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Paul you have been saying the same thing now for almost 15 years over and over and over - you hate affiliates, always have. You have never accepted what the Internet is or understood how it works. I know what you want and it is a utopia for anybody with good content and a complete dream that never was remotely possible on the Internet.
You wanted the Internet to mimic the world you lived in pre-Internet - paysites set up like porn shops, no free content anywhere, no affiliates - just millions of surfers searching the Internet for quality porn and finding the only way to get it was by joining a paysite they found through a search engine or a banner ad. Content producers and paysite/shop owners would have made hundreds of millions, easily. You being a content producer when there weren't all that many of them would have been a very rich man. And you've been angry ever since.
Total pipedream - the Internet is the wild west, still is - all of us would have been better off if porn had to be kept behind the counter - even affiliates.
Most of what you say is true but it's meaningless, only very strict government control of the Internet would make your dream possible.I moved my sites to Vacares Hosting. I've saved money, my hair is thicker, lost some weight too! Thanks Sly!Comment
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oh myyyy!!!Comment
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Maybe with idiots who thought selling porn was hard it is a dream. Nothing wrong in dreaming.
I don't hate affiliates. I dislike some of the morons who could work as affiliates, but not affiliates as a whole. It's short sighted sponsors I blame.
It could of been done and done easily. Affiliate programs set up the way they are are very expensive, strap the sites into doing what the affiliate wants, content is supplied as affiliates need and the customers are left miles behind.
The easiest way to compete with affiliates is do it all in house and/or at 10% max rev share. Then lower the price of the sites joins. Surfers would of very quickly learned that a site charging $30 a month is no better than one charging $20 to $22 a month. The $30 sites would of died a death because the only people looking at their porn wold of been doing it for free.
It seems you accept the way we went was wrong. Or are you still saying like another person that 1-500 of banner clicks is a great ratio?
Ratios from 1998 stunk. We just put out more and more free content because we actually believed it was working.
Nothing to do with Wild West. It was idiots and short term greed. It was bloody obvious it was a fucked up system. But those fucking it up were revered.
And as for not understanding the Internet. So the clowns who fucked it up DID understand it. But totally and utterly clueless about porn, marketing porn and selling porn. And that's the business we're in, the Internet is merely the delivery vehicle.Last edited by Paul Markham; 07-16-2011, 12:08 PM.Comment
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no one even feels your content worthy enough to pirate and give away for free ..Comment
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When the Internet started to roll I saw the money made by a few by spamming Newsgroups with pics with watermarks. Few surfers, but fantastic conversions, ratios and sales.
The problem was people who came after that initial time thought that selling porn was hard. You heard all the time "Why do people buy when there's so much free porn?".
They believed the solution was throw out tons more free porn to get 1-100 buying. When that went to 1-200 it didn't matter the number of surfers doubled or trebled. They kept saying it was because of all the free porn was attracting them.
Which was bullshit. As Damian shows quite clearly it was the numbers of people getting connected to the Internet.
Anyone who said this is madness was shouted down.
Should of listened.Comment
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I knowI have been posting this in a few threads during the last hour...
But this time - Its dedicated to PAUL !
ENJOY!Comment
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It's weird isn't it. All those millions, a gorgeous little girl, a puppy, living in amazing surroundings, and how he CHOSES to spend his time it typing the same 2 points out AGAIN AND AGAIN and calling anyone who points out he is wrong stupid.
I tell you what, if I was as rich as Paul and in as nice a house I would find something more fun to do that saying really stupid things on the internet to annoy people.Comment
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what broken join links? Prove it.
think it through - 100k uniques to sponsors per month, do you know ANYONE with that much traffic?
now tell me I'm lying.
now prove me wrong.
but insert_username_here keeps telling us insert_no_such_statement_here
short sighted sponsors
you have all been doing it wrong
Comment
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what broken join links? Prove it.
think it through - 100k uniques to sponsors per month, do you know ANYONE with that much traffic?
now tell me I'm lying.
now prove me wrong.
but insert_username_here keeps telling us insert_no_such_statement_here
short sighted sponsors
you have all been doing it wrong
You forgot:
"I've been telling you traffic isn't king. And getting it is the easiest job in porn"
and
"I know my content isn't good enough"Comment
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I was telling people that content was king from the beginning of coming online. I was shouted down by the gurus who knew it all and thought traffic was king.
Well it wasn't and today you know why. The growth in traffic to your sites was purely because of the growing number people coming online. To think they only got online connections to look at porn is over estimating the draw of porn. Converting less that 1-100 was ignoring the truth. People were getting off on free porn and not buying.
The trouble with the system was it was expensive, focused attention on people who didn't but and taught surfers not to buy. And the most important flaw was it was fairly easy to do and it all became like the arms race. Everyone was competing to see who could give away the most porn.
Well you got to the end game. Full scenes being given away, often many full scenes from the same site. The biggest servers are dedicated to free porn all courtesy of the industry trying to sell porn to people less and less inclined to buy.Comment
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Paul, I wish I could sit down with you at your cottage and show you how easy it is to make sales. You're just not creative enough to figure it out."WTF, on google you can find the answer to every question in human history, EXCEPT how to convert cams..
Its crazy..."
VenusBloggerComment
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I suppose being ignored and told I was talking bullshit, clueless about online marketing, etc. That now you guys have got to here this is my payback time to tell you.
"I told you so."
I've read so much BS on the boards it's amazing.
Traffic is King
Non exclusive is saturated.
You don't understand online porn marketing.
You're old.
Online porn made far more money than offline porn. Look at the turnover of Milcorp. That illustrated the level of knowledge the online guys had of the porn industry.
Surfers don't want polished porn, they want the real thing. Which is why Brazzers is a top site. And Shap is a clever guy with his site surfers don't want.
You guys couldn't sell porn properly and now you know it.
Sorry but if you come to Prague for the show, we can sit down and have an intelligent conversation about porn and the porn industry.Comment
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Yes, you throw a load of free porn up, and get 1,000 people to look at it and 1 buys. I already know.
Yes you can come and sit down with us at our cottage out in the stockbroker belt of Brno. I can tell you how converting 1-1,000 is really losing 999 potential sales.
If it's really so easy to get sales, why are so many people leaving the industry, why are boards closing or grinding to a halt, companies closing the affiliate programs, programs not paying, programs selling out for what I imagine isn't a lot of money, programs shooting less and less or wanting it cheaper and cheaper.
Yes while we sit out the back and I cook a BBQ, you can explain that to me. Seeing as sales are so easy to get.
In fact why don't you tell us all here? How do you get traffic, where do you send it (what kind of sites), how many views to get a banner click, how many surfers hit a tour before one buys and retention time.
Come on educate me. Please.
We'll see if he comes up with anything now.Last edited by Paul Markham; 07-17-2011, 10:56 AM.Comment
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Last edited by Roald; 07-17-2011, 12:46 PM.
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People are quitting because its not as easy anymore to simply submit some galleries with sponsor links and wait for the sales to roll in. The last couple of years have weeded out all the leechers and lazy webmasters trying to ride the easy train. Forget 1/1000, I would have quit years ago if I converted that bad. Why would I tell you here how to get sales and have everyone duplicate it? You just sit and whine every day and you saying this"Yes, you throw a load of free porn up, and get 1,000 people to look at it and 1 buys. I already know.
Yes you can come and sit down with us at our cottage out in the stockbroker belt of Brno. I can tell you how converting 1-1,000 is really losing 999 potential sales.
If it's really so easy to get sales, why are so many people leaving the industry, why are boards closing or grinding to a halt, companies closing the affiliate programs, programs not paying, programs selling out for what I imagine isn't a lot of money, programs shooting less and less or wanting it cheaper and cheaper.
Yes while we sit out the back and I cook a BBQ, you can explain that to me. Seeing as sales are so easy to get.
In fact why don't you tell us all here? How do you get traffic, where do you send it (what kind of sites), how many views to get a banner click, how many surfers hit a tour before one buys and retention time.
Come on educate me. Please.
We'll see if he comes up with anything now.
"How do you get traffic, where do you send it (what kind of sites), how many views to get a banner click, how many surfers hit a tour before one buys and retention time."
tells me you are still stuck in 2005."WTF, on google you can find the answer to every question in human history, EXCEPT how to convert cams..
Its crazy..."
VenusBloggerComment
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this cockhead is one of the biggest wastes of time hereComment
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who has repeatedly proven he has no traffic, no sales and a bunch of content on 5 1/4 inch disks he shot in 82Comment
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I wish you would sit down with me and tell show me how easy it is to make sales as an affiliate these days.
I was just going over things in my stats remote.
As an affiliate I made $400,000 MORE in 2008 than I am forecast to make in 2011. That shit hurts.
So I'd gladly have you come to Vegas. I don't live in a cottage, so you'll have to make due with sitting around my pool and explaining to me how easy it is to make sales.
I'll gladly even start a new company with you to make sales as an affiliate
-Robbie
ClaudiaMarie.ComComment
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I thought you would do that. Big cop out when faced with having to back up your words.
Then a bunch of bullshit about the lazy and leeches getting out because it was too easy. It never ever in any way should of been easy. That was the flaw in the whole system. You just fell into the hole you dug.
Why in fucks name should being an affiliate or sponsor be easy? That was the stupidest thing the sponsors who could of made billions made. They should of kept it hard. You're too much of an amateur too realise that.
Making it easy for any person to get in on the business did only one thing. It diluted the herd. Any fool could get in, open a site or work in the business at some level. The result was inevitable.
Here's my ICQ 213 327 873
Email paul_eva at paulmarkham dot com.
How much are you willing to prove you're not talking out your ass?Comment
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He's full of shit, like so many here. The reason he can't sit down with me is he has nothing to tell me. No sig and probably wouldn't survive if it was like the real world. Probably only does survive sucking off the tit of sponsors who provide everything for him.I wish you would sit down with me and tell show me how easy it is to make sales as an affiliate these days.
I was just going over things in my stats remote.
As an affiliate I made $400,000 MORE in 2008 than I am forecast to make in 2011. That shit hurts.
So I'd gladly have you come to Vegas. I don't live in a cottage, so you'll have to make due with sitting around my pool and explaining to me how easy it is to make sales.
I'll gladly even start a new company with you to make sales as an affiliate
And that's the problem and has been from the very earliest days.
I suppose sponsors replaced the retail level of offline porn to a large extent. The difference was immense. Shop owners had to get a shop, get it ready for selling, stock it and then make sure people came through the door and actually bought the contents they had on sale. In some cases stock was on sale or return, but not the norm for a new shop.
So the limit of suppliers meant the amount of money they took was fantastic. This is where the big money was made in porn, not in the production. It was the retail that made the money.
Online porn guys knowing so much about online marketing, decided to go a different route. Being an affiliate was made so easy the lazy and leeches could do it. So much money was spent on this side, the actual product suffered, so the entry level for sites was very low. And the market was saturated. With lazy, leeches and low level guys who probably would have problems finding a job.
When you ran your TGP sites, imagine it being 1 of only 100 TGP sites, because the rev share was low and opening a TGP site was a lot tougher. Nothing but the bare minimum was given to you, galleries after 3 months disappeared, they had the minimum of porn on them. So surfers had a lot less free porn to consume and the need to buy was far higher. So instead of 1-"500" surfers converting 1-50 converted. (Numbers to show the principal)
We all know a good gallery with a good spot would burn BW to an extent that it was a major factor. So imagine less surfers and far more sales.
Would you of been good enough to survive in a tougher environment?
Well I'll give you a clue and a challenge.Your reply is exactly what I mean but you just don't get it.
How many clicks from your site does it take to get a sale?
Let's run a test. I'll put up a sample clip of any mainstream sponsor you wish to choose. I'll sign up as an affiliate. We'll record the views of the post, views of the sample, clicks to the sponsor and conversions. You'll have ALL the takings on the joins. I just want to manage it so I can see the stats.
Maybe you could tell us how much of your traffic it takes to get a sale that way.
10, 100, 1,000, 5,000 ?????????????Last edited by Paul Markham; 07-18-2011, 12:06 AM.Comment
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"Imagine if some shit happened that didn't happen and then we would all be rich!"
[email protected]
Paul, you can set up your very own email account nowadays. You don't have to share it with your partner. Shall I teach you how to do it?
DamianComment
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Boy, you really dont get it huh.
Ok let me try to explain, I am not commenting on what you are saying. I am commenting on the fact that you keep saying the same thing over and over and over and over and over again.
So I don't care about what you are saying, its the ammount of times you are saying it...
Damn
PS your little test is of coure not going to happen. Just because I would never EVER want to work with you again and it just wouldnt prove anything
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Yes a lot of people seem to repeat the same thing over and over again. But what the fuck who cares.Boy, you really dont get it huh.
Ok let me try to explain, I am not commenting on what you are saying. I am commenting on the fact that you keep saying the same thing over and over and over and over and over again.
So I don't care about what you are saying, its the ammount of times you are saying it...
Damn
PS your little test is of coure not going to happen. Just because I would never EVER want to work with you again and it just wouldnt prove anything
As for the test, yes it will prove something. Something you don't ever want me to know. Which is how many freeloaders you have on your site. It's got nothing to do with working with me again. How about we find someone acceptable to both of us for you to work with?
How about I find someone to buy a sponsored link on your site?
Without you knowing.Comment
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another week of a broke bitter old man, spending all his life on GFY, posting shit no one cares about, while his wife has to go out to work to support him.
Has their ever been a more tragic failure on GFY?
Arsewithclass has models who claim he wont pay them. Read his pathetic excuse here http://www.gfy.com/showpost.php?p=17...&postcount=102Comment
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Paul, you post the same two points every day. 1) Giving away porn is bad 2) Spend more on content.
Name 3 other people on GFY that repeat the same 2 points over and over every day like you. In fact, name 1.
Everyone. You were always unpopular here, but have you not noticed a growing number of people posting for you to STFU?
You are boring and contribute absolutely nothing of any value here.
It's obvious you are just posting ridiculously stupid statements to troll your old content you admit is not good.
You literally have NOTHING better to do in your life than sit on GFY all day posting 1000 word posts no one cares about as you are always saying the same two points. Imagine making the millions you made and not being able to think of something worthwhile to do in your well deserved retirement. Fuck your life.
Things you could do today instead of pointlessly arguing with strangers:
1) Walk your dog
2) Play with your daughter
3) Volunteer at a school to help reading
4) Volunteer to help at a soup kitchen
5) Volunteer to help clear up the cabbage fields
6) Offer free photography lessons to disadvantaged people
7) Write letters on behalf of Amnesty International
You know, do something useful for society, meaningful.
I can see you on your death bed next year saying "yeah, but at least I called some people I never met idiots on the internet! LOL"
And dying.
Is that what you want to leave behind? The memory of you being a old man that was left behind by new technology who got angry and bitter and spent the last few years alive posting two points on a porn message board?
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can't believe im posting here but ive read the whole thread so... its a fair point, If you have a partner who is out generating money then you have a responsibility to pull your weight also, ie cleanup, have dinner ready for when she gets home etc. How would you feel if you got home from a days work and your partner has done fuck all except post crap on an internet msg board?
or generate money yourself.. how much money does posting on gfy really make? perhaps a better idea since you are posting thousands of words here every day anyway and accomplishing nothing is to create a network of retro porn blogs and actually start building up some TRAFFIC to send to your astral blue site.
given that your centent is so far ahead of anyone else in the biz you should make mad sales.Comment
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100k uniques to sponsor per month?
For real?
=============================================
Aside:
Would you like a few affiliates to send you that make-believe 100k uniques per month paul? Or would you turn it down, as most of it will be freeloaders? How about a few million a month?
Now tell me I'm lying. LOL. I'm off to cook dinner. Or will the internet collapse by the time I've prepared the meatloaf due to 'spammers' running a mailer, as I myself would have us believe? Prove me wrong.Comment
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i'm not quite sure what you are trying to tell us, Paul. That every porn website is supposed to have a 1:1 visitor/sales ratio?Comment
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And that's the problem. Maybe now you see it, I saw it years ago as you say. Most ignored it and carried on building the freeloaders base.
I saw online porn devastate offline porn, to the extent it closed loads of magazines and put those left of very small budgets. I saw the devastation to video and cable. All because of free porn.
Now it's biting you in the ass. As someone at the forefront of giving porn away, how does it feel?
And what are you going to try that's new? A tube site full of even bigger reasons not to spend money, selling to Dating sites that scam customers or selling sponsored links? Sorry I never look on your site so didn't know. Still might be a good example of the ratio of freeloaders to the ratio of buyers you have, we could repeat the exercise every 3 months.
Sponsors are the ones who need to try new ideas, not ideas at getting more traffic, been doing that for 12 years and look where it got us.
Sponsors need to be thinking about how to convert and retain more. That's the only future there is for online porn. That and web cams, even dating will fail. You can't keep conning customers there's a girl in the next street waiting to fuck them.
Wonder if in 3-4 years I'll be proved right again.
The real problem is the attitude of many. So what if I've been saying it over and over again. The important thing is.Was I it right and what's happening to turn it around?
Lazy people and leeches just close their ears or ridicule.Comment
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I like your posts/attitude so even though this is a paul wankham chest-beating thread, as they all are from paulie, here's a proper reply.I wish you would sit down with me and tell show me how easy it is to make sales as an affiliate these days.
I was just going over things in my stats remote.
As an affiliate I made $400,000 MORE in 2008 than I am forecast to make in 2011. That shit hurts.
So I'd gladly have you come to Vegas. I don't live in a cottage, so you'll have to make due with sitting around my pool and explaining to me how easy it is to make sales.
I'll gladly even start a new company with you to make sales as an affiliate
It's 2011, there is a global recession, and it's fucking DEEP. Of course we are all hurting - but we are hurting only in relation to what we earned in eg 2008. We aren't hurting like people with 'real jobs' are hurting - nowhere near it. Tell someone in an offline job, or 90% of them, what your terrible income forecast for 2011 is, and you'd likely get a smack in the mouth for your 'woes'.
I'm at about 25% of what I was doing in 2008, but I promise you I'll never moan to any of my friends about what I'm still earning - they'd tell me to stop being such a wanker. And before you (and I mean anyone in general, not you personally) start about standard of living, having to move down a level, etc - suck it up like 97% of the rest of the world are doing.Comment
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Of course not.
But when 100 people consume a product and don't even go to a paysite, you know somethings wrong. Today those ratios would be a dream, yet are still shit ratios.
And that's the point. Online porn accepted these ratios and only looked at the 100 who came and the 1 that bought. (Numbers to illustrate the example) Even today and people know something is very wrong, Warchild posts ratios close to 1-500 on banner clicks. He didn't come back after that. Probably realised he dug a hole for himself. How many views did his clips get, to get 1 sale?
I asked another guy to tell me what he wished he could tell me in my cottage, he didn't come back.
Roald when asked to show what his ratio of freeloaders to buyers is, made an excuse.
All we know is the online porn business is now in the same boat they put the offline porn business in. Free porn, legal or not, is killing the industry. And what are they doing about it?
Ridiculing the messenger so they can ignore the message. Is that bright or what?Comment
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fuck it, call me a leech or lazy but im not going to debate here with you as you will never agree on anything or believe what I say. So whats the use....And that's the problem. Maybe now you see it, I saw it years ago as you say. Most ignored it and carried on building the freeloaders base.
I saw online porn devastate offline porn, to the extent it closed loads of magazines and put those left of very small budgets. I saw the devastation to video and cable. All because of free porn.
Now it's biting you in the ass. As someone at the forefront of giving porn away, how does it feel?
And what are you going to try that's new? A tube site full of even bigger reasons not to spend money, selling to Dating sites that scam customers or selling sponsored links? Sorry I never look on your site so didn't know. Still might be a good example of the ratio of freeloaders to the ratio of buyers you have, we could repeat the exercise every 3 months.
Sponsors are the ones who need to try new ideas, not ideas at getting more traffic, been doing that for 12 years and look where it got us.
Sponsors need to be thinking about how to convert and retain more. That's the only future there is for online porn. That and web cams, even dating will fail. You can't keep conning customers there's a girl in the next street waiting to fuck them.
Wonder if in 3-4 years I'll be proved right again.
The real problem is the attitude of many. So what if I've been saying it over and over again. The important thing is.Was I it right and what's happening to turn it around?
Lazy people and leeches just close their ears or ridicule.
Enjoy your retirement
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no, it's because you don't believe anyways what people say and they are just saving time
and btw - i just recently put a few short clips on legal tube sites with my banner below the videos. Result: 1 out 200 people who clicked on my banner bought a membership
has the video been watched a few thousand times? yes, but i also look at tv commercials all the time without buying something
do i wish it was better? yes
could it be worse? yes
and now back to working on my shop
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You wont know, you'll probably be dead and you would have spent your last lonely bitter days on this planet spending all day, every day posting shit that no one reads on a web forum arguing with a bunch of strangers.
Strangers, that like you say don't know how to make or sell porn, don't know what porn was like before the internet, don't know fuck all about porn marketing.
But strangers who made money and lots of it, while you was trying to sell magazine prints in a bargain basement store for $2, at the same time trying to try and point out something you cant do anything about and that everyone knows, in the sad hope of "forcing" people to buy your porn in some eastern block socialist utopia, where all the porn surfers are made to buy your shit.
It is never going to happen. It never was. So run along, you failed, except it and put on your business partners Heinz spaghetti hoops on the hob, she will be home from her cleaning job at 5
Arsewithclass has models who claim he wont pay them. Read his pathetic excuse here http://www.gfy.com/showpost.php?p=17...&postcount=102Comment
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Would you like a few affiliates to send you that make-believe 100k uniques per month paul? Or would you turn it down, as most of it will be freeloaders? How about a few million a month?Comment
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No no, you are ridiculed because you are painfully, publicly ignorant and lie all the time. Nothing to do with ignoring your message. We all know your message. You post it four times a day. "Free porn is bad."
Try posting something different and you might not get ridiculed quite so much.Comment
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That's Paul's standard MO. You call him out, he then lies. You accuse him of lying. He pretends he didn't read your post and carries on about free porn.
Weird thing is, everyone can read the posts and see you didn't lie.
If I were to lie about something, I'd pick something less obvious.Comment
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Paul, I have a ton of respect for your work and knowledge. I have lost many litres of bodily fluid admiring your abilities. But free porn was absolutely inevitable. As you stated above, brick and mortar stores had to bring the people in. If they could have posted newspaper adverts with free porn you can bet your ass there would have been a ton of it. No eyes means no sales.
Fast forward to the internet, no clicks mean no sales. If your site has a high bounce rate you are going to do what you must to get the viewers' attention. So in a way, the internet marketers are right- traffic is king.
You are also right in that to convert the traffic, given the state of porn, it must be of quality or at least compelling. But the future of selling porn memberships is probably dead as we know it. Without a certain level of interactiveness no one will pay for porn.
Keep an eye on our friend nathen/fabian to see what he does. I would think a clone or acquisition of a MFC and dating (maybe what's left of FFN after they go belly up) is in the very near future for that network. I can't see him content sharing that pie.
Porn will be used as a value added service, like a condiment to get you in the mood to talk to a "real woman". There will still be a market for producers of pornography... but the salad days are gone forever.AlanAgus1 at gmail dot com-------------------------------Comment
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