Quote:
Originally Posted by CyberSEO
If you like to do it your way of the way of Rochard, sure, do it. I.e.:
1) We won WWII! (ok, how many German tank divisions were destroyed by the USA? how many German soldiers were killed by the USA? who and when hoisted the US flag on the Reichstag)?
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I would submit that Russia did a good job of picking the winning side. Oops. Wait. No, they didn't. They began the war as Axis allies, then did such a shitty job, they were kicked out of the club.
First off Russia began their Alliance with Germany badly by losing to Finland. Why? Because Stalin had executed over 60% of the Officer Corp and 70% of the General staff.
Hitler saw how weak the Russian Army had become and decided the time was right to double-cross Stalin. Turned out to be a good idea, poorly executed. The Axis had wiped out 59% of the Russian Army by the end of 1941. They never even needed to capture Volgagrad, it had no strategic value and they could have gone by it, but Hitler wanted to rub the capture of "Stalingrad" in Stalins face.
The U.S. Sent Military Aid, including Tanks & Planes to the tune of $20 Billion in 1940's dollars to Russia, on American Merchant ships that had to convoy through the German U-boat controlled shipping routes. The Russian Navy was almost no help here, as the Germans had destroyed it. You had more Amercan Merchant Marine sailors drinking beer in Murmansk on any given night than Russia had left in it's Navy.
How many German Tank divisions did the U.S destroy? Besides the German, Italian AND Japaneses Tanks on the ground in Africa, Italy, France, Germany and all across the Pacific; the USA also carried the brunt of the Air War over Germany. Half of our 400,000 military causalties were U.S. Aviators who died, mostly carrying out the daylight bombing raids that destroyed Germany's production capacity and transportation systems. The U.S.A wiped out the German Tanks before they could be built and destroyed the roads and railroads they would have been shipped on.
There is no doubt, that neither Britain or Russia had the ability to provide the Aircraft and crews of Airmen the USA invested. Germany would not have been destroyed without this effort, Russia and Britain probably would have negotiated a truce and the French would be speaking German today.
As for raising the flag over the Reichstag. Wow. Would you say there was ton of strategic value in doing that? Would you say it was the most significant moment of the war?
Or would you say that it did not even matter, as the Yalta Conference had determined who would possess and govern every bit of Germany, Italy and Japans territories?
Still, there is no doubt in my mind that Russia suffered more horribly than any other nation during the course of WWII. The USSR's total casualties are estimated at 22 to 30 million people. Thats almost as many people as Stalin had killed (estimates suggest 35 million) before the war. The courage and endurance of the people was incredible. A million died of starvation alone in Leningrad, and no one knows all the numbers for Volgagrad.
To Mutt's point, sure, maybe some of that courage was artificial. The casualty figures for the battle of Stalingrad report that 14,000 Russian soldiers were executed by their own people.