17-2003, 10:08 AM

It looks to me like the US wants to take over the world . Here's the plan Project for a New American Century . Bush is just the current manager in charge of implementing it .World domination is world domination - I think that puts Bush in at least the same league as Hitler .
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#85

07-17-2003, 10:17 AM

Originally posted by Why
why is the main sign in english, but the sign its hanging from is in another language, why hang political bullshit in a place where no one can read it?

dutch speak 3 languages, and they smoke pot

in Europe, u're considered under-educated if you dont know at least a second language
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#86

07-17-2003, 10:23 AM

Originally posted by perry noid
It looks to me like the US wants to take over the world . Here's the plan Project for a New American Century . Bush is just the current manager in charge of implementing it .World domination is world domination - I think that puts Bush in at least the same league as Hitler .

The US is already the dominant world power. Policy is to maintain that position of dominance rather than to surrender it to a regional power and end up in another Cold War like state. This is completely the normal thing to do for a country in the position the US holds. Any other strategy might be a grave mistake.

It is no different than a country like France that attempts to use the UN and the EU in order to increase it's power in the world. It was just last year that France was speaking of becoming a world power again someday. Should everyone be frightened that France wants to be a world power again? Seems to me that is a completely normal objective for a nation such as France. Is Chirac then in the same league as Hitler?

China wants to become a world-power. Their entire private and public policy is geared towards that aim. They are growing at 7% per year and plan to pass Japan and become the world's second largest economy in about 50 years. Is Hu Jintao then another Hitler?

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#87

07-17-2003, 11:17 AM

Originally posted by Colin
FDR was more like Hitler than George Bush is.

Care to be more specific on this assumption?
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#88

07-17-2003, 11:28 AM

Originally posted by Centurion

Care to be more specific on this assumption?

Not as assumption. Sort of a joke. But this is not....

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#89

07-17-2003, 11:33 AM

Originally posted by Colin
Who is/was more evil? Hitler, Stalin, or Bush?

Why did Hitler kill himself???

He got his gas bill in the mail.

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#90

07-17-2003, 11:40 AM

I voted for VISA

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#91

07-17-2003, 11:45 AM

Originally posted by Gel

Besides subjugating half of Europe under virtual russian rule?

The main this is the culling of the russian people. I've heard estimates as high as 40 million killed.

the Russian people loved Stalin even though he was killign them , fucking amazin!

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#92

07-17-2003, 11:54 AM

Originally posted by pauliewalnutz

the Russian people loved Stalin even though he was killign them , fucking amazin!

Well, maybe they respected him for taking down Hitler and making Russia a world power for decades. But love? Maybe too strong a word.

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#93

07-17-2003, 12:05 PM

Originally posted by Ironhorse

Well, maybe they respected him for taking down Hitler and making Russia a world power for decades. But love? Maybe too strong a word.

Well my girlfriend has bene here two years now and her grandparents and grand uncles and aunts loved him, and would die for him. Thats how she described it to me.

Are you russian also?

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#94

07-17-2003, 12:37 PM

This is like asking someone which one of their children they love the best.

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#95

07-17-2003, 01:32 PM

Originally posted by Holly
This is like asking someone which one of their children they love the best.

Hitler and Stalin are YOUR kids? Little brats.

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#96

07-17-2003, 01:33 PM

Originally posted by pauliewalnutz

Well my girlfriend has bene here two years now and her grandparents and grand uncles and aunts loved him, and would die for him. Thats how she described it to me.

Are you russian also?

My mother was born in Ukraine and I heard MANY stories of MANY people living in the area at the time marching west WITH the retreating german armies to escape Stalin. This is real shit, also historically documented.

I was born in Romania and one popular saying after the war was:

"It was hard with Der, Die, Das, but harder with Davai Ceas"

Davai ceas was the russian soldier greeting to all romanian citizens and it means, loosely translated: "Give me your watch"

In some cases russian officers would be sent ahead of the regular troops to warn all local people to stay indoors and not show their faces to avoid pillageing and raping by the russian troops.

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#97

07-17-2003, 01:39 PM

When the panzers rolled across Western Russian, many Russians celebrated thinking they had been liberated. Hitler could have played that whole liberated angle. It's an old one. He didn't.

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#98

07-17-2003, 02:16 PM

It's amazing how people are obsessed with George W. Bush. I was living in Europe shortly after he won the presidency. The media was demonizing him from day one. This is coming from a guy that didn't vote for him: You guys are obsessed with him in an unhealthy way. To compare him to two genocidal maniacs is a joke.

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#99

07-17-2003, 02:29 PM

Originally posted by Chichio
It's amazing how people are obsessed with George W. Bush. I was living in Europe shortly after he won the presidency. The media was demonizing him from day one. This is coming from a guy that didn't vote for him: You guys are obsessed with him in an unhealthy way. To compare him to two genocidal maniacs is a joke.

You think the news media should be reporting on two long dead guys instead of the one on the list who is still alive?

Here is a different question for you. Who currently has the potential to do the most damage to the world? Visa and one other person on the list.

Maybe if the world media had the power they do today and had been really down on Hitler and Stalin they wouldn't have been able to get away with what they did.

It's not a bad thing when the media is critical of government. In fact, many people believe that the media in a free society is part of the system of checks and balances.

Regardless of what the European media might be doing, the right leaning U.S. media has been kissing Bush's ass and defending him since he was elected. Only in the last month have we started to see a tiny bit of objectivity in their coverage of Bush.

If the U.S. media treated Bush like they treated Clinton, the guy would have been impeached or resigned by now.

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jayeff

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Join Date: May 2001

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#100

07-17-2003, 02:50 PM

Is quantifying someone's capacity for "evil" supposed to let them off the hook if he doesn't emerge as the most evil?

Since of the list, George Bush is the only living individual, is he evil? He has ordered the deaths of others and made decisions that caused the deaths of his own citizens, all for narrow commercial interests. I doubt if he was concerned that there is very little prospect of a broader outcome that might somehow balance those sacrifices. He lied - I believe knowingly - to deceive his own citizens into supporting an agenda quite different from his own.

But evil? I think such an extreme term needs to be reserved for far worse than GW.
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